Mid-Cornwall Lines - 1950s Western Region in 00

[The Stationmaster]

2 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

I'm not sure which was the Gannel siding and I can't see a reference in my copy of Cooke section 11 to any track at Tolcarn Junction being removed in 1928. However, there seems to have been no facing connection to the siding on the Up side of the main line after the layout was expanded in 1940. There was, though, a facing connection to the sidings next to the Newquay - Chacewater leg of the triangle - but that was a signalled move, so doesn't really help with your query.

Depends which edition of Cooke you have. The Gannel Siding is named in the latest edition and was the siding adjacent the running line as you came round the 'branch line' curve from Perranporth.   It remained after the 1940 alterations but lost its name and was differently connected at the Newquay end.   Why on earth it was called the Gannel Siding can only be explained by, I think, the GWR's version of logic as although  it was a long way from the River Gannel it was closer to it than any other line or siding at Tolcarn Jcn.  Incidentally it helps if I look at Tony's drawing the right way round as it was the connection at the remote (from Newquay end) which was removed in 1928 - earlier post corrected. mea culpa).

 

2 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

I don't know. The Down Inner Home had a main route indication (but no Draw Ahead) to the Sidings (40), so perhaps they went into the "Loop" road next to Platform 3, from where the loco could run round via Platform 3 itself and shunt the goods yard.

 

Alternatively, the loco could hook off at the Down Inner Home and run round via the Up Main, then propel the whole train into the sidings, although that would block both main lines during the move.

 

The goods yard on the model Pentowan will be laid out quite differently of course.

Good to see that you are going to renumber the platforms in what I regard as the correct way (not that GWR was entirely consistent in doing that itself😮).

 

Although. logically, there wasn't a Calling On Signal into the sidings on the Inner Home there was of course one of those (G)WR signalling peculiarities as a way of saving money.  So there was a 4ft long running arm reading into the sidings in conjunction with the route indicator (lever No.40) - which saved providing a separate 3ft arm to read to the sidings.  (if it had been the LMS/R doing it it would have been a bit different, and a bit different again if it had been the Southern  Area of the LNER/ER although both of them would have used the subsidiary arm to read the sidings if they hadn't provided a separate arm for that purpose)

[St Enodoc]

22 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

Depends which edition of Cooke you have.

Annotated "Third Print". Each page is dated Feb 74.

 

22 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

Why on earth it was called the Gannel Siding can only be explained by, I think, the GWR's version of logic as although  it was a long way from the River Gannel it was closer to it than any other line or siding at Tolcarn Jcn.

That's all I could think of too. Might has well have called it the Atlantic siding, which would have sounded far more exciting.

 

22 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

Incidentally it helps if I look at Tony's drawing the right way round as it was the connection at the remote (from Newquay end) which was removed in 1928 - earlier post corrected. mea culpa).

Feb 74 edition shows 1.1940 for all those alterations. That does make more sense though!

 

22 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

Good to see that you are going to renumber the platforms

My convention is to number all tracks from rear to front as seen by the operators, regardless of what the real thing did.

 

22 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

So there was a 4ft long running arm reading into the sidings in conjunction with the route indicator (lever No.40) - which saved providing a separate 3ft arm to read to the sidings.

The first time I've seen that entirely logical explanation - thanks!

[St Enodoc]

A bit more research. There's a drawing on the Cornwall Railway Society website of the layout at Tolcarn Junction, which confirms that the two sidings next to the Newquay - Chacewater line were indeed the Gannel sidings and the siding next to the main line was the Trencreek siding.

 

Now back to buffer stops.

 

Here's my latest thinking, based on the GWR General Appendix 1936 p157; the BR Rule Book 1950 Rule 32, various photos and your very welcome suggestions here:

 

1. All buffer stops - matt dark brown overall (same as track and points).

 

2. Porthmellyn Road No1 and No2 spur - lamps with white lenses on right (nearest main lines).

 

3. Pentowan platforms 1, 2 and 3 - red beams and lamps with red lenses. I can't work out the location of these. Some photos, depending on date, suggest that they are on the left, in the centre or on the right. Unless anyone comes up with a convincing argument otherwise, I think I'll put them in the centre. my reasoning being that they would be equally visible (or invisible?) to the driver when running chimney leading or chimney trailing.

 

4. All others - no lamps.

 

For the lamps themselves, I'll use some from the old Ratio 466 GWR square post signals kit, either with or without brackets.

 

I think that should all look fine from "normal viewing distances".

 

Thanks to everyone who's contributed to this discussion so far.

[The Stationmaster]

1 hour ago, St Enodoc said:

A bit more research. There's a drawing on the Cornwall Railway Society website of the layout at Tolcarn Junction, which confirms that the two sidings next to the Newquay - Chacewater line were indeed the Gannel sidings and the siding next to the main line was the Trencreek siding.

 

Now back to buffer stops.

 

Here's my latest thinking, based on the GWR General Appendix 1936 p157; the BR Rule Book 1950 Rule 32, various photos and your very welcome suggestions here:

 

1. All buffer stops - matt dark brown overall (same as track and points).

 

2. Porthmellyn Road No1 and No2 spur - lamps with white lenses on right (nearest main lines).

 

3. Pentowan platforms 1, 2 and 3 - red beams and lamps with red lenses. I can't work out the location of these. Some photos, depending on date, suggest that they are on the left, in the centre or on the right. Unless anyone comes up with a convincing argument otherwise, I think I'll put them in the centre. my reasoning being that they would be equally visible (or invisible?) to the driver when running chimney leading or chimney trailing.

 

4. All others - no lamps.

 

For the lamps themselves, I'll use some from the old Ratio 466 GWR square post signals kit, either with or without brackets.

 

I think that should all look fine from "normal viewing distances".

 

Thanks to everyone who's contributed to this discussion so far.

Judging by what I saw locally back along the lamp on the stop block at a station platform was placed on the end of the top of the block nearest the platform - which obviously made things a bit simpler for the Lampie.  But at Henley under the overall roof the stop blocks had a lamp at each end of the buffer beam while the other, shorter, platform appears at times to have had no lamp at all although it might well have been removed if a vehicle was stabled there😮.  The lamp cases were always black.  The buffer beam was painted red

 

An interesting question about stop blocks is when they began to be painted black on the Western (presumably with a bitumen based paint?).  The GWR 1936 GA and the  WR 1960 Regional Appendix both refer to 'men painting stop blocks'.  and I can recall black painted stop blocks on the Western from a long way back although it was no doubt discontinued at some time.

[St Enodoc]

12 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

Judging by what I saw locally back along the lamp on the stop block at a station platform was placed on the end of the top of the block nearest the platform - which obviously made things a bit simpler for the Lampie.  But at Henley under the overall roof the stop blocks had a lamp at each end of the buffer beam while the other, shorter, platform appears at times to have had no lamp at all although it might well have been removed if a vehicle was stabled there😮.  The lamp cases were always black.  The buffer beam was painted red

Thanks Mike. That's a good summary of what I found from the very few photos I could find that were clear enough to interpret. Sometimes the lamps were on the platform side, sometimes on the other. Sometimes they were on the right and sometimes on the left, irrespective of which was the platform side. Sometimes they were in the centre. Sometimes (mostly in the diesel era I think) there were lamps at both ends of the beams. Sometimes there didn't seem to be any lamps at all.

 

Take your pick!

[St Enodoc]

22 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

2. Porthmellyn Road No1 and No2 spur - lamps with white lenses on right (nearest main lines).

Fitted tonight. Photos tomorrow then, with luck, spraying.

[St Enodoc]

Here's one of the two lamp-fitted buffer stops for Porthmellyn Road.

 

 

The lamp is sliced off one of the dolls in the Ratio 466 kit and just fixed to the end of the beam with cyano.

 

It's a fine, almost calm, day today so I'll wait for the dew point to rise a bit more, then head out to the paint shop (more commonly known as the lawn).

 

Today's other main job is to tidy up the railway room ready for tomorrow's postponed running session. There should be 8 of us so a good afternoon is in prospect.

[john dew]

1 hour ago, St Enodoc said:

 

 

 

 

 

It's a fine, almost calm, day today so I'll wait for the dew point to rise a bit more, then head out to the paint shop (more commonly known as the lawn).

 

Today's other main job is to tidy up the railway room ready for tomorrow's postponed running session. There should be 8 of us so a good afternoon is in prospect.

You called?

[St Enodoc]

This morning I finished the two Porthmellyn Road Spur buffers stops, by gently sanding away the paint from the front of the lamps leaving a dull white disc to represent the lens.

 

 

The afternoon was devoted to the running session. In the end, there were only seven of us so with just two yardmasters, a signalman (working both boxes) and Fat Controller combined, and four drivers it was quite intensive. Nevertheless, we got through 31 trains, which I think was pretty good. It's now just before 0800 on Saturday in Mid-Cornwall and the main line has calmed down a bit after the passage of no fewer than 9 overnight expresses from Paddington, Bristol and Wolverhampton (so far).

 

Next time, in January, @Barry O will be here again, which will be good after a break of three years.

 

In the meantime, after fitting the buffer stops and a few other odds and ends, it will be time to start cutting timber for Pentowan, which is quite an exciting prospect.

[St Enodoc]

Today I installed four of the new buffer stops.

 

 

At Porthmellyn Road, the extended front rails on the LM&S kits let me fit a full Peco N gauge insulated fishplate to each rail, to eliminate the risk of spurious short circuits if the rails move or expand. I only noticed when taking these photos that one of the fishplates has slipped under a rail, which I find a common problem with these small items.

 

Fitting these let me recover two Hornby-Dublo buffer stops that are now back in place at the ends of the Chapel Sidings.

 

 

At Wheal Veronica, there's no room for fishplates on the MT buffer stop side, so I cut one end off each, leaving half the fishplate plus the little spacing piece. I think I've cut slightly too much rail away on the sidings but that can be disguised with some weeds one day. You can see the small extension shelf that replaced Baz's Buffers and gave me room for the MT units.

 

Finally, here are the new buffer stops with the china-clay wagons and the coal wagon back in place.

 

A touch of paint and some ballast and that will be another little job crossed off The List!

[St Enodoc]

Yet another brake van is on its way to Mid-Cornwall, this time from our favourite (sometimes) auction site.

 

It's a Bachmann Toad in bauxite, branded Tavistock Junction, which will share the main line Class D workings with its Penzance-based cousin.

[Stubby47]

 

KMRC Bargains

[St Enodoc]

16 hours ago, Stubby47 said:

 

KMRC Bargains

Thanks Stu. The TOPS era van is a little out of period for me. I've already got the Helston Branch van, of course (plus a number of other Kernow specials)!

[St Enodoc]

So, Dapol corridor Toplights are on the way. A couple of full brakes will definitely be in order and a small selection of the passenger coaches, to complement my Slaters kits and replace some long-unbuilt BSL/Phoenix kits too I think.

[St Enodoc]

I knocked another job off The List today.

 

When we moved into our house, "we" decided that we didn't want the carpets in the lounge room and dining room, so when the railway room was built, I laid them on the floor.

 

Because of their sizes, there was a gap in the corner at what became the Up end of Penzance and the Down end of Porthmellyn Road.

 

I investigated buying an off-cut from a carpet shop but most weren't interested and those that were quoted silly prices, meaning that they probably weren't interested either.

 

Things stayed like that until a month or two ago, when a local discount store offered a suitable rug for well under $100 that could be made to fit by cutting away a corner.

 

 

Here it is. I think the operators, particularly the Penzance yardmasters, will appreciate it.

 

Finally, for all you jacaranda lovers, this is a view you won't see very often. Our neighbour opposite always puts up a good Christmas display and this year the jacaranda in his back yard is still in bloom. I reckon that's your lot for this year in the blossom department now though.

[St Enodoc]

Today we had our first joint North Shore Railway Modellers' Association/British Railway Modellers of Australia joint social meeting for three years. Apart from an excellent pizza lunch and plenty of chinwagging, the main attraction was the NSRMA's latest layout, which represents a stretch of the NSW Main West line through the Blue Mountains, in H0 scale. The layout is about 15m long and its main features are Valley Heights station and loco depot and Katoomba station, which will allow double-headed and/or banked trains to operate on the 1 in 40 gradient. The layout will make its first appearance in this extended form at the Forestville exhibition in March.

 

 

I also came away with a few offcuts of two different types of XPS foam sheets to try out, before deciding which to use for landscape work on the Mid-Cornwall lines in due course.

[Coach bogie]

We have some interesting red blossom trees alongside the purple in Brisbane.

 

Back in UK now. Winter so no leaves on the trees. But I do have the luxury of three model shops, in the area. Already stocking up for my return to Aus.

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

[St Enodoc]

Today I cut quite a lot of 42x19 and 64x19 timber, to make an almost complete kit of parts for the Pentowan baseboard structure. I say almost complete, because I still need to cut the diagonal bracing for the two leg units. I'll do this when I assemble the legs, so that they're nice and square. That took me, neatly, almost to the end of the Perth Test Match.

 

Next weekend, I should be able to assemble everything and then lay some plywood on top, temporarily. That will let me mark out some track centres with a view to sorting out how the carriage sidings will work and, in consequence, whether I'll need 9 or 10 of them (9 would be better if I can get away with it).

 

No photos today, as it's all just bits of wood lying around the railway room.

[St Enodoc]

I assembled most of the bits of wood today, starting with the two leg units.

 

To maximise the space for magazine shelves under the boards, I didn't use my normal X-bracing with 42x19mm but a single diagonal brace of 64x19. Two screws into the leg at each end of the brace will compensate.

 

After cutting two slightly oversized rectangles out of the carpet, I set the whole frame up with clamps to make sure everything fitted.

 

It did - just! - but only after I'd reversed the position of the upper end piece on the inner leg to give more space on the Polperran side.

 

I can get two pairs of shelves lengthways pus one crossways in this space, with about 5mm clearance at each end, and two more pairs of shelves lengthways at the Polperran end (or I will, once I've removed the clamps).

 

There's a 900mm wide space between Pentowan and Paddington but only 600mm at the Nancegwithey Viaduct end, to maximise the lengths of the roads at Pentowan.

 

At Pentowan throat, the board will be narrower to give the signalman more room.

 

I'm pleased with this, so tomorrow I'll add some glue to the joints and screw the sub-assemblies together rather than clamping them. After that, I'll be able to screw the bases to the floor and lay some 9mm plywood sheets on top, ready for marking out the track layout. Exciting!

[Barry O]

Good work.. 

Baz

[Keith Addenbrooke]

As always, very neatly done.  Standard lengths of PSE sold here are 2.4m / 8’ long.  Is it the same in Aus?  (Just trying to get a feel for how long a run you have for Pentowan).  Certainly looks nice and rigid without a lot of cross-bracing - guessing the 64 x 19mm helps in that respect (3” x 1” nominal PSE I presume).  Useful photos to see, Keith.

Edited December 9, 2022 by Keith Addenbrooke

[St Enodoc]

1 hour ago, Keith Addenbrooke said:

As always, very neatly done.  Standard lengths of PSE sold here are 2.4m / 8’ long.  Is it the same in Aus?  (Just trying to get a feel for how long a run you have for Pentowan).  Certainly looks nice and rigid without a lot of cross-bracing - guessing the 64 x 19mm helps in that respect (3” x 1” nominal PSE I presume).  Useful photos to see, Keith.

That's about right, Keith. You can get various lengths, 1.8m, 2.1m and 2.4m being common, but not every length in every size. I mostly use 42x19 (2x1) for most things, 42x42 (2x2) for legs and 64x19 (3x1) for L-girders. The Pentowan L-girders are 2095mm for the wide bit and 1710mm for the short bit.

Edited December 9, 2022 by St Enodoc
Oops typo!

[St Enodoc]

1 hour ago, St Enodoc said:

That's about right, Keith. You can get various lengths, 1.8m, 2.1m and 2.4m being common, but not every length in every size. I mostly use 42x19 (2x1) for most things, 42x42 (2x2) for legs and 64x19 (3x1) for L-girders. The Pentowan L-girders are 2095mm for the wide bit and 1710mm for the short bit.

I spotted a typo after I posted this. The correct lengths are as above.

[Sandhole]

6 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

I assembled most of the bits of wood today, starting with the two leg units.

 

To maximise the space for magazine shelves under the boards, I didn't use my normal X-bracing with 42x19mm but a single diagonal brace of 64x19. Two screws into the leg at each end of the brace will compensate.

 

After cutting two slightly oversized rectangles out of the carpet, I set the whole frame up with clamps to make sure everything fitted.

 

It did - just! - but only after I'd reversed the position of the upper end piece on the inner leg to give more space on the Polperran side.

 

I can get two pairs of shelves lengthways pus one crossways in this space, with about 5mm clearance at each end, and two more pairs of shelves lengthways at the Polperran end (or I will, once I've removed the clamps).

 

There's a 900mm wide space between Pentowan and Paddington but only 600mm at the Nancegwithey Viaduct end, to maximise the lengths of the roads at Pentowan.

 

At Pentowan throat, the board will be narrower to give the signalman more room.

 

I'm pleased with this, so tomorrow I'll add some glue to the joints and screw the sub-assemblies together rather than clamping them. After that, I'll be able to screw the bases to the floor and lay some 9mm plywood sheets on top, ready for marking out the track layout. Exciting!

This is superb civil engineering.
Regards,
Chris.

[St Enodoc]

15 hours ago, Sandhole said:

This is superb civil engineering.
Regards,
Chris.

Thanks Chris. As a mechanical engineer, I'll take that as a compliment (I think...).