adb968008
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Posts posted by adb968008
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Six.That's 4 sectors, out of a possible 5... How many variations are you expecting?
Aggregates (Construction)
Coal
Petroleum
Distribution
Metals
General
Your choice for general is limited (50149) but it was none the less one of the rounded design groups original proposed sector liveries, but wasn't adopted and (via initial drab grey), turned into Dutch livery instead, presumably because the tasty new livery was meant to be future looking and including your old knackers used for engineering stuff was counter to this plan, and separate to railfreights business.
RfD later evolved to represent European distribution, with the blue roof in addition.
However the 31 isn't what comes to most people's minds, when it comes to Railfreight, they were starting to be a little long in the tooth at this point, think of a 31, redstripe railfreight & Dutch wore much better.
33/37/47/56/58/60 were the champions of rail freight sectorisation liveries.
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Another solution would be to stop using Mazak. I cannot imagine that the material cost of the chassis block is a major part of the overall cost of the model, surely that is assembly of a number of disparate parts, and all that is required of the chassis block material is that it is reasonably rigid and heavy, and rustproof (or at least rust resistant). Now, I am neither a qualified metallurgist nor do I have any sort of knowledge of production engineering, but would not a different material, perhaps whitemetal, be just as good or better? What other applications are there for Mazak besides model railway chassis and what makes it so special in that role?
It is obviously highly satisfactory in the majority of cases, but needs very strict QC at the source, the small foundries and backroom workshops where it is mixed and poured into the moulds, and this cannot easily be provided under the present circumstances, so another material might be worth considering.
I'm lucky, and have not lost any models to this for many years, touch wood!
In the older days the chassis used to contain lead, but that probably explains why Railway modellers are more extreme and of odd temperament with later age.
maybe use Brass.. but it aint cheap.
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I'm not sure there's that much they can offer ?
08, Choice of 31, Railroad 37, Railroad 47, 50149, 56, Railroad 58, 60, 87, Railroad 90 ?
Of that lot, 08s were mundane, 31's weren't the most awe inspiring ambassadors of this livery and even then not many variations (Distribution/Coal/Petroleum/Construction), 50149 is already done, class 60's didn't exist in 1987, 90's were brand new and Intercity.
Doing Railroad 37/47's is probably risky given how extensively this period was covered by Lima loco's that are still swilling about in the 2nd hand model railway ocean, not to mention the dozens of newer offerings by Bachmann, Heljan and ViTrains out there.
The locos at the October 1987 unveiling at Ripple Lane, and the models made in the same liveries have all been done and the toolings used in 1987 are still the same in 2017 for the 37/47/58 only the 08 and 56 are newer:
08834 Distribution - Bachmann
37673 Distribution - Bachmann
37892 Petroleum - Lima
47079 Metals - Lima
56001 Construction - Dapol
58050 Coal - Hornby
The best they could offer is a mix of Railroad/Main range models which would be confusing and difficult to sell at best, massively criticised at worst.
Maybe another option would be the railfreight odd ball collection : 47901 RfA, 50149 RfGeneral, 58050 RfCoal, 87101 RfD
To me, the only way I could see this work, is for a retailer to have commissioned a collection of cross manufacturer models into a single set, but again I think this would be hard concept to sell.
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updated list of affected models here (101 thus far)
Personal thoughts on storage... styrene is an insulator, cellphone traps heat. Having a model in a box that sweats your loco in summer, and releases moisture in winter doesn't sound like an optimum solution. If it's stored in a variable temperature location, I'd imagine out side this style of packaging would make more sense. Bubble wrap i'd avoid to.
But ultimately.. if the alloy is tainted..all your doing is delaying the pain not preventing it.
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Talking of whistles, the finest ever heard in the UK was that fitted to A4 'Dominion of New Zealand' being an NZR standard chime whistle not dissimilar to some, but by no means all, US steam whistles.
Dedicated to thread-drift am I!
I firmly believe that all model sound fails when it comes to the rising and falling of trains approaching and receding, and there would be no better demonstration of failure to evoke something real than the attempt to recreate a complex echoing cold night time sound of a chime whistle.
I wouldn't mind if those dedicated to sound would keep it to themselves, but you can't buy some US models without it, and the attendant hype and price. grrrr.
Having vented, I will go back to my picture of Bachmann A1....
cheers
p.s. here are contenders for a best Peppercorn model by Bachmann..
A1 60147 'Great Eastern'.
60147_A1_BR_LNER_portrait_1abc_r1200.jpgA2 60528 'Tudor Minstrel'
BR_A2_Parcels_at_Speed_60528_3abc_crop2_r1200.jpgboth edited
I just listened to the Hannaford recordings of DoNZ and DoC, the great thing of YouTube allows us youngsters who never saw them in steam, to imagine, as the sounds of the whistles live on, on preserved locomotives overseas... they do sound identical.
If someone wanted to do DCC sound of an A4 with these whistles, it's very possible.
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But on the opposite hand the Reading branch of Hobbycraft drastically reduced the range of Hornby it had on offer several years ago (which is a shame as they were very clever at reducing some prices to a ludicrously low level on lines that didn't sell)
I'm speculating, but perhaps the second part of your statement,could explain the actions for the first half of your statement.
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Need more catering vehicles....
Though I wouldn't say no to a Tavern car, even if from the outside there's not much you can see of the inside.
Bulleids would be nice, if they included lights, lights through the tiny tavern car window would be a little quaint too.
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Another wild card, maybe easier, is to use a lion off D1000 Western Enterprise, this looks smaller than the lion on the side of a OO gauge class 85, so also could be a substitute for a HO scale one ?
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Not quite, PKP is 3000v DC, not 25kv AC.They are Class 83's. Charlie
The lion on the side of EP07-1059 was made in U.K. I think 2006 and applied as a special paint job in 2007.
The transfers I referred to would be in HO scale for the Piko or Schliesenmodelle EU07, for Polish modellers wanting to paint it.
(I don't think theres much demand in Poland for a class 81 or 83 in OO or HO :-) the BR lion on wheel etches are those painting this EP07 in HO but I'd wager they will be better sized than OO scale ones on a HO class 81.
I just checked their site and they are off stock anyway, will need to email and ask.
I'm thinking about using a Heljan class 17 chassis for mine, it's a close fit (and its slim), plus there's loads of dead ones out there from Gear-gate days.
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Wildcard but maybe Try kalkomanie.com (you may need to use chrome/translate to send them an email, they used to have them listed).I've managed to buy a Sommerfeldt single arm pantograph for mine to repalce the stock one.
With reference to the early blue or electric blue liveries, does anyone have any good close up pictures of the cast iron emblem and numbers? I'd like to etch some to fit the HO scale model.
They do HO transfers for EP07-1051 (this is pkp EU07 painted in BR blue livery which carries the cycling lion on its sides).
There is a whole page here, including lion close ups.
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Relative to popularity of the Bluebell railway I suspect, it has a cult following.Hattons have posted the order in which P class are selling the most.
Top 3 spots are occupied by Bluebell engines, SECR 178 in first place then 323 in Bluebell blue and 31027 in BR.
Next it is an SR green engine 325, then BR 31323 (bluebell loco), and again SR 1555.
In 7th SECR grey, a surprise really. Followed by Primrose in Bluebell early 1960s special livery, followed by 1558 in sunshine lettering (which I would thought would be before SECR grey and Primrose).
In tenth place is SECR 753, clearly the KESR preserved loco is less popular than the Bluebells preserved members. I would have expected SECR 178 and SECR 753 to be similar in sales and ranking.
The last two places are occupied by the 2 industrial P class (also both preserved). I would probably have brought these if the other colours of the same locos had not existed. Bowaters was not far from where I lived...
The KESR somewhat lives in Bluebells shadow.
A Bluebell railway modeller is quite spoilt for choice when it comes to modelling their fleet, and of course those pre-grouping liveries were around in the 1960's here too.
If you already own 55, 473, 488, 592, 928, 21c123, 9017, 30064, 73082, 75027 and the ability to order a H, Atlantic, B4 then adding 3X Ps isn't a big stretch at this point, especially as most of their passenger stock is available too.
I'd imagine the O1, Q and std2, who knows maybe even Captain Baxter too now industrials are in vogue, and will follow at some point then you can model the whole fleet with a couple of renumbers.
Regarding the O1 I recently stumbled across images of this in a location associated to a manufacturer in China, (I'm being vague as it's tied directly to a traceable individual in China and his employer, who may or may not have put files online by innocent mistake ), so It's a natural guess it's being considered, (and no it wasn't a C I saw), indeed I'm surprised a Q hasn't yet appeared either.
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I don't care where it comes from as long as quality, price and delivery time meet my requirements.
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Hah, trust me, I'm not going anywhere near model railways, this hobby would never pay my salary, mortgage etc and I have all respect those that do make a career from it...... and if you're going down that track, you're far from being in the vanguard; virtual railway simulators are getting to be 'old hat' nowadays.
However I do know it's only time before a commercial venture appears, it already has on real world railway applications.
My efforts are on the technologies that make it a possibility, to make something one needs to understand how it will be used, by thinking.
Anyway we're way off topic at this point, so let's bring it to close.
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They only need one or two admins based in the Philippines or such like, to scan millions of auctions worldwide.Are there really enough hours in the day for ebay to actually go to all that trouble with the millions of sellers out there? Beyond a few random checks or investigations of suspicious transactions I suspect this is simply a tightening of the wording of their policy rather than a 'we're coming to get you' warning.
Everything is software algorithms, that flag up inconsistencies.
They Read it, then either bin it or escalate it to level 2, 3 etc.
The earlier levels may just be automated warnings, emails, or even personalised responses higher up the chain it always ends in legal at the top.
I'm sure they will have dedicated UK investigative resources, even if they are contractors, there business model is at risk if they don't do some level of enforcement.
I know one company that scans every card scan, email, text message, phone photo, phone record, USB, cd,DVD, wifi connection, Bluetooth and rj45 connection you name it, for every employee in the company daily, over 100k employees and cross references this against various parameters for patterns (date, subject key words, expense reports, travel records etc).
US corps can be real paranoid.
Here is what got Uber banned in London...
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greyball
They combined Uber, with credit cards, Banks, Facebook, Google and even the local mobile phone shop all via APIs to do this in milliseconds.
In 2017 it's naive to think that opening just a handful of websites cannot and will not be mined, analysed and shared by hundreds of companies worldwide all accessing, compiling and sharing data about you in all manner of complex ways to learn about every aspect of your life, mostly for financial gain.
A really simple example.. go online search "boilers" and see how unrelated many websites you visit suddenly start sharing ads about boilers, plumbers, gas heating etc, not just on your laptop, but it'll start showing on your phone and iPad tooo.. that'll be Google Adsense at work, linking all your ip's mac, addresses, devices to you as a user and showing you content as you move around, and collecting more detail on each site you visit.
Certainly don't type in Escort and Model without Ford and OO gauge, your misses might start seeing things she might not want to expect ! They might also start showing up on your phone if your walking down a certain street !
EBay's own forums are filling with people caught by this, even before this policy change.
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Yes but ebay is saying they will pursue the buyer also... (Again I can't believe ebay can legally enforce restraint of a consumers choice of platform to do business).eBay has become very much Seller Beware rather than Buyer Beware due to their methods of dealing with returns (you cannot effectively deny returns as eBay will *force* a return and refund the buyer, and then chase you for the money and threaten to negatively affect your credit scoring etc (a friend has had this with a camera he sold recently).
I understand what they are trying to do.. stop people cutting ebay out of a deal procured using their site, but the wording is open to such interpretation that it goes go way beyond that into restricting trade of items not sold (but merely just listed) on their site that could be sold offline to people who use ebay.
heres an example..
I find a class 47 on ebay that is sold by a well know model retailer, who's username is easily recognised.
I goto that retailers website and buy it from the retailer directly.
The retailer takes the item offline as they sold it.
Ebay can claim fees from the retailer for my circumventing ebay's Website to conclude a sale, as I used ebay to find the item.
They can also go after me for their costs in proving that in my search history, I looked for that item on ebay, but bought it direct, as the listing allowed me to identify the customer and I was able to identify them. Ebay lost out because I found a cheaper route to the same item from the same ebay seller using eBay's website.
(They would probably need to establish a pattern from my shopping habits.. they could have a computer program analyse my ebay browsing habits, and combine that with other website tracking tools, or even collaboration on browsing history from my ISP for example, and if I make a habit of looking for an item on ebay, but then not buying it but visiting another site, they could start to become suspicious for example). All this can be fully automated today and such software is readily available and widely used already.
All it does is track me and every other joe, and flags up anomaly and automatically dish out warnings to the lowest level offenders then send everything else to low level guys out in the 3rd world to sift through this stuff, deal with, and flag up the ones of interest for management attention and so on.
heres another example..
I get the 47 in the mail.
In the box is an invoice for the 47, but also lists Retailer's website on the invoice.
Retailer can be chased by ebay for using eBay's customers who bought goods on ebay to advance the business away from their site.
Ebay could do this by ghost buying the item themselves, presumably on the back of suspicions, i.e. the seller constantly removing items from sale, or a report by a user.
or another scenario..
I have a 47 on ebay.
I sell it to john doe in the shop, who says he saw it online and decided to come look at your shop.
I remove the item from ebay
Turns out JohnDoe works for ebay undercover team, or maybe Jon doe just has a grudge against you.
ebay claims I have sold the item to JohnDoe as a result of JohnDoe finding the item on ebay and visiting the shop to buy it, claims the final valuation fee, and all the enforcement fees associated with it. They will could, if it's worthwhile to them, also try to claim everything you've ever taken offline of ebay without a sale too is as a result of this, and you'll need to prove otherwise..
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http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/rfe-spam-non-ebay-sale.html
Ebay have made some changes to their terms relating to selling and communication of items outside of ebay.
I'm not sure how enforceable this is, and I suspect a challenge for anti-competition laws may result from this, but as of today ebay are saying by agreeing to using their site for sales:Sellers are also liable for final value fees if they offer or reference their contact information, or ask for a buyer’s contact information, in the context of buying or selling outside of eBay, even if the item does not sell.
1. Do not put promotional material in the packaging when you send the item..
by using ebay your agreeing that you will not promote the sale of any item not listed on ebay to any customer who buys from you on ebay.
2. By using ebay you need to be very careful not to sell any item listed on ebay, to any person off ebay, whom may be a customer of ebay. (In other words if you accidentally sell an item at a show, to someone who has an ebay account, and then delist the sale from ebay, you may find yourself in a policy violation.In your listing page or in communications with another eBay member you can't refer to or promote your personal website (including links to home page web addresses that promote websites outside of eBay), sales outside of eBay, or other businesses.
(I personally don't see how this is enforceable) but this is a big vulnerability to sellers, if you have a buyer at a show, whom may have seen that item online, and sell the item, delist it, they could go to ebay and report you !
To me this sounds like restraint of trade, as the only way you can be certain is to exclusively list the item on ebay and nowhere else... bit tricky if you have more than 1 of the item.
Finally it goes on about not publishing any contact information on your listings (Now here I see an issue as most business sellers contact information is visible in their listings !!!)Canceling a listing to sell to a buyer who found the item on eBay
They are trying to protect their IP (customer base) and their revenue (by people cancelling a sale and selling it offline), but they are saying they will charge introduction fees, and persue costs for for enforcement (i.e. They are going to have revenue protection staff trying to catch people out).
How draconian is it...
I buy from all the shops on ebay, I also know the shops websites. If I find an item I want on ebay but it's cheaper in the shop..hey ho ebay policy violation...introduction fees, enforcement fees etc etc...
As it stands any trader needs to weigh up the risk of selling on ebay, versus the value of their business of ebay, but by having both your in conflict with ebay.
Ebay defines anything sold outside of ebay as:
For a seller, who sells offlineHideHow to tell if you're buying or selling on eBay
The best way to tell if you're actually transacting on eBay is:
Open a new browser and type www.ebay.com.
Click My eBay at the top of the page and sign in.
Check to see that the listing you've bid on, bought, or sold appears in the Purchase History or Sell sections.
If your transaction doesn't show up in My eBay, then you didn't buy or sell the item on eBay.
In draconian, in short, your contract to sell an item is pretty much a life time commitment to sell that item exclusively on ebay and nowhere else, unless you can 100% prove anything you sell outside, that is also offered for sale on ebay, is to a person who does not use ebay and is willing to sign to that effect.
For a buyer,
Well anything that at all, listing, email, parcel contents with anything more than a return address and an invoice should be reported... it would seem even email addresses are banned by ebay as otherwise your exposed to enforcement fees etc by entrapment.
As I said, I can't see they will get away with this, but I don't want to be the guinea pig.
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Crowne plaza booked, just got tickets for two days this year.
One day for scrummage, and a second for appreciation.
Last year one day wasn't enough.
Just noticed in the list of Traders, this years Hornby's got two stalls, their stand and a "sales".. are they, like Bachmann intending to have an outlet as well as their exhibitor stand ?
For a moment I thought I saw Peters spares, which would have sent me into overdrive, but then I saw it said books.
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Unfortunately it doesn't work like that.and then there was probably those that thought, Ooo, I'll have a few of those and make a pretty penny dribbling them out every now and then on Ebay looking at the silly prices some were fetching at shows and auction.
Hopefully Hornby announcing further runs and Hattons saying their planned AB will be here in January with plenty to go around will have firmly pi$$ed on the speculators chips.
Serves the bassa's right!
P
If it looks to be a goose, but not a golden egg, the chicks may find themselves left in the nest.
In other words... speculators may not accumulate, and the shops supplying them end up with a whole load of cancelled preorders stuck on their shelves... and what happens when shops end up stuck with tons of unsold stock ? Dumped.
I don't think it will be that bad, I suspect theirs enough buyers for sellers out there and will sell well and fast but not inflated. Same goes for the other two works liveried ones. There's room in the market for both the AB and the Peckett, and probably one or two more before it hits saturation.
Don't forget whilst the AB will sell in droves, Hattons isn't a network of retailers /swapmeet traders / ebay dealers/ model railway shop retailer nationwide... there's lots of people the Peckett will reach that the AB won't.
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I use paint lining pens off ebay for metallic colours (silver, gold, copper etc) and also some primary colours that I use in small amounts for mixing etc.I must have thrown away gallons over the years, and it's not especially environmentally friendly stuff, either. The problem is stuff you only need in tiny quantities; Humbrol copper or brass, essential for us GW types, probably less than a dozen brush fulls a year. But, of course, when you're in the shop and know fully well that you've only taken a few dips into the tin, you don't buy a new one. So, when you come to do the safety valve cover on your latest pannier, you open the tin and everything is in a solid lump; not only a terrible waste but necessitating a journey to your friendly local modelling supplier of comestibles for a new one.
Repeat ad infinitum...
Some are 4 years old and still good as new, cost £1 each or so on the slow boat from china.
In many cases, with 1mm or less tips, I don't need a brush either.
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I love that livery, as a kid I remember these coming to service, the Hornby model followed shortly after.I hate orange & brown:
I hate orange & brown:
For some reason, I decided to make concerted efforts to photograph 142002, culmulating in about a dozen or so pictures of it around manchester.
And your unit in that picture .. 002 :-)
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Sorry, but I have to comment on this because you could not be more wrong.
Apologies I've edited my wording, I wasn't referring to Rapido, more of the comments that followed.
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No, I wont.By all means aspire to greater things - but think through the reality of what you are asking for before posting.
The hobby is built on dreams, made in to reality.
I don't critise other people's dreams just because they don't agree with (or scare) my own comfort zone.
30 years ago Zero1 was the ultimate in the hobby and was never going to be improved.
The first chuff chuff sounds on a B12 tender were a joke, but people still bought it, as it was reality.
today both are combined and people readily pay £200+ a time for it. DCC Sound.
That's today's reality.
I work on Augmented and Virtual reality software, 3D to me is now old school and out of date, so are "computer games".
Some day you might wear an ordinary pair of glasses, look at your platform, and see smoke escaping the coach, passengers walk the platform, baggage handlers manage their trolleys, and yes the carriage doors might open slower, or be slammed shut powered by a hexbug sized motor. You might even blow a whistle to a sound activated speaker, that starts the train moving using your wifi rather than DCC, and the sound might come out of several speakers under your boards in surround sound, and you will even be able to video it.. as you watch it. Your loco leaks virtual steam (no suethe lampoil needed) and it might chuff with real 1960's recorded sound viewed through glasses with an original 1960's video back scene, the wheels might slip to virtual regulator controls, inducing virtual steam/smoke. The locos themselves powered by wirelessly charged miniature batteries that take seconds to charge.
You may not need anything other than off the shelf software / hardware from Amazon to do it, and your train collection.
Then you might think differently about perceptions of what is forwards and backwards to realism in the hobby.
You may look back at coaches with hook/loop couplings as quaint and old, not to mention roofs that cannot be removed, doors that can't be opened etc.
If you look on YouTube today kids all ages are making home movies using toys to enact a story, tomorrow they will use AR/VR to make Hollywood effect quality movies, and for those who are enthusiasts.. they may be using their models too, but only if the hobby limps it's technology forwards to allow the hardware to enable the imaginations unlocked by software.
I hope my dreams don't scare you or bring too much derision from people on here, as my company spends $mns annually on investing in this kind of tech and it will come to market, all it needs is each persons imagination to implement it when it does.
I've over 600 locos in my worldwide collection, but I stayed away from scenery and DCC by nature of my own job and the potential I've seen. (That and like everyone else in my age group..we don't have/family commitments and in many cases money, to do it), which is why such tech is being invented.. it makes impossible possible.
If your not sure what I'm on about, this is about as primitive as it starts..
Now remove the iPad, wear a normal pair of glasses (with AR) and replace its augmented pictures (cartoons to old folk) with overplayed video and sound, and walk around your layout to your hearts content, talk to Alexa and tell it to run a command that shunts your train, magnet release couplings, the station tannoy announces it to passengers, see the animation and yes open and close the train doors before it departs. Today your stations in the mountains, tomorrow is a suburban rush hour commuter platform packed with people.., and S&C location, followed by an S&D one, all moving round, one day is sunny, another is evening, it might even be snowing all with the same stock, track, in the dark loft without any scenery.
If my suggestion at opening doors or having an extra wheel spin, frightens people on here, you don't want to see what walks round my employers offices, sorry if my thinking is wildly ahead of some, but don't tell me or anyone else to stop thinking.
Off topic, not half, so let's not discuss or make fun of this eh as this threads not about potential (several people made that clear), it's just about a coach, that [edit for clarity] some other posts here suggest [/edit] should be basic and nothing more.
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My NSE version (as well as the RTC version) arrived today. Just got the NSE version out and fitted a Bachmann 36-557 21-pin decoder and placed it on the track amongst some new Polish friends and got the headcodes working:
Not sussed out where you find the interior lights but does not seem to be on F1. Will hopefully sort that out later. First impressions are good especially the dark blue finish which matches the loco currently pushing the unit:
which turned out to be Haymarket which, unbeknown to the powers that be, got fitted with the SR multiple unit wiring.....
If Haymarket can get to push the NSE set then 97201 is off for a quick visit to Stewarts Lane to be wired up for MU running with the RTC set......
Keith
Some nice looking PKP stock there, can I see some GYSEV stock too ?
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There's some really vindictive people in this community isn't there ?
This is supposed to be a creative hobby.
At the end of the day all I did was break ranks and express some concern, some of which was addressed (and everyone now knows about lights, sprung buffers etc), I'd rather take the risk to hope for better, than sit back wait for release and berate someone's efforts and sink their sales.. a trait many here try to earn badges doing.
I stayed polite, withdrew and maintained my dignity, I also respect the manufacturers statement and input, unlike many others here, I am also conscious to avoid not bearing grudges or agendas unlike several here.
So if everyone's all fine and dandy with the EP, let's hope the same stay Schmum when it's released eh ?
please.
Why Hornby has missed 30 Anniversary of Railfreight Sectorisation
in Hornby
Posted · Edited by adb968008
I didn't know about 673 either, but I just turned up 37104 also. (I seem to have memory of an 08 too).
I'm not sure why General was selected for 149, I understood it's trials was for China clay,which seems to me the domain of Aggregates, yet always seem to have Distribution 37's on it. I can only guess it's a "we haven't done a loco in General yet" or "no sector wants to own 149" experiment, that failed anyway, 8/15/19's liveries were more for celebrity appeal. I did see 50's on engineers stuff towards the end (I have a picture of 50041 in Manchester Piccadilly on a civil engineers train above my layout), and have pictures of 50008/15 in Longsight depot one evening (got to cab them too), but I recall this being massively unusual, hence why I was where butter wouldn't normally get.
Either way, there wasn't many of them, I suspect General was too vague, and as a Railfreight was a profit centre, engineering stuff was a cost they wouldn't want (there was not yet a "railtrack" customer).