Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 2, 2017 Author Share Posted April 2, 2017 Hi Phill, Cracking work as always. Thats going to make an impressive and enjoyable feature (watching trains snake through the garden). Can I ask a couple of questions... Ive only just been able to get near the garden as its been so wet-so Ive performed some minor maintenance to the track bed. I seem to remember you saying that you had similar conditions and shift in the ground (clay?) which affected your original concrete track bed? How will you avoid such with your new viaduct? Also with decent plastic impregnated (Phenolic) ply now no longer available, plys, inc. marine ply being costly and varying in quality, '25yr exterior MDF' also being pricey, what materials are you using for the trackbed either side of the viaduct? Atvb CME I don't think that was me as I don't recall ever having problems with clay soil moving my track foundations? Hopefully the viaduct will have firm enough foundations......if not I will cross that bridge when I come to it ! I have some off cuts of the original Phenolic Ply from nearly 20 years ago to finish the project (I knew they would come in handy one day ) . But if i did need to use new wood I would us that fancy outdoor MDF ( Medite Trycoya) which although expensive seems to do the job! (y) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted April 2, 2017 Share Posted April 2, 2017 (edited) I don't think that was me as I don't recall ever having problems with clay soil moving my track foundations? Hopefully the viaduct will have firm enough foundations......if not I will cross that bridge when I come to it ! I have some off cuts of the original Phenolic Ply from nearly 20 years ago to finish the project (I knew they would come in handy one day ) . But if i did need to use new wood I would us that fancy outdoor MDF ( Medite Trycoya) which although expensive seems to do the job! (y) Hi Phill, Apologies-I thought that we had discussed, a year or two back, that your 'MK1' layout had a concrete track-bed that sufferred from shift and thus broke up? Your viaduct should be okay as above ground though. Lucky you re the Phenolic ply, the original stuff sounds perfect for the job! I will let you know how my PVCu/Filcris experiment works. The exterior MDF, according to hype and manufacturer's info, sounds great, but as some will, 'last a lifetime' and some merely 25 yrs, no one yet knows if such is fact. Seems like a good stable, flat, smooth starting point though, especially if topped off with heat applied mineralised roofing felt. ATVB CME Edited April 2, 2017 by CME and Bottlewasher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 2, 2017 Author Share Posted April 2, 2017 Hi Phill, Apologies-I thought that we had discussed, a year or two back, that your 'MK1' layout had a concrete track-bed that sufferred from shift and thus broke up? Your viaduct should be okay as above ground though. Lucky you re the Phenolic ply, the original stuff sounds perfect for the job! I will let you know how my PVCu/Filcris experiment works. The exterior MDF, according to hype and manufacturer's info, sounds great, but as some will, 'last a lifetime' and some merely 25 yrs, no one yet knows if such is fact. Seems like a good stable, flat, smooth starting point though, especially if topped off with heat applied mineralised roofing felt. ATVB CME Hi CME, The problem I found with the concrete track base was the constant concrete dust & grit getting onto the loco wheels which created problems back then as I was using track power not R/C as I do now I think your idea of UPVC track base is an excellent one & with adequate support will I'm sure be a great success.........how does it compare to the fancy MDF cost wise? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 2, 2017 Author Share Posted April 2, 2017 This afternoon I have been working on both approaches to the viaduct in the sun ........ 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted April 2, 2017 Share Posted April 2, 2017 Coming on well and highly inspirational to get me into the garden too next week. Having looked at yours, I have thought for some time I should get mine lower, but it would mean demolishing most of what exists already, after all, the baseboards started at operating height within the shed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 2, 2017 Author Share Posted April 2, 2017 Coming on well and highly inspirational to get me into the garden too next week. Having looked at yours, I have thought for some time I should get mine lower, but it would mean demolishing most of what exists already, after all, the baseboards started at operating height within the shed. How high in the garden would your line be ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted April 2, 2017 Share Posted April 2, 2017 (edited) How high in the garden would your line be ? Just measured and it is 45" where it leaves the bottom end of the shed and will be 48" thereabouts if it continues down the garden on the level. Because of having DCC Sound, it would be interesting to have an incline and gradually drop the line. Starting with a new height would not pose any problems inside the shed, as the baseboards could easily be lowered, but the existing top-end external loop is still in situ and it would entail removing the well made top and reducing the height of the posts. I think I will just introduce an incline when building the second garden extension. Edited April 2, 2017 by coachmann Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted April 2, 2017 Share Posted April 2, 2017 (edited) Hi CME, The problem I found with the concrete track base was the constant concrete dust & grit getting onto the loco wheels which created problems back then as I was using track power not R/C as I do now I think your idea of UPVC track base is an excellent one & with adequate support will I'm sure be a great success.........how does it compare to the fancy MDF cost wise? Hi Phill, ahh, I understand, such dust & detritus would play havoc with 7mm scale locos. The Upvc/Pvcu?? Is dirt cheap, I get trade at local supplier, plus ocassional FOC off cuts/damaged items. The Filcris product is more expensive, yet they still did me a great deal and cut such roughly to size FOC before shipping and Filcris is as long lasting as cockroaches after a nuclear war or wheatabix when mixed with milk and left to dry out, so great value for money. Ironically the steel posts show signs of pitting-theyre up cycled from Down Ampney MK1-and wont last as long as the galv up-cycled posts (used on the rest of the layout)-having said that, they will still last years. With plastic baseboards expansion & contraction may be an issue....time will tell. In fact one could use plastic soil pipes with concrete in them as posts/uprights. Kindest regards, CME. Edited April 2, 2017 by CME and Bottlewasher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 3, 2017 Author Share Posted April 3, 2017 Excuse my ignorance, but what is FOC & Filcris? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 Sorry Phill, FOC=FREE OF CHARGE. Filcris recycle plastics into forms that replicate wood/wooden sections (same sort of stuff that is used by local authorities for benches, bins etc etc) The G45/SM32 fraternity have been using them for a few years. IIRC, I discovered them a few years back and wrote about them in a couple of articles and on WT et al. The whole Filcris system isnt entirely suitable for 7mm, yet many parts/sections are, especially when coupled with PVCu. Hope that clarifies. ATVB CME. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 3, 2017 Author Share Posted April 3, 2017 Thanks for that CME....BTW with regards to posts, I have always used metposts with 4x4 wooden fence posts & never had any problems with them & some are now pushing 20 years old! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 Hi Phill, Thats great service from those products...metposts are a great product as they keep the post out of the wet/soil and thus increase longevity. On clay (here) though half of the year they lean and rock about, as the clay dries/cracks up, also, timber quality is a mixed bag too. The knack for timber now is find as straight and true a piece as possible and rot proof the heck out of it-with the loss of proper creosote (and engine oil a no, no) even thats a bit of a challenge. Hence my weird and wonderful construction methods. Lol! ATVB, CME 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted May 3, 2017 Author Share Posted May 3, 2017 An unlikely pairing in the form of my DJH/Model Express Warship Druid & my Heljan Crompton in Withercombe yard. Druid has in fact just returned from testing new trackwork & permanent way on the branch line......... 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted May 3, 2017 Share Posted May 3, 2017 Very nice Phill! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted May 3, 2017 Share Posted May 3, 2017 ....Druid has in fact just returned from testing new trackwork & permanent way on the branch line......... 1-20170430_140636.jpg Hi Phill....Have you shot any videos of Druid's test runs around the new alignment...especially sending forth powerful reverberations via Bluetooth? Randall 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted May 3, 2017 Author Share Posted May 3, 2017 Hi Phill.... Have you shot any videos of Druid's test runs around the new alignment...especially sending forth powerful reverberations via Bluetooth? Randall Hi Randall Druid certainly was making sweet Maybach Music via Bluetooth , as was D7022 today ......no video yet, but I will take some for you when I get chance 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted May 4, 2017 Share Posted May 4, 2017 Hi Randall Druid certainly was making sweet Maybach Music via Bluetooth , as was D7022 today ......no video yet, but I will take some for you when I get chance Thanks Phill.....because you and your layout are so highly thought of, anything you do will demonstrate to many more people than I could reach that very cheap, decent high quality sound is achieveable without relying on soundchips. I can't wait! Randall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted May 5, 2017 Author Share Posted May 5, 2017 Here's a short film of Druid in action with her Bluetooth sound system for Randall & anyone else who would like to see it 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 Here's a short film of Druid in action with her Bluetooth sound system for Randall & anyone else who would like to see it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oD4j4dHnw8Y Thanks Phill... I'm overjoyed to see Druid wending her short freight through such a superb setting complimented by bluetooth sound. I hope others will be attracted to trying it for themselves. Randall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 Superb! So much better than DCC in this instance.....Im tempted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daifly Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 Superb! So much better than DCC in this instance.....Im tempted! In what way "better" pray? What are we missing that you have heard? Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CME and Bottlewasher Posted May 5, 2017 Share Posted May 5, 2017 In what way "better" pray? What are we missing that you have heard? Dave Hi Dave, Although speed and motion may/may not be synchronised as it is with eg. DCC, it lacks, most DCC's, 'fart in a baked bean tin' sound reproduction (some are better than others). In short Phill's model Warship, sounds like a real Warship bursting through a tunnel/cutting. My hearing isnt what it once was (it was near to pitch perfect at one time) and Id have to hear it live, but very much like Mostyn's et al's under-baseboard sound system, it sounds highly realistic, most DCC sound decoders dont, because sound doesnt scale well etc etc. ATVB CME Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daifly Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 Surely the sound quality will have a great deal more to do with the speaker size and DCC or BT is just a delivery system. Both will presumably use a digital sound file which will vary in quality depending on the way they're put together. The sound on the video will vary with the quality of the recording equipment used - again nothing to do with DCC v BT. I still don't get it. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyWales Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 Surely the sound quality will have a great deal more to do with the speaker size and DCC or BT is just a delivery system. Both will presumably use a digital sound file which will vary in quality depending on the way they're put together. The sound on the video will vary with the quality of the recording equipment used - again nothing to do with DCC v BT. I still don't get it. Dave Hi Dave... DCC sound quality is constrained by the compression necessary to store samples on the chip. Lots of the harmonics are lost. Sending quality uncompressed (in this context) sounds (even through tiny speakers) via bluetooth is much better. Phill uses Radio Control/battery power so he's happy to have a sound system that doesn't rely on track power. Lastly, it can cost less than £15 per loco. Huge benefits, as I'm sure you'll agree. Randall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3 link Posted May 6, 2017 Share Posted May 6, 2017 Hi Dave... DCC sound quality is constrained by the compression necessary to store samples on the chip. Lots of the harmonics are lost. Sending quality uncompressed (in this context) sounds (even through tiny speakers) via bluetooth is much better. Phill uses Radio Control/battery power so he's happy to have a sound system that doesn't rely on track power. Lastly, it can cost less than £15 per loco. Huge benefits, as I'm sure you'll agree. Randall When I am on a long journey in the car I use Bluetooth between the cars audio and my iPhone, that way I can play all my favourite tunes, and the wireless sound quality is very good. Martyn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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