R Marshall

From my collection.

2008 - Copy.jpg

Mick,

That's the one!

Stylish.

Regards,

Roy

According to the late Willie Yeadon's Registar, No738 was a "Class S" (B13) and new from Gateshead June 1908. To Dairycoates 19 July 1928, withdrawn from there 30 July 1938.

Mick,

Ken Hoole's Illustrated History of NER Locomotives says "although they were included in Class S they were often referrred to as Class S/07 (a bit like the V/09 Atlantics, which also had narrow splashers), the suffix indicating the date of the modified drawings". So I was wrong about the year and it seems an informal classification anyway. He includes a lovely picture of 2008 in NER lined black, which I can't add for copyright reasons.

Regards,

Roy

According to the late Willie Yeadon's Registar, No738 was a "Class S" (B13) and new from Gateshead June 1908. To Dairycoates 19 July 1928, withdrawn from there 30 July 1938.

Regards,

Roy

Dairycoates, almost ninety years ago.

738 Dairycoates.jpg

We'll stay in the north east for the BR photos today with a brief look at the NER line from Newcastle to Carlisle.

 

 

Wylam Class 101 Newcastle to Carlisle April 81 C5337.jpg

Wylam Class 101 Newcastle to Carlisle April 81 C5337

 

 

Wylam Class 101 Newcastle to Carlisle April 81 C5338.jpg

Wylam Class 101 Newcastle to Carlisle April 81 C5338

 

 

Wylam bridge over Tyne April 81 C5341.jpg

Wylam bridge over Tyne April 81 C5341

 

 

Bardon Mill Class 101 Newcastle to Carlisle Aug 77 C3503.jpg

Bardon Mill Class 101 Newcastle to Carlisle Aug 77 C3503

 

 

Denton School crossing view east Aug 73 C1371.jpg

Denton School crossing view east Aug 73 C1371

 

 

David

David,

I love those pictures of the Newcastle and Carlisle!

Regards,

Roy

A few more from Beamish for this afternoon.

 

 

Beamish Rowley station Sept 11DSC_5187.JPG

Beamish Rowley station Sept 11 DSC_5187

 

 

Beamish Pit 2nd September 2011 DSC_5274.jpg

Beamish Pit 2nd September 2011 DSC_5274

 

 

Beamish Pit 2nd September 2011 DSC_5275.jpg

Beamish Pit 2nd September 2011 DSC_5275

 

 

Beamish Pockerley Waggonway 2nd September 2011 DSC_5280.jpg

Beamish Pockerley Waggonway 2nd September 2011 DSC_5280

 

 

Beamish Pockerley Waggonway 2nd September 2011 DSC_5282.jpg

Beamish Pockerley Waggonway 2nd September 2011 DSC_5282

 

 

David

David,

That Y7 is a little beauty!

I guess that on the Polesworth shot the up and down fast lines are widely separated?

Regards,

Roy

Water softeners, Hessle, 1947

Credit: Angus Young, Hull Daily Mail

 

 

 

IMG_0156.JPG

 

Great picture - that looks like a C6 (NER V09) serving as a stationary boiler - likely to be 696 (2939), or 698 (2941).

 

Both were shedded at Dairycoates in August 1946, along with 742 (2933), but it can't be the latter, which was a 1904 build with wider splashers. All withdrawn by March 1948 says RCTS Part 3A.

 

Sad end for such an elegant locomotive.

 

Regards,

 

Roy Marshall

Springhead, ex H&BRly Class F3, now class N13.

Mick,

Lovely picture!

Regards,

Roy

Yes then rejected it as there are issues with wheelsets  on signature locos.  The three points out front will be Peco Code 55 large radius, in the yard Peco small radius Code 80 insulfrog (as in HD - if it works, why change it?).  Part of the line is in a cutting so the visual improvement will be limited by the slightly restricted view of the track.

 

The layout using Finetrack at Newcastle didn't seem to be running all that intensively - I only saw two trains moving even though I passed it several times.  As you saw HD has very intensive running and Croft Spa will be the same. 

 

All the very best

Les

Les,

Of course - makes sense.

Regards,

Roy

Croft Spa baseboards and trestles are now in my workshop. 

 

I've got to do a feasibility study with the trestles to see if they will fit under Hawthorn Dene.  If they will that will allow me to take the legs off and make the layout a bit lighter to carry.  If not it works as it is.

 

Two of the new trestles will need a small piece adding at the top (I think) to fit under No Place.  We'll get that done in January or so...

 

I'll start the thread for Croft Spa once real construction of it starts.  In the meantime I've ordered the Streamline for it and cleaned Sherwood Models out of the points I will need for the fiddle yard.   Access Models have got me the Peco bungalow kits I need to butcher to make th three pairs of semis in the road behind the station, and I picked up a pair of Pee Dee Models low-relief houses that will make the pair of semis close to them with a bit of jer-jer-jiggling.....

 

 

Les

Les,

Have you considered Finetrax for Croft Spa?

Regards,

Roy

I have not looked, but the attached from my collection is probably the picture you ref to.

A No129 2510 Springhead - Copy.jpg

Mick,

Yes, that's the one, though cropped differently - it doesn't show as much of the loco behind, but does show both front buffers, strangely enough.

Regards,

Roy

Phil,

RCTS Part 6C, Figure 61, opposite Page 61, shows 2510 (H&B 129) at Springhead, dated 1925, with a domeless belpaire boiler, a smokebox door with a very flat edge and 3 dog clips on the bottom edge of the door.

Regards,

Roy

It's a "Doctored" photograph, the cab side sheet has been "Filled In" with a lighter colour, and also, the number changed from 117 to 121. "Dogs" are not shown on the original drawing, they must have been a later addition. Attached, a colour postcard of the original print of No117

A No117 2498 postcard.jpg

Mick,

A good-looking locomotive. Somehow inside motion, whilst a nightmare for the fitters and crews, adds to the looks. You could see Union Mills turning out one of these - several 8-coupled locos have been produced already.

Regards,

Roy

Les,

Agree on the Thompsons - the market might be saturated, but there isn't (other than kits) a convincing set of East Coast stock for the 1950s - and Thompson's carriages ooze style, in my opinion.

Solid progress on the J72 would be welcome, but realistically it must be a year or more away.

Regards,

Roy

Mick,

The cab panel looks very light - RCTS says the livery was "invisible green" panelled in broad blue with narrow vermillion borders, so the cab and tender sides should look the same, I guess (which they don't). Also, there are no dog clips on the lower edge of the smokebox door - these were removed by Darlington works from 1924, RCTS says.

Regards,

Roy

As I mentioned earlier, my Q6 has been backdated to a pre-war LNER machine with D.50 boiler. As can be seen below, this is now complete and ready to be pressed into service, once I have a suitable set of wagons to hang behind the tender, even a nice LNER brake van would do for now!

 

 

 

More photos and details are available on my workbench thread

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/99152-jaymz-modelling-adventures/?p=2442854&do=findComment&comment=2442854

 

Thoughts and comments are always welcome!

 

Cheers

 

J

Nice looking model - I like the profile of the original NER dome cover.

According to RCTS Part 6C, this locomotive received the tender from C7 2169 (continuous coal rails and oval frame slots) in October 1934, in exchange for its own original 4125 gallon self trimming tender (of the variety with coal rails "sawn off" at the back of the coal space). However, it's perfectly possible that it had a further tender change (to a 3940 gallon tender as modelled) in the period of your model.

Regards,

Roy

Hi Martin, 

99% certain were at milepost 9¼ heading toward Annfield Plain. There was a good deal of open casting around the Consett area at the time of the phot and I can remember seeing a hopper and loading arrangement in Consett station Yard about 1979 but never saw it in use.

Bob Young was just starting to build up his open cast coal businesses around the Consett area about this time. He used the ex NCB loco shed at Leadgate as a garage and eventually took over Leadgate school as offices. I can't remember when it started but he had a large opencast site that included a drift, directly opposite Leadgate industrial estate but this may have been later than the photo.

 

It's just a theory but that could be opencast coal and if so it's destination could possibly be Wardley via Tyne Yard.

Bantling Castle.JPG

 

 

P

 

PS. I see you've gone all DCC. Might see you at Manchester?

 

Porcy,

 

Google Earth shows the tall mast to be WSW of the lattice structures, confirming that the train is heading away from Consett, as you say.

 

Regards,

 

Roy

Brough station looking west c1910.

Brough Station.jpg

Mick,

I'd be interested in others' views on the locomotive in this shot.

I'd guess a NER 4-4-0 because of the apparent curve of the splashers. It looks as if there is something on the footplate either side of the smokebox, which suggests NER Class M1 (D17/1) as built with outside steam chests or the solitary 3CC (D19) as rebuilt in 1898, but the buffer beam number doesn't look to start with 16?

Both classes were shedded at Botanic Gardens at the right time.

Regards,

Roy

Sorry to disagree but the tender behind 1621 is not of 3940 capacity. It did indeed have a tender of that capacity but it was removed to put behind a newly built J39. The tender currently behind 1621 has a capacity of 3038 gallons and does indeed have lower sides.  Note also that it does not have the outside compensated brake rods that 3940 tenders had. On 1621 the pull rods on the tender run behind the wheels and the adjusters can be clearly seen in your photo.

 

The heights of the side sheets were 3038 3' 9", 3940 4' 3" and 4125 (trimming and not self trimming) 4' 9".

 

ArthurK

Arthur,

Here's a 3038 gallon tender with 65033 - clearly much smaller than that currently with 1621.

I've made no study of tender brake rods, but oddly enough, 65033's tender has the outside rodding you describe for 3940 gallon varieties, as do the 3038 gallon tenders in figures 66 and 72 of RCTS Part 3C

For additional evidence compare figures 66 and 67 in RCTS Part 3C  showing both types of tender (3038 and 3940 gallon) with 1621.

Regards,

Roy

Early builds of the C7s had 4125 gallon tenders but were not self trimming. The later batches were attached to the 4125 gallon self trimming tenders the same as those fitted to the later Q6s, B16s and Q7s There were differences in some of these tenders notably the type of spring hangers used but all these self trimming type had essentially identical bodies except that the rails of the 1917 batch of Q6s were cut back at the end of the coal space. 

 

All these later tenders had the rails swept down at front and rear. The preserved Q6 is not fitted with one of these nor do I believe it to be self trimming none of the early 4125 gallon tenders were ever self trimming which is why those on the C7s were swapped with those from the Q6s. I believe 3395 to be attached to be the standard 3940 gallon, non self trimming style. It certainly was when it was initially bought for preservaton.

 

In short if it has straight ended coal rails ending at the rear of the tender it is not self trimming.

 

I never claimed that the tender behind 63344 was not self trimming, of course it is. The angle was change to six inch when moved to a C7. This angle was not changed back to three inch when it was subsequently put back behind a Q6.

 

ArthurK

Arthur,

I think we agree on many points, but look at the attached pictures of 1621 (with a 3940 gallon tender) and 63395 (with a tender that at least has the height of a 4125 gallon tender whatever the capacity). Pictures of 63395 both immediately before and immediately after preservation show a tender of comparable height and for a modeller it's the apparent size that's important.

Regards,

Roy

One definite example of  Q6s sporting Atlantic tenders at the end of their days is 63344 at Tyne Dock on the scrap road, coupling rods removed. The give-away is the six inch footplate angle on its tender. Not all C7 tenders had the angle changed when passed on the Q6s although most that were switched in pre-war days did. No doubt when the C7s were scrapped useful tenders were retained for use on Q6s. At the end of days remaining Q6s had a motley of tenders from Q7s and B16s as well as from C7s. I doubt if many records were kept of these changes in the last days.

 

ArthurK

 

Book 8 067_1.jpg

 

As I understand it, no Atlantics were built with self trimming tenders or coal rails swept down at the rear of the coal space. The one you show with 63344 is, I believe, self trimming, was swapped from a Q6 to a C7 and, at that point, had the angle iron altered to suit the C7 footplate. As you say, the angle iron was not altered back when it was coupled to other locomotives afterwards.

 

All the Atlantic tenders were 4125 gallons, self-trimming or otherwise. The 3940 gallon tenders are noticeably lower in the height of the sides, so I don't believe that the tender shown with 63395 in 1967, or as preserved, can have come from a Q5 unless the tank had been replaced with a 4125 gallon tank. 

 

Edited to say that the two 4CC or C8 locomotives had 3800 gallon tenders, of course.

 

Regards,

 

Roy

Derailment at North end of York station, no other details. Photographer unkown.

York North End Derailment 2 - Copy.jpg

Mick,

As you can see, this is NER Class 3CC (LNER D19) number 1619. Looks like a Z Atlantic at extreme right, so after July 1911, anyway.

Regards,

Roy

North end of York station. Engine number and date etc are unkown.

York East End.jpg

Mick,

I think this is a NER Class S, one of the first batch 2001 - 2010. Likely the last of that batch 2010, looking at the number plate.

Another cracking shot!

Regards,

Roy

Mick,

A 7mm layout of York will be something to see!

And if you've got more York pictures of that quality, I look forward to them, hopefully, on here. What do you use for cleaning them up?

It's rare that I can challenge a caption, but I've got pictures of a B16/2 near Northallerton - the caption says April 64, but there's too much foliage on the trees for April, I think - I reckon there are only buds in April at best.

Regards,

Roy

D19, No2018, York.

D19 2018 - Copy.jpg

Mick,

2018 is a NER Class R (you can make out the class on the front buffer beam), later D20 62347. Only one D19 (NER 3CC) was built - 1619. 

I reckon you were just testing us.

Stunning picture though!

Regards,

Roy