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Crowne plaza booked, just got tickets for two days this year.

One day for scrummage, and a second for appreciation.

 

Last year one day wasn't enough.

 

Just noticed in the list of Traders, this years Hornby's got two stalls, their stand and a "sales".. are they, like Bachmann intending to have an outlet as well as their exhibitor stand ?

For a moment I thought I saw Peters spares, which would have sent me into overdrive, but then I saw it said books.

and then there was probably those that thought, Ooo, I'll have a few of those and make a pretty penny dribbling them out every now and then on Ebay looking at the silly prices some were fetching at shows and auction.

 

Hopefully Hornby announcing further runs and Hattons saying their planned AB will be here in January with plenty to go around will have firmly pi$$ed on the speculators chips.

 

Serves the bassa's right!

 

P

Unfortunately it doesn't work like that.

 

If it looks to be a goose, but not a golden egg, the chicks may find themselves left in the nest.

 

In other words... speculators may not accumulate, and the shops supplying them end up with a whole load of cancelled preorders stuck on their shelves... and what happens when shops end up stuck with tons of unsold stock ? Dumped.

 

 

I don't think it will be that bad, I suspect theirs enough buyers for sellers out there and will sell well and fast but not inflated. Same goes for the other two works liveried ones. There's room in the market for both the AB and the Peckett, and probably one or two more before it hits saturation.

 

Don't forget whilst the AB will sell in droves, Hattons isn't a network of retailers /swapmeet traders / ebay dealers/ model railway shop retailer nationwide... there's lots of people the Peckett will reach that the AB won't.

I must have thrown away gallons over the years, and it's not especially environmentally friendly stuff, either. The problem is stuff you only need in tiny quantities; Humbrol copper or brass, essential for us GW types, probably less than a dozen brush fulls a year. But, of course, when you're in the shop and know fully well that you've only taken a few dips into the tin, you don't buy a new one. So, when you come to do the safety valve cover on your latest pannier, you open the tin and everything is in a solid lump; not only a terrible waste but necessitating a journey to your friendly local modelling supplier of comestibles for a new one.

 

Repeat ad infinitum...

I use paint lining pens off ebay for metallic colours (silver, gold, copper etc) and also some primary colours that I use in small amounts for mixing etc.

Some are 4 years old and still good as new, cost £1 each or so on the slow boat from china.

 

In many cases, with 1mm or less tips, I don't need a brush either.

I hate orange & brown:

I hate orange & brown:

I love that livery, as a kid I remember these coming to service, the Hornby model followed shortly after.

 

For some reason, I decided to make concerted efforts to photograph 142002, culmulating in about a dozen or so pictures of it around manchester.

And your unit in that picture .. 002 :-)

Sorry, but I have to comment on this because you could not be more wrong.

 

Apologies I've edited my wording, I wasn't referring to Rapido, more of the comments that followed.

By all means aspire to greater things - but think through the reality of what you are asking for before posting.

No, I wont.

 

The hobby is built on dreams, made in to reality.

I don't critise other people's dreams just because they don't agree with (or scare) my own comfort zone.

 

30 years ago Zero1 was the ultimate in the hobby and was never going to be improved.

The first chuff chuff sounds on a B12 tender were a joke, but people still bought it, as it was reality.

today both are combined and people readily pay £200+ a time for it. DCC Sound.

That's today's reality.

 

I work on Augmented and Virtual reality software, 3D to me is now old school and out of date, so are "computer games".

 

Some day you might wear an ordinary pair of glasses, look at your platform, and see smoke escaping the coach, passengers walk the platform, baggage handlers manage their trolleys, and yes the carriage doors might open slower, or be slammed shut powered by a hexbug sized motor. You might even blow a whistle to a sound activated speaker, that starts the train moving using your wifi rather than DCC, and the sound might come out of several speakers under your boards in surround sound, and you will even be able to video it.. as you watch it. Your loco leaks virtual steam (no suethe lampoil needed) and it might chuff with real 1960's recorded sound viewed through glasses with an original 1960's video back scene, the wheels might slip to virtual regulator controls, inducing virtual steam/smoke. The locos themselves powered by wirelessly charged miniature batteries that take seconds to charge.

 

You may not need anything other than off the shelf software / hardware from Amazon to do it, and your train collection.

 

Then you might think differently about perceptions of what is forwards and backwards to realism in the hobby.

 

You may look back at coaches with hook/loop couplings as quaint and old, not to mention roofs that cannot be removed, doors that can't be opened etc.

 

If you look on YouTube today kids all ages are making home movies using toys to enact a story, tomorrow they will use AR/VR to make Hollywood effect quality movies, and for those who are enthusiasts.. they may be using their models too, but only if the hobby limps it's technology forwards to allow the hardware to enable the imaginations unlocked by software.

 

I hope my dreams don't scare you or bring too much derision from people on here, as my company spends $mns annually on investing in this kind of tech and it will come to market, all it needs is each persons imagination to implement it when it does.

 

I've over 600 locos in my worldwide collection, but I stayed away from scenery and DCC by nature of my own job and the potential I've seen. (That and like everyone else in my age group..we don't have/family commitments and in many cases money, to do it), which is why such tech is being invented.. it makes impossible possible.

 

If your not sure what I'm on about, this is about as primitive as it starts..

https://youtu.be/voB-oaudsbI

https://youtu.be/LM0T6hLH15k

Now remove the iPad, wear a normal pair of glasses (with AR) and replace its augmented pictures (cartoons to old folk) with overplayed video and sound, and walk around your layout to your hearts content, talk to Alexa and tell it to run a command that shunts your train, magnet release couplings, the station tannoy announces it to passengers, see the animation and yes open and close the train doors before it departs. Today your stations in the mountains, tomorrow is a suburban rush hour commuter platform packed with people.., and S&C location, followed by an S&D one, all moving round, one day is sunny, another is evening, it might even be snowing all with the same stock, track, in the dark loft without any scenery.

 

If my suggestion at opening doors or having an extra wheel spin, frightens people on here, you don't want to see what walks round my employers offices, sorry if my thinking is wildly ahead of some, but don't tell me or anyone else to stop thinking.

 

 

Off topic, not half, so let's not discuss or make fun of this eh as this threads not about potential (several people made that clear), it's just about a coach, that [edit for clarity] some other posts here suggest [/edit] should be basic and nothing more.

My NSE version (as well as the RTC version) arrived today. Just got the NSE version out and fitted a Bachmann 36-557 21-pin decoder and placed it on the track amongst some new Polish friends and got the headcodes working:

 

4-TC-01.jpg

 

Not sussed out where you find the interior lights but does not seem to be on F1. Will hopefully sort that out later. First impressions are good especially the dark blue finish which matches the loco currently pushing the unit:

 

4-TC-02.jpg

 

which turned out to be Haymarket which, unbeknown to the powers that be, got fitted with the SR multiple unit wiring.....

 

4-TC-03.jpg

 

 

If Haymarket can get to push the NSE set then 97201 is off for a quick visit to Stewarts Lane to be wired up for MU running with the RTC set......

 

Keith

Some nice looking PKP stock there, can I see some GYSEV stock too ?

There's some really vindictive people in this community isn't there ?

This is supposed to be a creative hobby.

 

At the end of the day all I did was break ranks and express some concern, some of which was addressed (and everyone now knows about lights, sprung buffers etc), I'd rather take the risk to hope for better, than sit back wait for release and berate someone's efforts and sink their sales.. a trait many here try to earn badges doing.

 

I stayed polite, withdrew and maintained my dignity, I also respect the manufacturers statement and input, unlike many others here, I am also conscious to avoid not bearing grudges or agendas unlike several here.

 

So if everyone's all fine and dandy with the EP, let's hope the same stay Schmum when it's released eh ?

please.

Bear in mind these days optimising value is seen as loading the company up with debt, charging extortionate 'management fees, separating out ownership of IP and assets and charging rent for them before driving the company into the ground to get rid of the problematic bits ie staff, customers etc. I hope this isn't the case here.

Hornby's biggest asset is its name, and some of its other brand names.

 

Splitting that out and starting a new company using that name, would to me seem counterintuitive, as would charging Hornby to use its own name. Neither would clearing out your staff, in what is a very limited skill set industry that are not easily replaced, unless it was ultimately clear they aren't part of a future strategy (or just don't want to be).

 

I could foresee some brands or sub-brands being either sold, or ranges retired if they are not producing margin or have limited potential. Similarly there could be some focussed and targeted marketing and specific tie-ups coming to exploit potential.

 

Additionally we could see a combining of interests, PAMP owns multiple companies, including an interesting possible complimentary technology company in Scotland and you could equally see a new technology product emerge too.

 

Be sure of one thing, investment companies don't just open their wallets on a whim, they have strategies and investment criteria, they have done their maths and have a plan, it won't be about buying and selling trains, it will be about realising growth potential in struggling companies. I for one think Hornby has tons of potential, but managing and effecting change is a hard thing, and we've seen a few execs come and go recently demonstrating how hard it is, especially from within.

 

A strong parent maybe what is needed in this instance, especially if that parent contained not just the ability to execute a strategy, but someone with a little enthusiastic knowledge too, as this would give confidence to both company and investors, that such a plan could be implemented, I suspect they do and soon enough we'll see who it is and the management team to support him and run the business.

 

Far from negative, I think this could be an exciting time at Hornby, with oppourtunity to blow away some dust and come up with some new ideas as investment money has been put in and sustained, so exploiting that to get a return is the obvious next step, exploration by its nature is creative.

 The key sentence in that statement is 'The motivation for PAMP in any discussion will be to optimise long term value (whatever they consider that to mean) for all Hornby shareholders'.  

This should be the goal of any company owned by shareholders.

 

 

* - from 2017 report, revenues of the divisions are:

1) Model Rail - £22 million

2) Scalextric - £12 million

3) Airfix - £6 million

4) Corgi - £4 million

5) Humbrol - £2 million

 

Also interesting, given the changes of previous management (now reversed, though will take time to heal the damage) is they give percentages for key channels, and for Trains its UK Independents 38% UK Nationals 7% Export 7% Europe 29% Other 19%.

Revenue doesn't mean too much, its margin and potential, but those things you won't see in any financial report.

Now PAMP has control they get inner access to this information and make decisions accordingly, and there statement clearly indicates they haven't yet started and all options are open.

I'd imagine the first indications will be by end of year, but it could take a few years.

 

I wouldn't read too much negative in to their statement, PAMP has continued to invest, if they felt there was no potential, they would have cut their losses and bailed out, if that was cheaper and higher return to their shareholders than spending more to take control and realise potential.

In a word.. no. Won't work.

 

If a picture is worth a thousand words, then here's two thousand:

 

This is taken from my drawing of the chassis. The upper view is on straight track - no problem. The lower view is superimposed on R2 track. You can see that the 9th wheel (yellow) is WELL inside the gauge, and also just how far it (and everything attached to it) would have to move laterally (out or in!) to make it work. Also, any abrupt vertical transition could have the effect of high-centering the car, leaving it tottering on the wheel.

 

The instrumented wheel was only lowered during recording runs, so our story is that the car is modelled as it would be en route to its next gig. ;>)

 

Bill

Again thanks for taking the time explaining.

I think I could rig something to counter that, but I'll accept the storyline, as it'll take me a day or two to make it.

(I may do anyways just for fun, but I'll leave my making point here).

 

as for DCC, I don't know where sound came from, I was thinking light control, raising/lowering wheel, opening a door (heightened expectations and all) but I'd settle for clickerty clack, doors and a general people conversation if it were sound myself.

 

I see some are making fun of my suggestion, so I'll end it with this is what Europeans are now getting. (£500 inc 3 coaches and the loco all Sound, lights, operable doors and pantographs), 145 Euros today for that coach with opening doors, DCC lights and sound, though unsurprisingly it's sold out.

https://youtu.be/BYUnS5FYAqg

 

As it is, we're getting what we're getting and I'm sure many will be ok with it, the last responses certainly cleared up some concerns, reading some other posts I don't think the UK market is ready for this kind of evolution (that model in the video was first produced in 2009).

 

As I said I didn't want to cause a fuss, but my opinion is this coach could be much more, but I don't want to rock the boat. I wish the model the best and look forwards to the painted samples. Thanks for the detailed responses though they are appreciated, I think that everyone here would agree.

Wow, that's quite a list... ;>)

 

- The instrumented wheel is a separate, but fixed, part. it does not rotate. We looked at having it rotate but in order to keep it on the rails on a second radius curve it would have had to be made well over-scale. It would have looked more like a steamroller than wheel! Not to mention that it would be out of gauge anyway for EM, P4 etc.

 

- Production models will have full interior lighting. As this is a first tooling review sample many parts, including the electronics, are not yet fitted. The model also has a very full interior that will be painted and decorated appropriately, including all of the gauges and pipework.

 

- The buffers are separate and sprung.

 

- Not sure what DCC has to do with a passenger car model. There is no sound or decoder fitted... though we did discuss the possibility!

 

Hope that this answered some of your questions.

 

Bill

Thank you for your timely reply, and the depth of answers, it may be worth asking Rails to promote some of these points as I just double checked their ads and they weren't mentioned... this is a move towards more reassuring.

 

Is it to late to give up on the extra wheel ? (I get the p4 bit, but in an 80/20 situation surely p4 is a minimal sale, but the USP aspect must be greater ?), could a wheel loose on an conical eggcup style axle (or place the drilled wheel centre between two inverse conical bearing cups) not give the wheel the angular flexibility on curves, The frame of which could be adjustable on the chassis for the p4 peeps, on a first radius curve I wouldn't expect the angle to be more that 20 degrees and barely noticeable on a moving train, once off the curve it would gravitate down to its natural centre, which of course is inline to the rail...with no flange to worry about and the axle height set by definition at the rail to wheel height. (Real railways have cone shaped wheels for this purpose for over 100 years, I'm suggesting do it on the axle, or on the wheel centre for a model), I've seen it done on a different rtr model but for the life of me I can't remember which it was (not uk), but was on a fixed chassis under a cab on a 4-6-2 or like to allow it round sharp curves. ( 9f 2-10-0's have an unflanged centre wheel and a fixed wheel base attracting no complaints even though it overhangs on curves and this is fixed axle and rigid chassis, it's one of the more popular classes with enthusiasts).

 

Glad also regarding the grills and access door wind shield (though the CAD doesn't show the door wind shield ?, which is on your pictures of the real thing).

 

another post here (not yours) suggested price reflected unique nature of what might be a single purchase for most people, I think that's under estimated, I suspect demand for this could be quite high, unique rolling stock isn't "unique", most people I'd generalise only own one steam crane, observation car , auto-coach, stove van, brake tender, snow plough...and this coach belongs afterall with Mallard. I do think there's potential to move this from could have to must have for many more people.

 

Finally, I should add I do like the crease in the vestibule end interior corners, nice touch.

 

Again thanks for the response, it's appreciated.

I see on the prototype, there are a number of wind shields/window bars not just on end windows but also protecting the side windows On the door above the dynamometer wheel, I don't see these on the model will these be included ?

 

Is the extra wheel is just moulded on ? I know it's a gimmick, but it what makes this coach unique, and considering the price of it, this USP is this "odd number of wheels" not the point of this coach, not to have it free spinning ?

 

Does it come with interior lights I havent seen any reference to it ?

 

How about the red tail light on the upper left side coach ends ?

 

Are the buffers moulded on ? Or are they separate, sprung ? looking at the EP it's not clear, but given all metal is pronounced they suggest to look moulded plastic ? (It's also a functional question of strength..moulded plastic buffers goes back to the 70's and ebay is littered with stuff where they've broken off with simple buffer locks on curves etc).. I'm sure everyone's had a buffer come off something when shunting it'd be gutting to see it break off this and not be a separate fitting that fails safe to allow refitting)..

 

At risk of being harsh, I hope this doesn't turn into a Ratner's model, but this coach sets a new bar on price, double that of its peers latest DCC fitted toolings and triple that of its current off the shelf peers, one would expect it to stand out for the right reasons, not just because " its unique so therefore it's expensive". The tooling isn't made out of jelly, if it sells out more can be made, its limited (actually it's not "limited" it's "exclusive") only by self imposed limitations, nothing else.

 

I'm thinking it could have had representations of operable hinged doors, raising/lowering wheel, adjustable windows, maybe even a DC operated recording device and really set a new bar for modelling but instead it just looks like it could just be any other coach on my layout.

 

It's not all bad..

 

I've seen some comments on here about the raised door edges, but actually these have been captured reasonably well, the coach has indentations at the upper part, and raised edges on the lower part of the door, this has been reflected in the model, it maybe could be sharpened up a little, but it is only an EP, but they have captured it, and it's a bit unusual to see both inprototype and the human eye.

 

I can also see some of the external gauges have been captured on the frames, presumably these will be painted on the sample to be pronounced.

 

The underframe detail, whilst invisible on the layout running, has been captured in the earlier EP exceptionally well.

 

Nice to see coupling chains too.

 

But My perception today is Yes it's unique prototype but at the moment the model is just looking a bit average and priced a little high, I'm not yet seeing the value add justification, but I do really hope to be turned around and blown away at some stage as I would like one, and am happy to pay the price, but to be proud of owning it, not just because it fills a gap and left feeling a mug.

 

Don't want to get into a spat, or be a detractor I do support this model, and overall I'm not against Stallion pricing, if it's worth it, but I'm just feeling less horse more pony about it from what I've seen so far, which I find is a shame.

Is the UK market bigger than the German one?

I think we've had this debate before, depends what you call German... is that DACH region, Germany, every country which has some imported German stock, every country with stock modelled by a German company or every German manufacturer, not forgetting Roco is Austrian.

 

British is uniquely British, German is European.

 

However I feel ebay gives the answer..

In the model railway category tonight we have 267k items in the UK and 354k in Germany (inc rest of EU selling to Germany).

(As way of side track ebay Austria only has 2144 items in model railways listed... they all use the German site, just as Canadians list on the US site).

 

Other food for thought, the highest value item in UK models is err... well isn't a model, it belongs in the bizarre thread.. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Replica-Diesel-Engine-EMD-F7-Santa-Fe-Super-Chief-Model-Railway-Pub-Man-Cave/292248069221?hash=item440b57a465%3Ag%3AqWQAAOSwrqlZfZqB

but ignoring that we're looking at a £9k item, and 129 items above £1000

 

In the German thread... that 1,105 above the 1000 Euro threshold, the highest value is a 28k euro marklin collection followed by a few CIWL coaches for 25k...

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Wunder-Spur-1-Orient-Express-6-teilig-digital-mit-Personenwagen-Packwagen-KM1/182697238740?hash=item2a899aa0d4%3Ag%3AZ%7EMAAOSwWJ5ZgLUU

and we think we're paying too much.

 

My opinion, Uk and Germany are close to equal, if you took all the "foreign elements" out of the equation and focused on pure DB/DR stock solely used in Germany.

 

Anyway back to topic before the offtopicStasi arrive.

Ours seems to be a craft hobby without evening classes!

That's what the club is for :-)

Does this imply the end of production?

There's is a periodical sale of westerns, I have 8 (D1000/13/5/23/41/48/58/62) 4 of which were bought over the last few years in sales as it was "too good to miss", I have all the preserved ones bar D1010, I really don't need anymore westerns, but what happens to be on offer right now ?

 

The only livery I'm missing is blue half yellow ends, afaik it's not been done (pristine condition).

 

If you look at layouts 40 years ago there tended (at least in North America) to be an attempt to fit as much track onto the layout as possible to the point where many layouts were all track with almost no room for anything else.

 

These days we tend to want to be more realistic, to the point where some layouts have almost no track and are mostly scenic elements.

 

 

 

 

I don't think there's that many new tools produced since 2010 that can hit the 20k barrier for production, I'm not so sure there were many before it either since 2000. 

I'd imagine popular ones like Thomas, Pug, 08, 47, Scotsman, A4, Merchant Navy, Black 5, West Country all pre-2010 but models like 71000, P2, Crosti, they've been heavily done but doubt they reached 20k. In these pages somewhere is a mention of 6000 USA tanks, which is seen as a massive success, and there's lots of them out there still.

 

I suspect 3000-6000 is more the range now.

 

However the points of your post stack up, no way would someone in the 1990's suggest doing Kestrel, Lion, DP1, DP2 and the Bulleid Diesels as a rtr model as the decisions would probably be made on a 20k+ production run. I suspect the statistics of the APT-E only stack up because it's a train of 2 halves joined together, not 4 distinct tools, thus doubling the production numbers.

 

However that the costs of tooling for 3000-6000 is matched by sufficient market price to support this quantity is allowing us models to be made that was never before possible and that in itself is stimulating the hobby. 

The concern is that this is unicorns blood and each new tool reduces the hobby life by half, there is a growing pile of "limited" and "exclusive" stuff out there, which after release the left overs looks to be lingering on the shelves for years afterwards, obviously tieing up cash, reducing the return and delaying further investment.

 

Some ready to run European stuff has been made in quantities of 50 per livery, with a production run of less than 1000, but at a cost of nearly £500 per loco and it's not brass !

Well I'm in my 40's, and there's no way I'm saying how much I spend a year, other than no figure suggested on this thread comes close.

 

I bought my first loco (D824 Highflyer for £9.99 from Railmail c1981/2 paid by Postal order, so I've been a remote buyer since Christmas money from grandparents days). 45691 followed a year later at £16.95 and in 1984 I used my holiday money to buy a Lima 9400 for £10 spending much of the summer broke, but looking at it.

Since then model railways has been in my life at every stage.

 

So I don't fit the demographic, age profile nor spending profile being commented on above.

 

Secondly, I rarely ever set foot in a model shop, I only have 3 shops that I know of, in a range of 30 miles from me. If a shop was in a mall I'd probably try to avoid it, as the prices are invariably unattractive at such locations.

 

As for feeling special, well I have the million air miles and lifetime status, and the airlines do sit and take notice of you, but in model railways, I very much doubt any manufacturer (well there is one but I'm not engaged with them), knows I exist, nor probably care, which is the same for me, nor any Uncle Tom cobble and all. The retailers however are the ones who know, but even then I don't see Hattons, Rails, Derails, Kernow or Hobby shop etc seeing me standing above the crowd.

 

Retailers with the muscle to commission their own tools have major benefits over manufacturers, they can tell what sells and at what price, not just by one manufacturer but all of them. Secondly, knowing they could have the mailing list to support the sale, they have the distribution, and lower commissioning cost overheads (no annual catalog, sales & marketing teams, extra HR etc), and finally when they sell, they are selling at a comparative RRP to other models, and so take not just a retail sales margin, but a manufacturers margin too.

 

If we theoretically deconstruct a £100 RRP locosale:

 

that could be £20 VAT, £20* retail margin, £60 trade.

Then work back the £60 trade as £10 margin, £10 overhead, £20 tooling, £20 for the model.

So a retailer going direct: £20 tooling+ £20 model+ £20 vat your looking at £40 margin*.

 

if your lucky enough to hit the jackpot and do a repeat run, with the tooling fully amortised, your looking at a £60* margin (assuming the £ and China's'/UK's inflations hold out and you didn't borrow to finance it).

 

Consider many models are sold with a 10-15% discount from RRP the retailers selling that loco not with £20, but maybe just £5 margin, it's not hard to see why going the commission route is attractive.

 

Now on a £5 margin, how do you finance a £5000 p.mth retail space in Westfield when your customers know that ebay, mailing lists, Facebook etc all exist sending offers shipped from a warehouse if your price is £1 higher than theirs ? Lego and Apple can afford to do this, as by enlarge that competitive threat doesn't exist.

 

In 2017, I'd wager the bulk of business is anonymous and online, as this represents the fastest, easiest and cheapest way for most people to pursue the hobby. It also is the most cost effective, as business can be a warehouse rather than a mall, If it wasn't there wouldn't be 100k items in the oo gauge category on ebay every day. I'd expect more manufacturers with the clout to be able to do this.

 

How can Hornby combat this, well look at Rail's Q1.. 250 locos off an extra run of production, what "extra" did it cost Rails, an ad on RMWeb, a post on Facebook and an email to customers.. and 50% were sold with 48 hours at full RRP before the items were in stock. And Hornby, well a guaranteed low risk sale of 250 right off the bat shipped in one shipment to a single reliable retailer without any extra "tooling cost". This has to be an attractive way of countering the threat, and expanding this approach beyond NRM locos could well pay off.

How can smalił retailers get a slice of this action, Perhaps a smaller shop could take the lead on a run and sell bundles to two or three others as a means to reduce the cost/risk but still get benefit ? - bit like Bachmanns rep's editions.

 

* - I know there's other costs and I'm being simplistic, but this is just theory, roll with it.

I don't disagree, but not getting in front of the wider public is IMHO holding back all Hornby's brands. And it only has to be in a handful of the most relevant malls across the UK. This is not just about trains, but Corgi, Airfix, Scalextrix, Pocher etc. The business case would have to stack up. Throw in the overseas rail brands and you have the potential to make an interesting store. I'm not a retail expert but even as a temporary pop up type store it could be trialled. Some malls do this.

 

look what happened to Model Zone, Beatties...

It is difficult to hide the joint at the top of a coach, where things are very noticeable to the eyes.

Back in the 1980's may be, locos today have all kinds of parts visible to the user but a joint invisible to the naked eye..

I just took apart a Bachmann std 4 2-6-4t... into about 4 distinct parts of the body, including separating frames, tanks, cab roof and boiler, when assembled it was impossible to know it was comprised of so many bits... indeed I did have to wonder why as it's not got anything in common with other classes or variations within the fleet, The 3MT is another loco made of many bits.

 

It's definitely possible, some DCC locos have switches hidden under body panels, especially in Europe.

Personally I think Hornby should be opening flagship stores like Lego and Disney in major shopping centres to promote and sell all their brands, especially as such centres lack decent places for males to hang out during shopping trips! This wouldn't conflict with model shops as they are not in the Westfields etc.

They've already been there and done that. They have been closing their outlets at places like Swindon. If they can't make it work at the Swindon Works outlet there's not much chance anywhere else.

Concessions aren't working either, I was recently at Hamleys in London, really nice display of Hornby stuff, but no one looking at it. Hamleys isn't a cheap shop either, so it's not as if railways were over priced in that particular environment. Scalectrix had some interest there though.

 

I think the reason it doesn't work for kids, is it doesn't reflect reality and it doesn't reflect excitement. Racing trains isn't as exciting as racing cars. But even to 4 year old modelling mail trains isn't relative.. mail hasn't gone by rail for years.

I'd figure tube trains with working doors, coal trains with loading hoppers (remember that triang one), container train loading, maybe even tieing up with other stuff appealing to kids... a Cadbury chocolate train might be a win win, if you can remove the parcels van roof and extract a dairy milk..they'll definitely play with that !

 

DCC and sound is lost on kids, but station sounds is something they can both relate to and maybe interact with too.. if a train stopping at a station triggered recordings (that maybe able to have the kids record sounds themselves) might appeal.. door sirens, approaching train sounds, horn, announcer "mind the gap" etc. Much cheaper and more relational than DCC sound.

I still don't see why companies can't manufacturer coaches with the frame in the tooling, rather than the roof.

 

From an assembly perspective it's no difference, in fact it might be easier to fit a weight by dropping it in, covering with the interior and snapping together, than putting the interior in, adding the weight to the frame and trying to line it all up without it falling apart.

 

It may even be cheaper when different diagrams of coach have similar sides but a different roof.

 

But a removable roof could allow easier fitting of passengers, lighting and appeals to kids no end as they can "play" with some realism.

Did they make the same wheezing/creaking sound at faster speeds too?

 

I really only remember that on the move at slow speed for station stops - probably generally with AC electrics as I'd have been listening more to the HST power cars screaming out rather than the coach sounds!

Mk3,s have that distinctive sound of air escaping a balloon, not sure what it is but you often hear it in multiples when standing in the station.

Both boilers and one chassis are in use on the O1 and H.

 

 

But then we would loose an O1!

 

What the Bluebell could do is first make a spare boiler for the current 2 locos, then spare chassis parts for the O1 and gradually creep towards having enough parts to do an R1. At a certain point, the cab, side tanks and bunker will be all that is required. They could even make a Stirling chimney. The SECR had quite a high degree of standardization (the P class being rather unique in everything and it is amazing that half of them survived).

They need to finish the 84xxx and 32424 first ! Plus the overhaul queue is quite long :-)

I'm in the non lit camp here , whilst I can understand people wanting lit coaches I'm sure there's a large group who aren't interested in lighting .

For me I have over 20 on pre order and will be ordering another 8 when the hst trailers appear. If as someone above stated it could possibly add maybe another £10 per coach to have lighting it becomes a large amount of extra cash for a feature I don't require.

I wonder whether Oxford could maybe go the route Hornby took with the lighting in their mk2e coaches and have some fitted lighting and some without.

It would be a shame to have to reconsider quantities due to a large price increase.

Just my thoughts

 

Paul.

It's here.I know it's not a new tool, but it's a nice release non the less, and my collection of NRM prototypes is growing.

 

Is it me or is it unusual to see Hornby fitting the front end detail, rather than leaving it to the buyer ?

 

Parts bag of headcodes and lamps.