Bachmann 2014 ...for those with crystal balls....

[coachmann]

I doubt it, but I still think/hope there will be something along which will happen to delight me and, I suspect, you in the shape of a certain 0-6-2T although alas it won't be of either TVR or RR origin.  There might even be something with a slightly unequal wheelbase but to get the ducks in the right row they should have started with the right chassis which already goes under a tank engine - and if Bachmann are reading this I trust that message gets through

I think this could be a premier line though I doubt Mr.H spoke of this in Margate, and so Bachy should have a clear run with plenty of Coal and a full Tank. 

[Guest]

The Bachmann crystal ball gave us a big clue in the price-rise etc announcement the other day, when the NER Q6 was ruled out due to "limited geographical operating area". This effectively means that any loco/DMU/EMU which was mainly seen north of a line drawn between Goole and Preston is never going to come from Bachmann. I would add another three rules: any class of loco which was extinct before 1960, and any class with less than 20 examples or with two or fewer livery options. A high preservation-era profile is also going to help. 

According to those rules, could we be expecting an Adams radial? A few survived (Albeit only just) into the 60's, 71 were built, and there's no shortage in possible liveries! And on top of that, there is a preserved example!

However, I am not willing to bet any money on them making one.....

[S.A.C Martin]

The Bachmann crystal ball gave us a big clue in the price-rise etc announcement the other day, when the NER Q6 was ruled out due to "limited geographical operating area".

 

Just what exactly does "limited geographical operating area" mean? The Blue Pullman was unlikely to be seen on 95% of the network including but not limited to all branch lines at varying times and that was still produced. How did we end up with both a Lanky Tank and a G2a? If you actually mean "anything north of York" then yes, aside from the Scottish build D11 (and who predicted Bachmann would do BOTH variants? Come on!) then say that. I don't believe that is true though.

 

 

 

This effectively means that any loco/DMU/EMU which was mainly seen north of a line drawn between Goole and Preston is never going to come from Bachmann.

 

 That seems a little extreme! I know only my own personal choice of railway (and very loosely in comparison with real experts) but you're effectively ruling out almost every 0-6-0 tender engine ever built for work north of York. That seems unlikely! Particularly when you consider Bachmann have previously manufactured the J39.

 

I would add another three rules: any class of loco which was extinct before 1960, and any class with less than 20 examples or with two or fewer livery options. A high preservation-era profile is also going to help. Given what has already been produced, that must surely narrow down the options.

 

That's exceptionally narrow minded, particularly given the extreme levels of winding down steam on the Great Western and Eastern Region in particular from 1958 onwards.

 

I would say the case for a model these days has something more to do with adding to the existing range available and building on that. The choice of the GCR O4, followed by D11 and then the extinct J11 class must surely show that there's no hard and fast rule with that Bachmann are willing to take on as a subject for manufacturing.

 

Therefore I fully expect an L&YR 0-6-0 (at least I think to choose from that is preserved, no?) to add to the excellent Lanky tank. But "joined up thinking" is very much in Bachmann's DNA. Peppercorn A1 followed by A2, another example. Hall followed by modified Hall. SECR C class and Billinton E4 joined by the in progress Brighton Atlantic new build.

[S.A.C Martin]

I think this could be a premier line though I doubt Mr.H spoke of this in Margate, and so Bachy should have a clear run with plenty of Coal and a full Tank. 

 

I see what you did there...

[coachmann]

The Bachmann crystal ball gave us a big clue in the price-rise etc announcement the other day, when the NER Q6 was ruled out due to "limited geographical operating area". This effectively means that any loco/DMU/EMU which was mainly seen north of a line drawn between Goole and Preston is never going to come from Bachmann. 

Bachmann has produced locos that were regulars north of Goole and Preston, but of course they were also seen elsewhere on the railway system too, so widening the net of potential customers. As you said, the NER Q6 has a limited geographical operating area. One has to put ones self in Bachmann shoes and look at the locos with the best potential for mass-sales after taking all the various factors into account. For example, a SE&CR 'H' Class 0-4-4T has a heck of a lot going for it.  A NER G5 0-4-4T hasn't. While they both had limited geographical areas, the sell-out of the SE&CR C class 0-6-0 and the fact that the H Class ran in an area where folk tend-to-spend clinches it. I know people buy what appeals to them and tend to look for excuses to purchase, and so a Q6 might sell well. But it's a gamble.

 

Locos that I feel in my water would sell in required quantities are the LSWR/SR S15 4-6-0, GWR Saint 4-6-0, BR Std. Class 2 2-6-0, LNER Thompson A2/3 Pacific and LMS Caprotti Black Five, but it's not my outlay.

[Flying Pig]

The Bachmann crystal ball gave us a big clue in the price-rise etc announcement the other day, when the NER Q6 was ruled out due to "limited geographical operating area". This effectively means that any loco/DMU/EMU which was mainly seen north of a line drawn between Goole and Preston is never going to come from Bachmann.

 

Given the presence on my shelf of a Lanky Radial, a solidly Northern type I never thought to see rtr, I still think it's way too soon for NER fans to take the leap off Dunston Staithes.  What they could do is shut up and contain themselves in patience however.

[tomparryharry]

Going on your basis, Coach, that means the Pwllyrhebog Incline locomotives are a bit of a gamble?

 

Funny that, I'd have thought they were a sure-fire bet, seeing as they made it as far as Swindon.....

 

Ian

[locoholic]

...a Q6 might sell well. But it's a gamble.

I think that's the important point - developments in China mean that manufacturers will become more risk-averse. If I had to choose a prototype to model, it would be one that operated in the Home Counties, with inside cylinders, has preserved examples and could be painted in at least two different liveries - perhaps a 94xx pannier tank, a J69 tank, or N7. What did happen to the tooling for the Lima 94xx, by the way? i would have thought that was a natural for the Railroad range.

[The Black Hat]

 I’m sorry but at what point does the Q6 have a limited operational area. The class was seen everywhere from Northumberland to Hull and beyond. Interregional trains would have taken them to Carlisle, to Lincolnshire, Doncaster, Leeds and Sheffield. Even beyond. Add that the Q6 is based on the busiest preserved railway in the country, with buildings modelled by both Hornby and Bachmann. It’s been on tour to preserved railways, gala events. In my thinking that means you can run it with “rule one” alongside your southern/western preserved railway – or better still, everyone should buy one!

 

The very fact that the line is being repeated causes damage to its chances. People are not thinking clearly for themselves and accepting like sycophants the reasoning, the release and idea that it can’t work.  The Q6 was pregrouping, lasted till steam and is preserved. That’s many liveries, options and specials that can be done and passes the usual tests and demands for being in the Bachmann stable. Its use means that either modeller’s will buy and accept what companies produce regardless of what it is and not question it, or that Bachmann are using a ruse here in the light that the Blue Pullman, and an overhead electric were also discounted before being produced.

 

This makes following the topic and wanting the model very frustrating and in some ways emotional. When others seemingly easily get models they request, the continued absence of the engine that is the entry to a NER fleet makes those after it both envious, despondent and feel neglected. The very notion is that Bachmann are the company of choice to make the model. There is no second option. No reserved company identified. That’s not a bad thing to conjecture on the release of another Bachmann model, is a massive plus point. The cry is, “Us next please!” Producing the Q6 would be a massive reward for patience and customer loyalty, even with price increases, the clamour for the model is still strong and also for Bachmann to gain custom.

 

In light of this, the belief is that now hope clings to the notion that the Q6 follows the Blue Pullman and electric in being discounted by a statement before then appearing in a release. That’s not much left to go on but it’s all I and others have left.

[Fenman]

 ... Producing the Q6 would be a massive reward for patience ...

 

Nope, I haven't seen any patience exhibited in your numerous posts in this thread alone.

 

I, on the other hand, have been immensely patient in containing my desire for a Midland Railway Johnson 1808 Class, so much so that I have never actually even mentioned it before. So I guess I deserve it before your Q6, huh?

 

Paul

[The Stationmaster]

 

 

In light of this, the belief is that now hope clings to the notion that the Q6 follows the Blue Pullman and electric in being discounted by a statement before then appearing in a release. That’s not much left to go on but it’s all I and others have left.

No it isn't - as I said in another thread if you are so sure of its potential you have the simple - although not necessarily easy - option of talking to the right people and getting it developed yourself or in conjunction with a group of like-minded folk.  Various factories in China are crying out for work and raring to go on new projects if what I have been told is anything like correct and all you need are some drawings, some photos and the right amount of cash and you're away.

 

If other folk are prepared to mortgage their homes to finance such work there's clearly a precedent that works - some might even have found the right bank manager.  Word on the street - if Bachmann are to be believed - is that you have a clear field and the 'strong demand' you can see suggests the railway concerned or someone else might be happy to get into bed with you on the project.  Nicely detailed engine selling for c£140-150 and you're on your way. 

[stewartingram]

Didn't the Q6 trial on the S&D, and also head the substitute loco-hauled (Blue) Pullman set on a couple of occasions too?

 

OK I'l shut up, I don't want one of those, it wasn't East Anglian.....

 

Stewart

[S.A.C Martin]

I'm puzzled by the negativity shown to the clamour for a Q6.

 

I agree, on occasion, not done positively or patiently, BUT I hope it could at least be acknowledged that as one of the major founders of the LNER, the NER is a virtually untapped resource. The Q6 is a popular loco and fits in with the G2a and O4 in terms of Bachmanns catalogue items.

 

All said I find it remarkable something NER hasn't been made yet. I made a somewhat heinous error in another thread yesterday regarding Raven engines, and looking at my books today find there were more NER classes that made it to BR days than I thought.

 

If not a Q6 then there is definitely scope for a few of the passenger engines which made it into the late 50s.

 

I dare say the Q6 is already complemented by the presence of Thompsons O1 in Hornbys range (albeit needing a few additions to the running plate in form of the pumps for the Tyne lot).

 

But hey, this is meant to be about the Bachmann price rides. If this means paying a bit more for something of the quality of the J11 then I'm perfectly happy with that. I'm buying less models and doing more modelling these days anyway.

[tomparryharry]

Slightly off-topic, but....

 

Isn't Alexander Models making a Q6?

 

Sure, it's not RTR, but it might fill a hole in your desired collection.

 

I'd like a TVR 'A' class, but I don't think I'll see one from Barwell anytime soon. I'm resorting to buying kits, as & when they come along.

 

Regards,

Ian

[The Stationmaster]

I'm puzzled by the negativity shown to the clamour for a Q6.

 

 

Fairly straightforward reason I'd have thought Simon - play a record often enough and some folk can get hacked off with hearing it.

[S.A.C Martin]

Fairly straightforward reason I'd have thought Simon - play a record often enough and some folk can get hacked off with hearing it.

Even so Mike - without persistence where the hobby be? The demand for better detail and better performing chassis are two things which modellers wrote about with regularity, pre internet and pre internet forums.

 

Perhaps because we can read it every day now it has become the broken record of broken records - but provided its in context and it's done constructively I don't see a problem (I accept it may not always have been done like this).

 

I mean we're all tired of a lot of round robin debates in the modelling fraternity - how refreshing by comparison is it to have little to argue on with Bachmanns presentation here? Many questions RE price rises yet almost all more or less answered.

[coachmann]

Many popular (plus not so well-known) locos have been done as kits at one time or another. So I looked through my old West coast Kit Centre catalogue and there was no whitemetal kit for a Q6, therefore I can see why the people who clamour for one have never built one.     The reason this is being laboured is because an earlier post intimated that Bachmann would not produce this loco. If correct, an option is to look at the various Bachmann 8-coupled chassis to see if there is anything suitable for slight modification. Then shop around for brass tube and find someone to draw the rest on CAD so the parts can be etched. NER locos were pretty basic as designs go with a parallel boiler, straight footplate and large cab.

[The Black Hat]

Fairly straightforward reason I'd have thought Simon - play a record often enough and some folk can get hacked off with hearing it.

 

So why did Bachmann listen to all the clamours for the Blue Pullman then?

 

My calls for the Q6 are as repetative as the same members here always proclaiming their views as always being right. Easy to take a stand like that when you already have the obvious ones for your region made in RTR.

[Paul Cram]

Many popular (plus not so well-known) locos have been done as kits at one time or another. So I looked through my old West coast Kit Centre catalogue and there was no whitemetal kit for a Q6, therefore I can see why the people who clamour for one have never built one.     The reason this is being laboured is because an earlier post intimated that Bachmann would not produce this loco. If correct, an option is to look at the various Bachmann 8-coupled chassis to see if there is anything suitable for slight modification. Then shop around for brass tube and find someone to draw the rest on CAD so the parts can be etched. NER locos were pretty basic as designs go with a parallel boiler, straight footplate and large cab.

Nu Cast did a kit. Not particularly accurate though. Dave Bradwell does one and so does Alexander models so no one needs to start drawing another kit.Although I model NER I have no pressing need for a Q6 although I do have the Nucast kit. If the Bachmann price is going to be in the region of £150 then I'd rather have the Bradwell kit. I have not seen the Alexander models kit but if his J27 is anything to go by then it will be nice.

[Flying Pig]

I'm puzzled by the negativity shown to the clamour for a Q6.

Why? It should be plainly obvious that the clamour arises largely from people with no sense of proportion, a massive chip on their collective shoulder and a deluded sense of entitlement. This rather than any feature of the locomotive itself is what irritates the rest of us. I personally would love to see an NER prototype produced but I don't appreciate every thread that bears the faintest similarity to a wish list being turned into some sort of bizarre cargo cult.

[gc4946]

If there's only three new toolings to be announced this July, my revised speculation on what may appear is as follows:

 

1. GCR brake van to go with the O4 and J11

2. LNER (ex-GER) J17 - redirection of efforts from their abandoned J15 plans, also NRM version could be commissioned in the future

3. 101 centre car (the TCL/TSL type) so 3-car units can be offered

[Brocp]

So no one read in the Bachmann price rises thread read where Dibber mentioned that Graham Hubbard had said this sort of thing before most notably about Blue Pullman? Seemed like a hint that a Q6 was very on the cards to me.

[S.A.C Martin]

Why? It should be plainly obvious that the clamour arises largely from people with no sense of proportion, a massive chip on their collective shoulder and a deluded sense of entitlement. 

 

One person does not make a collective. I've seen lots of constructive clamour for a Q6 on other forums, and on MREmag, and sometimes even in the written press. Certainly if we're going to go down that route, what makes Blackhat's posting any different to the clamour for an industrial locomotive of years past? Look what happened - Hornby actually made one in the form of the Sentinel. So the manufacturers do listen. Perhaps not when it's put in a particularly ill manner, accepted.

 

I won't comment on the fact that here it does seem to be a case of singling out one person for scrutiny, but I feel it's unfair to generalise an entire pre-grouping railway and its modelling fraternity on the basis of one individual's actions.

 

 

 

This rather than any feature of the locomotive itself is what irritates the rest of us. I personally would love to see an NER prototype produced but I don't appreciate every thread that bears the faintest similarity to a wish list being turned into some sort of bizarre cargo cult.

 

I can appreciate that point of view and I agree to some extent - however thread drift is inevitable, and to be fair the discussion was only started because the Q6 was mentioned specifically by class name, by one of the head honchos of Bachmann.

 

Perhaps the Q6 discussion has run its thread, and we can all agree to disagree to varying degrees…!

[newbryford]

What's a Q6?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3p4pAo9XMI

 

Apologies for the images at 1.35

 

There's a lot of it about..........................

 

Oops - that's a reference to Q10

Cheers,

Mick.

[OOgaugeJaf]

OK, adding a bit fuel to the Q6 debate, please see below some info and a link to the LNER Encyclopedia in relation to thier allocation and areas used:

 

'they were allocated to Tyne Dock, Borough Gardens, Blaydon, Carlisle, Stockton, Newport, Darlington, Neville Hill (Leeds), Selby, Dairycoates, and Springhead (Hull & Barnsley). They would occasionally be used for medium and long distance freight, as well as the heavy mineral traffic for which they were designed. During LNER ownership, the Q6s tended to venture further afield including trips to Manchester via the Woodhead Tunnel, Doncaster, and after 1930 they ventured north of the Tyne. In the 1940s, they also ventured south to Peterborough and March'.

 

http://www.lner.info/locos/Q/q6.shtml

 

So they were more widely used than some folk may think