Londontram Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 I've got a couple of scratch builds on the go at the moment which have come to a stop because I cant seem to source the right type or shape of chimney and as it happens domes as well. Has any one ever tried making there own. I haven't got the facility to machine one out of metal but has any one had any success with any other methods say from plastic rod or building up the profile with filler or something like that, Castings out as you need something to take a mold from so its a bit of a chicken and an egg thing in this situation. There is 3D printing but on my restricted budget I'm finding it very hard to justify the costs. What I need is an old school solution So I would love to hear your advice on any methods you might have tried and how you got on. PS One of the stalled project a Caledonian 492 class 0-8-0 tank cir 1900 Or alternatively have a look at these pictures of one of the locos in early LMS days and have a think if the chimney and dome look similar to another readily available one of a different type of loco Thanks for any help you can give. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leopardml2341 Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 Try wrapping many layers of thin plasticard, bonding as you go, around a suitable size former (internal dia of chimney). When at the requisite diameter for tha largest part of chimney, shape with abrasive, using a drill to rotate, and with perseverance you could well end up with a chimney. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefrk Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 Hi Steve, the first pic looks similar to a NB J37. In the second pic which is earlier, the chimney is taller and could be similar to a J35, (NB, sacrilege I know). I might have some left-over chimneys from these and domes which might 'do'. I'll look this afternoon. Usual price for someone to turn a bespoke chimney was around £25 a few years ago. Nice work on the scratchbuilds.... Friend of mine has done one of those too. All the best, Dave Franks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted July 31, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2015 Peter Denny used to make his own chimneys with very low tech equipment. He would curve a suitable washer to the shape of the boiler, using an off cut of boiler/smokebox tube as a former. He would then solder a brass tube to the washer, solder another washer for the rim, fill the angles with solder and with a long bolt down the tube, mount it in a hand powered drill to "turn" the solder to shape with files. In your case, the thiicker chimney top might merit two lengths of tube in telescope fashion. Chimneys made in this way can look absolutely as good as the best CNC machined or injection moulded versions, It doesn't get much more "old school" than that! I hope it helps, or at least gives you an idea of the possibilities, Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted July 31, 2015 Author Share Posted July 31, 2015 Peter Denny used to make his own chimneys with very low tech equipment. He would curve a suitable washer to the shape of the boiler, using an off cut of boiler/smokebox tube as a former. He would then solder a brass tube to the washer, solder another washer for the rim, fill the angles with solder and with a long bolt down the tube, mount it in a hand powered drill to "turn" the solder to shape with files. In your case, the thiicker chimney top might merit two lengths of tube in telescope fashion. Chimneys made in this way can look absolutely as good as the best CNC machined or injection moulded versions, It doesn't get much more "old school" than that! I hope it helps, or at least gives you an idea of the possibilities, Tony Now this method appeals to my build philosophies and I might give this one a serious look thanks Tony, right now I need two chimneys and two domes both similar but one slightly taller than the other and no doubt I will need more in the future. Brass tube is ready available from my local shop and one length would would do many chimneys. I had been thinking along these lines but wondered if any one had done it successfully before having a go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrel Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 How about getting some wooden dowel and turning it on a lathe? Don't know how easy it would be or if it would work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 Now this method appeals to my build philosophies and I might give this one a serious look thanks Tony, right now I need two chimneys and two domes both similar but one slightly taller than the other and no doubt I will need more in the future. Brass tube is ready available from my local shop and one length would would do many chimneys. I had been thinking along these lines but wondered if any one had done it successfully before having a go. I have, and it was the Peter Denny method that first got me to have a go. Modern resources in the way of a range of sizes of drawn brass tube, and variable speed drills makes it even easier. Soldering together two nested tubes is also possible if there isn't a thick enough single wall tube available. Domes likewise from solid rod, but cut the top shape first, then add the washer in the right position to form the flange to the boiler. Important stuff: eye protection, always; take your time, slow and steady yields the good results. Expect a couple of failures as you learn how. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brack Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 If you're a member of ngrm online (free to join) auldreekie on there has a large collection of colonial narrow gauge locos of British and continental origin and most of the fittings, domes chimneys etc are built from styrene and filler. His results are very good. His photo bucket account is here: http://s1340.photobucket.com/user/auldreekie1/library/?sort=3&page=1you don't get the words but there may be some inspiration in the pictures. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted July 31, 2015 Author Share Posted July 31, 2015 Domes likewise from solid rod, but cut the top shape first, then add the washer in the right position to form the flange to the boiler. . For the domes I was thinking of a bit of brass tube for the body, the bent and shaped washer for the base but I've got some plumbers solder which can be built up into a "muffin top shaped lump" which could then be filed and sanded to the dome top shape, eye and dust protection needed obviously . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Northroader Posted July 31, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2015 I usually go with the brass tube, with one washer near the top as a flange, filed to fit over the tube as necessary, and placed on a shaped brass disc, curved to fit the smoke box top. You could need to find a wider diameter tube to be included to form part of the cap for the one in your photo. The whole lot is soldered up to hold together, but you"ll be very lucky if the solder stays in place in sufficient quantity to give enough to file up a fillet. For the curvy, fillet parts I change to Milliput. And gently file this to get the profile I want. It is possible to get something which you'll be happy with. The chimneys shown are slightly tapered, which you might get away with using Milliput. For taller old time chimneys which are noticeably tapered, I ditch the tube, and use brass foil. I tin this, then roll it into a tapered tube of the right size. Then apply a hot soldering iron, and voila, tapered tube. And tapered chimney when trimmed to size and the seam is filed smooth. Whilst making free with your site, may I say I was totally appalled to read in the Caley 6wheelers blog, how such a trivial sounding little accident could make such a mess of your life. sincerely best wishes for the future with your modelling and everything else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted July 31, 2015 Author Share Posted July 31, 2015 It seem that a few of you have tried this and seemed with practice to be able to get results you were happy with so I'll give it a go building up with brass tube and solder and if needs be filler as well. Northroader thanks for the thoughtful words it has been a bit of a game changer and is unfortunately still ongoing its quite shocking how it impacts on so many levels. Bit of a double edge sword really as I've plenty of time to model now just no funds to do it with still its fun to return to modeling rather than being a "parts fitter". Regards Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted August 1, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 1, 2015 For the dome, the usual Denny method was to use the round pin from an old mains plug cut to length and soldered onto a washer/disc. These are round and already have a "dome" shape formed. He used to fill the slot in the end with solder and again, do any necessary re-shaping by turning in a hand drill. I know one or two people have suggested suitable chimneys to purchase but there is just something so satisfying about the idea of making one form a few scraps of material. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 In respect of the Caley 492, have you shown your work to Jim Smellie of Caley Coaches? He might have something suitable in his range of castings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penrhos1920 Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 I know you've said that 3D printing is expensive but I've done a chimney safety valve cover and dome that way and it's quite cheep. Usually the postage is more than the printing of the parts. What is expensive is drafting time if you've never drawn a chimney before. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted August 1, 2015 Author Share Posted August 1, 2015 In respect of the Caley 492, have you shown your work to Jim Smellie of Caley Coaches? He might have something suitable in his range of castings. Hi Horse. Jim seems to have gone a bit funny of late (General view of a few people on the Caley forum) I tried to get a Dunalastair chimney and dome from his 900 class kit about eight months ago as he advertises any part from any of his kits are available individually and at first he didn't respond to my request so after two weeks I politely asked again and received a rather blunt and un helpful reply stating he couldn't supply me with any of the parts I asked for so I've still got that one to finish but thought I'd try again with the same request as the 900 class chimney and dome is almost the same as the 492. So far two weeks later I've not received a reply to my request using his on line parts ordering form and talking to a few chaps including one of the society committee members on the Caley forum they've had the same problem. So it looks like that avenue might be a dead end. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 Hi Horse. Jim seems to have gone a bit funny of late (General view of a few people on the Caley forum) ...... Yes, I suppose that running your own kit range can lead to weirdness.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefrk Posted August 1, 2015 Share Posted August 1, 2015 Hi Steve, the first pic looks similar to a NB J37. In the second pic which is earlier, the chimney is taller and could be similar to a J35, (NB, sacrilege I know). I might have some left-over chimneys from these and domes which might 'do'. I'll look this afternoon. Usual price for someone to turn a bespoke chimney was around £25 a few years ago. Nice work on the scratchbuilds.... Friend of mine has done one of those too. All the best, Dave Franks Hi Steve, unfortunately I don't have a good match for either of the two chimneys you are looking for. I'll ask around if any friends have anything available. As regards Jim Smellie he often has bits on sale on EBAY under the name 'caleyjim' so keep a watch out as I'm sure he's had chimneys and domes for sale in the past. All the best, Dave Franks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted August 17, 2015 Author Share Posted August 17, 2015 Remember a few weeks back I asked if any one had built there own chimney well the advice you gave me encouraged me to give it a go. It was made from two bits of brass tube one cut as a collar sliding over the other bit and two small washers one bent to the curve of the smoke box top. The whole assembly was soldered together a little bit at a time letting the heat from each touch with the iron disperse and slowly the general shape was built up, when done a variety of needle files giving it the final finish shape Here are some pictures the first one of the parts laid together then the next two when first built and looking at the first one against the plans its pretty close to the right size. A couple more on the loco Thanks to you guys I've learnt a new skill which is why I love this site so much thanks Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Northroader Posted August 17, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 17, 2015 SUCCESS!!! Good lad, Steve! Glad you did it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted August 17, 2015 Author Share Posted August 17, 2015 SUCCESS!!! Good lad, Steve! Glad you did it. Thanks it went very well I just need to add a little filler to the base flange to finish it off but I managed to build up the solder at the top washer enough to file the profile into it. Thanks for the help and advice I followed it to the letter and it worked first time. I've got a Caledonian Dunalastair that's needs a chimney next so I'll use the same method for that. Regards Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted August 17, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 17, 2015 Nice one! That has to be more satisfying than finding a suitable casting or having one printed in 3D. It is lovely to see somebody having a go at what I would call "proper modelling" on RMWeb. Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted August 17, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 17, 2015 Only just seen your thread. My Dad built a CR 0-8-0T in Plasticard many moons ago - as shown by it being a little "warped". The chimney is metal and could only have come from Nucast - knowing father he would have done what you have now done but starting with a whitemetal chimney as a start point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian@stenochs Posted August 20, 2015 Share Posted August 20, 2015 Usual price for someone to turn a bespoke chimney was around £25 a few years ago. Dave Franks I turn my own chimneys and domes and did once offer a bespoke service. A chimney takes about 2-5 hours work depending on complexity so £25 is very reasonable. How much does your local garage charge per hour? Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Northroader Posted August 31, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 31, 2015 I thought I'd just throw in a picture of some fittings for an old Victorian loco (7mm scale) I've done this week, using the methods outlined in post #10; Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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