Islesy

A selection of crops from unedited photographs to (hopefully) help you decide...

Hello Dave, hope you're keeping well? The canopy shewn is merely the first EP plain one, with a more detailed 'lumpy' version currently being worked on...

Exactly what my lad said to me when I showed him the painted EP - and he's not a railway modeller (yet)....

Mmm....

Tony mentioned the paint files in the PRO records at Kew, which are illustrated below. I've also included a summary of those vehicles in used in the CETs where I could cross-reference the information.

Hello @Tony Cane good to see you on this thread! I came across your name as I compiled information on the Casualty Evacuation Trains, so it's a small world! Mike King is a good friend of mine, and was, as ever, a massive help during the research on the GBLs. I had hoped that there would be scope for Hornby to produce versions of the GBLs used in the CETs, but whether that ever transpires is anyone's guess now. I have copies of the PRO files on the trains, and there was some interesting information on the Queen Alexandra's Nursing Corps website, which I believe you also contributed to? Here is my collection of notes on the subject, which you'll see you cropped up in, for the benefit of those interested in the subject. CASUALTY EVACUATION TRAINS. HC Deb 07 December 1939 vol 355 c796 796 §71. Sir A. Knox asked the Minister of Health whether he is aware that 32 trains, each with eight officials of the St. John Ambulance Association, are at present standing idle; what is the weekly cost of these officials; and why the train and the personnel could not be assembled quickly in case of an emergency? §Mr. Elliot The casualty evacuation trains, which, owing to the course the war has taken, have happily not been used to a great extent, have hitherto numbered 28, apart from two in Scotland. They are now being reduced to 18. The weekly cost of the orderlies averages about £26 per train. The mobility of the trains and the need for keeping them and their equipment in constant readiness for immediate service, if required, makes it necessary to keep trains and staff continually in commission. Administrative Memorandum No. 93 relating to Hospital Trains operating in the United Kingdom, dated 17 June 1944 , was distributed by the Office of the Chief Surgeon, ETOUSA, APO 871. The following Hospital Trains being used in the United Kingdom had following patient carrying capacities: BUNKS LITTERS AMBULATORY PADDED Hospital Train No. 31 252 64 1 Hospital Train No. 33 231 64 1 US litters were to be used, if possible, for the evacuation of litter patients on Hospital Trains No. 17 – 27 – 31 – 33 – and 36 British-built Hospital Trains: Hospital Trains furnished from British sources were of two distinct types: the bunk type and the litter type, and consisted of 14 cars, half of which were ward cards. Both were constructed of similar equipment. All cars were of the uniformed un-reinforced wooden material in normal use by all major British Railways. Ward cars were built from baggage cars, personnel cars were obtained from slightly modified first class sleepers, ambulatory patient cars came unchanged from passenger wagons, as did the kitchen-diner cars. Without exception, these trains proved to be the most unsatisfactory of any Hospital Trains in use, even though the five bunk-type car was considerably better than the litter-type car. The primary objection was the lack of protection afforded the patients and personnel in case of accident. Another major factor was the lack of heating or ventilating systems for the patients’ cars (only source of heat was a double two-inch steam line –ed), the bunk-type cars did have a small fin-type radiator affording only minimal heat. Furthermore, there was no heating in the lavatories, no heating of the water pipes, and the ward cars had no windows since they were based on baggage cars. Sanitary facilities were primitive and privacy only consisted of a curtain. A chemical toilet was the only fixture (bedpans and urinals had to be emptied into it by hand –ed). The only source of hot water was a gasoline burner with a small overhead cold water tank. Lighting was insufficient and based on a storage-battery which had to be kept charged by the train axle-operated generator. Hard unadjustable bucket seats were most uncomfortable for the ambulatory patients, and the litter patients had extremely rough journeys lying on stretchers without any cushioning or padding (only the bunk-type cars had beds with springs –ed). Although demoded and really unsuitable, they were the only available means of conveyance at the time. Red Cross Ambulance Train No 32 The photos of the Red Cross Ambulance Train below and at the top of this page are from the collection of Mary Vida Essberger, (nee Smith) who was a trained Red Cross nurse in 1939 and served on and trained on Red Cross Ambulance Train No 32, which was based in London, possibly South London and was due to be despatched to France but never went. Sister Smith was struck down with pneumonia and had to resign from the Red Cross and later worked as a PA to Sir William Rootes for most of the war, in central London. Her son still has more pictures of her and the rest of the nurses and civilians and doctors that made up the Train's detachment. The sister on the train was Sister Wallace, who had nursed King Edward VIII when he was ill and when he was Prince of Wales. The following has been received from Tony Cane of the World War Two Railway Study Group whose website is www.saxoncourtbooks.co.uk/ww2rsg/ Ambulance train 32 was one of 34 Casualty Evacuation Trains (CET) that were converted from existing coaches. The requirements for these were made in 1938 but they were not actually built until mid 1939. Each had originally two brake coaches, as shown in the picture on your site and 10 ward cars. The brake coaches were converted to provide accommodation for staff, and storage of medical equipment, and then stored for later use. The ward cars were standard luggage vans, and after being fitted with brackets for rapid conversion to part of an ambulance train, were put back into normal service. Later a restaurant car replaced one of the ward cars. The authorities assumed that any bombing of our cites would produce such large numbers of casualties that the local facilities would be overwhelmed. This thankfully did prove to be an overestimate of capabilities of aerial bombing, but they were still put to good use in other rolls. They were used to clear the hospitals in threatened areas, moving patients out of the cities to more rural areas. Those moved to the South Coast had to be moved again when France fell. Train 32 was one of four built by the Southern Railway. There are pictures of its sister train No 33 in two articles published in the railway press soon after they were built. These also have drawings of how the conversion was made and a list of equipment supplied. For example I can tell you that this included 20 teaspoons! There is also a good general history of the CET trains in the book Hospital Ships and Ambulance Trains by John Plumridge which also has pictures of train No 33. Train 32 was stored initially near Streatham Common. The only other information I have specifically about train No32 is that it moved 163 patients from Brighton to Macclesfield in September 1940. The war journal of Joyce's War - The Second World War Journal of a Queen Alexandra Nurse includes chapters about her time on ambulance trains in India. The Queen Alexandra's Royal Army Nursing Corps (QARANC) Article from "Modern Transport" of November 4th 1939. Formations of the trains were as follows:- CET 32 SECR BCK 6628, SR Maunsell unclassed saloon 7794 (later replaced by LSWR restaurant car 7835), vans 2358/70/66/59/60/63, 2466/80/61, SECR BCK 6630. Allocated Eardley Road (Streatham). CET 33 SECR BCK 6626, SR Maunsell unclassed saloon 7910 (later replaced by LSWR restaurant car 7836), vans 2356, 2464/77//69//75, 2369/67, 2468/72, SECR BCK 6635. Allocated Sevenoaks. CET 34 SECR BCK 6629, SR Maunsell unclassed saloon 7982 (later replaced by LSWR restaurant car 7839), vans 2473/62//63/71/65, 2361/68/64/57, SECR BCK 6633. Allocated Sevenoaks. @Tony Cane If you pass your email address on to me by PM, I'll send over copies of the PRO files I photographed - it would be a shame to see that information go to waste. Best wishes, Paul.

Regarding end views, the attached may prove of some help, as they were taken at Neville Hill. As for TfW, looking at my notes from earlier in the year, the formation should be: TfW Class 67 TfW Mk4 Standard B (SOE) TfW Mk4 Standard C (SO) TfW Mk4 First/Kitchen H (RFM) TfW Mk4 Open 1st L - Accessible Toilet (FOD) TfW Mk4 DVT (DVT) Of course, that was last summer, and a lot has happened since! Also found these notes on formations: Twelve refurbished Mark 4 carriages for the Holyhead to Cardiff Central Premier Service by the end of 2019, to replace the Mark 3 carriages, plus 3 DVT. Need work internally as TfW say 19 first class seats, assumption is Coach H will be amended to make the seating area 1st and the buffet closed with trolley only in standard, or turned so that it is at the standard end. Set 1 Formation noted as: 82226 DVT 11323 Coach L 10325 Coach H 12454 Coach C 12225 Coach B 67008 Set 2 noted as: 67025 12219 Coach B 12447 Coach C 10328 Coach H 11324 Coach L 82229 DVT Class 67 hauled, taken from former ECML Sets: BN23 11423 11323 11292 10325 12318 12455 12456 12454 12225 BN24 11424 11324 11293 10328 12319 12403 12425 12447 12219

A massive opportunity missed in not offering the Tyne Dock variant this year, especially given the depth of the tooling variations. The Crosti? Less so in my opinion and this was certainly not part of the tooling variations when I left. With KR Models producing the ‘right’ hoppers, albeit not to modern standards, there is a an opportunity to match motive power to rolling stock, however I doubt we’ll see the 9Fs much before Easter 2022, which will impact on Year 2 releases. Maybe a mid-year announcement?

That’s the Donkey Engine cover, it’s on one side only and can be in one of two positions, depending on the variant. It’s on the Hornby models....

the three equal sized sections below the running plate look very roughly surfaced. i'm not certain what i'm actually looking at? They are weights, which vary in design and size, depending on the variant...

No, that wasn't the case. Measurement and survey of details were taken from Stroudley examples at both the Bluebell Railway and at the Mid-Hants in November 2019, which were used as the basis for this range of coaches. Prototypically, the Stroudleyesque 4w Brake that Edwardian is admiring should have been on a shorter chassis, but a bit like Les Dawson's piano playing, all the notes are there, just not in the right order...

Looks like we'll need to wait for 2022 for the Tyne Dock versions though...

It'll be interesting to see what's not in the 2021 range, as much as what has made it in...

Wishlisting, in any form, is not research. Research is the long hours spent in archives, grinding through manufacturer’s drawings trying to piece together build histories and common components. It’s the hours spent trawling through photographic collections (online and offline), looking for livery variations and it’s the days spent putting together a business case for any particular subject. It’s about talking to those folk who worked with the subject and the time spent tracking those people down and it’s about establishing whether there are any licensing implications that might erode any profit margin. And that’s before trying to work out the complexities of engineering that is required to deliver a model at a reasonable cost...

No Terriers worked over the East Kent Light Railway at all I’m afraid, let alone in BR days.

Not sure where you got that information from, as it definitely still exists ;-)

A sense of perspective is needed here chaps and chapesses - this item was released ahead of its original release date in response to a speculative release by another 'manufacturer'. Given how Hornby operate their releases, do you honestly think that there will not be further releases in the future? When have Hornby released only one run of a newly tooled item in recent times? How many 21t Hoppers, 20T Brake Vans etc have been released, as a direct comparison? All this has highlighted is the 'must have it now' attitude of many 'collectors', when what was required was perspective, common sense, product awareness and patience...

Way back, when the W1 was original in CAD, that option was given some consideration, before being dismissed due to cost implications...

*Warning! Contents may differ from those illustrated.

I couldn’t possibly comment...

Just an example of the differences at the front of 2001/2002

There's all sorts of oddities creeping in: The front casing differed between 2001 and 2002, 2002 obviously has different valve gear, there's the front sole bar drop, different smoke deflectors, etc, then after streamlining there were extra cab ventilators on 2003-6, lubricators in different positions, different rivet patterns on the cabs, 2005 had a single chimney, 2006 had 5 handholds on the firebox, not 4 etc, etc. Enough to make it 'interesting'

It is, but it’s wrong, as there is a distinctive ‘hump’ between the cab and the smoke box of the streamlined P2 that isn’t there on the ‘standard’ version and which hasn’t been allowed for. All of which means that it requires new tooling to produce ;-)

Can I join in this year...?

I have several reasons for liking this; both the motive power and the rolling stock...