tractor_37260

16 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Ebay is an excellant valuation tool.

however its not just 1 auction your looking at, its patterns of consistency.

 

if you look up an item code and hit “sold” you see how much previous ones sold for, and “completed”, shows those that didn't sell. Almost always the lack of a sale is down to price, with condition a part factor in that price.

 

You do need to invest a bit of time, eliminate the lowest examples, (usually its a seller who doesnt appreciate its worth, or a faulty/damaged/butchered or inaccurate described one)... then look at the trend over time.

if you see consistent sales above a certain price, then you have an idea of how the market values it...

 

if you want an indicator on trade price & demand, look how much auctions sell complete for (not “buy it now”), on newly released stock... A few people have commented on the low s/h value of 2019’s new terriers... Consider many buyers are themselves dealers, and if they can buy new from Hornby, they arent going to pay more for it on ebay...if you take out those buyers, your down to pure demand from the public... and if there isnt appetite, it goes low.. as new rrp discounting has been limited in 2019, dealers are realising higher margins, which means that spread between s/h and rrp is wider...hence the terrier s/h price gap is wider... that to me would be a caution against a manufacturer making more... if demand was higher that gap would be less as the public, excluding dealers, would still be trying to buy for lower than rrp..

 

if you want a science formula why not consider this for a straw man... (its not an exact, and ive rounded but its just to give an idea) 

 

100% = rrp

85% = expected discount rrp

70% = a healthy s/h rrp

60% = potential trade  (ex vat)
50% = an unhealthy s/h rrp

40% = a healthy s/h trade purchase price

30% = an unhealthy s/h trade purchase price

 

apply examples..

 

Hornby K1...

 

£155 100% = rep

£133 85% = expected discount rrp

£110 70% = a healthy s/h rrp

£95   60% = potential trade  (ex vat)
£78   50% = an unhealthy s/h rrp

£60   40% = a healthy s/h trade purchase price

£45   30% = an unhealthy s/h trade purchase price

ebays median average “auction” close price for the last 90 days is £69, putting it exactly 45th percentile... 16 auction sales

unsold = 4, all > £72 (>45th percentile).. so demand lies <45th percentile.

 

Bachmann class 90..

 

£180 100% = rrp

£157 85% = expected discount rrp

£126 70% = a healthy s/h rrp

£108 60% = potential trade  (ex vat)
£90   50% = an unhealthy s/h rrp

£72 40% = a healthy s/h trade purchase price

£54 30% = an unhealthy s/h trade purchase price

ebays median average “auction” close price for the last 90 days is £130 putting it above 70th percentile..., 11 auction sales.

unsold = 6, all > £144 (80th percentile).. so demand lies between 70-80%

Theres more demand for 90’s over k1’s given by two benchmarks.. quantity sold (rarity people aren't selling as many) and price (value), both sold and unsold.

if it were me i’d be stocking more class 90’s than k1’s... new or second hand.

 

Now compare the Hornby and Bachmann 66’s...

 

(Hornby - 58 sold at auction, Median price £50 / 65%)

 

£75 100% = rrp

£64 85% = expected discount rrp

£53 70% = a healthy s/h rrp

£45 60% = potential trade  (ex vat)
£33 50% = an unhealthy s/h rrp

£30 40% = a healthy s/h trade purchase price

£23 30% = an unhealthy s/h trade purchase price

 

(Bachmann - 206 sold at auction, Median price £75 / c48% )

£170 115% = 2017/18 rrp

£145 100% = rrp

£123 85% = expected discount rrp

£100 70% = a healthy s/h rrp

£85 60% = potential trade (ex vat)
£77 50% = an unhealthy s/h rrp

£50 40% = a healthy s/h trade purchase price

£35 30% = an unhealthy s/h trade purchase price

Clearly people are clearing out Bachmann 66’s, but I think theres a great deal more to come.

Those who were buying before the 2019 rrp price drop are losing out nearer 60% of the rrp value.

However I believe there is correlation between Hornby 66 being in the lower end of the healthy range, and Bachmann’s slide out...

 

a few month in, a healthy s/h Hattons one could be £100-£120, which I think will put more downward pressure on both Hornbys and Bachmanns.. at the end of the day, the Bachmann one s/h is probably better than a Hornby, even new, and I expect retailers will discount the Bachmann 66 more in the face of the Hattons one.

 

 

A very interesting analysis .........

There's currently 344 Bach 37's on eBay and 190 Bach Class 66's  and that will no doubt increase....and with so much choice, average selling prices will likely fall.....

On 06/06/2019 at 17:44, apollo 079 said:

E-mail from Oxford confirms it will be 12014 and 12030 (in ScotRail).

Aye all very well, but when are they going to release them...................?

2 hours ago, 66738 said:

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F303271277241

On eBay. I bought one the other day. Can’t wait to put it in a 25 worthy of it.

66738

Thanks for that, shall be ordering one shortly......

When checking function mapping options via the Lenz manual for the 21pin Silver+ both CV7 and CV8 are shown as 99

3 hours ago, Will 1062 said:

Jamie Goodman sound with a Zimo "Dumbo" Speaker in the tank.

Thanks....have you got contact details for Jamie ? Zimo or Lok4/5 decoder ?

Not 100% accurate for a planned Class 27 but "near enough" - similar PM with different electrical equipment.

Yep your right ....old photo on MRD site I also looked it up on Lenz.de  it shows as same as your photo in the thumper.

So it is a Silver+

Many thanks for help sorting this out.

On 15/08/2019 at 13:59, Will 1062 said:

 

This sound will compliment the Heljan 25 quite nicely! 

Sounds very good, start up especially....what sound file & speaker/s are fitted ? 

1 hour ago, RFS said:

My file of Lenz definitions shows code 82 being "82 Silver21 mit 21pol. Federleiste" with Federleiste being German for "female connector". 

>> Re the photo above on the left is an original Lenz Silver - I've had it for a number of years still with manual, so it's def NOT a + version.  CV128 on it reads  2

 

I think you have labelled your two decoders the wrong way round: your unknown decoder is indeed the latest Silver21+ decoder and CV 128 will tell you if the firmware is current, the current release being 14. It's your other decoder that's the earlier Silver (ie non +) version.

>> The "unknown" decoder on the right on the above photo looks nothing like a Lenz Silver of any kind, the board layout is completely different.   CV128 on it reads 14  

https://www.modelrailwaysdirect.co.uk/Lenz-10321-Silver-21-plus-Locomotive-Decoder-10321-01/

above link shows a 21pin Silver + it's very similar to the original standard Silver in my above photo, but nothing like the "unknown" decoder

 

This is the copy of the file but there may be a couple missing:

 

70 Gold mini
 71 Gold H0
 72 Gold maxi
 73 Köf H0
 75 Silver
 76 Silver mini
 77 0-V36
 78 Silver direct
 79 Silver 21
 80 LF101XF
 81 Standard
 82 Silver21 mit 21pol. Federleiste
 83 LRC100
 90 Gold mini PLUS
 91 Gold (H0) PLUS
 92 Gold21 PLUS
 93 Standard PLUS
 95 Silver PLUS
 96 Silver mini PLUS
 97 Silver Plux12 PLUS
 98 Silver direct PLUS
 99 Silver21 PLUS 

Firstly thanks to all who have tried to help.

I've now re-read both decoders:

21pin Silver             Unknown  21pin 

CV7 = 82                     CV7 = 99

CV8 = 99                     CV8 = 99 

15 minutes ago, RFS said:

CV7 should not also be 99. It should be the decoder type so I don't know why it reads 99 . Is it the same on both?

Yep both CV7 and CV8 read 99 ....very odd.....

25 minutes ago, RFS said:

The current Lenz Silver+ 21-pin decoder has 5 functions. Whether the earlier version (without the +) has 5 too I couldn't say. What does CV 7 say? That will tell you the version.

 

The Standard has never been offered as a 21-pin decoder. Would have been nice if they had though. 

CV7 reads 99 also.... I was also pretty sure Standards were not available in 21pin versions. 

25 minutes ago, Butler Henderson said:

Is it definitely 3 function? Lenz do Silvers as 21 pin with 4 functions.

Only 3 outputs AFAIK, but I'll look into it further 

Attached photos may help

The unknown one is marked LP 811 

Trying to identify a 21 pin decoder.  CV8 reads 99 which I believe is Lenz.

I think it's a Lenz Standard - (3 function outputs) -  but did Lenz produce 21 pin Standards  - thought they were all wired with plugs? 

TIA 

9 hours ago, DRS Crewe On A Mission said:

 

 

Just out of interest when you refer to the roofs of the 37/6s are you referring to different colours or slight variations of one colour or something else? I don't think I have ever researched Class 37/6 roofs so that could be something I could do when I get some spare time. It would be interesting to spot the differences. 

As originally built early series 1 37's had riveted strips across the roof at the No2 boiler end later built series 2 all had plain sheet panels. RSH builds also had the extra cant rail grille strip supports.

These features remained throughout refurb into later sub classes including the 37/6's.

37 001 - 095 riveted band strips

from 37 096 on plain metal panels

1 hour ago, sulzer71 said:

All i want for Christmas is a bunch of Scottish 37/0's 

Xmas 2022...........maybe..............

2 hours ago, DRS Crewe On A Mission said:

 

Pretty much. But I'm also saying that it makes sense to make the most of tooling with regards to running numbers and liveries too. My example was 37606-37609. I think that these four are all identical with regards to tooling/moulds. This means that the tooling is limited to just these four locos. As Accurascale have already done it's about making the most of the tooling that has got limited options. By this I mean it would be pointless just announcing 37606 out of these four, because why not announce the other three 37s as well in different running numbers and liveries. It makes perfect sense. 

Doubtful ACC will/would do different runs of an identical livery apart from the running No ?  It's easy enough to change "just" the numbers to get any of 607/8/9 three different model runs could be produced instead. Producing this particular variant without No's would also be an option but unumbered models at least in 00 did not sell that well in the past.

49 minutes ago, Roy Langridge said:

 

With respect, I don't see them either. Look at the video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsLQp93Y71o

 

Roy

Oops - I stand corrected, must be overdue a spec savers visit !  

2 hours ago, Titan said:

Just wondering if there will be a representation of the strengthener half way along each radiator slat, as seen here:

 

 

Bachmann did not bother:

 

 

But interestingly for all it's faults, the Lima Deltic did:

 

 

 

It's quite obvious from many photos in this thread that these grille supports will be present on the new Deltic.

As for the Lima version the less said the better ! 

4 hours ago, D400 said:

This is a game changer. Particularly impressed by the bogie and underframe detail. 

 

Bruce

Totally agree...that roof fan/grille looks spot on..and the dubious double rain strip above the cab door/windows as on the Bach model is gone....hopefully the front cab/window shape will finally be faithful to the prototype.....gonna be yet another great model...from Accurascale....great stuff lads...keep em coming....

Great news indeed, finally a retooled and "accurate" 37  - I'm sure these will sell in "bucket loads"  2020 is gonna be one expensive year.......LOL

And some other celebs :   .... Neil Young / Roger Daltry /  John Entwhistle / Eric Clapton /  Gene Hackman / Bruce Springsteen / Donald Sutherland /  Phil Collins /  Merle Haggard ......

On 10/11/2019 at 10:28, Butler Henderson said:

Fitted an ESU Lokpilot v4 which has a number of very long CV screens in Decoder Pro - are their are any particular CVs that need tweaking or are necessary to change to get the lights responding correctly?

You may ?  find that a Lokpilot V4 does not have enough function outputs to give full control of all the lighting options available.  The earlier sound fitted versions came fitted with Zimo decoders that allowed full control of the fitted lighting options, I assume this is still the case with the latest batch of models. 

HTH

On 07/11/2019 at 17:02, Neil said:

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Squire Tools are also very good for all sorts of components/modelling items, with FREE postage on £15 and over orders, delivery is also very quick. Recommended.

On 05/11/2019 at 20:26, Philip CW 37128 said:

Good evening everyone

 

Can I ask a little bit of advise from some of my customers. When I step down at Warley, I wanted to purchase one of the group's class 37 models. If it's an easy job, I would like to purchase a 32-775SD (37032)and remove the Mirage nameplate without affecting the model underneath. If not it will have blue 37284

 

Many thanks for any info

 

Cheers

 

Philip

Hi Philip

Before using any liquid option, try using the pointed edge of toothpick to remove the plate, or if your very careful use the edge of a rounded blade hobby knife and very gently scrape off the nameplate.  These options normally leave no trace of the nameplate and no damage to the main body colour.  Failing that, T-cut/cotton bud will remove the nameplate only, but leave a small shiny patch.

HTH

Ken

On 01/11/2019 at 16:07, Gary H said:

Thanks very much, now I understand it! Over the last 12 years, (having taken a 12 year break from British 00)  I have done a few installs on U.S outline loco's, fitting LOK 4's, Tsunami's (yes, I know) and converting Athearn's useless 1.5 volt incandescent headlight bulbs to LEDs etc but these 51968 adapter boards and Bachmann Class 37's and their lighting are very much out of my comfort zone/ familiarity. Last time I owned a Bachy 37, it was from the very first run without lights and 4 axle drive!!! Thanks again for taking the time to reply to my query! 

Here's one of my 51968 boards wired up ready to install in a 37. NB: This is one of later versions, there have been a number of revisions to the 51968 circuit board layout.

Note SMD resistors have been fitted to the output's for FL / RL / Aux 1 & 2 (Tails)  the other Aux outputs (3 to 6) will have in-line resistors fitted to the wires.