Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 6, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 6, 2014 Don't you mean chocolate and cream? Nope. I've always throught that these would have looked really lovely in early BR colours. Not prototypical of course but with a little weathering to highlight the panneling, really, really nice. There's an autocoach on an early MRJ with just the right amount of weathering for this project. The nearest I've come so far is the ex-Moffat railcar in 3mm scale. At least it didn't have all the waggly bits to contend with. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Huw Griffiths Posted February 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 6, 2014 Don't you mean chocolate and cream? Phil - you've been dreaming about the biscuits again! Last time I checked, they were called health foods - they make you feel good. In my case, this is certainly true for Bourbons - although I don't normally like chocolate flavour anything, I've always liked these things - especially when washed down with a decent port. Still, rolling moving swiftly on ... . Phil - that steam railmotor looks interesting - if the wrong scale. I wonder how much work would be involved in kitbashing a RTR coach or autocoach into that steam railmotor they've got at Didcot. Either that, or one of those ex-Lima AEC railcars in "blood and custard" or other suitable colours. Whatever the score, I'm sure it'll look good in the end. Huw. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Got an etched kit in the store somewhere but that's probably too advanced (read: will take lots of bodging and fiddling best not shown in print) to build. Besides, I fancy finishing it in custard and cream... Don't you mean carmine and cream? Custard and cream would be............. cream and cream. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 6, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 6, 2014 Phil - that steam railmotor looks interesting - if the wrong scale. I wonder how much work would be involved in kitbashing a RTR coach or autocoach into that steam railmotor they've got at Didcot. Either that, or one of those ex-Lima AEC railcars in "blood and custard" or other suitable colours. Whatever the score, I'm sure it'll look good in the end. Huw. No need - it's a Worsley works kit available in 3, 4 and 7mm scales (http://www.worsleyworks.co.uk/4mm/4mm_LMS_Pregroup_LNWR.htm) The 3mm version is an aid to scratchbuilding, deliberatly so, but a good start for producing a model. At the price, £18 when I bought mine, it was a steal. The main problem as I recell, was that the non-driving end was too narrow and needed a couple of mm grafting into it. This wasn't hard with a bit of spare etch followed by some careful filling to restore the panels. I scratchbuilt a power bogie but in 4mm, there may be something suitable already available. The 4mm kit I have is now available as part of the Blacksmith range. I'm expecting it to require a fair bit of work as the design dates from a long while ago, not quite when it was a modern image prototype but not far off. However, I've many projects ahead of me before it reaches the workbench. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Happy Hippo Posted February 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 6, 2014 Disc 17 probably reads to disc 11 Paul but it might be led by it (as would be the case with the running arms 18 & 19). The purpose of 17 would seem to be to allow a movement past the Home Signal which is going to one or other of the sidings beyond 11 or possibly shunting onto a train in a platform line. The 'Westernisation' depends very much on period but because the toe of the first point is virtually under the overbridge the most awkward bits can be ignored leaving just a semaphore stop signal reading from the platform line and a disc from each of the sidings. Also a disc at the platform line toe of the release crossover. Incidentally the signalbox would normally lie parallel to the running line as that helps setting out the rodding runs and gives the Signalman a better view in many instances. Nothing about the lack of trap points then Mike? They are readily available from the Peco range as well! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 6, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 6, 2014 Yes it is an omission, but I am afraid it is probably a bit late for that now on the demo layout. To install them now would result in some work with a cutting disk, then one has to lift the offending piece of plain track out of the ballast and make good. The link I posted earlier to Seaton (SR) shows where they should be located for those contemplating using this track plan on their first layout. I've mentioned them in Part 3 of the series. While they are available, a tenner for something most people won't operate is money probably better spent elsewhere - a kit for a static version might be a good idea though. Another issue is that one should be installed in the curved track at the start of the loop, not an option with Peco which are very firmly straight. This is, of course, a beginner project and if you want to include trap points then it will be more realistic. There's stuff you could do differently at every stage, that's the great thing about the hobby, so many options. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 6, 2014 Nothing about the lack of trap points then Mike? They are readily available from the Peco range as well! I decided not to raise that one as Phil has already laid the track - and published all that sort of stuff. While I firmly believe that adding trap points can help add a prototypical feeling to a layout I think we have to accept that there different approaches to our hobby and one of them is where a person is developing beyond the trainset and might not be looking to take everything to the limit (hence my suggestions about the signals). Mind you if well informed modellers who have done a good bit of prototype research get it wrong on their 'ultimate' layout it's a different thing entirely Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 6, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 6, 2014 (edited) I decided not to raise that one as Phil has already laid the track - and published all that sort of stuff. While I firmly believe that adding trap points can help add a prototypical feeling to a layout I think we have to accept that there different approaches to our hobby and one of them is where a person is developing beyond the trainset and might not be looking to take everything to the limit (hence my suggestions about the signals). Mind you if well informed modellers who have done a good bit of prototype research get it wrong on their 'ultimate' layout it's a different thing entirely That's my feeling. I want that 1/3rd of magazine readers who currently consider themselves "non-modellers" to get stuck in and make something. The first layout won't be perfect but that's why I say you should start small. Once you ARE modelling, you'll spot ways to make your layout more realistic but the most important thing is to start. Mind you, once you have started, the chances are you will specialise. The trap points will still be missing but you'll be whittling a full set of inside working valve gear out of metal you smelted yourself or worrying exactly which carriage prints would be hung in a 1935 toplight. Or you will run Hornby straight from the box on perfectly laid C&L trackwork with every nut and bolt in the correct place! There is also a practical issue. Stephen Williams excellent pair of books published by Wild Swan are probably as near difinitive as you are going to get on the subject but each was several times the length of the total number of pages available to me. Edited February 6, 2014 by Phil Parker 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Happy Hippo Posted February 6, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 6, 2014 Thank you for all the replies and explanations. We all have to start somewhere, I just feel that mentioning in part 1 might have been preferable to leaving it to part 3. However, the prices quoted for Pecos' finest shows when I last bought a Peco trap: Very expensive! The cheaper alternative would be a few bits of scrap rail to represent the trap which is a technique used by more than one well respected modeller in the past. It is also a much easier fix than cutting out track and replacing with working units. Personally I prefer to make fully working valve gear out of my hoard of unsold BR sandwiches.(Still in the original wrappers!) Much tougher than any metal I know 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 6, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 6, 2014 Thank you for all the replies and explanations. We all have to start somewhere, I just feel that mentioning in part 1 might have been preferable to leaving it to part 3. However, the prices quoted for Pecos' finest shows when I last bought a Peco trap: Very expensive! The cheaper alternative would be a few bits of scrap rail to represent the trap which is a technique used by more than one well respected modeller in the past. It is also a much easier fix than cutting out track and replacing with working units. Personally I prefer to make fully working valve gear out of my hoard of unsold BR sandwiches.(Still in the original wrappers!) Much tougher than any metal I know They were planned to be in Part 1 but were bumped for space reasons - trackwork is a huge subject as the superb 2mm Society publication shows. Again, a book with many times the pagecount available to me. Peco aren't expensive really. These aren't going to be popular items and they do work. Pitching the idea to the board that tooling was required for something most people won't buy must have been "interesting". As for the cheaper version - that had crossed my mind so watch this space. Edgeworth isn't finished and I'm going to use it for a few more projects over the next year if possible. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePurplePrimer Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I just downloaded my digital copy of BRM and went right to the back to see how this layout was coming on, I've been finding it very interesting. I noticed you have printed the question I posted here in regards to board and pin sizes - I think it's great that you put this section here for us to ask questions and have printed clarifications in the magazine. I would like to see more articles like this - longer term projects where you have time to explain certain things in more detail. Off to read the rest of the magazine now. Thank you Phil and the rest of the BRM team Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatB Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 IIRC the Peco trap point appeared in the late '60s, when ROI and the "Bottom Line" were slightly less dominant in the world of business. That and the fact that, as I understand it, in those days, if Mr Pritchard said they were going to make it, Peco made it . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 6, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 6, 2014 I just downloaded my digital copy of BRM and went right to the back to see how this layout was coming on, I've been finding it very interesting. I noticed you have printed the question I posted here in regards to board and pin sizes - I think it's great that you put this section here for us to ask questions and have printed clarifications in the magazine. I would like to see more articles like this - longer term projects where you have time to explain certain things in more detail. Off to read the rest of the magazine now. Thank you Phil and the rest of the BRM team I'm grateful to you for pointing out my mistake. Having never claimed to be anything other then a competent bodger, I like to try and show that despite appearances to the contrary, we are all human and get it wrong sometimes. It's nice to let RMweb feed back in to the magazine too. Interesting point about the long term projects. This is the second I've been involved with in the last 18 months. Both seem to have been appreciated by the readers which would indicate that there is an appetite for more of the same. I'm not suggesting that every project should be spread over many issues but occasionally, maybe we can do this? What does everyone else think? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGTBILKO Posted February 7, 2014 Share Posted February 7, 2014 Edgeworth has been an inspiration to me and I've got as far as building the baseboards and scratch building the bridge. I have increased the size making it 3' longer and 3" deeper, enabling me to use longer turn-outs. Like you, Phil, I've purchased a second hand Bachmann Pannier tank for £60, exactly similar to the one you've illustrated, running number 9643. Mine hasn't arrived yet but I think it hasn't got the split chassis (thank Heavens!) as you stated. See http://www.Bachmann.co.uk/service/assmbly.php the service sheet is number 18750 oddly enough. It would be nice to see a decent 14xx, I see Dapol made one but does anyone know how long ago? Regards, William. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 7, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 7, 2014 Edgeworth has been an inspiration to me and I've got as far as building the baseboards and scratch building the bridge. I have increased the size making it 3' longer and 3" deeper, enabling me to use longer turn-outs. Like you, Phil, I've purchased a second hand Bachmann Pannier tank for £60, exactly similar to the one you've illustrated, running number 9643. Mine hasn't arrived yet but I think it hasn't got the split chassis (thank Heavens!) as you stated. See http://www.Bachmann.co.uk/service/assmbly.php the service sheet is number 18750 oddly enough. It would be nice to see a decent 14xx, I see Dapol made one but does anyone know how long ago? Regards, William. William - Excellent news. Increasing the size is a good idea if you have the space. As well as longer turnouts, you get to put a little more scenery in the extra width which makes things look better. The 0-4-2 dates from Airfix days although I have a feeling that Hornby may have tinkered with the chassis in recent times. You are right, a really top notch version would be nice. Mind you, we can now buy 2-4-2 locos RTR so perhaps there is a move from the easier chassis to more complex ones? Anyway, keep us informed on your progress and if you have any questions - just ask. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 7, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 7, 2014 Edgeworth is now loaded in to the car. Testing this morning was promising with everything working OK. We'll have to see how it is after a trip up the M1. See you at the show! 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottsy11 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 phil what is the length and with of this and what controll do i need it mentions a cdu can you buy these also does the controller come with a transformer or is it built in thank you Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 10, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 10, 2014 phil what is the length and with of this and what controll do i need it mentions a cdu can you buy these also does the controller come with a transformer or is it built in thank you Pottsy The layout is make up of 3 X 3ft long boards, each is 14 inches in width. If you have more space, I'd make it a bit longer (so you can use medium points) and wider to allow for more scenery. The DC controller used is a Gaugemaster Combi (http://www.gaugemaster.com/item_details.asp?code=GMC-COMBI&style=&strType=&Mcode=Gaugemaster COMBI ) which comes with a plug in transformer. This powers both the points and the track. We gave these away as a subscriptions offer a few months ago which is why I used it - not sure if this is to be repeated though. Have a chat with the guys at Gaugemaster as they will be happy to advise you. The Capacitor Discharge Unit (CDU) also comes from Gaugemaster (http://www.gaugemaster.com/item_details.asp?code=GMC-CDU&style=main&strType=&Mcode=Gaugemaster CDU ) and this is wired between the controller and points to give them a bit more of a kick when switching. Hope this helps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottsy11 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 thanks phil cant waite to get cracking Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottsy11 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 has it survived its outing to doncaster and did it get the attention of us novices Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 11, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 11, 2014 has it survived its outing to doncaster and did it get the attention of us novices It survived fine at Doncaster, unlike my canal scene which needs re-grassing thanks to all the people stroking the fibres! There was a lot of interest and several people who have been inspired to have a go at a layout because of it. That's the bit I'm really pleased with - the more people who get their hands dirty with a bit of modelling, whatever standard, the better as far as I am concerned. Interest from N gauge modellers was very strong with 2 or 3 planning a similar model taking advantage of the extra space the smaller scale allows. That's a good idea as a scenic run in to the station and a bit more hill and yard front and back would make the model look better. Since all the main kits are available in the smaller scale then it's a really simple project. Just follow what I did with different scale trackwork. I look forward to seeing the results. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 11, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 11, 2014 The table cloth around it looked like someone had been fondling a nylon cat... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickbradshaw Posted February 11, 2014 Share Posted February 11, 2014 Hi Phil, came to the show on the Saturday and even discounting the Theater presentation, (did you have pics on the sunday? ) I think I spent longer at this layout than any other including the impressive Black Country Blues and Hassel Harbour Bridge layouts. I was the guy with the long hair and goatee, ( hope that narrows it down,) and you managed to get me sufficiently fired up to return to my layout that's been in the baseboard stage for over a year now and begun the planning stage way back in October 2011. I have a thread on a different forum, but I may start a thread on RMweb also, once I have something to show other than some basic Scarm renderings. Sadly my friend is still pushing ahead with his grand plan for a 30ft end to end run around his room, but you can't win them all. Kind Regards, Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottsy11 Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 took your advise and used local b&q for cutting the timber good idea. gave the rather young looking oparater my sizes and here comes the but this where the worry started when he replied "it wont matter if there a couple of mil out will it"?? well not as confedent as when i set out i headed home up into the loft and and started assembling. one black thumb and finger later i have now assembled the base boards (in a fashion) how big did you make your back scean boards and are they bolted onto the base boards? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Phil Parker Posted February 12, 2014 Author Administrators Share Posted February 12, 2014 I was the guy with the long hair and goatee, ( hope that narrows it down,) and you managed to get me sufficiently fired up to return to my layout that's been in the baseboard stage for over a year now and begun the planning stage way back in October 2011. I have a thread on a different forum, but I may start a thread on RMweb also, once I have something to show other than some basic Scarm renderings. Sadly my friend is still pushing ahead with his grand plan for a 30ft end to end run around his room, but you can't win them all. Nick Nick - I remember you. Glad you hear I've got you modelling again. Sadly the presentation was without slide on Sunday too but I'll fix that for Ally Pally in a few weeks time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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