RMweb Premium brushman47544 Posted January 30, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 30, 2013 They're here! I've received an email from Hornby letting me know that I can buy the Southern Railway version (only) from them direct using their website. Who'll be the first with pictures and a review... ADMIN EDIT: Topic originally started by Sasquatch but now integrated with all the delivery/distribution posts from the 2BIL topic. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 I just received an email newsletter from Hornby stating that the Southern 2 Bil (R3161) was available to buy from them now... So good news and presumably not too long a wait for the others - Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Multiple identity account 2 Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 I too got the newsletter this morning. Quite happy. Hope to get an SR version soon for my showcase...think it'll be a nice contrast against my Class 60 078. Can't wait to get my hands on one of them, love the SR green and hence I'm opting for it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted January 31, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 31, 2013 Gaugemaster are advising that Hornby has SOLD OUT of the 2Bil production run on pre-orders. While many retailers will still have stock from their quota available they suggest you get in QUICK. www.gaugemaster.com No commercial connection Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerces Fobe2 Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 No commercial connection Just electrical EMU jumper then! XF Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartb Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Gaugemaster are advising that Hornby has SOLD OUT of the 2Bil production run on pre-orders. While many retailers will still have stock from their quota available they suggest you get in QUICK. Kernow are saying the same. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby (John) Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Modelzone website stating IN STOCK! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted February 1, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 1, 2013 Gaugemaster are advising that Hornby has SOLD OUT of the 2Bil production run on pre-orders. While many retailers will still have stock from their quota available they suggest you get in QUICK. www.gaugemaster.com No commercial connection Is there therefore something a little unsettling about Hornby currently offering the model for sale on their own website before any dealer has the stocks to offer their pre-booked customers? If the model has sold out, where has Hornby's direct-sale stock come from? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby (John) Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Is there therefore something a little unsettling about Hornby currently offering the model for sale on their own website before any dealer has the stocks to offer their pre-booked customers? If the model has sold out, where has Hornby's direct-sale stock come from? In stock at Modelzone Ian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted February 1, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 1, 2013 In stock at Modelzone Ian. Well, yes, so you pointed out. But elsewhere on RMweb today, I have read that Modelzone's Hornby stock is actually owned by Hornby. While of course that "fact" has not been vouchsafed by either party officially, if it is true it is no surprise that Hornby are making stock available early via that route. Silence from other prominent boxshifters so far, which is odd. On the other hand, a popular Northants bricks-and-mortar dealer has said on RMweb today that he is rather vexed by something Hornby has done - could all these things be related? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RFS Posted February 1, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 1, 2013 Kernow are saying that they still have some stock from their allocation available to pre-order. I believe when it's said it is "sold out" it just means Hornby have sold all models to the dealers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted February 1, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 1, 2013 Kernow are saying that they still have some stock from their allocation available to pre-order. I believe when it's said it is "sold out" it just means Hornby have sold all models to the dealers. My point entirely. If "Hornby have sold all models to the dealers" how come they have stock to sell direct from their own website? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Ian, surely that is an interpretation of words? Say Hornby make 100 units. They keep 30 back for themselves, and offer 70 to dealers. When the 70 have been sold to the dealers, then they say "sold out". Meanwhile, their 30 sell at their own pace. In effect, the Hornby website becomes A.N.Other dealer? Stewart Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted February 1, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 1, 2013 I think I see this as the thin end of a very thick wedge. Hornby can undoubtedly make more money selling direct at full RRP than they can via dealers. In the days of virtually unlimited product availability, this wasn't an issue, but now batches are strictly limited, with most sales almost immediately on release, then dealers' opportunities to sell more are being limited by Hornby's parallel wish to sell direct. We have already seen what happened when Bachmann had a runaway success with the C Class - the spiffy livery version became unavailable in days. Hornby are offering the product today, yet no retail dealer has yet been able to do so - the exception being Modelzone, who apparently may have a deal with Hornby, so we are told. If we believe that a healthy retail market requires a genuinely competitive environment - and I do - then for the leading (by market share and reputation) manufacturer to start sales direct before his retailers have a chance does not sound like good news. Certainly, if Hattons are unable to fulfill my order, I will not be buying direct from Hornby, not because of price, but because I think this is bad for the hobby. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike at C&M Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 Is there therefore something a little unsettling about Hornby currently offering the model for sale on their own website before any dealer has the stocks to offer their pre-booked customers? If the model has sold out, where has Hornby's direct-sale stock come from? We have had a delivery in today from Hornby which was packed yesterday (31st), a day after people were informed that the units were at Margate and available for sale directly from them, but absolutely no sign of the 2-BILs within our parcel. So where are the units that the retailers are to sell? We were informed last week that no more retailer orders were being accepted as the production run was pre-sold. I can add that this point is not relevant to the posting made by a "popular Northants bricks-and-mortar dealer" mentioned above by Oldddubbers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 1, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 1, 2013 Well, yes, so you pointed out. But elsewhere on RMweb today, I have read that Modelzone's Hornby stock is actually owned by Hornby. While of course that "fact" has not been vouchsafed by either party officially, if it is true it is no surprise that Hornby are making stock available early via that route. Silence from other prominent boxshifters so far, which is odd. On the other hand, a popular Northants bricks-and-mortar dealer has said on RMweb today that he is rather vexed by something Hornby has done - could all these things be related? See what I have posted on one of the other Hornby threads regarding what seems to be part of Hornby's sales strategy (witness not too distant past statements from the Chief Executive regarding direct sales and sales through concessions - it appears that Modelzone might well be the latter?). It does look as if - if the 2BIL is not an isolated example - that Hornby might be giving some initial priority to direct sales and what could well be sales via a concession. In any case there is a difference between a sell out of stock to retailers and stock which Hornby keeps for its own sales purposes (and long has done having got into direct sales) - they are two separate things. What it does mean I think is that some retailers are going to have to be a tad more accurate in the wording they use to explain to customers why they have no stock of a particular model. Incidentally I was told yesterday by a retailer that his information from Hornby is that they will be despatching 2BILs to retailers next week. And some folk might recall something I posted back in December regarding changes in Hornby's trade terms which might have an impact on retailers' pricing and heavy discounting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 1, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 1, 2013 I think I see this as the thin end of a very thick wedge. Hornby can undoubtedly make more money selling direct at full RRP than they can via dealers. In the days of virtually unlimited product availability, this wasn't an issue, but now batches are strictly limited, with most sales almost immediately on release, then dealers' opportunities to sell more are being limited by Hornby's parallel wish to sell direct. We have already seen what happened when Bachmann had a runaway success with the C Class - the spiffy livery version became unavailable in days. Hornby are offering the product today, yet no retail dealer has yet been able to do so - the exception being Modelzone, who apparently may have a deal with Hornby, so we are told. If we believe that a healthy retail market requires a genuinely competitive environment - and I do - then for the leading (by market share and reputation) manufacturer to start sales direct before his retailers have a chance does not sound like good news. Certainly, if Hattons are unable to fulfill my order, I will not be buying direct from Hornby, not because of price, but because I think this is bad for the hobby. Er yes, as I have already mentioned as just such a possible situation on another thread. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted February 1, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 1, 2013 While we may not necessarily agree with some of the ethics discussed - and at this stage with little or no hard evidence to back them up - we should at least be able to have confidence that our pre-orders via our retailer of choice will be capable of being fulfilled. In very nearly all cases this is done. A retailer orders a quantity and the order is accepted or - in a few cases - is adjusted to a lower number if the production run is over-subscribed. Pre-orders should only be taken for the number assigned with perhaps a notional allowance of spares to accommodate any damaged stock returns. In only one case that I can think of has the retailer not been supplied with the previously agreed quantity of models, has had to offer their humble apologies to hopeful customers and this did not involve Hornby. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozexpatriate Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 See what I have posted regarding what seems to be part of Hornby's sales strategy (witness not too distant past statements from the Chief Executive regarding direct sales and sales through concessions - it appears that Modelzone might well be the latter?). It does look as if - if the 2BIL is not an isolated example - that Hornby might be giving some initial priority to direct sales and what could well be sales via a concession.Like this one from Hornby on November 9, 2012, Mike? ... we are encouraged that sales to the consumer via our chain of in-store concessions continue at a higher level than last year. The retail landscape continues to undergo a period of significant change in the UK. The swing towards e-commerce sales of our products, via the sites of specialist on-line retailers as well as the e-commerce sites of our "bricks and mortar" retailers, continues. Our own e-commerce sites are trading well and we will continue to develop this channel of distribution. ... Our online and direct marketing sales continue to show encouraging growth. By Christmas this year we expect to have completed the redesign and relaunch of all our websites to provide cross-selling facilities and "single- basket" shopping across all our brands. The availability of the 2BIL at Hornby.com before anywhere else is a big departure for them. I had always interpreted the 'in-store concessions' as being the Hornby department in the big department stores, but frankly I never fully understood the term. The Hornby website redesign of a couple of years ago was done to accomplish single-basket shopping. (I don't remember where they mentioned it.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted February 2, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 2, 2013 "Single-basket shopping" direct from Hornby still only encompasses their own group products. The statement quoted appears to acknowledge the swing to e-commerce but does not offer anything to those who shop online with a retailer and can pick and choose from all the brands stocked. An analogy would be perhaps McVities only selling their Ginger Nuts direct or releasing them first to Aldi stores. You'll find them in Tesco next week and possibly a little cheaper and you can order online from Tesco at any time to include all other brands and your entire weekly shopping but McVities want first bite of the cherry to protect some of their commercial interests and at that level you can't blame them. I agree with Ian's comments about being a thin end of some potentially very large wedge which the few large manufacturers could drive through the marketplace forcing us to buy direct. That would have catastrophic consequences for both the retail trade and those smaller businesses who maybe rely on impulse sales across the counter or whose products are stocked by some retailers in order to offer a complete product range across the hobby. Far from "one-basket shopping" the extension of this would be to create a situation where we have to make multiple purchases with each only containing a single brand. It would also kill off the initiative shown by those retailers who choose to commission unique items or alternative liveries on mainstream items and potentially return us to the 1960s where you could have anything you liked so long as it said "Hornby" underneath and was in the colour they chose. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
neal Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 Case in point, I for one am getting tired of strobing retailer banners placed annoyingly close to topic headings such that they are 'accidentally' pressed to link to retailers web sites. This is particularly the case for tablet and mobile device users (with fat fingers like me!). To me this detracts from the site, and is a slightly underhand way of getting hits on retailers sites - not far from the hated pop-ups. I fully appreciate the new landscape in which RMWeb operates, but would ask that a little more space is given between link banners and site content links. With regards the 2-bil issue, only time will tell how the customer may view this situation. At the moment I am not impressed, but this could be the way things are going. This could backfire, in which case it will not have done the Hornby brand any favours. N Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 To me this detracts from the site, and is a slightly underhand way of getting hits on retailers sites - not far from the hated pop-ups. I fully appreciate the new landscape in which RMWeb operates, but would ask that a little more space is given between link banners and site content links. If I were to build extra space in some would grumble that too much space is taken. We try to ensure any advertising is in context with the relevant area and I do go back and suggest amendments if I think the ads are too distracting (rapid gif frame changes etc). I also configure it so that clicking on an ad opens a new tab/page so that a user can always navigate back to where they were. I can promise you there's no intention to be underhand (unlike many sites and their ads with hidden closes), in fact quite the opposite. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
neal Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 If I were to build extra space in some would grumble that too much space is taken. We try to ensure any advertising is in context with the relevant area and I do go back and suggest amendments if I think the ads are too distracting (rapid gif frame changes etc). I also configure it so that clicking on an ad opens a new tab/page so that a user can always navigate back to where they were. I can promise you there's no intention to be underhand (unlike many sites and their ads with hidden closes), in fact quite the opposite. Point taken Andy. I must say there are many many site which are worse for this. Perhaps I should invest in a stylus! N Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted February 2, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 2, 2013 It might be best if we all wait and see what happens in a couple of weeks when retailers receive their allocation. I may well be wrong but market forces will then begin to influence the situation Do we want to pay £20 more direct from Hornby just for the privilege of being first ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 2, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 2, 2013 It might be best if we all wait and see what happens in a couple of weeks when retailers receive their allocation. I may well be wrong but market forces will then begin to influence the situation Do we want to pay £20 more direct from Hornby just for the privilege of being first ? I think it's the same as anything else Ian - you pays your money and you takes your choice. Although clearly the discounted ones will go fastest so it might come down to Hobson's Choice of course. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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