Bachmann Branchline announcements for 2015/6

[davidw]

just glanced at the Bachmann website Mk1's almost £40. Sleepers almost £43. i suspect when the Thompsons are delivered there wont be much change from £50.00.

 

 

 Class A2 60536 'Trimbush' BR Lined Green Early Emblem £ 169.95 ouch....

[Dunsignalling]

 

 

 Class A2 60536 'Trimbush' BR Lined Green Early Emblem £ 169.95 ouch....

Maybe, having watched a whole bunch of people eagerly snap up sets of six Hornby A4's at that price last year, they decided that was the going rate for ER Pacifics.     

 

John

[Combe Martin]

Don't forget that as you buy Bachmann items from a retailer there will most likely be a discount on those prices !

[Black 5 Bear]

just glanced at the Bachmann website Mk1's almost £40. Sleepers almost £43. i suspect when the Thompsons are delivered there wont be much change from £50.00.

 

 

Class A2 60536 'Trimbush' BR Lined Green Early Emblem £ 169.95 ouch....

Just get what you can from the 2014 range, I've just bought 3 MK1 Sleepers in maroon for £25 a piece, an absolute bargain in my opinion considering the level of detail.A single coach will soon be £50 plus....

[SamTom]

TheSignalEngineer wrote:

S4040 would be a BR Mk1 SO. The Bulleid BSK would be S4040S, as it was a prenationalisation design.

Thanks for this: I didn't know carriages could have the 'same' running numbers (i.e. bar the origin suffix) in that way. Thanks also to caradoc for the reference.

[davidw]

Just get what you can from the 2014 range, I've just bought 3 MK1 Sleepers in maroon for £25 a piece, an absolute bargain in my opinion considering the level of detail.A single coach will soon be £50 plus....

  I've 6 sleepers. Ideally one more and I'm done for the night Scotsman.  Where did you get for £25  The cheapest I got was £29.00 

[davidw]

Don't forget that as you buy Bachmann items from a retailer there will most likely be a discount on those prices !

i do appreciate that - and seek out bargains. Prices are heading up though. 

[SamTom]

Bachmann's BR(S) green Mk1 BSK and CK although sold individually have in the past been sold with numbers that will correctly make up a 3-set (but no set numbers on the brake ends):

 

Set 518 formed BSK S35020 (39-078) + CK S15904 (39-128) + BSK S35021 (39-078A) (NB: CK 39-128B also carried S15904 but is a darker green)

Set 525 formed BSK S34641 (39-078D) + CK S15567 (39-128C) + BSK 34642 (39-078E)

 

Set 525 was augmented in 1962 with SOs S3824 (39-053D) and S3825 (39-053E) and CK S15915 (not produced by Bachmann).

 

Etc.

 

 

Sadly, a quick ckeck confirms I've missed my chances there, unless something turns up second hand.

 

But still, I already knew I'd probably have to go down Coombe Martin's route.

 

Now, I wonder if Bachmann produced any of their Blood and Custard Mk1 coaches with Sxxxxx running numbers. (Exits stage left...)

[jonathan452]

just glanced at the Bachmann website Mk1's almost £40. Sleepers almost £43. i suspect when the Thompsons are delivered there wont be much change from £50.00.

Skimmed through the latest 'Continental Modeller' in that well known newsagents.

 

Noticed in the review section that the latest LS Models releases (DB loco hauled IC coaches) were £55 each.

 

Just thought this would be worth mentioning as another (UK versus Continental outline) comparison.

[sub39h]

When it comes to discussing prices - people always seem to ignore the fact that Bachmann raised RRPs on models already built and sat on the shelf! If that doesn't tell you something about their intentions nothing will convince you. 20% increase in labour costs does not equate to a 20% increase in cost in the overall product - or as much as 66% in the case of the Polybulk.

 

By and large I think their loco prices are quite reasonable (unlike Team Red Box) but also unlike Team Red Box their rolling stock prices are getting silly where Hornby has fairly reasonable prices on coaches and wagons.

 

If Bachmann want to try and peddle a reissue of an old tooled 4-axle wagon for nearly £20 good luck to them. I won't be buying one! I hope for their sakes there are enough people who do. I'm just glad I've got my Mk2Fs on pre-order at Hattons with a price guarantee of £25.46. No doubt by the time they're released they'll be at least double that.

[Combe Martin]

Once again, we get someone moaning about prices that hasn't 'listened' to what's been said. 

 

When Bachmann made their announcement about price rises they also said they'd discovered they were making a LOSS or at best BREAKING EVEN on some of their range.  This is why some older items already made have gone up.  This is also why some older items (but newly made) have gone up more.  One rise to stop making a loss, then a 20% rise last year, and a 20% rise this year.

 

Next, you can't compare Bachmann's latest full RRPs from their web site against a discounted price you may have paid a retailer for something last year.  You have to compare like for like.

 

Lastly, labour costs are everything.  Most added value is labour costs somewhere, and it dosn't have to just be in the factory, outside suppliers have rising labour costs too.  In the factory it's not just only workers doing the assembly whose labour costs have gone up, everyone from the tea lady to the accountants costs have gone up.   Don't forget all our raw materials come out of the ground originally.  It's the labour costs of getting them out of the ground, transported and converted into something usable that gives them a price !  

[farren]

Wouldn't it be novel to mention say a new release and not just the bleeding price price raises. Say the new crain which as my attention. Or maybe a new loco.

[Bernard Lamb]

 

If Bachmann want to try and peddle a reissue of an old tooled 4-axle wagon for nearly £20 good luck to them. I won't be buying one! I hope for their sakes there are enough people who do. I'm just glad I've got my Mk2Fs on pre-order at Hattons with a price guarantee of £25.46.

I would not be too sure about that.

They have found a way out of that by withdrawing the model before it has been produced and then reintroducing it later.

As it has been withdrawn there is no RRP and thus no obligation on Hattons or any other dealer to honour any promise.

Check the history of the Stanier Mogul if you need convincing.

Bernard

[rembrow]

I would not be too sure about that.

They have found a way out of that by withdrawing the model before it has been produced and then reintroducing it later.

As it has been withdrawn there is no RRP and thus no obligation on Hattons or any other dealer to honour any promise.

Check the history of the Stanier Mogul if you need convincing.

Bernard

I agree with Bernard Lamb. I have a pre-order with Hattons for Bachmann Thompson corridor coaches, which when announced, like the Mk2Fs had a Bachmann retail price of £25.46. The retail price on the Thompsons was withdrawn and Hattons e-mailed me to advise that they could not guarantee the original price as it had been withdrawn. Hattons do seem to be guaranteeing prices that are not withdrawn, even where there are significant price increases, such as the Stanier Porthole coaches which they supplied at the original pre-order price, even though the the rrp had increased by some £16. The acid test will be the new North British Warship which has not had its retail price withdrawn since announced by Bachmann, but the rrp has been increased substantially over the last 2 years from £77 approx to £140 now. Hattons can't be expected to honour such massive price increases, as the cost to them of the purchase must be more than the 'guaranteed' retail price and I don't expect the retailer to make a substantial loss on new stock.  

[SDJR7F88]

I agree with Bernard Lamb. I have a pre-order with Hattons for Bachmann Thompson corridor coaches, which when announced, like the Mk2Fs had a Bachmann retail price of £25.46. The retail price on the Thompsons was withdrawn and Hattons e-mailed me to advise that they could not guarantee the original price as it had been withdrawn. Hattons do seem to be guaranteeing prices that are not withdrawn, even where there are significant price increases, such as the Stanier Porthole coaches which they supplied at the original pre-order price, even though the the rrp had increased by some £16. The acid test will be the new North British Warship which has not had its retail price withdrawn since announced by Bachmann, but the rrp has been increased substantially over the last 2 years from £77 approx to £140 now. Hattons can't be expected to honour such massive price increases, as the cost to them of the purchase must be more than the 'guaranteed' retail price and I don't expect the retailer to make a substantial loss on new stock.  

I believe a friend of my has one on order for £77 there, seem he might get if for that then?

[mat]

I think that when you pre order you enter into a contract to pay the agreed price for the item so I would not be happy myself it days before the price went up and the money was just taken from my account.

[rembrow]

I think that when you pre order you enter into a contract to pay the agreed price for the item so I would not be happy myself it days before the price went up and the money was just taken from my account.

You have to know the full terms of the pre order contract, which normally does give the retailer the option of altering the price after contacting the proposed purchaser to seek their agreement to continue with the sale at a revised price.

[Legend]

Once again, we get someone moaning about prices that hasn't 'listened' to what's been said. 

 

When Bachmann made their announcement about price rises they also said they'd discovered they were making a LOSS or at best BREAKING EVEN on some of their range.  This is why some older items already made have gone up.  This is also why some older items (but newly made) have gone up more.  One rise to stop making a loss, then a 20% rise last year, and a 20% rise this year.

 

Next, you can't compare Bachmann's latest full RRPs from their web site against a discounted price you may have paid a retailer for something last year.  You have to compare like for like.

 

Lastly, labour costs are everything.  Most added value is labour costs somewhere, and it dosn't have to just be in the factory, outside suppliers have rising labour costs too.  In the factory it's not just only workers doing the assembly whose labour costs have gone up, everyone from the tea lady to the accountants costs have gone up.   Don't forget all our raw materials come out of the ground originally.  It's the labour costs of getting them out of the ground, transported and converted into something usable that gives them a price !

 

There are labour costs in most things as you say. Assembly, design, services, transport. But it is not everything as you say. There are raw material costs, packaging,heat and light,depreciation on tooling , so that I would be very surprised if labour amounted to more than 25 % of the final selling price (and I suspect closer to 10%), including retailers and manufacturers profits. So a 20% increase in labour cannot equate to a 20% increase in final price! yet this is the argument being put forward.

 

You know what though, at the end of the day it's irrelevant. If you think it's value for money you'll buy it, and for me there are still some steam locos in this category . But for most items Bachmann are pricing themselves out of existence. As someone else said he could foresee them being the modern day Wrenn. I think thats a pretty good description . I bought one Wrenn loco in 20 years!

[Black 5 Bear]

You have to know the full terms of the pre order contract, which normally does give the retailer the option of altering the price after contacting the proposed purchaser to seek their agreement to continue with the sale at a revised price.

Hatton's have a fixed policy on this or certainly used to. If the item has been offered for sale without the declaration "price may rise and we will notify you of this" they usually honour the order at the original price quoted. I think certainly in relation to Bachmann products, this is very fair on their part....

[Ozexpatriate]

I think that when you pre order you enter into a contract to pay the agreed price for the item so I would not be happy myself it days before the price went up and the money was just taken from my account.

I agree that automatically taking an increased amount of money from your account would be a bit sharp.

 

I don't have any issues with a retailer contacting me and asking whether I want to proceed with the order at an increased amount, particularly if no money had changed hands by that time. That seems totally fair.

 

When a substantial down-payment has been made, say 50% for a commissioned item, I think there would be a lot more pressure on the retailer to maintain the original price.

 

When pre-orders can easily last for as much as three years or more before product arrives, there are a lot of logistical problems. Credit cards expire, people move, people cancel orders, (sometimes because a duplicate arrives sooner) and yes, prices go up. It can't be fun for retailers to manage all this.

[Ron Ron Ron]

With so many price comparisons being bandied around, particularly against European H0 models, I've just spent 5 or 10 minutes having another look at what our Europeans neighbours are paying.

The conclusion is that we are still getting our 00 RTR at cheaper prices than that being charged for their Hornby and Bachmann H0 counterparts, coming from the same factories as our 00 models, from the same manufacturers.

As if that's news !!!!!

 

Some examples...

Hornby Rivarossi USATC 0-6-0 tank  - m.r.p. £145

Hornby Rivarossi DB Class 627.0 diesel railcar  - m.r.p. £160

Hornby Jouef SNCF 2 car DMU  - m.r.p. £203

Liliput DB Steel Transport Wagon with Blue Tarpaulin  - m.r.p £43

Liliput DR BR56.2 steam freight locomotive  - m.r.p. £317

Hornby Jouef SNCF Class 141R tender loco (2-8-2)  - m.r.p. £234

 

(all above locos are DC - i.e. DCC Ready)

 

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[jjb1970]

If you pay a deposit and a model is heavily delayed then I'd expect the retailer to either honour the initial price or return the deposit as whilst I realise what a deposit is I also think that if the product delivery slips by the sort of timings normal for model railway items then the purchaser can reasonably cancel and request a refund of the deposit. Even where no deposit or a nominal deposit has been taken I've been in the embarrassing situation with certain brass items of being contacted by retailers four and five years after ordering to ask if I still want the things as they're finally being made and telling them things have moved on and I will not be continuing with the order.

[Ozexpatriate]

I've been in the embarrassing situation with certain brass items of being contacted by retailers four and five years after ordering to ask if I still want the things as they're finally being made and telling them things have moved on and I will not be continuing with the order.

Something that is likely to become more frequent with RTR plastic I think, even at three years or so.

[The Stationmaster]

Something that is likely to become more frequent with RTR plastic I think, even at three years or so.

Especially when - to encourage pre-orders - retailers quote ludicrously low prices which they can't honour and which (usually in slightly smaller print) they say they can't honour.  There was one example where, so I heard tell, even the manufacturer laughed at the pre-ordere price for the very simple reason that even they hadn't got a clue what the price would be when the model is released but even if it arrived tomorrow it would be impossible for it to be that cheap.

[MikeHunter]

Got to comment, as an LMS modeller, I'm delighted with the new models. Will hurt the bank balance though. The LMS half cab, coal tank and rechassied Scot are the highlights for me. Also waiting on the Stanier Mogul. If I can stretch to em, I'll also have a G2, and maybe another Jinty, I only have 3....

 

I was starting to think the LMS was being forgotten, but Bachmann has chosen some decent new locos over the last couple of years. The major gap now is an 0-4-4 Johnson 1P, and a push pull set, if I was getting greedy, I'd like an S&D large boiler 7F in LMS black, and a couple of extra Stanier coaches from Hornby, open 3rd and buffet. I love Bachmann's small engine policy, maybe a Kirtley 0-6-0, and a modern 2P?