What Happens After SPADs?

[The Stationmaster]

Stopping at signals in the dark which you are not used to stopping at certanly tests your route knowledge, particularly so if you're in an area with three aspect colour lights. On the Banbury to Oxford line the area around Tackley and Heyford is pitch black during the Winter months and on sighting a single yellow at 60mph you really do have to be on the ball in order to stop at the red which isn't very far away. The nearby canal attracts fog on very cold nights too and the signal just shy of Heyford Station on the Down Main is in a 'dip' so you're dropping down the gradient towards it, hoping to see a red glow before you pass over the AWS magnet, often as not though you can't see it until you're about two loco lengths away if there's a pea-souper about. A handy thing about this part of the route is that Oxford panel's signals are numbered to match the nearest mileposts which helps you to know where you are in the dark. Heading north from Oxford, once you're past Wolvercot Jcn. the signals are numbered DM69, DM72, DM75 and DM77, each one having a distant / repeater before hand.

Regrettably the former WR (and ER too) method of numbering automatic signals is being swept away in the tide of uber-standardisation which has now hit railway signalling.  In the past it was fairly easy to work out exactly where any colour light signal was in a WR mas area provided you had a modicum of geographical knowledge, and of course its number also told you which line it applied to.  You can now forget that sort of simplicity.

 

And the Cherwell Valley is a right place for morning mists which has never helped the sort of situation Nidge is describing.

[The Stationmaster]

 GSM-R is a fantastic tool to have in the cab, we should have had it years ago. The sound quality is so much better than the old NRN system, which is vital when communicating safety critical information such as ''pass such and such signal at danger...''. It also saves a lot of time - say for instance I'm approaching Bedford on the Up Slow and already no that I'm not getting releif in the station, well the signaller cand send a message to the screen saying 'contact controlling signaller' which I can do straight away, he then asks if I'm due releif, I say ''no I'm right away to Acton Canal Wharf'' then he can see about keeping me on the move without jamming up the platforms at Bedford.

We should indeed have had it years ago we were repeatedly being promised it in the mid 1990s and that it would be 'ready next year (although it was only called GSM back then).  I don't know if GSM-R will ever have the facility but the original promise was that it could also transmit printed text - thus, provided you had a printer as part of your cab radio kit you could for example have a printed message instructing a Driver to pass a signal at danger as confirmation of a verbal instruction etc.  Our trains had that capability back then - the radio system never did!

[Rugd1022]

I never knew that about the mileposts between oxford and banbury, im going to nick that fact and claim it for my own with my trainees!!

 

Regards gsm-r going to the wrong box, a number of occassions ive say waiting to exit hinksey at OX116/OX114 and when ive rung the signaller ive got through to ascot under wychwood box, similarly pushing 'at signal' there sometimes sends the message to ascot box so when you ring oxford box (via your mobile) to see why you haven't had the signal at departure time he didnt know you were ready to go as he hadn't had the message!

 

I shall expect a regular influx of royalty checks then Jim! Obviously the same applies to the signal numbers in the up direction.

 

The mileage / signal number connection also applies to some of Gloucester panel's signals going down the Lickey route, some of which show the mileage from Derby . 

[Fat Controller]

I notice Nigel referred to the 'SG' button on the CSR; what do the initials stand for? I'd thought it was a purely French term, as our signallers will ask drivers to send them (or ask me to ask them if there's no answer on the loco radio..)

[PaulRhB]

I don't know if GSM-R will ever have the facility but the original promise was that it could also transmit printed text -

While it doesn't print it there is the text facility already there and the messages are logged. There is a procedural issue that means you can't send texts apart from 'wait signal' at present but we keep pressing for pre approved texts and there's a trial been done recently on Wessex with non safety critical messages to check the reliability. There's a reason for only the pre approved text that I can't go into but they are working on this.

[big jim]

I notice Nigel referred to the 'SG' button on the CSR; what do the initials stand for? I'd thought it was a purely French term, as our signallers will ask drivers to send them (or ask me to ask them if there's no answer on the loco radio..)

SG on gsm-r is the 'standing at signal' button, you press it to remind the signaller you are standing at a signal

 

I seem to remember its the same on CSR but its been a few years since i used that on the chiltern

[kenw]

SG on gsm-r is the 'standing at signal' button, you press it to remind the signaller you are standing at a signal

 

Pressing SG on gsr-r on coming to a stand at a signal also informs the signaller you've actually done so - in case he's waiting to call to give instructions, to avoid distraction by doing so while you're still approaching a red signal, and we wouldn't take an incoming call while doing so.

[kenw]

Should be off during normal driving though and as GSMR is now in it's a better option generally so you don't risk having it on and getting other calls. Certainly we train them to have it off round here.

 

Do agree there. Although our rules do allow a Pilotman to use a mobile for his duties, this does pre-date GSMR

[phil-b259]

I notice Nigel referred to the 'SG' button on the CSR; what do the initials stand for? I'd thought it was a purely French term, as our signallers will ask drivers to send them (or ask me to ask them if there's no answer on the loco radio..)

 

Given an awful lot of pan European railway stuff (of which the GSM-R is part) uses French terms. I guess with the main body being the UIC (which stands for Union internationale des chemins de fer) it shouldn't be a surprise.

[Grovenor]

In railway signalling terminology G is the abbreviation for siGnal so nothing wrong with SG for stopped at signal.

Keith

[phil-b259]

In railway signalling terminology G is the abbreviation for siGnal so nothing wrong with SG for stopped at signal.

Keith

 

That is also true of course - though it is unusual for other departments to be exposed to signalling nomenclature as lots of it isn't that obvious abbreviations wise.

[15715GC]

 

What Happens After SPADs, Signaller's point of view?

[PaulRhB]

See my post on page 1 plus once it's all stopped and safe you fill in a form to capture essential detail while it's fresh. That's then submitted to Control and they agree with the Operator whether the train can be moved to a defined place or has to wait for a relief driver. They have risk tables for the incident and rankings for all drivers based on time passed out through to previous incidents etc to consult.

The evidence gathered immediately can explain why it happened and sometimes it comes down to a driver losing attention for perfectly innocent reasons caused by them being conscientious. Difficult to explain that without going into specific details that would be unfair as it would be searchable and could possibly reveal names so not for here.

Not a pleasant job to have to talk a driver through the form who's gutted about the incident but equally I've talked to some subsequently who were glad of a friendly voice when under that stress.