Class 66 in OO Gauge - New Announcement

[Pre Grouping fan]

19 minutes ago, The Black Hat said:

Is that the ones of Royal Scotsman, CEMEX, etc or there more to follow?

66789 is the Large Logo Blue livery. The Scotsman, Cemex liveries plus one or two more, are still to follow. 

[TomScrut]

26 minutes ago, The Black Hat said:

Is that the ones of Royal Scotsman, CEMEX, etc or there more to follow?

 

Yeah, Royal Scotsman x2, Biffa, ONE, Cemex

 

And then a Jaffa FL which isn't a celeb.

 

I don't think I have missed any.

[TomScrut]

21 minutes ago, Erixtar1992 said:

agreed. Plus spend a small bit of time fitting some LEDs for marker lights and they look spot on. Im fairly glad i waited before ordering a hattons version, after buying their RHTT and having bits fall off so easily i was unsuprised by these,  they look good but need a bit of love it seems.  
 

 

Have you done anything to have switchable end lighting? I forgot they don't have markers either!

[atom3624]

If people go as far as removing the axle boxes, perhaps the following protocol could be considered:

 

1. Ensure axle and inside of AB are cleaned of any glue.

2. VERY SLIGHTLY open out the bogie side frame hole.

3. PERHAPS mount the AB on an appropriately sized drill bit - smooth shaft is preferred if available, well centred and turn down the outer surface slightly - to optimise the space available.

4. Obviously, by preferred method, re-glue the AB cover.

 

Al.

Edited March 31, 2020 by atom3624

[daz9284]

On 29/03/2020 at 13:10, charliepetty said:

You can easily retro-fit the same sounds and speakers.  See:

https://www.dckits-devideos.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=253_68&product_id=1639

 

That is true, but it's another £25 per each model I own. I don't mind the £122.50 price but when I add it to basket with the EM2 speaker the price jumps to £140.

 

Regards

Darryl

[Erixtar1992]

1 hour ago, TomScrut said:

 

Have you done anything to have switchable end lighting? I forgot they don't have markers either!

Ive bought a few of the little function boards so function 3&4 work for lighting on a V4, so having them independant.  
obvs this is another advantage to the hattons version.   I do like the colour of their lighting also, looks less toy like

[TomScrut]

23 minutes ago, Erixtar1992 said:

Ive bought a few of the little function boards so function 3&4 work for lighting on a V4, so having them independant.  
obvs this is another advantage to the hattons version.   I do like the colour of their lighting also, looks less toy like

 

Something like this?

 

https://www.coastaldcc.co.uk/products/lighting-kits/8-function/Bachmann-class-66-(later-style)

[The Black Hat]

52 minutes ago, Erixtar1992 said:

Ive bought a few of the little function boards so function 3&4 work for lighting on a V4, so having them independant.  
obvs this is another advantage to the hattons version.   I do like the colour of their lighting also, looks less toy like

Does this not negate being able to use Horn when using sound on V4? or are you using a standard decoder. Just wondering as then could fit a sound v4 to some.

 

Thanks in advance.

[Erixtar1992]

1 hour ago, TomScrut said:

 

Something like this?

 

https://www.coastaldcc.co.uk/products/lighting-kits/8-function/Bachmann-class-66-(later-style)

 

1 hour ago, The Black Hat said:

Does this not negate being able to use Horn when using sound on V4? or are you using a standard decoder. Just wondering as then could fit a sound v4 to some.

 

Thanks in advance.

sorry no, i meant an output board for boosting a loksound V4’s aux3&4 from Logic level output to full power aux. I put function by mistake haha. 

you can then use a lokprogrammer to assign the tails ect to whatever function keys you wish

[Erixtar1992]

Duplicate post.

Edited March 31, 2020 by Erixtar1992

[TomScrut]

1 hour ago, Erixtar1992 said:

 

sorry no, i meant an output board for boosting a loksound V4’s aux3&4 from Logic level output to full power aux. I put function by mistake haha. 

you can then use a lokprogrammer to assign the tails ect to whatever function keys you wish

 

Ah right I will have to look into that. I assumed the tails at one end were on the same circuit as the headlights on the other on the Bachmann?

[TomScrut]

TBH I don't see the point in interrogating Hattons about their intentions for future releases at the moment!

[TomScrut]

Well I will share my experience of these models so far.

 

I have 66789 and 66756.

 

First taking out of the box, very nice model and certainly leaps and bounds over the Bachmann in terms of detail especially in the underframe IMO. All in all I'd say they came in good nick, none of the misaligned name plates or glue marks, and the axle box covers look straight and not glued to the bogie. One had one of the downward facing pipes that fit to the lower edge of the body having fallen off, and the other had one of the front end pipes fallen out. I have had far worse from models that haven't had these levels of complaints, so I am happy with that as they won't take a lot of fixing back on.

 

Body removal without damaging the ladder handrails seems near impossible, I have had two fall off the same ladder, and whilst on the second one I encouraged them out of the holes with tweezers this just damaged the paint. I can't help but think this could have been designed so they didn't move upwards with the body, and I think somebody has already suggested this. During the process of fitting the slotted air dam I knocked two of the fine detailed bits off, again I'll have to glue these back on. Not sure if I'd rather those parts were moulded at the expense of detail or not yet.

 

I still can't believe they fitted the wires straight across the speaker enclosure! I wont be fitting sound to them so it doesn't affect me but I do think this could easily have been avoided.

 

But, once out back together they look awesome and look forward to giving them a run tonight. Unfortunately in the not so distant future it will be top back off again, as I have some Lokpilot V5 MKL decoders coming (I have put normal Lokpilot V5s in for now but the logic outputs won't work on this model AFAIK so had to order different ones). I intend on recreating the lighting configuration of the sound models, or at least prototypical lighting but probably set up how I want it. If they run as good as they look I'll be very happy despite the niggles/room for improvement. Given these cost similar to what Bachmann wanted a year ago it's a massive leap forward. Whether it proves to be too big a leap at once I don't know.

[TomScrut]

Further to the above, I have been having a run with 66756. One of the axlebox covers was on slightly wonky, I have pulled it out and put it back on straight and seems to be behaving. I have yet to run 66789.

 

I am now looking at the lighting in terms of the mappings, I am going to try and replicate the lighting of the sound ones other than instead of "train mode", have a function for each end to deactivate the lighting. That is because I would expect train mode to turn the headlights on at the train end when reversing. I currently have a Lokpilot V5 in there, which has the correct functions other than AUX3 and AUX4 are logic level. I have some Lokpilot V5 "MKL" decoders on the way.

 

Anyway in case it is helpful to anybody else, with the switches set to "Loksound V5" I have the following lights against each output:

 

AUX0/Lights - Directional markers

AUX1 - Tail lamps (non exhaust end)

AUX2 - Tail lamps (exhaust end)

AUX3 - Day headlamp (non exhaust end)

AUX4 - Day headlamp (exhaust end) 

AUX5 - Night headlamp (non exhaust end)

AUX6 - Night headlamp (exhaust end)

AUX7 - Cab light (non exhaust end)

AUX8 - ?

AUX9 - ?

AUX10 - Cab light (exhaust end)

 

Now I am guessing that AUX8 and AUX9 don't do anything, as I aren't aware of any other lighting function on the locomotive!

 

I may have to get my hand in my pocket for a LokProgrammer though. I aren't sure I want to manually program the CVs of all 4 I am due to have! It was bad enough on the two 68s I have.

Edited April 3, 2020 by TomScrut

[pinzaboy]

3 hours ago, TomScrut said:

Well I will share my experience of these models so far.

 

I have 66789 and 66756.

 

First taking out of the box, very nice model and certainly leaps and bounds over the Bachmann in terms of detail especially in the underframe IMO. All in all I'd say they came in good nick, none of the misaligned name plates or glue marks, and the axle box covers look straight and not glued to the bogie. One had one of the downward facing pipes that fit to the lower edge of the body having fallen off, and the other had one of the front end pipes fallen out. I have had far worse from models that haven't had these levels of complaints, so I am happy with that as they won't take a lot of fixing back on.

 

Body removal without damaging the ladder handrails seems near impossible, I have had two fall off the same ladder, and whilst on the second one I encouraged them out of the holes with tweezers this just damaged the paint. I can't help but think this could have been designed so they didn't move upwards with the body, and I think somebody has already suggested this. During the process of fitting the slotted air dam I knocked two of the fine detailed bits off, again I'll have to glue these back on. Not sure if I'd rather those parts were moulded at the expense of detail or not yet.

 

I still can't believe they fitted the wires straight across the speaker enclosure! I wont be fitting sound to them so it doesn't affect me but I do think this could easily have been avoided.

 

But, once out back together they look awesome and look forward to giving them a run tonight. Unfortunately in the not so distant future it will be top back off again, as I have some Lokpilot V5 MKL decoders coming (I have put normal Lokpilot V5s in for now but the logic outputs won't work on this model AFAIK so had to order different ones). I intend on recreating the lighting configuration of the sound models, or at least prototypical lighting but probably set up how I want it. If they run as good as they look I'll be very happy despite the niggles/room for improvement. Given these cost similar to what Bachmann wanted a year ago it's a massive leap forward. Whether it proves to be too big a leap at once I don't know.

Yes. The wires across the speaker is a shame. Because my speaker resonates a bit nd spoils the sound I was considering changing the speaker but to do so will involve a major deconstruction of the wiring.

[rob D2]

5 hours ago, ERIC ALLTORQUE said:

Well the burning question on i guess everones mind is for Dave of Hattons to answer for future releases of this model

The axlebox issue needs a factory fix to irradicate it on any more issues of this,a longer axle and a wheel cast with or it machined on would sort it for good as they have to make the wheels anyway somewhere

The large headlight issue,is that going to be sorted on the Royal Scotsmans and future issues of them variations

One has to admit without these issues this would have been whole lot better release,as in lots of comments against this.

That said properly sorted its a light year past the Bachmann one for sound and DCC functionllity,lets see you release the brakes and give it full power before controlling the movement of the train,its much at doing what the real locomotive does,hat off to Ian Bishop for its functionality,funny the best bit about it but non of the clips on you tube have used drivelock.....

Answers please @Hattons Dave

 

 

Jeeeezzz, give him a chance. You may have noticed a lot of businesses having to  adapt to the global pandemic - I’m sure Dave is involved in that readjustment and has to do his real job, which sure as hell, isn’t full time monitoring RMweb to provide future answers to questions they have no answers for yet.......let them sort this batch as much as they can .

[Edna Clouds]

There's plenty of wire coiled in a loop, and releasing the wires from the groove pathways on the chassis leaves plenty of 'slack' to manoeuvre an EM2 speaker in or out of its little glory hole. There is no need for any wire cutting. I put Bif's decoder and an EM2 speaker in 789 at Christmas after the last minute delivery! The axle boxes took a little longer, but it runs beautifully now.

[TomScrut]

6 minutes ago, Edna Clouds said:

There's plenty of wire coiled in a loop, and releasing the wires from the groove pathways on the chassis leaves plenty of 'slack' to manoeuvre an EM2 speaker in or out of its little glory hole. There is no need for any wire cutting. I put Bif's decoder and an EM2 speaker in 789 at Christmas after the last minute delivery! The axle boxes took a little longer, but it runs beautifully now.

 

That's very good to know that it has been accounted for even if it's not obvious!

 

You'd think it would cost more to do two different wired board assemblies than it would save in wire TBH

[YesTor]

Just to follow up on my last post having removed all axlebox covers, and basically all that seems to be required is the use of a 3mm drill to gently enlarge the existing holes in the bogie sideframes:

 

 

 

 

One of the internal section sideframes was loose on my model and I guess some may find it easier to work on this section if removed from the main bogie, however it really isn't necessary as we are only very gently enlarging the holes anyway, but just for reference:

 

 

 

Clean up the axlebox caps as necessary, add a tiny dab of glue to the tip of the axle and insert and clip the cap back into place:

 

 

 

 

I left the glue to harden overnight, and all looking neat and tidy in the axlebox department...

 

 

 

A quick test shows the 'shed' now running as smooth-as-silk and not a wobble in sight...   Joy!  

 

 

 

One beautiful model!

 

cheers

Al

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by YesTor

[159220]

8 hours ago, YesTor said:

One of the internal section sideframes was loose on my model ....

 

 

Is anything on on these models properly glued on? I am not for a moment saying it is not an impressively detailed model, I did enjoy looking at them for the hour I owned them before I asked for a refund, but the quality control asserted over the factory is woefully poor. (It is clear it is project management inexperience as the RHTTs/FEAs had loose bits and avoidable manufacture issues/quality control and I suspect these must be produced at a different factory than the 66s.)

 

Still, I think in the last page or two, much food for thought has been given to Hatton's. Shall they listen is a different matter! It is disappointing that knowledgeable people on here (and privately) have reached out to Hatton's with constructive feedback, they had ample opportunity to take on this advice yet I see very little acknowledgement of it. The axel box and other errors were so easily missed.  

 

To part with my money again, there are three simple steps:

 

1. Get on top of quality control, do not overload the factory with 31 different examples but allow them to do 6-8 examples and stress the level of quality you expect. 

2. Address the bogie tooling, clearly as Yes Tor has beautifully demonstrated the axel hole on the internal side frame needs widening. 

3. Address the various livery errors, though this really is part of 1. Understand if you provide the factory Pantone, they shall match to the closest RAL. So ideally, specify RAL. All the main ROSCOs and FOCs provide this information. 

 

Yes RMWebbers who love Hatton's are likely to criticise this post, yet it is aim at Hatton's if they want my money. Really, if they are to be a manufacturer they would release across the retailer network so I can support a local family business rather than fun warehouse lighting. 

 

I shall see how the next seven are, as I am interested in the pink Freightliner. But at the point, unless a batch next year seems sensibly manufactured I shall be waiting for Bachmann to come along and provide a new 66 to the hundreds of retailers out there who do not stock Hatton's Orginal's and need my pocket money far more than Hatton's do through these uncertain times.

 

To the comment about the nowt being wrong with the Bachmann 66. I disagree, yes the body and livery application is great (cab windows and WiPac lighting is the correct size) but the chassis really does speak for the time it was designed. More details can be applied, especially around the sole bar wiring. Ideally I would like a new chassis, so I can keep bodies like my Tube Lines 66 - best livery ever! 

 

 

[rob D2]

The detailing of the Bachmann one is of its time - it’s sturdy but lacking a fair bit .  
 

that said my main complaint was the ever increasing price point from them - £150-160 is taking the .......

 

if I can get a Bachmann one for 70-95 pounds I’d probably take that over the hattons one at present .

 

[TomScrut]

11 minutes ago, rob D2 said:

The detailing of the Bachmann one is of its time - it’s sturdy but lacking a fair bit .  
 

that said my main complaint was the ever increasing price point from them - £150-160 is taking the .......

 

if I can get a Bachmann one for 70-95 pounds I’d probably take that over the hattons one at present .

 

 

That's the thing. The Hattons one is said to be expensive but Bachmann dropped their prices from around that.

 

The Aggregate Industries one is knocking about at £90 ish still I think but new Bachmanns seem to be around the £120 mark at the moment

[john new]

On 30/03/2020 at 20:14, john new said:

 

After a bit of running backwards and forwards on my short shunting plank I have noticed a slight wobble but for the moment happy to live with that. My first sound loco so have a lot to learn, volume setting for a starter, it is a bit loud for inside the house.

 

Slow running seems very good, weird though is its running through my reverse curves over the yard throat points, at slow speeds (3 or less set on my Powercab) it derails on several of the routes but going though the same route a bit faster it is fine. This is the converse of what I anticipated. May be an issue with my track as this is a bigger beast than normally runs on it (longer, heavier and a Co-Co not Bo-Bo or smaller). However, it is the Society engine, so despite being far too modern for the layout this was a must have. One to look into further, luckily not yet ballasted the track so scope to tinker.

 

 

After a fair bit of testing and running the loco backwards and forwards to try to address/fix the derailing issue mentioned earlier I finally sussed what was the basic issue, but for ages, not the cause. The symptom was the leading axle on whichever bogie was leading going through from the toe end towards the frog was jumping the track and always wheel into the V. Turning the loco physically around made no difference, which I felt eliminated it being an issue with the wheel set or the bogie. I also de-pinned the track and made a few minor alignment adjustments, they did not eliminate the issue.  I should have spotted it more quickly, it was always the leading end but because the two points are opposed one on the (to be) scenic section one in the fiddle yard it took me far too long to twig that whether the engine was going as forwards or as reverse there was always a leading axle going into the problem points!

 

I have now found what I think is the issue, the specific shape of Hornby point frogs. Of the five points on this shunting plank two are, IIRC,  Hornby* and three PECO (1 x Streamline Y and 2 Set-track); on none of the PECOs does the derailment issue occur. The Hornby's have a slightly different frog design with a slightly rounded end to the plastic nose rather than the V of the PECOs. The loco will take the curved route without a problem; however, for whatever reason, when going through with the route set for straight the flange appears to just nudge the nose of the crossing V and get deflected towards the curve. This is just enough to lift the lead wheels off the track, the other two axles staying on; the weight of the loco stopping the other two axles from also lifting off. 

 

This may be the cause of other reviewers suggesting the locos don't like 2nd radius curves; on my shunting plank the bogie swing/overhang is severe on the 2nd radius but it copes fine with the actual curvature, it is just the two Hornby points that are problematic.

 

Slow running and the bits of the sound and lighting options I have so far tested are excellent. No issues so far with bits falling off/getting knocked off but I have yet to risk removing the body to fit the coupling option onto the second end.

 

Hope this helps others.

 

*TBC when I lift them. Definitely not the same frog shape as the other three. Pretty sure they came from a train set box and probably not the latest design.

 

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by john new
Note added for clarity

[MRDBLUE17]

Hello everyone,

 

I received my model of 66088 yesterday and I have to say I’m quite happy with it. The level of detail, cab interiors and underframe are superb. It’s heavy and has a nice smooth quiet motor. 
 

The lighting also makes a vast improvement and eventually I will add sound as well.

 

It did have a couple of missing axle box covers but a quick call to Hattons means these will get sent out so no complaints there. 
 

At first it did wobble quite badly which didn’t improve during running in as well as the decoder warming up. Thanks to Al’s informative post (YesTor) I removed all the axle covers as I found the loco wasn’t level on the track contributing to the rocking. One axle cover was glued as wasn’t even turning. Instantly I found the loco was smooth and level. I ran it in for 30 minutes each way and the decoder remained cool. 
 

The rotating axle boxes, whilst a nice feature, won’t really be noticed in normal use so I decided to cut back the shafts and have glued the covers back on over the holes in the side frames. It looks great and runs very well plus less chance of them working loose and falling off in future. 
 

A slight compromise maybe but, it’s a quick fix which has given perfect running and with the level of detail on this new model I will hopefully add more in the future.

 

All the best

Mark

 

[YesTor]

12 hours ago, 159220 said:

Is anything on on these models properly glued on?  

 

Okay, okay, I think a little context may be required here... I'm not even certain that this piece is necessarily supposed to be glued, all I am saying is that one piece appeared slightly loose and came out when pulled.  If anything, it may even be preferable to have this section removable - if you've ever stripped bogies, wheelsets, motor and gearbox for a total stripped-down clean and re-assembly then you'll know that it is actually preferable to not have everything bunged up with Superglue.   ie. bunged-up with glue does not always equate to being great...   Just saying... 

 

What I will add, is that I now own 11 of these models and each and every one is covered in a wealth of separately-added detail - etched, plastic, grilles and otherwise - and overall I can recall one etched air-dam step being loose in the box on one model.  So I think that, "Is anything on these models properly glued on" might be a tad OTT. 

 

The bottom line is that with an ever-increasing quantity of added-on parts per model it is surely inevitable that something will always likely be loose, whoever the manufacturer.  If bits were dropping off left, right and centre then I'd complain, but to be fair, they aren't.  Okay, the axlebox issue ain't so great, for sure, but I believe in credit where credit is due (without bias), and feel that with regard to detailing and general standard of assembly that Hatton's have done exceptionally well in this department. 

 

I hope that provides some context as to the thinking behind my comments re loose parts.

 

Best

Al

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by YesTor