Guest 2750 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 (edited) I did indeed have a lovely two days playing trains and modelling. I have now added the majority of the detailing (minus top lamp iron which I will do later today). I'm going to do a touch of further cleaning up, removing the Krystal Klear glazing and then will spray red oxide primer, followed by Halfords Satin Black. I know at one point I think Tony did wonder if it was going to be worth the effort, but I think the results speak for themselves. I should also thank former RMweb member James Wells, who suggested the alteration, as he had noticed the rather underweight smokebox on his Nucast J27 he built in his teens, he used plasticard to bulk up the smokebox, however as I had a J27 kit for Dave Alexander, he includes two smokeboxes to represent both types. Edited September 2, 2014 by 2750 12 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Grafarman Posted September 2, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 2, 2014 Another book of mine is shortly to be published by Irwell Press, showing BR in its 'blue period'. Obviously, post-'Semis', but it does show many diesel/electric classes which also acquired nicknames. Apologies for the plug. Tony, please could you post the title and ISBN number when it becomes available; always happy to make room for more books on BR Blue... Thanks David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 2750 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I did indeed have a lovely two days playing trains and modelling. I have now added the majority of the detailing (minus top lamp iron which I will do later today). _MG_7818.jpg I'm going to do a touch of further cleaning up, removing the Krystal Klear glazing and then will spray red oxide primer, followed by Halfords Satin Black. I know at one point I think Tony did wonder if it was going to be worth the effort, but I think the results speak for themselves. I should also thank former RMweb member James Wells, who suggested the alteration, as he had noticed the rather underweight smokebox on his Nucast J27 he built in his teens, he used plasticard to bulk up the smokebox, however as I had a J27 kit for Dave Alexander, he includes two smokeboxes to represent both types. Following on from my last post, here is the prototype photograph I'm working from, 2392 (which is the preserved J27 and as it happens is the one Rob had numbered it as, in BR condition). Longtime York loco and is seen here on York North Shed in 1939. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Tony, please could you post the title and ISBN number when it becomes available; always happy to make room for more books on BR Blue... Thanks David Tony, David Hope i am not sticking my nose in here, but Tony's new book is: INTO THE BLUE Price: £9.99 PUBLISHIED SEPTEMBER 2014 AVAILABLE FROM MOST W H SMITH HIGH STREET SHOPS OR DIRECT FROM THE PUBLISHER Gary J Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gr.king Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Tom: Is your chimney upright, or leaning slightly forwards / right?? If there's any enamel already on that loco watch out! You might get away with car aerosol red oxide primer if put on in light, fairly dry coats, but if you follow up with the same sort of aerosol for the satin black it may pickle the lot, especially if you let it get wet enough to produce a shine..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidw Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Tom: Is your chimney upright, or leaning slightly forwards / right?? If there's any enamel already on that loco watch out! You might get away with car aerosol red oxide primer if put on in light, fairly dry coats, but if you follow up with the same sort of aerosol for the satin black it may pickle the lot, especially if you let it get wet enough to produce a shine..... You may want to dip the lot in paint stripper... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
69843 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 although one doesn't have to be old to be a git. Welcome to my generation Tony....it's sad, but very true. Anyhow, enough of the doom and gloom. Found another LNER gem on British Pathé: Some footage of the operation of a signal box. However, it gets good at 4:28, and some quite rare footage at 5:22..... The video drops in and out of sound for the running section, but the sound is on for the departure of B17 2835 (later 1635 and 61635) in Wartime Black with NE lettering on the tender 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted September 2, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 2, 2014 I know at one point I think Tony did wonder if it was going to be worth the effort, but I think the results speak for themselves. I should also thank former RMweb member James Wells, who suggested the alteration, as he had noticed the rather underweight smokebox on his Nucast J27 he built in his teens, he used plasticard to bulk up the smokebox, however as I had a J27 kit for Dave Alexander, he includes two smokeboxes to represent both types. Tom the nucast kit comes with two smoke boxes (one long and one short) and two spectacle plates to cover the J26/J27 variations. Baz Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45609 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 (edited) Tom: Is your chimney upright, or leaning slightly forwards / right?? If there's any enamel already on that loco watch out! You might get away with car aerosol red oxide primer if put on in light, fairly dry coats, but if you follow up with the same sort of aerosol for the satin black it may pickle the lot, especially if you let it get wet enough to produce a shine..... You may want to dip the lot in paint stripper... Absolutely! This is very good advice as I was bitten by this many years ago. Strip the paint first on anything that is of unknown formulation but avoid the strong paint strippers. Anything not metal and/or not soldered on will not survive. Superstrip is good but pricey. A caustic soda solution or caustic oven cleaner are also good options for removing old paint. Having said that it is likely to be a fairly tedious and messy job. The other option is to prime and spray with Arcylic paint through an airbrush using less agressive solvent. Something like this http://www.snmstuff.co.uk/vallejo-model-air/ Cheers....Morgan Edited September 2, 2014 by mlgilbert30 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 2750 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Tom the nucast kit comes with two smoke boxes (one long and one short) and two spectacle plates to cover the J26/J27 variations. Baz Indeed Barry, but the smokebox diameter is very much undersize on both. Thanks for the comments gents. Regarding Chimney, it must be the angle or the photo as I checked several times and whether it was straight. The J27 and Q6 are both going to be nitromorsed this evening. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted September 2, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 2, 2014 Welcome to my generation Tony....it's sad, but very true. Anyhow, enough of the doom and gloom. Found another LNER gem on British Pathé: Some footage of the operation of a signal box. However, it gets good at 4:28, and some quite rare footage at 5:22..... The video drops in and out of sound for the running section, but the sound is on for the departure of B17 2835 (later 1635 and 61635) in Wartime Black with NE lettering on the tender What a fascinating collection of coaches in those trains! Several views of Tourist Stock twins (in one case with bulging plywood panelling), and various pre-Grouping types. Looks as though in the post war period it was a case of making up trains with anything that could turn a wheel! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pebbles Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 As far as I can make out the smokebox diameter for a J26/27 9superheated or otherwise), should be a shade under 25.6mm. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted September 2, 2014 Author Share Posted September 2, 2014 Tony, please could you post the title and ISBN number when it becomes available; always happy to make room for more books on BR Blue... Thanks David It's called Into The Blue, published by Irwell Press this month. I'll seek out the ISBN number, but you can order it direct from Irwell on 01525 861888. Thanks, Tony. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted September 2, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 2, 2014 It contains some of my pictures taken over a 20 year period from 1973 until the beginning of BR breaking up. I have thousands, and if this soft-back sells well, there could be others. Seriously, it's the first time Irwell has published a book devoted to British Rail blue. Why? Am I that good at persuading publishers? I doubt it, but it's aimed at a 'younger' market, one that's not mainly composed of grumpy old gits like me, the likes of whom are not increasing in numbers. Quite the opposite, although one doesn't have to be old to be a git. I wrote it with modellers in mind to some extent, but it's not captioned with masses of minute detail differences amongst classes, mainly because I don't know about those differences. Just details of locations, dates and workings (I hope) when locos hauled regionally-identifiable trains, signalling in many areas was mechanical and those trains didn't look like some dim-wit had been given the most polychromatic of paint palettes and told to squirt the contents at them! Hi Tony If I recall on meeting each other a couple of months ago you said something like "Oh! You are older than I thought". I think the chaps at Irwell Press might find those interested in the BR corporate image are older than they thought. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted September 2, 2014 Author Share Posted September 2, 2014 (edited) Tom: Is your chimney upright, or leaning slightly forwards / right?? If there's any enamel already on that loco watch out! You might get away with car aerosol red oxide primer if put on in light, fairly dry coats, but if you follow up with the same sort of aerosol for the satin black it may pickle the lot, especially if you let it get wet enough to produce a shine..... I might have been lucky with this, but I've used acrylic car paint on top of enamel with no trouble. As long as the primer is left (at least) overnight, the satin black will not pickle what's underneath. Older car paint (the much-more durable cellulose) would attack enamel and/or plastic finishes. The original models were most likely sprayed with cellulose car paint anyway, with just enamel weathering (which has been rubbed-down considerably already). Tom's giving it a try, so I hope he'll report accordingly. Edited September 2, 2014 by Tony Wright 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I think Clive has a very good point. I got interested on Railways, real and model in 1977, in the middle of the Blue period, and I HATED IT, so I went and modeled the German, Swiss and Austrian railways for their colour, Now I have a nice collection of Blue Diesels, most with sound, and I LOVE EM. I think you have another winner on your hands Tony, BTW I've just finished reading; A Lifetime with Locomotive and Layouts. superb. Andy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted September 2, 2014 Author Share Posted September 2, 2014 Another splendid day running trains and chatting about locos and photography has just been spent in the company of David Allsop (Landscapes). He brought along three locos, of which I photographed two.... The spotters at Little Bytham would have been jumping for joy at the sight of this Scottish-based A2, 60529 PEARL DIVER. David renumbered and renamed it from 60533, a Bachmann A2 (only to look in the new catalogue to find Bachmann is to produce exactly this one). He also weathered it to perfection to produce this not-long-out-of-shops finish. It ran beautifully, with just a hint of slipping when getting this 11-car express going. Once again, a pleasure to invite a fellow modeller who's trying to do things for himself, and let him run his models - at speed as well! This is his PDK-built A2/1, which has already featured on this thread. This was slightly less successful at running, on two counts. One is it's too light (resin-boiler) and two, the rear bogie wheels caught the inside of the cylinders on my tightest curves (2' 9" - out of sight). This is a common problem with Thompson Pacifics and I usually resort to nibbling a bit of the cylinder end away. The bogie is allowed to swing in just a slot, not on an arm pivoted at both ends; the latter I usually arrange. This also restricts sideways movement. Since this loco is for his Haymarket shed depiction, it won't matter. The third loco, a new Hornby B1, also failed on the 2' 9" radius curves (only on the inner circuit), because the front steps fouled the outer bogie wheels. Both the A2/1 and the B1 ran perfectly on the Down slow. We discussed how locos should be built to suit their home layouts (all mine will negotiate 2' 6" curves) and I put the newly-built A1 on to demonstrate. After several perfect laps, the front bogie derailed on a large-radius Peco point in the fiddle yard. After checking, I adjusted one rail, then adjusted the springing on the bogie. After that, perfect, but it'll teach to be 'smug' about the running on LB. Many other trains romped round properly, though. David also took some pictures with his little Canon, which seemed very good indeed on the rear screen. Perhaps he'll post some. Thinking again about the necessary compromises on a model railway, I'm still delighted with the open nature achieved on Little Bytham. The fact that the trains go 'offstage' dead straight certainly helps. The second view of 60529 illustrates this quite well - the photographer could have been standing on Marsh Bridge. Thank you David for an excellent day's company. 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 2750 Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 I might have been lucky with this, but I've used acrylic car paint on top of enamel with no trouble. As long as the primer is left (at least) overnight, the satin black will not pickle what's underneath. Older car paint (the much-more durable cellulose) would attack enamel and/or plastic finishes. The original models were most likely sprayed with cellulose car paint anyway, with just enamel weathering (which has been rubbed-down considerably already). Tom's giving it a try, so I hope he'll report accordingly. Sods law isn't it! I received a phone call from Tony, just after I had begun applying nitromos to the side of tender. To be honest, I think I would have been at it for years, as it was taking a long time to lift. I stopped adding any more, have used fine wet and dry...and it's now as smooth as a baby's.... Ready for Red Primer tomorrow. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
landscapes Posted September 2, 2014 Share Posted September 2, 2014 Another splendid day running trains and chatting about locos and photography has just been spent in the company of David Allsop (Landscapes). He brought along three locos, of which I photographed two.... DSC_8736.JPG DSC_8739.JPG The spotters at Little Bytham would have been jumping for joy at the sight of this Scottish-based A2, 60529 PEARL DIVER. David renumbered and renamed it from 60533, a Bachmann A2 (only to look in the new catalogue to find Bachmann is to produce exactly this one). He also weathered it to perfection to produce this not-long-out-of-shops finish. It ran beautifully, with just a hint of slipping when getting this 11-car express going. Once again, a pleasure to invite a fellow modeller who's trying to do things for himself, and let him run his models - at speed as well! DSC_8743.JPG This is his PDK-built A2/1, which has already featured on this thread. This was slightly less successful at running, on two counts. One is it's too light (resin-boiler) and two, the rear bogie wheels caught the inside of the cylinders on my tightest curves (2' 9" - out of sight). This is a common problem with Thompson Pacifics and I usually resort to nibbling a bit of the cylinder end away. The bogie is allowed to swing in just a slot, not on an arm pivoted at both ends; the latter I usually arrange. This also restricts sideways movement. Since this loco is for his Haymarket shed depiction, it won't matter. The third loco, a new Hornby B1, also failed on the 2' 9" radius curves (only on the inner circuit), because the front steps fouled the outer bogie wheels. Both the A2/1 and the B1 ran perfectly on the Down slow. We discussed how locos should be built to suit their home layouts (all mine will negotiate 2' 6" curves) and I put the newly-built A1 on to demonstrate. After several perfect laps, the front bogie derailed on a large-radius Peco point in the fiddle yard. After checking, I adjusted one rail, then adjusted the springing on the bogie. After that, perfect, but it'll teach to be 'smug' about the running on LB. Many other trains romped round properly, though. David also took some pictures with his little Canon, which seemed very good indeed on the rear screen. Perhaps he'll post some. Thinking again about the necessary compromises on a model railway, I'm still delighted with the open nature achieved on Little Bytham. The fact that the trains go 'offstage' dead straight certainly helps. The second view of 60529 illustrates this quite well - the photographer could have been standing on Marsh Bridge. Thank you David for an excellent day's company. Good Evening Tony Thank you so much for a really wonderful day, it really was a privilege to be able see Little Bytham and your collection of wonderful LNER locomotives. Sorry about the two locomotives that let me down, but even in the short time I was with you I have learnt some valuable information regarding how model locomotives should run and some great tips on photographing them which l that I am very keen to put into practise as soon as I can. Also many thanks to your charming wife Mo for providing a very nice lunch as well. The photos of 60529 Pearl Diver and 60509 Waverley that you took look great I will put some of my own photos on very soon but some how I do not think they will come up to the standard of the ones you have put on this evening. Regards David 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted September 3, 2014 Author Share Posted September 3, 2014 (edited) Good Evening Tony Thank you so much for a really wonderful day, it really was a privilege to be able see Little Bytham and your collection of wonderful LNER locomotives. Sorry about the two locomotives that let me down, but even in the short time I was with you I have learnt some valuable information regarding how model locomotives should run and some great tips on photographing them which l that I am very keen to put into practise as soon as I can. Also many thanks to your charming wife Mo for providing a very nice lunch as well. The photos of 60529 Pearl Diver and 60509 Waverley that you took look great I will put some of my own photos on very soon but some how I do not think they will come up to the standard of the ones you have put on this evening. Regards David Thanks David, I don't think your two locos 'let you down', they merely illustrated the point that 'layout' locos should be able to negotiate the tightest curves on the layout they're meant to run on. I seem to recall that the Hornby B1 I have had to have its front steps 'shaved' a bit to go round a 2' 6" radius curve (it's away for weathering at the moment). I also substituted the rather clumsy and fat-treaded bogie wheels, which also helped. I assume Hornby leave the steps off at point of sale (as they do with their 8F and others) because their locos will often have to run over train set curves. In the case of Bachmann's K3 and Fairburn tank, no front steps are provided at all, because of the risk of their fouling on curves. As for 60509, an increase in the length of the bogie slot and a bit off the inside of the cylinder ends and she'll be fine on 2' 6" curves. Next time you come, I'll open her up and see if more ballast can be inserted. It was beautifully-made though. To reiterate in general, even on a largish layout like mine, there have to be compromises. Because of my insistence on trains entering/leaving the scenic section on the straight, the consequence is (slightly) tighter radii 'off-stage'. The M&GNR overbridge at the north end and Parks Bridge (a farm access) at the south end are, to all intents and purposes, parallel with each other. To have full-width curves at the end would have lost this essential feature and introduced daft half right angle-curves to the fastest section of the ECML. As a further consequence to that, some locos have their cylinder ends nibbled away inside (invisible when painted) or their front footsteps shaved inside just a bit. I will not tolerate, however, no front footsteps when they should be there or cut-back cylinder drain cocks in most cases (though some older locos have this latter 'failure' because some of Stoke's off-stage curves were tighter - in time, I'll extend those drain cocks). Whatever the necessary compromises, I will not tolerate poor running. That's why that A1 derailment had to be investigated, and fixed. As I've said before, I must be a bit of a zealot! Edited September 3, 2014 by Tony Wright Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Jason T Posted September 3, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 3, 2014 I imagine that with many RTR locos, the steps are included mainly for display purposes as I can't think of many (any?) which will get round even the generous curves on Bacup without at least some modification. Problem is, when you take the time to try and improve the look of the locos, the lack of front steps grates somewhat. On all my Black Fives, the bogie wheels have been replaced with Gibson ones and Comet steps, the Crab needed new guide holes for the steps drilling ( which does cause them to sit further out but is an acceptable compromise for me) and others have required the back of steps shaving down and Gibson wheels fitting. All part of the fun of modelling though Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 Front steps have been a nighmare probably since the firs model locomotive was built. Plastic ones don't help due to the inherent thickness. I am considering having some etched on the next coach sheet similar to the ones I had done for the Duke 8P, as they can be set out further than scale and yet still look right. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatman Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 I would warn against Nitromors. I once did a series of "Code 3" Models of Yesteryear, which required all the Matchbox paint being removed. It came off a treat, but even after scrubbing with cellulose thinners and hot water, the new paint would NOT set. New cellulose staying as wet as the tin-full permanently. So I tried my usual self-etch Sikkens from the spray gun and it dried instantly as did the coats on top. After that I just rubbed the original paint down and used self-etch straight over that. Perfect finish. I use self-etch for all uses, including the painting of Ureol patterns and the final resin mouldings. No need for scrubbing with vinegar/VIM/etc. Regards, Boatman Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
landscapes Posted September 3, 2014 Share Posted September 3, 2014 (edited) Good Evening All Following Tony's very kind invitation for me to visit him at his home and see his layout Little Bytham first hand I have posted a few of my own photos showing two of my locomotives and one of Tony's own models. The first photo is of Bachmann A2 60529 Pearl Diver on an up express, I hope I got the North South orientation correct. The second photo is of my PDK A2/1 60509 Waverley approaching Little Bytham station having failed on an up fish train. And the final shot shows Tony's B1 61206 taking over the fish train from the failed A2/1 which was later packaged up and taken back to Swindon for some minor repair works. I did not have the heart or the skills to remove the back ground and why should I Little Bytham is truly and wonderful model railway layout in a great setting. Thank you again Tony. Regards David Edited September 3, 2014 by landscapes 15 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wright Posted September 4, 2014 Author Share Posted September 4, 2014 Good Evening All Following Tony's very kind invitation for me to visit him at his home and see his layout Little Bytham first hand I have posted a few of my own photos showing two of my locomotives and one of Tony's own models. The first photo is of Bachmann A2 60529 Pearl Diver on an up express, I hope I got the North South orientation correct. The second photo is of my PDK A2/1 60509 Waverley approaching Little Bytham station having failed on an up fish train. And the final shot shows Tony's B1 61206 taking over the fish train from the failed A2/1 which was later packaged up and taken back to Swindon for some minor repair works. I did not have the heart or the skills to remove the back ground and why should I Little Bytham is truly and wonderful model railway layout in a great setting. Thank you again Tony. Regards David Thanks David, The B1 is actually Tony Geary's work, though it is, now, my property. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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