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Everything posted by 73080

  1. It is true that it could be tweaked to represent the 1962-1968 period, but it would require the removal of the NB and TOPS panels. I am not convinced that that I could do so without making a mess, unless I weathered the model, which I did not wish to do. Therefore, I did not order this model. As it is now sold out at Accurascale, they have not suffered from my lack of order. In the Class 37 thread, on November 20, 2019, 50B55B posted: "The D6702 graphic depicts a pretty rare combination of small yellow end with TOPS data panel, whereas the D6704 graphic depicts GFYE without a TOPS data panel, which locos with full yellow ends commonly had. Are these graphics based on photos of the prototypes? Also, if the 41A shedcode depiction is a representation of the paint stencilled style rather than the early cast shedplates the 41A should be on one line, not with the A below the number." In response Accurascale Fran posted: "Well spotted and an error on our part. It will be corrected and updated." The 41A shed code was changed on the graphics, but not the TOPS panel or NB which remain. I am puzzled by McC's comments that the graphics (of D6702) will be changed to be 100% accurate. It is not possible for it to be mid-1960s and have TOPS panels and NB. Do you now wish to disappoint everybody who thought they were buying a model with TOPS panel and NB ? NOTE: the class 37.co.uk website states for D6702: - boiler removed 15 Feb 1969 - painted standard blue August 1969
  2. You quoted from a paragraph that started with the words "Until Accurascale demonstrate otherwise..." I hope that you will demonstrate otherwise.
  3. I regret to state this, but Accurascale has turned its back on modellers of the steam/diesel transition period (i.e. 1962-68) who want diesels with gysp. There was no class 37 for this period even though they label the model of D6702 on their web site as gysp mid-1960s. Their image clearly indicates livery features that were not applied until 1969. This is not mid-1960s and is after the end of steam in 1968. Now they are not proposing a gysp class 31 for the steam/diesel transition period. It can not be that the gysp Deltic models are unpopular, as of the two currently listed on their website, one is sold out. In contrast, none of the two plain green models appear to have sold out. Neither have any of the three fye Deltic models sold out. So it can't be that Accurascale gsyp models are unpopular. Until Accurascale demonstrate otherwise, it may be wise to assume it will be a long time (if ever ?) before we see Accurascale produce any gsyp model Class 31s or 37s for the 1962-68 period. I can only assume that they have no personal interest in the period, and so have no interest in producing such models !
  4. As it appears that not all model paint manufacturers have the same colour for Sherwood Green, may be British Standards can be of help. This link shows the British Standard BS4800 colour chart - Sherwood Green BS 12D45 is to be found on the left, 16th row down. https://prontopaints.co.uk/bs-4800-colour-chart/ To my eye, the colour two rows above it in the chart (Willow aka Green Mist - BS 12B17) looks more like the colour of the cab of D9505 in the above photograph, than does Sherwood Green. But as I stated earlier, different people perceive colours differently, especially when it is shades of green. Here is another BS4800 chart - whilst there are very slight colour differences from the previous link when viewed on my computer screen, fundamentally the colours are the same. https://www.e-paint.co.uk/BS-4800-colour-chart.asp
  5. I respectfully disagree. The Class 47 shows streaking on its pale green panel, so is illustrating what a weathered side looks like like. D9500 also shows an element of weathering. If you were to say that after several months in service, the too colours started to show less differences, I would tend to agree with you. That said, I stand by my statement that the ex-works colours were very different.
  6. I too wondered for a moment whether Minerva's original cab colour would be a better choice - until I reminded myself what it actually looked like ! It was shown in pauliebanger's attached video posted on January 5 (see about one and half pages above). The preserved Class 14 locos in green livery seem to have varying liveries for the cab area. In particular, D9500 seems to be an outlier with a much more vivid green than many others - see this flickr image: https://www.flickr.com/photos/33106/17097256083/in/photolist-s3PUzi-9b2Qhk-2k8R4RV-9ab2A8-wXfXB4-aj3NBK-2k8UTfz-2g36Zf3-2h6kQgF-2j3GbgU-x2A4gH-oa1L6R-fQqnc1-af4bWK-miNwB2-x8d9ra-5fiyEb-bTrAzk-DRBMtC-apdqfy-apdoWd-9bLan4-aMnTXT-gKY8nG-akErHd-johxzi-a3HFPN-2kXBxPA-KuHfXb-q3S7Pv-cfNJRm-aqjzpd-2jAxiuS-bWC9YW-nHpFp7-akBCsD-fBLeZY-pAhy4q-akBCqt-aenRwo-dQ5QBA-9uXTsi-GBZUKs-d5d8Qj-2mVPk5h-9LQxB8-9PBG5J-CN8Sgc-2jWz89p-s9cDrN The following comments only refer to the BR 1960s green livery, and not necessarily to preserved liveries. It is the result of studying numerous Class 14 web images, and those in Strathwood's books in the 'Sixties Diesel & Electic Days Remembered' series. I believe that the Robert Carroll image of D9505 (shown above by Ressaldar) correctly indicates an unusual greyish green cab colour not seen on any other class of BR locomotive. If anybody disagrees, please post a link to a colour photograph that refutes this statement. The Heljan 4mm Class 14 cab colour is also wrong - in that case the colour is too much a yellowish green rather than a greyish green. As such, I now believe that Minerva did the right thing in changing the cab colour. The new colour is marginally too light (which maybe could be darkened by weathering), but appears to be as close as most of us could achieve to the correct colour balance (as opposed to containing a little too much white). If anybody thinks the 1960s cab colour was sherwood green, please see what Railmatch paints think is Sherwood Green, and compare it to the colour of the cab of D9505 shown above ? https://howesmodels.co.uk/product/br-diesel-sherwood-green-15ml-enamel/ In this debate, in the interests of tolerance, we should also be mindful that about 1 in 12 caucasian males (some studies quote a little less) suffer from colour blindness, and this often affects the ability to distinguish between different shades of green. Therefore, some people will genuinely perceive this cab colour differently to others.
  7. According to notes on the rear of some Jim Aston photos, the last day of scheduled steam working from London Cannon Street was 12 June 1959 34013 hauled 5.14pm departure 34004 hauled 5.44pm departure
  8. Comment regarding Deltic models on Gauge0Guild forum: "Heljan’s has so many errors and the Loveless production ones were close but still off the mark" Link to Loveless website below. As this page appears to have been last updated on 16 Sept 2016, it may now merely be a record of what was produced. If I remember correctly, when it was released the model cost about £2,500. http://www.loveless.co.uk/deltic/
  9. I have Rivarossi HR2433 (set of two E444) which do NOT have traction tyres. This set was released in 2014.
  10. In discussing the Bachmann model, it is helpful to know if there was a film coating to the windscreens AND that film coating gave the appearance of a colour change or tint when viewing the windscreen AND what colour that might be. For that reason, I have only been referencing colour photos. Whilst you are factually correct that the windows were not tinted, I hope you will understand if some of us continue to use the term 'tint' or 'tinted' windscreens as shorthand for 'a film coating that gives the appearance of a colour tint at certain times and angles when viewing' the windscreen. The Brush Type 4s (later class 47) were not released to traffic in number order. The first Crewe built locos were not released to traffic until late January 1964. The locos built by Brush that were released to traffic in 1962/63 were D1500 - D1549, D1682 - D1697 and D1699 (D1698 was not released until 13 January 1964). I can find no evidence from colour photos that any of these locomotives were ex-works with window glazing that produced a noticeable visual tint. In contrast, D1724, which was released to traffic by Brush on 17 March 1964, had windscreens that produced a noticeably visual tint (as did D1730, 32 & 33 as stated in an earlier post). Photos taken in 1965 of D1711, 20 & 22 also show a tinted effect to the windscreens. D1711 was released to traffic on 20 January 1964. It would appear that a change took place in the visual appearance of windscreens of locomotives released to traffic by Brush, probably during January 1964 and definitely by March 1964. As for early Crewe built locomotives in ex-works condition, matters are less clear. The colour photos that I have found of Crewe built locos in the D1550 - D1600 range in ex-works condition, show a total absence of a tinted appearance with any hint of pink or purple (like the Bachmann model). Instead, the windscreens either appear to be neutral in colour or to have a dark blue tint. This dark blue tint appears to be caused by shade and and angle of reflection, though I would not be surprised if there was also a film coating helping to cause it. What I can be certain is this. The slight dark blue tint on early Crewe built locos is distinctly different from the pink/purple tint found on later Brush built locos. To confuse matters further, photos of some of these Crewe built locos in gfye livery in the late 1960s show a distinctly purple/pink hue to the windscreens. Perhaps the early Crewe built locos had windscreen coatings that did not initally cause a pink/purple tint, but with age or as grime accumulated such a tint became apparent. Does anybody have expert knowlege on the subject ? (Released to traffic dates taken from class47.co.uk website)
  11. No, distinctly tinted windscreens are definitely visible on separate photos of D1730 and D1732 in ex-works gsyp (and D1733 in its original experimental blue livery) in 1964. (See Strathwood's Sixties Diesel & Electric Days Remembered Volume III page 84 for D1730, page 77 for D1732 & page 54 for D1733 without red panels in 1965 and Volume II page 81 for D1733 with red panels in 1964. The apparent windscreen tint can vary from subtle to pronounced, depending on the angle it is viewed and/or on lighting conditions. Windscreen grime may also make it more pronounce. Therefore, it is much easier to be certain that a photo shows a tinted windscreen, than to say that a loco does NOT have a tinted windscreen from a photo. For example, how may of you would say that D1733 in its amended experimental blue livery (i.e. without red side panels) had tinted windows from this photo ? https://www.flickr.com/photos/rgadsdon/27787240094 That said, I have found no certain evidence of tinted windscreens in all the Class 47 colour photos I have seen that were taken before autumn 1963 (D1500, 08, 19, 20, 24 & 31 and D1685). From photographic evidence, alternative expanations are possible, including: a) the 1962 and some or all 1963 built locos did not have tinted windows ex-works; or b) the tinting or these locos was more subtle than on later locos, and so is less visible on photos; or c) by a quirk of chance, the tinting was not apparent in these photos (in my opinion very unlikely). Viewing photos of gsyp liveried Class 47s taken in 1965-1967, tinted windows can definitely be determined in over 75% of the colour photos. Anyone thinking of buying the tinted windscreen version of D1565 in gsyp perhaps would like to view this later photo of D1565 in gfye livery before deciding: https://www.flickr.com/photos/robmcrorie/16431499903/in/photolist-r2ZJst-26E6r57-21jZh4i-tTkbE5-23bw7hm-2kTYoDG-2kZji4T-2i2tQzr-2bXvyH7-2iCMjN8-2iT8mZD-2iVfFdp-AKBEhd-2gja8De-2hYpNUj-2hYpNTs-2gjJmvm-9p5jeo-SgmLKY-2hWtJPp-282WTxk-26E6r4f-9p5jcW-282WTrD-b5D5LR-2kfoxeT-2dxVe5Q-adPA5d-2e2C3TK-zGvFUD-qUgiyY-chHU8m-aNKbM8-AT448H-e6vm7S-e74vq7-MeaovP-282WTu4-282WTvX-5hboZj-26E6r6Q-28jr5NU-26E6r3o-282WTon-282WTmP-26E6r2w-LawG9r-S6zEKb-26E6r5s-2ktXywS Absence of proof of tinted windscreens is not proof of absence.
  12. Lionheart Trains advert in May 2021 Gauge O Guild Gazette states that the 45xx models are: "Expected in shops Late Summer 2021".
  13. I recently purchased a set of Roco coaches that were only still available from a handful of suppliers. I decided to use ebay, but with a vendor who had a physical shop in Germany and their own separate website. Assuming UK VAT was payable on everything including postage, the price without VAT was less than the limit of £135. It was sent by what ebay describe as "standard delivery from outside UK" priced at £18.25 - the address label stated 'Deutsche Post' top left and 'DHL' top right. A Customs Declaration CN23 form was included in a sealed plastic envelope attached to the outside of the parcel, but had not been opened for inspection. The documentation made no mention of VAT, though the ebay page stated the VAT rate as 20% rather than the German rate of 19%. Ordered on 6 May 2021 and advised of despatch the following day. It was delivered by Parcel Force on 12 May with no additional charges. The experience was as quick as could reasonably be expected, easy and efficient. If anybody wishes to use this vendor, their ebay name is kieskemper1928. Their website may be viewed at: https://kieskemper-shop.de
  14. It appears that the last lighter green production was in 2007, with production from 2009 onwards being in darker green. LAST LIGHTER GREEN SK - 39-028 C SO - 39-053 C BSK - 39-078 C CK - 39-128 A (39-128 with 1st class stripe, 39-128 A without) FK - 39-153 A (both 39-153 and 39-153 A with 1st class stripes) BG - 39-178 A BCK - 39-228 A (both 39-228 and 39-228 A with 1st class stripes) RFO - 39-253 (without 1st class stripe) RMB - 39-262 GUV - none - first issue in darker green FIRST DARKER GREEN SK - 39-028 D SO - 39-053 D BSK - 39-078 D CK - 39-128 B FK - 39-153 B BG - 39-178 B BCK - 39-228 B RFO - I can find no evidence of it being issued in darker green to date RMB - 39-262 A GUV - 39-273
  15. If you study photographs it is possible to find examples of both the lighter and darker versions. That may be because the lighter version is a good representation of the green on a sunny day, whereas the darker version is a good representation of the green on a dull day. If so, then the only advice is not to mix the darker and lighter versions in a rake of coaches, nor in rakes passing each other.
  16. In response to this post, it has been incorrectly suggested that the Hobby Shop previously had listed 60505 on its web site. Only 60501 was listed on the website, and this now appears to be sold. The Hobby Shop deserve full credit for selling a defective model of 60505 in this way and listing its faults, unlike certain other vendors (look for a top lamp bracket on photos on their web sites). Incidently, it appears that it has sold quickly on ebay, so some-one was happy to pay £155 + p&p for a model missing this detail.
  17. E6004 was in plain green with stripe livery in March 1966. There is photographic evidence of the locomotive in green with syp on 15 April 67 and 3 March 1968. It was overhauled at Crewe Works in December 1968, and that may be when it received blue fye livery.
  18. Two 4mm kits have been produced by DJH: K41 with BR1/1A tender - 70000 to 44 K57 with BR1D tender - 70045 to 54 There is an in depth article by Allan Sibley about the prototype variations and building a highly detailed P4 model using the DJH kit, in the first Model Railway Journal Compendium: https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?ac=sl&st=sl&ref=bf_s2_a1_t1_1&qi=faunRKW3eUN,33Z6x1vzXud,1,E_1497963026_1:2:10&bq=author%3Dbarlow%20bob%26title%3Dmodel%20railway%20journal%20compendium or on ebay: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Model-Railway-Journal-Compendium/124220887733?hash=item1cec2452b5:g:CX8AAOSwiGBeySzA The author's conclusions are: "..... the (P4) model will quite happily negotiate curves down to 3ft6ins radius and has sufficient adhesion to haul at least eight Mk1 coaches, its maximum train length on the current layout..." "..... For the most part it is extremely good, being dimentionally accurate, well-designed and nicely finished...." However, he clearly identifies that the kit has some detail deficiencies, and shows how to make a better model.
  19. Quote from bottom of ebay listing: "100% of the sale of this item will benefit South Devon Railway Trust"
  20. Hornby R3452 6825 'Llanvair Grange' - BR lined green late crest Rails of Sheffield - £89.50 Kernow - £89.99 Hattons - £109
  21. Does anybody know the dates when the proposed D6702 in gsyp wore this livery ? It appears to have a TOPS panel whilst retaining the 'D' prefix to its number. The photo of the actual loco referred to above, does not state a precise date, whilst the class 37 behind in gfye livery appears to be without its 'D' prefix. I have tried to find the earliest date when locos received these data panels without success. For comparison, there is an earlier image of D6702 at:- https://hiveminer.com/Tags/d6702/Timeline 4th row down - left image (when I opened this page) Also there is a photo dated 17.3.68 of D6702 with 'NB' after its number, but no data panel at: https://www.rail-online.co.uk/p251491321/h6557C62#h6557c62
  22. There are several available on: https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?ac=sl&st=sl&ref=bf_s2_a2_t1_5&qi=zxBd1IBsrSWikPte6raBNTv234E_1497963026_1:2:2&bq=author%3Dmike%20et%20al%3B%20king%26title%3Dillustrated%20history%20of%20southern%20wagons%20secr%20vol%203 Postage to Netherlands may vary - I have only checked one of the second-hand sellers, and they will post to the Netherlands for £4.99, instead of free postage within UK.
  23. If anybody is still seeking the ACME 40154 (Ep4a grigio ardesia - grey) model of DM 98 / 99 - Bagagliai per treni merci (Goods Brake Van) discussed some months ago, I have discovered that it is available at the time of this posting at Pierre Dominique in France - priced at 38 Euro + 15 Euro shipping to UK: https://www.pierredominique.com/art-70179-wagon-fret-type.html N.B. When the item is sold out, the link will result in a blank page
  24. From Public Timetable dated 18 April 1966 - 11 June 1967 List of all weekday departures from Waterloo to Bournemouth (* = and Weymouth) listed as having refreshment facilities: B = buffet L = light refreshments (presumably a buffet, but only serving light refreshments) SX = Monday to Friday; SO = Saturdays only 08.30*, 10.30*, 11.30 - all B - SX (L - SO) 12.30 Pullman service - 'The Bournemouth Belle' 13.30* - B - SX (L - SO) 15.30* SX - B 15.35 L 16.35* B 'The Royal Wessex' 17.30 and 18.30* B - SX (L - SO) 21.20 B - SX (nothing SO) - train ran to Poole arriving 00.26 One curiosity is that there was no service on the 19.30 to Bournemouth / Weymouth, but the 21.20 to Poole was given a full buffet service Mondays - Fridays. The only trains reaching Bournemouth with a full restaurant service in this period were 'The Pines Express' (running via Reading) and 'The Bournemouth Belle'.
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