Worseter - update

[Killybegs]

Having finished with the valve gear for the time being, yesterday I made a start on the retainer plate that includes the dummy springs. In due course it will also carry the model springing and the power collection. Folding it up would have been tricky without my 'Hold and Fold' tool, which I put in my vice to leave both hands free to manipulate the various tools used to do the bending. The second side made the first side seem easy by comparison. The front end is left floating with no cross member, so I fabricated one from scrap etch which had the front edge recessed for the pony truck - see close up. The retaining plate ought to sit tight up against the underside of the frame but DB admits in the instructions that it doesn't but, as it is hidden by the wheels and brake hangers, this is not a major problem. I have inserted washers on the mounting bolts so that the retaining nuts can be tightened without distorting the retainer plate. My new front cross member is the same thickness as the washers so it also keeps everything level. To keep the dummy springs level and at the correct height I made up a little jig from brass U section and packings from scrap etch. These are a single thickness at the end with the spring adjustment mounting and double thickness at the other. I hope that makes sense! The jig was chemically blackened so that it didn't get accidentally soldered in place.

 

Edited.  See posting No. 633 for information on overcoming problems with the retaining plate

 

 

Edited August 19, 2016 by Killybegs

[45609]

Instead of spending a nice afternoon in the garden soaking up the sun I decided to hide in the workshop and remove the flanges from the middle driving wheels. Earlier on I deliberately left some material on the rear face of the wheel centres so that I had something to mount onto a step mandrel and keep things running true.  I had the foresight to not remove, from the Unimat chuck, the mandrel I turned up for machining the wheel centres a little while ago. So, after putting a small step onto the end of this mandrel, I was able to mount the wheels and secure with a nut and a washer.

 

 

Obviously all of the flange has to come off but I didn't want to turn too much off the diameter and make the wheel undersize.  For the first wheel I took a little off at a time until the flange was just cleaned off and then moved the cross slide in less than half a division on the handwheel.  (One division on the Unimat handwheel is 0.05mm). This essentially leaves the original coning of the tyre just on the front edge. This cross slide position was then locked for the remaining five wheels that needed the flange taken off.   The photos below show the work in progress and the result.

 

 

 

Step 2 is to now remove the redundant extra boss on the rear of the wheel centre and get the wheels down to the finished width.  I had previously said that the soft jaws in the Myford had been finished with and in a way they had. The previous recess diameter was of no use because this was sized to grip on the tyre flange outer diameter. A new setting was needed so I faced back the soft jaws and machined a new recess to grip on the slightly smaller flangeless outer diameter as shown below. 

 

 

It was then a relatively simple job to face off the boss to be flush with the rear of the tyre.

 

 

A little clean up and deburring after machining has now seen an end to this part of the work.  Every wheel has now been paired and bagged up following measurement across the outer faces whilst the pair is held over a back to back gauge. The measurement is required for each wheel pair as it is used for making the axles to the right length. Only 15 of those to do.....

 

Morgan

Edited August 13, 2016 by 45609

[Killybegs]

Instead of spending a nice afternoon in the garden soaking up the sun I decided to hide in the workshop and remove the flanges from the middle driving wheels. Earlier on I deliberately left some material on the rear face of the wheel centres so that I had something to mount onto a step mandrel and keep things running true.  I had the foresight to not remove, from the Unimat chuck, the mandrel I turned up for machining the wheel centres a little while ago. So, after putting a small step onto the end of this mandrel, I was able to mount the wheels and secure with a nut and a washer.

 

Flangeless 1.jpg

 

Obviously all of the flange has to come off but I didn't want to turn too much off the diameter and make the wheel undersize.  For the first wheel I took a little off at a time until the flange was just cleaned off and then moved the cross slide in less than half a division on the handwheel.  (One division on the Unimat handwheel is 0.05mm). This essentially leaves the original coning of the tyre just on the front edge. This cross slide position was then locked for the remaining five wheels that needed the flange taken off.   The photos below show the work in progress and the result.

 

Flangless 2.jpg

 

Flangeless 3.jpg

 

Step 2 is to now remove the redundant extra boss on the rear of the wheel centre and get the wheels down to the finished width.  I had previously said that the soft jaws in the Myford had been finished with and in a way they had. The previous recess diameter was of no use because this was sized to grip on the tyre flange outer diameter. A new setting was needed so I faced back the soft jaws and machined a new recess to grip on the slightly smaller flangeless outer diameter as shown below. 

 

Flangeless 4.jpg

 

It was then a relatively simple job to face off the boss to be flush with the rear of the tyre.

 

Flangeless 5.jpg

 

A little clean up and deburring after machining has now seen an end to this part of the work.  Every wheel has now been paired and bagged up following measurement across the outer faces whilst the pair is held over a back to back gauge. The measurement is required for each wheel pair as it is used for making the axles to the right length. Only 15 of those to do.....

 

Morgan

 

What a coincidence. I was tidying up the temporary wheel set yesterday afternoon. Having done the same wheel check with the back to back gauge (S4 News arrived on Friday!), their axles also need to be reduced in length.

[Mike G]

It certainly is so I'm glad it's got a big section on the Crostis. I had a look for the later Irwell publication 'The Book of the 9F 2-10-0s by Richard Derry' but it is out of print and secondhand copies are a silly price.

 

I'll bring my copy up next time. You can BORROW it.   I should have some motive power of my own to demonstrate. 

 

Mike

[barrowroad]

I'll bring my copy up next time. You can BORROW it.   I should have some motive power of my own to demonstrate. 

 

Mike

Thanks Mike, much appreciated - Tuesday 6th Sept is the next meeting at mine.

[Killybegs]

Still a long way to go but at least it's sitting on some wheels! Not the proper of wheels, of course, but a set that Morgan lent me to get things set up before letting me loose with the real things. No suspension yet, the bearings are sitting on little pads of 1mm styrene which puts it at about the correct level. I also have play around with washers and the like. One little problem that came up was with the tabs on top of the bearings which were fouling the the retaining plate. However, as they are asymmetric, I carefully removed them and re-soldered them the opposite way round to that shown in the instructions. This cured the problem. I even managed not to lose any.

 

[Dave Holt]

John,

Looking decidedly like a 9F, wrong wheels or not! Looking forward to further developments.

As a matter of interest, I went through Worseter(!!) (Shrub Hill?) last Saturday, behind Earl of Mount Edgecombe. Didn't see your Brit ('cause its at Barrow Road, I suspect).

Dave.

Edited August 18, 2016 by Dave Holt

[Killybegs]

In my post  No. 626, I mentioned the fact that the retaining plate didn't sit tight on the frames.

 

Since then, I have had another look at it and have found the cause(s) of the problem. The principle one is a clash with the horn plates. These project slightly below the bottom of the frame and the cut outs in the retainer plate are not quite wide enough to accommodate them. A few minutes with a file on each pair of cut outs cured the problem. On the model, there is a drop down on the frames that matches this projection of the horn plates. I found that this was slightly wider than the horn plates themselves which therefore added to the problem, so they were also filed back. Now, it is interesting to note that, looking at a couple of rather dark photographs of the prototype, it appears that although the horn guides come down below the level of the frames, the horn plates don't! Does anyone have any clear pics of this area?

 

 

There is also a clash between a cross member of the retaining plate and the front brake shaft bracket. A little work with a file on the cross member cured this.

 

Having got rid of the gap (and the need for the washers), I had to remove the bracing that I had added to the front of the retaining plate. This has now been replaced with a length of 1 x 1mm brass angle. This has to short enough to fit between the frames and the ends have to be notched to fit into the retaining plate.

 

 

Now, perhaps, I can proceed with sprung suspension!

[Killybegs]

Yesterday turned out to be one of those days when it seemed the world (and etched kits) were conspiring against me.

 

It was hard work tapping the retainer plate for the 10BA adjusting screws as it's a very difficult and delicate fabrication to hold securely without bending something, particularly when it comes to the two at the vulnerable front end. However all this paled into insignificance compared to trying to fiddle the springs into place. Magic them in to place might be more apt. Eventually I discovered that putting a curve on the spring helped get the one 'test' into place. I think, if at all possible, I am only going to do this once so that's going to when everything else is done and I have the proper wheels. I have modified a pair of fine nosed pliers to enable me to adjust the screws from below as I couldn't be doing with taking it all apart to fiddle with the adjustment. If I was building another one, I would probably look at designing an alternative suspension system prior to starting the chassis. 

 

As a result of all this fiddling about, the dogs were late getting their walk so we got caught in a heavy shower that we would have missed if we had gone out earlier. Did I have my waterproofs? No, there was a clear sky to the South. What was the rain doing coming from the North! On the way back I noticed that (presumably) an agricultural vehicle had had an argument with my hedge, leaving a tree halfway across the road. So much for my cup of tea. Out with saw, choppers and clippers. An hour later it was all done but needless to say I got soaked again.

 

This morning has gone better. One brake hanger and shoe assembled. This has been assembled as per instructions. DB says you really only need to go to this level of detail (soldering in a length of tube the cutting off the rest of the hanger below it before filing to a nice curve) on the front shoes which are more visible but I don't think I want to have all that excess length (which will be visible) below the shoe, so I will make them all the same. Incidentally the 2mm OD tube is oversize for the 1.75mm hangers, so I filed a length down to size prior to cutting off the 2mm length required. An extra thickness goes on the back of the front pair of shoes but is left off the others to allow for sideplay.

 

[Dave Holt]

Sounds like quite a day. At least you managed some positive progress with the brake hangers. The arrangement on the 9F was most unusual to get round the proximity of the wheel flanges and is well represented by Dave's design. These items were a bit more of a challenge with my Comet/Gibson hybrid chassis! The Comet chassis had a stretched wheelbase to suit "00" wheels so just provided conventional hanger/brake blocks whereas the Gibson mill frames had the correct wheelbase so required the hanger to be behind the wheels, as on the real thing. I ended up with the same arrangement as the DB kit.

Happy building,

Dave.

[Killybegs]

Well, all the brake hangers and shoes are finished at last. That's the trouble with having so many driving wheels. You may be able to see that those for the front wheels have full thickness shoes as they are more visible and there will be no side play on the front axle.

 

With so many to do I devised a simple assembly procedure that minimised the risk of of one bit moving while another bit was being soldered

1. Drill out all holes to 0.7mm

2. Remove cusp from all single thickness edges

3. Fold up shoes using 0.7mm drill bit to get correct alignment and solder. File off cusps on shoes.

4. Solder washers to hanger using 0.7mm and file off cusps.

5. Fold up hanger using 0.7mm drill bit to get correct alignment.

6. Insert short length of 0.7mm brass rod through brake shoes and hanger and solder in place after checking that everything is square and parallel. I have left these projecting out of the hangers for the time being.

7. Insert 2.0mm o/d tube between front and back sections of hanger. Retain in place with 0.7mm drill bit, check positioning using drill bit as guide and solder in place.

8. Cut off redundant hanger below tube and file to shape.

 

I do all my soldering of these small assembles in my little vice which has one terminal of the RSU attached to it with a crocodile clip. Old drill bits are great for keeping bits together without being accidentally soldered in place!

 

 

I made one change from the instructions in as much as I fitted washers (Parts 151) to both sides of the hanger to stop any lateral movement on the pivots. DB does provide 4 extra ones on the fret (they are easy to lose!) so I was only left with 6 extra ones to fabricate. These were filed up from scrap etch as shown below.

 

 

 

 

[45609]

That's the trouble with having so many driving wheels.

 

John, from my point of view that is the understatement of the week!

 

Nice work, by the way.

 

Morgan

[Mike G]

Nice work, by the way.

 

Morgan

 

Nah, he still can't eat a decent size breakfast   This looks more irresistible than, takes a gulp of air, than the Brit...gotta go and lie down.

 

Mike

[Killybegs]

I have been reviewing the recommendations for fitting the brake gear and have come up with a plan of my own. DB suggests making the whole lot removable to enable the wheels to be dropped out if needs be. However, I have run a few checks and have come to the conclusion that only the brake stretchers and pull rods would need to come off.

 

I have therefore finished off the brake hangers by soldering in a short lengths of 0.7mm rod, turned down to 0.45mm at the outer end, to represent the ends of the stretcher assembly. The latter can then be sprung into the back of the hangers. Washers (part 39a) were soldered on at the same time.

 

[Dave Holt]

John,

I hope you'll be able to get the brake hangers to pass down between the wheels and the frames if you want them to be removable as I doubt they'll pass between the wheel flanges.

I remember now that on my home brewed version, I made the hangers a permanent fixture to the frames and opened the bottom hole (in the hangers) into a slot so the outer sections with the brake blocks, together with the stretchers and pull rods could be removed as a unit from below, but leaving the hangers in place.

Regards,

Dave.

[Killybegs]

John,

I hope you'll be able to get the brake hangers to pass down between the wheels and the frames if you want them to be removable as I doubt they'll pass between the wheel flanges.

I remember now that on my home brewed version, I made the hangers a permanent fixture to the frames and opened the bottom hole (in the hangers) into a slot so the outer sections with the brake blocks, together with the stretchers and pull rods could be removed as a unit from below, but leaving the hangers in place.

Regards,

Dave.

 

Hi Dave,

Provided one starts removing the wheels from the front, the hangers can be swung forward to allow the wheel sets to be dropped out.

[Killybegs]

In between social engagements and housework today, I found time to make a start on the brake stretchers. As can be seen in the photo below, the stretchers come with the locations of the holes lightly etched but no detailing. This was fabricated from 0.20mm N/S strip and 0.45 N/S rod. The etched stretchers have been filed to look a bit more like round rods. The other end of the pull rod is yet to be detailed.

 

[Killybegs]

I finally finished the brake gear last week and have now moved on to the plumbing, the fabrication of which certainly required a lot of patience. That was after I had got my head around where pipes started and where they finished. The first thing I looked into was how to secure the tops of the pipes under the footplate. I settled on a piece of styrene let into the top of the firebox and drilled to take the pipes. Sorting out exactly where to drill the holes for the 5 pipes was in itself a major exercise. The pic below shows the assembly straight from the workbench so there is still some cleaning up to do. 

 

[Bulwell Hall]

I finally finished the brake gear last week and have now moved on to the plumbing, the fabrication of which certainly required a lot of patience. That was after I had got my head around where pipes started and where they finished. The first thing I looked into was how to secure the tops of the pipes under the footplate. I settled on a piece of styrene let into the top of the firebox and drilled to take the pipes. Sorting out exactly where to drill the holes for the 5 pipes was in itself a major exercise. The pic below shows the assembly straight from the workbench so there is still some cleaning up to do. 

 

92006.64b.jpg

John

 

This just gets better and better.  I do look forward to seeing her on her proper wheels and with coupling rods, connecting rods and all the valve gear fitted!  Keep up the good work - she is going to be stunning!

 

Gerry

[Mike G]

John

 

This just gets better and better.  I do look forward to seeing her on her proper wheels and with coupling rods, connecting rods and all the valve gear fitted!  Keep up the good work - she is going to be stunning!

 

Gerry

 

Definitely!

[The Stationmaster]

I finally finished the brake gear last week and have now moved on to the plumbing, the fabrication of which certainly required a lot of patience. That was after I had got my head around where pipes started and where they finished. The first thing I looked into was how to secure the tops of the pipes under the footplate. I settled on a piece of styrene let into the top of the firebox and drilled to take the pipes. Sorting out exactly where to drill the holes for the 5 pipes was in itself a major exercise. The pic below shows the assembly straight from the workbench so there is still some cleaning up to do. 

 

92006.64b.jpg

 

WOW!!!!!

[Killybegs]

Fortunately, there's a lot less pipework on the other side of the loco!

 

[Killybegs]

Just in case the underside of the loco feels neglected, here are those bits of pipework that are fixed to the body rather than the chassis. They are fairly crude but they do appear from and disappear under the footplate in the right places. The large diameter exhaust steam inlet pipe needed filing down to half thickness to conceal it behind the valance where it is attached to the underside of the over thick footplate. 

 

Only one sand box has been modelled as it is the only one visible.

 

You can also see that the inspection holes for the lifting arms have now been drilled out.

 

 

[Killybegs]

As we are off on our hols next week, and I probably won't get a lot more done before then, I will leave you with a pic of 92006, still on her temporary wheels and bereft of brakes and valve gear for the time being. I am hoping to pick up the wheels at the beginning of November but in the meantime I have the cylinder wrappers to put on and I need to make up the sanding assemblies. I think the chassis is now ready for a trip to the paint shop but that will have to wait for a while.

 

[Mike G]

SPANKING!!