Marbelup Posted February 14, 2014 Share Posted February 14, 2014 I have read a few reviews of the Form 1 SLA printer but not seen or heard of anyone seriously using one for model railway applications. Has anyone seen any actual results or good photos of prints from the Form 1? I wonder if it comes close to the results Rabs has been getting from his B9Creator. I would also be interested in any feedback of the durability and longevity of the finished parts, as this is an issue with some SLA resins. Although it would be nice to have my own printer, I haven't seen anything affordable that can do good quality and sufficient build size for my models. For now, I am continuing to use Prime Gray from I.Materialise and getting pretty good results provided I work within the limitations of the material. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted February 15, 2014 Share Posted February 15, 2014 I'm also interested to hear from anyone who has used one because the only opinions I've seen are from people with a very obvious bias either for or against it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lyneux Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 I'm interested in both of these machines (Form1 and B9Creator). Now that they have both been available for over a year, I've been trying to find more information on the Form1. I've just been reading this: http://kelsorj.wordpress.com The author has had two Form1 machines and neither has printed his test piece all that well. At one point he compares his calibration model with one printed on a B9 Creator. An interesting comment about the B9 resin (not sure if it is "red" or "cherry"): "It has the tactile feel of wax and a strong press with a fingernail leaves an indentation." At the end of the day the B9 Creator still seems to come out on top. My only worry is the self-assembly nature of the B9 kit: there seems to be a large chance of messing up the calibration when assembling it (hinted at by threads such as this: http://b9creator.com/support/?mingleforumaction=viewtopic&t=2179.0 If I were to go for a B9 Creator, it'd have to be using one of the other available resins (e.g. Spot HT). Guy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 It took me about 6 months of trials to get to the point where I could consistently expect successful prints with my B9. Others have found it easier, and there's a lot more information about now than when I started. That's not to say that I didn't have successes before then and that I haven't had failures since. I'd recommend the spot-HT resin over any of the others if you dont't need to metal cast things. One thing to watch out with the Form 1 is that they generally don't put a scale bar next to their photos. I had a rather frustrating conversation with one owner where he insisted that the Form1 printed the eiffel tower with better detail than the one on the B9. It took quite a while (and about 5 repetitions) to get him to realise that his print was about 4x larger! No wonder those 'super thin' details came out Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanbuttler Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 Hi Rabs, I'm yet to build my B9, had it about 2 weeks now but not had the time to concentrate on the build properly yet. There is a course at the distributor's (iMakr) on Monday 3rd Nov which I'm going to, I'll start the build after that. I'll let you know how I get on I think you're right Rab's there is a lot more content around now to help you build and calibrate, hopefully I'll get on ok. I've a bottle of Cherry and Red resin - what are the benefits of the spot-HT over the B9 stuff? Cheers Al Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 I've found that it's: Mechanically stronger and stiffer Doesn't smell as bad Doesn't feel waxy after printing Is more tolerant of slightly incorrect print settings Doesn't degrade the PDMS as badly Holds small details better Additional strength means small details are more likely to survive Less prone to cracking after time in the sun Basically, it's better in every way except it's slightly more expensive and that you can't cast it. It gets underrated on the B9 becuase it's no good for jewellery (because you can't cast it) and most users are making jewellery. However, it's great for models. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanbuttler Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 Crikey! I might see about returning my unused Red and getting some of this stuff. Do you know what resolution its capable of or does that not matter? With the B9 it appears you need Cherry for the 30mn stuff. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugsley Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 The Spot HT is capable of creating the smallest details - I've got some parts where an unsupported wire came out successfully - I'll post some pics later. In terms of assembly, the B9 is pretty straightforward - the instructions on the website are very good - allow the best part of a day for it though. I have a B9 and a Form 1, and I'll be honest, I don't really use the Form 1 at all, the B9 is much better for small scale stuff, so I'm probably going to sell mine and use the funds to upgrade my B9 to the latest spec. The B9 is better for 'pushing the envelope' as well - you can tweak all of the settings easily, it's not all wrapped up in proprietary settings. Anyone want to buy a Form 1? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stadman Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 I have a sample print from a form1, looks ok, should try to paint and see how it goes. Don't know if it's straight from printer or been fettled before sending. Kev S Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Good sales job! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stadman Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Good sales job! No commitment to buy though Had a makerbot sample as well, unfinished so showed all the layers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugsley Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Good sales job! I think my standards are excessively high - it's probably good enough for most people! I know of others who are getting good results with theirs - the biggest problem I have is the lack of time to work out how to get the best out of it. The B9 arrived first, so I've got that working brilliantly and know how to use it better. Because of that, it's the default 'go to' when I need to do something. Kev - If you do decide to buy one, let me know - I'll do you a good deal and I'm not too far away from you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stadman Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I think my standards are excessively high - it's probably good enough for most people! I know of others who are getting good results with theirs - the biggest problem I have is the lack of time to work out how to get the best out of it. The B9 arrived first, so I've got that working brilliantly and know how to use it better. Because of that, it's the default 'go to' when I need to do something. Kev - If you do decide to buy one, let me know - I'll do you a good deal and I'm not too far away from you. So many toys, so close to Christmas Better send a letter to the bearded one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebell Model Railway Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I was contacted by Form labs about 5 months ago asking if they could borrow some models to test there Form1 plus, results were very good, I got my test prints a little while ago I was impressed sadly they didn't send a printer with them... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabs Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Looks good, what scale are they? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyH Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 We have a newt model, Form 1+, at work. It is slightly like the envisiontec machine where you have to really experiment with the angle of the build and support materials. Great resolution, but requires experience and finesse to produce usable models. They have really made me think about what I can produce at my custom scale with a block of (small) metal and hand files, Cheers, A Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebell Model Railway Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 They are OO Scale Rabs.as they were looking at how well their machine would cope with models like this. Sadly I can only dream of getting one of these machines, but was nice to be asked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marbelup Posted October 31, 2014 Author Share Posted October 31, 2014 Hello Bluebell Any thoughts on the robustness and stability of the Form1+ prints? Have they shown any signs of warping in the time you have had them? Have you tried painting them to see if they take paint well? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebell Model Railway Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 No warping, the material or resin is quite flexiable so probably need slightly thicker walls... but nothings broken off.No not tried painting them they were going to be used as demo pieces showing the differences, But have painted a similar one from a local company, but the quality was a tad better and a bit more strong. But the form labs print might be down to the curing process to harden it.. maybe it had been sent before it had finished that process. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marbelup Posted November 1, 2014 Author Share Posted November 1, 2014 Thanks Bluebell Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointstaken Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Looking at the posts above, reminds me of the early days of home computers in the mid 80s. I did eventually buy a NewBrain computer (no comments from you lot either!) running CP/M. Using a printer needed "bit twiddling" as a Laskys salesman informed me, with storage on a tape drive. I'll wait until these 3D printers become commodity items. I don't want someone twiddling with my bits, thank you. Dennis Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stadman Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Looking at the posts above, reminds me of the early days of home computers in the mid 80s. I did eventually buy a NewBrain computer (no comments from you lot either!) running CP/M. Using a printer needed "bit twiddling" as a Laskys salesman informed me, with storage on a tape drive. I'll wait until these 3D printers become commodity items. I don't want someone twiddling with my bits, thank you. Dennis We all like to wait a while to see how things develop, it was years before I bought a digital camera. Without the early investors things would never progress. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marbelup Posted November 4, 2014 Author Share Posted November 4, 2014 The Form1+ is worth keeping an eye on as it is one of the few "affordable" 3D printers (along with the B9 creator) which can potentially offer quality similar to the best available from Shapeways, i.Materialise, etc. because it uses Stereolithography. Almost all the numerous other home-based printers are the "extrusion" type and simply not capable of producing smooth, detailed models. There is a good review of the Form1 at http://3dprintingindustry.com/2014/07/08/form1-3d-printer-review-renishaw/ Interesting that the print quality holds up against printers costing up to 36 times more. I would think seriously about a Form1+ apart from the fact that most of my S scale models, apart from 4-wheelers, are too large. Even ordering from i.Materialise (Prime Gray), I have to orient some models at 45 degrees to fit within the maximum build size (yes, they allow that). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
billbedford Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 There is also the Projet1200 which RS (!) are selling for £3200. Though to me the 46 x 27mm build platform looks too small Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marbelup Posted November 4, 2014 Author Share Posted November 4, 2014 Just a teensy bit small, but you can build things 150 mm tall! Good for giraffes! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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