robertcwp

There are lugs underneath at each corner on that hold body to chassis. These are part of the glazing moulding. There are also lugs half way along each side. Put the vehicle upside down, say in a loco cradle. With a small screwdriver push gently on the lug at the corner just behind the buffer. Push sideways towars the centreline of the vehicle. At the same time push gently on the buffer shank - don't push the stepboards or you will breake them. The chassis should then part from the body. Do this at each corner. Lastly, slide fingernail between chassis and side and work towards the middle, which should spring the body off of the lugs at the midpoint. I have found that you only need to do one side. Watch out for various BFO issues (ie Bits Falling Off). Each bogie has a step at each corner. One or two of these were not glued in properly and have fallen off mine. As mentioned above, the stepboards are not particularly strong, though nowhere near as flimsy as those on the Hornby Staniers. Don't press on the glazing or you will pop it out. Also, some of the underframe detail can break if not handled gently. When reassembling, make sure to get body and chassis the correct way round. This is easy to get wrong on the full brake - look for the guard's doors and matching lower steps on the chassis. To part bogie from chassis, slide screwdriver in beween at side and gently prise off.

I am not aware of an RU being used. I think the Bristolian was advertised with a buffet service, so it probably went straight from the GWR vehicle to W1646. The change to a 10-car set came in September 1961 when the train was slowed and gained a Bath stop. Annotations in the Winter 1961-2 carriage workings indicate it was adjusted a couple of times during the timetable. There is colour film of the set on its steam-hauled Saturday working. Not all the vehicles are visible but every one that is has B4 bogies except the RB, which has CW. September 1961 formation was: BCK, 3 × SK, CK, RB, FO, 2 × FK, BCK The CK was withdrawn 30/10/61 and reinstated 6/11/61. One SK was also withdrawn from the set (date not clear in carriage workings, but may also have been 30/10/61).

True, but Thompson RFs could run unclassed, and often did in later years, as did Gresley RFs.

Or Thompson catering vehicles, RF and RK, which were common on the ECML in the 1950s. Some of the ex-streamliner catering vehicles could also be seen, notably a RT-TO pair in the King's Cross-Glasgow Queen Street train.

The RB is the most useful Mark I catering car. All regions, wide range of liveries (maroon, green, chocolate & cream, blueg/grey, Inter-City) and service life of around 30 years. W1646 was repainted chocolate and cream for the Bristolian in 1961 (when it was almost new) and was, I believe, the only Mark I with Commonwealth bogies to carry that livery. The WR's other choc/cream RB vehicles were all from the first batch with BR bogies (W1729-32 carrying the livery). One of that batch ran with chocolate & cream BSO W9276 as its dining trailer in the Cathedrals Express c1961.

Correct, the last few of the standard (ie not Hastings) batch had the revised exhaust, apparently from new. Plate 39 in 'Power of the 33s' shows D6583 thus fitted in original livery, photo dated October 1963.

I think it means that they are going back to original photos and doing a new book, rather than scanning a copy of the original book, as is done with some reprints. It means that the new book should be better than the old one, which I don't have but know someone who does.

I believe Swindon commenced painting stock crimson/cream from 5 May 1949, with the first train to traffic being the Cornish Riviera on 26-5-49, though whether this was existing stock repainted or included new stock I do not know. Lot 1720 of 30 Hawksworth corridor thirds built by Gloucester was completed in brown and cream, 30/4/49.

I don't do pubs I can't add anything to this other than that one of the BCKs appeared in a Blue Pullman stand-by set in the early 1960s.

In the Summer 1954 NER carriage workings, the York-Swansea train alternated between NER and WR stock the basic formation being BTK, CK, Restaurant (WR)/RB (NER), 2 TK, CK, BTK. Strengthened by an extra 3 TK on Fridays and Saturdays when the train ran through to/from Newcastle.

I think you really need both the official documents (eg carriage working books) and photos. There is usually a pretty good correlation between the two though with numerous small variations, such as a coach taken out or added, or slight differences in type for example a first replacing a composite or vice versa. There were often numerous changes in the workings within a timetable - I have copies of lots of WR books that had been kept up to date for changes and they are generally festooned with amendments. One thing you don't find very often is a photo of a complete set of Hawksworth stock, other than say a three-coach set in the stock's latter years.

I give up.

Hawksworth stock was still being built in 1949. I think the Porthole stock only appeared around then too - crimson and cream from new except the first lot of CKs, which were unbranded LMS livery (though possibly not all of them). The colour footage of the Cornish Riviera leaving Paddington that appears in Steam on 35 mm Vol 3 shows predominantly Hawksworth stock in crimson/cream, with Collett dining pair and a one or two other Collett coaches. Black and white material on the same DVD shows lots of mixed formations in the 1950s, including Collett, Hawksworth and BR Standard stock. I would be interested to know the title of the video and whether it has reappeared on DVD.

Yes, but no guarantee that the stock would be Hawksworth.

Thinking in post-1956 terms (ie second rather than third) here are some formations I noted from carriage workings: BCK, BSK BSK, CK, BSK BSK, SK, BCK BSK, SK, CK, SK, BSK BSK, SK, CK, BSK BSK, SK, CK, BCK plus various longer formations such as: BCK, 6 SK, BCK BCK, 4 SK, BCK, BG BCK, 2 SK, 2 CK, 2 SK, BSK BSK, 3 SK, 2 CK, 3 SK, BSK These were all listed as GWR stock but could be any combination of Collett and Hawksworth stock. Plus a single BCK with a van on the Highbridge branch in the mid-1960s.

And how much less if they hadn't done curtains at all, which would have been fine by me?

The Devonian went through lots of changes in the late 1950s and early 1960s. A good colour photo of the train in 1958 appears on the front cover of the Ian Allan album Western Steam in Colour 2. The diner is a Mark I diag 16 kitchen first in crimson/cream, one of 5 built in 1952. In 1956-7, the train still included an LMS dining car, as shown here. Here is a close-up of the diner: I think it is an LMS Period II restaurant composite, as modelled by Dapol/Hornby. The vehicle to the left does not appear to have restaurant branding and may be an early open second without the middle door. Here is my crimson/cream Diag 16 RF. It appeared in Model Rail January 2008. Built by Brian Kirby by converting a Bachmann RU with etched sides made by Bob-65B. Railway Observer 1958 p358 noted maroon RU W1918 in the Devonian. Railway Observer 1960 p408 noted that following the WR takeover of the Devonian stock, barring maroon diners M229M and W9607W, both sets were in chocolate/cream. Railway Observer 1961 p94 noted that from January the Bradford-based train had a WR semi-dining SO (W3984) and an ER RF (in fact Stanier 12-wheeler E43M with prefix changed). Railway Observer 1961 p326 noted that the Devonian at last had a pair of ER standard dining vehicles in the Bradford-based set (RU E1926 and TSO E4344) instead of the LMS RF E43M and WR SO. Railway Observer 1961 p399 noted that the Bradford-based Devonian set had had RU E1926 replaced by RB E1668; the Paignton-based set contained RB W1728. Those two cars and their open seconds were maroon, but the rest of the winter load of nine vehicles was chocolate and cream in both sets.

I compared my Ince Castle and Swindon today. Though the colour seems to be the same, Swindon has more of shine to it and Ince Castle looks a bit dull in comparison. Both run fautlessly.

I now have my 7037 Swindon. I didn't buy it because of the collector aspect, I bought it because it is a late crest, Collett tender, single chimney Castle. It runs very well too. Interesting point about the screws on the transit brackets. I have not put mine back in on any of my Hornby locos, remembering the HST problem if you did so. I also agree that the plug is a pain - some kind of flange would help in getting a grip on it. Greens are a problem. It may be my eyes or the light in the railway room but I can't see much difference between Bachmann and Hornby greens, though Bachmann's possibly has slightly more depth of colour.

Some prototype information: both of these vehicles ran on the WR in the later years and both gained blue/grey livery (as did the other two 1957 prototype open firsts). 3084 was withdrawn in 1971 but 3083 lasted a bit longer. A colour photo of W3083 in blue/grey appeared in Model Rail 112 Christmas 2007, along with a colour photo of the Cravens first 3082 also in blue/grey. I believe 3083 is preserved and is or was painted in mock teak livery as on Thompson coaches in LNER days. The remaining open first was W3081, built by BRCW, seen here in 1971.

I have a Swindon on order from STEAM but have not heard anything yet. I was fairly late in placing my order so am probably towards the back of the queue.

Thanks for the comments. I would like to get back to doing more to the layout, like building the overbridge and road behind the carriage washer that I started about four or five years ago. Then work, new conservatory, house redecoration, new kitchen, more work, scanning five zillion carriage working books, running two Yahoo Groups and lots more got in the way. Plus I must put the full-size MARTON CENTRAL station sign I had made back on the wall in its proper place.

A few more photos from today. Bachmann/NRM DELTIC. No bufferbeam detail as I found that the bogies would not pivot if any of the detail were put on. P1050343as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Bachmann G2a having its first outing on a train. Very smooth runner and no problems handling almost 9' of coal wagons. Needs some dirtying though, like all the new stock. P1050344as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr First train hauled by my Bachmann Patriot - a good runner. P1050345as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Station. P1050342as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr How long will it be before we see RTR 10201/2/3? This is a Silver Fox one with Lima Class 40 bogies. It runs well enough. Those lampposts need straightening though. P1050348as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr P1050350as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Austerity 2-8-0. P1050347as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Britannia. I don't like the new Hornby loco-tender coupling arrangement. The plug is very fiddly and it's easy to accidentally uncouple loco and tender when putting them on the track, as I discovered when I noticed all that was holding the two together was the wire! P1050346as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

Layout is now restocked. Here are a few images. At last an outing for the Diagram 16 kitchen first. P1050327as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Ince Castle. The stock is in the winter formation of the Cambrian Coast Express c1959. P1050340as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Early diesels. P1050329as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Hopefully the last outing for this Class 22 as it will be replaced by a Dapol one. P1050332as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Bachmann 9F. P1050335as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Push-pull train passing the loco depot. P1050336as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Blue Pullman. P1050337as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Busy scene at the station. P1050339as by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

Given the recent rate of progress, or lack of it, blue will not be appearing again for a year or two, other than DELTIC and a Blue Pullman. Tomorrow is track cleaning day followed by putting out the stock and testing all the new stock, of which there is lots since the layout last ran in c1960 period.