Tallpaul69

Thanks Brian, Brian's post brings me nicely back to the subject of Parcels trains:- Having previously detailed the local parcels trains I intend to portray, today it is the turn of the long distance parcels. Initially, space will probably dictate that it is sensible to cater mainly for those that used the Relief Lines at Maidenhead, and then to maybe add one or two more off the Main Lines! So these are the initial workings I will model:- 2140 Parcels Shrewsbury to Paddington (due 0450) This train starts from the Lower Fiddle Yard and passes anticlockwise through Lower Thames Yard on the relief line at 0401, then proceeds into the Main Fiddle Yard where it is held for a future working .(0855 Parcels Fishguard to Paddington) 0505 Parcels Paddington to Bristol This train starts from the Main fiddle yard and passes clockwise to Lower Thames Yard on the Relief Line at 0538. It then proceeds round the layout back to the Main Fiddle Yard to await a later working..(2025 Parcels Paddington to Cardiff) 1440 Milk Empties Wood Lane to Plymouth This train starts from the Mail Fiddle Yard and pauses in the down relief loop at Lower Thames Yard between 1546 and 1604. In reality this train paused in the Maidenhead Goods Line, but in my world Lower Thames Yard has no Goods Line! the train then moves on to the Lower Fiddle Yard where it is shunted to form an Up working. 1145 Parcels Dr. Days Junc.to Old Oak Common (1745) This train starts from the Lower Fiddle Yard and passes through Lower Thames Yard on the Relief Line at 1646 before passing clockwise to the Main Fiddle Yard where it waits for a later working. .(1145 Parcels Dr. Days Junc. to Old Oak Common) 0830 Milk Whitland to Kensington This train using the revised consist from the 1440 Milk Empties starts from the Lower Fiddle Yard , passes Lower Thames Yard at 1650 on the Relief Line and passes anticlockwise round the layout to reach the Main Fiddle Yard where it waits for the following days 1440 Milk Empties. 2025 Parcels Paddington to Cardiff This train starts clockwise from the Main Fiddle Yard using the stock from the earlier 0505 working and passes Lower Thames Yard on the Relief Line at 2102, It then proceeds to the Lower Fiddle Yard for shunting and to wait for a later working. 0855 Parcels Fishguard to Paddington(2132) This train starts from the Lower Fiddle Yard using the shunted stock from the previous days 2240 Parcels Paddington to Penzance working and passes Lower Thames Yard on the relief Line at 2046 before passing anticlockwise into the Main Fiddle Yard to await a later working. (This train reverses to form the 2137 Parcels Paddington to Penzance) 2137 Parcels Paddington to Penzance This train starts from the Main Fiddle Yard clockwise passing through Lower Thames Yard on the Relief Line at 2224 and passes down to the Lower Fiddle Yard where it is shunted and sorted to be available for a return working. 2240 Parcels to Penzance This train starts from the Main Fiddle Yard clockwise passing through Lower Thames Yard on the Relief Line at 2316 and passes clockwise round to the Main Fiddle Yard where it waits for a later working. (Next day) 0842 Parcels Shrewsbury to Paddington(2358) This train starts from the Lower Fiddle Yard using the shunted stock from the ??? and arrives at Lower Thames Yard up relief Line loop at 2206 where it shunts to pick up vans until 2225 before passing anticlockwise into the Main Fiddle Yard to await a later working. This set of workings will require further work to minimize the number of carriage sets needed. Enjoy your modelling Stay safe Cheers Paul

Hope you will post some pics after Saturday? (if all goes to plan...…) Take care All, Cheers Paul

Hope you and your's are ok? I'm trying to persuade myself that I need a second King. Currently, as I'm modelling 1960/2 the plan is to have a King one way and a D6xx Warship the other! Need to work up a good story so SWMBO doesn't disapprove? Meanwhile, unfortunately, in the real world, and today, the figures don't get any better. Jjust got my fingers crossed today is a blip, otherwise we will all get a three line whip confined to barracks, with just a weekly shopping trip! Glad I don't have a dog, keeping them exercised must be a nightmare with the current restrictions never mind if they get tighter!! I guess we all must try to look on the bright side? Keep smiling and stay safe Cheers Paul.

Bet that got you in a load of trouble? Drinking and chatting up SWMBO's friend? Stay safe, this afternoon's figures are depressing! Paul

Hi All, Havn't got to write a full blown post today, partly because a few household matters have got in the way, but also because the post this morning delivered a book from ebay and I've spent some time digesting its contents. The book is a copy of BR Western Region Passenger Train Working for Paddington station 10/09/62 to 16/07/63 This book gives me a better picture of what happens to the train stock arriving at Paddington and how the stock for the outward trains was provided. This will allow me to as realistically as possible align the incoming and outgoing mainline stock on the model to what happened in real life. I had data from the local carriage working book for the local passenger trains but not the mainline ones. Hope everyone is staying safe and well, Best regards Paul

Fair Comment, I just had not noticed that particular one before! Normally I can put up with (ignore!) most adverts. Best regards Paul

To All RMWeb readers:- Am I being hypersensitive, or do others agree with me that in the current situation, adverts for Funeral Plans on RMWeb are, to say the least, tasteless? I understand that the booking for the advert may have been taken weeks ago before Coronavirus reached the UK, I I think it should be removed, and if necessary payment refunded? Any views Folks? Meanwhile, stay safe, keep up the exercise (unless you are in Spain or Italy), and keep smiling! Best regards Paul

Clive, If you went for DCC, you wouldn't have that problem! On the other hand you might have a number of other problem, like the agro and cost of chipping your fleet, especially if you got bitten by the sound bug!! As always, you pays your money and you takes your choice? Cheers Keep active and sane. Paul

We are (in the main) a GF establishment too since my wife was diagnosed last year! However, we do our separate things on breakfasts (have done for years cos we like different things!), and I keep my own bread. We are currently doing separate things in other meals to use up what is pre GF in the chest freezer, which also means a bit less to shop for in the next 2/3 weeks. Hope everyone is well and managing to keep fit? I walked 25 mins each way to our eldest sons, put a bag with our grand daughter's birthday present and a couple of things he asked me to get in our local Coop, on the doorstep, rang the bell and walked away 2metres down the path. When my son opened the door we had a 2 metre conversation! Still IMHO too many cars on the roads, and theres no big supermarkets etc. near us. Thankfully, we and all our family are ok. Keep modelling Cheers Paul

Individually, yes, but together??? Oh well, each to their own!! Take care Cheers Paul

Hi All, Here is my promised details on Local Parcels trains for Lower Thames Yard:- The parcels trains on Lower Thames Yard will be represented by 4 sets of vans with the following exceptions:- 1)The 0540 Reading to Princes Risborough and the 2010 Maidenhead to Reading which will have their own dedicated set. While they travel up the branch as a set in the morning, they return down the branch individually attached to the various afternoon passenger trains. 2) The 0720 Reading to Slough Fish vans will be represented by 5 vans which travel from the lower fiddle yard in the morning entering the Branch fiddle yard clockwise. They return individually attached to part fitted or unfitted freights. 3) There will be an up and a down milk tanker train representing the several milk trains in each direction on the WR Main line. As there are 6down “Local” parcels trains and 5 up ones in a day, plus a number of “Long Distance” parcels trains in each direction the sets will make several trips round the layout. Some trips will be round and round trips, while other trips will be to/from the Lower fiddle yard from/to the Main fiddle yard. When sets arrive at the Lower fiddle yard they will be positioned in the siding at the operators side of the yard so that some vans can be swapped with other vans waiting in the kickback sidings off the front siding. The aim will be as far as possible to perform the swap without manual intervention by use of the Lower fiddle yard shunter. The Parcels Trains Down 0430 Paddington – Westbury This leaves the Main fiddle yard clockwise to visit Lower Thames Yard down relief loop between 0510 and 0515 to drop off a GUV that will travel up the branch at 0620 on the 0540 Reading to Princes Risborough parcels when it reverses from the up relief to the Branch. This set then travels down to the Lower fiddle yard to have its consist changed as described above. 0533 Paddington – Oxford This leaves the Main fiddle yard clockwise to pass through the down relief line at Lower Thames Yard at 0620 and continues round the layout back to the Main fiddle yard to appear later as another working 0645 Paddington – Reading This leaves the Main fiddle yard clockwise to visit Lower Thames Yard down loop between 0924 and 0928. This set then travels down to the Lower fiddle yard to have its consist changed as described above. 1122 Reading – Paddington This the first up through parcels of the day starts from the Lower fiddle yard and uses the revised consist of the 0430 train above. It visits the up relief loop at Lower Thames Yard between 1144 and 1150 and then travels anticlockwise round the layout to the Main fiddle yard to appear later as another working. 1130 Paddington - Didcot The above 0533 train consist reappears clockwise from the Main fiddle yard and visits Lowe Thames Yard down relief line loop between 1207 and 1212. This set then travels down to the Lower fiddle yard to have its consist changed as described above. 1155 Oxford to Paddington This up parcels starts from the Lower fiddle yard and uses the revised consist of the 1130 train above. It visits the up relief loop at Lower Thames Yard between 1425 and 1450 and then travels anticlockwise round the layout to the Main fiddle yard to appear later as another working. 1230 West London – Didcot The above 1122 train consist reappears clockwise from the Main fiddle yard to pass through the down relief line at Lower Thames Yard at 1454. This set then travels down to the Lower fiddle yard to have its consist changed as described above. 1233 Newbury – Kensington This up parcels starts from the Lower fiddle yard and uses the revised consist of the 0645 train above. It passes through the up relief line at Lower Thames Yard at 1333 then travels anticlockwise round the layout to the Main fiddle yard to appear later as another working. 1905 Reading – Paddington The above 1155 train consist reappears anticlockwise from the Main fiddle yard and visits Lower Thames Yard up relief line loop between 1927 and 1925 then travels anticlockwise round the layout to the Main fiddle yard to appear later as another working. 2040 Paddington – Reading This leaves the Main fiddle yard clockwise to visit Lower Thames Yard down relief loop between 2215 and 2218 to attach a GUV that has travelled down the branch on a local passenger train. This set then travels down to the Lower fiddle yard to have its consist changed as described above 2300 Oxford – Paddington This up parcels starts from the Lower fiddle yard and uses the revised consist of the 2040 train above. It passes through the up relief line at Lower Thames Yard at 0015 then travels anticlockwise round the layout to the Main fiddle yard to appear later as another working, this time clockwise. In balances in the above workings will be absorbed by adjustments to the Long Distance parcels train workings but I think the above is enough detail for one posting, so I will leave the details of the long distance parcels workings for a later post. Enjoy your modelling and stay safe! Cheers Paul

Never heard of a kit that listed a round tuit as part of the items not supplied? But maybe that's what I need for when the hole in one bit doesn't line up properly with the hole in the bit it is supposed to join to?? Hope you are all well and keeping safe! Cheers Paul

Mick, Surely there's nothing wrong with sitting on the floor, so long as you can get back up again! Mind you, sometimes sitting down on the floor in the confined space of a layout centre well is as difficult as getting back up again! But I second the request to keep the photos coming. Hope everyone is well and keeping safe, only another 6 (ish!) months to go? Take care Cheers Paul

I'm suffering from DMU starvation! With Clive and Gibbo on the trail of Saints (No! not the locomotive class!), DMUs seem out of their heads. Anyone got some pics to fill the gap? Hope you are all well and staying safe? Cheers Paul

Fair comment Mike, My basis for running this train under Rule 1 is that on the layout it provides variety in the trains run and in real life was fed by two trains from Hull and Grimsby, which were important fish landing areas, via Banbury to Oxford, and on to Swindon, Plymouth and Whitland. It will only be 4/5 vans - one for Maidenhead, one for Taplow and 2/3 for Slough. The WTT shows fish flows from Milford Haven, and (I guess!) from Lowestoft via NLR and Acton. So my rule 1 argument is that the only one left on rail was the flow from the North East and that was because of the distances involved! But what I do have to do is work up a story for how the Fish vans got back to Reading, as there is little in the WTTs, Parcel Train Formations, or Marshalling Instructions to help. Cheers Paul

I hope tomorrow to post my setup for Parcels workings on Lower Thames Yard in 1960/2. However, first I need to work out how a total of 4 parcels sets can represent six local and four long distance parcels trains. On top of this I need a siding on the Lower Fiddle Yard for the overnight storage of the inbound 8.10 pm Maidenhead to Reading Parcels to form the outbound 0540 Reading to Princes Risborough Parcels. Other key parcels will be the 0720 Reading to Slough Fish and a daily inbound and outbound Milk Tanks. The returning Fish vans remain a problem, with only the 3,20 am Acton to Reading West class H listed in the Marshalling Instructions as allowed to pick up from Slough, Taplow, and Maidenhead. I have yet to investigate possible attachments to passenger workings or the marshalling instructions for trains heading out of the London Division! Best regards Paul

Thanks for your inputs Guys, but I feel I must point out that, perhaps because a 1964 pic was posted by Mike (only to illustrate the Reading Fish Dock!), the thread has lost sight that I am modelling in the 1960/2 period! My earlier questions quoted a 1959 picture, and its caption. In 1961 WR London Division WTTs there were a number of dedicated Fish trains although a couple were labeled "Q"! So while taking the point that later in the 60s the fish by rail traffic was lost, in 1960/2 it was alive and well, at least sufficient for my portrayal of the Morning Reading to Slough Fish train to be realistic. I may put the odd fish van in perishables trains (other than the returning fish vans off the above train) but that is all. Take care Keep smiling Regards Paul

Knead the dough, who brought bread into the conversation? Or are we going in for domestic science (as I believe it was once called!) as practical help with Coronavirus19? Not sure about that-didn't someone say the other day they couldn't get any flower? Sorry, I'll try to get back to the serious stuff next posting!! Cheers Paul

Thanks Guys, I can now finish off my consists for the morning Fish and the 12.00 Oxford to Paddington Parcels. The Fish will get a BG as its Guards accommodation, and the Parcels will get also get a BG, both in line with my '61 Formation of Local Parcels book! What I now have to do is work out how the Fish BG got back to Reading! (and the fish vans back to Oxford!) So far I have not located in the Formations of Local Parcels any pick up at Slough of a Brake Van (BG), either towards Reading or Paddinton. Next thing will be to look at the Local Coach and Local Diesel Unit workings to see if any of them picked up the Van? The fish vans I suspect went on a number of freights as they were dropped off at a number of stations, not just the terminating working at Slough. Possibly in two stages, firstly to Reading or Didcot and then on to Oxford. Cheers Paul

Here on the edge(?) of civilization on the edge of an urban part of Bedfordshire, wind is also keen! There are, in my opinion too many cars on the road, but in my hour long walk this morning, there were few walkers about. Many dog walkers, folks returning with food shopping, there were also a few cyclists. Only had to cross the road twice to avoid others. Looked from a distance at queue systemsat local Morrisons and small Tesco. Both had people in a queue with good (2m) spacing. This afternoon have posted a couple of versions of Fishy questions regarding the WR in 1960/2 on RM Web, and now catching up on other threads (such as here!) Have also fixed up a tray to allow some modelling in comfort, will hope to post a pic tomorrow. Take care Cheers Paul

Hi All, I am asking these fishy questions here, so that I can get the input of those of you who do not follow my "Lower Thames Yard" thread:- These questions are all in the context of the1960/2 timeframe on the Western Region out of Paddington First Topic:- Around 0745 a train left Reading for Slough. It was hauled by a 57xx and dropped fish vans at the stations along the way. The train was a class C, so I assume it had a Passenger Brake rather than a Toad?. If so, what sort of passenger Brake would have been used? I am not sure if any fish would have been carried, but in some texts the train is referred to as a Fish and parcels train so parcels could have been carried. Second Topic:- In 1959, before the closure of Reading SR Station, there was a parcels (?) bay at the eastern end of Reading Station. On page 82 of " Through the Links at Southall and Old Oak Common" there is a picture taken from the approaching 1.15 Paddington to Weston Super Mare (due to pass Reading 1.48) of a Hall (presumably the Reading East End Pilot) on vans ready to pull them out of this bay. The text describes the bay as a Fish Dock and says they were to be attached to the 12.00 Oxford to Paddington Parcels (at Reading 1.36-2.00). My questions:- 1) What traffic was handled in this bay 2) What sort of vans were used? From what I can see of the vans, which are partly hidden by the Hall, they appear to be BGs? 3) The 12.00 parcels from Oxford was a Hall job? Might the Hall in the pic be the train engine rather than my first idea of the Reading east end pilot? 4) A likely candidate for bringing the vans to Reading is the 06.45 Paddington to Reading parcels, but this arrives at Reading at 10.04, which only allows 2 hours or so for unloading, so is this reasonable? Many thanks for any thoughts? Best regards Paul

The Fish is a class C. So the next question is what sort of passenger Brake would have been used? I am not sure if any fish would have been carried, but in some texts the train is referred to as a Fish and parcels train so parcels could have been carried. I have another related set of questions:- In 1959, before the closure of Reading SR Station, there was a parcels (?) bay at the eastern end of Reading Station. On page 82 of " Through the Links at Southall and Old Oak Common" there is a picture taken from the approaching 1.15 Paddington to Weston Super Mare (due to pass Reading 1.48) of a Hall (presumably the Reading East End Pilot) on vans ready to pull them out of this bay. The text describes the bay as a Fish Dock and says they were to be attached to the 12.00 Oxford to Paddington Parcels (at Reading 1.36-2.00). My questions:- 1) What traffic was handled in this bay 2) What sort of vans were used? From what I can see of the vans, which are partly hidden by the Hall, they appear to be BGs? 3) The 12.00 parcels from Oxford was a Hall job? Might the Hall in the pic be the train engine rather than my first idea of the Reading east end pilot? 4) A likely candidate for bringing the vans to Reading is the 06.45 Paddington to Reading parcels, but this arrives at Reading at 10.04, which only allows 2 hours or so for unloading, so is this reasonable? Many thanks for any thoughts? Best regards Paul

Trying to get back to modelling and planning...…. I have now done the planning of the Up version of the Down expresses I posted about a few days ago. I won't bore you with the details, but it seemed to work. Just need to sort the consists for the four sets. Another set of passenger workings I have started on is what I call the intermediate workings. These comprise the Paddington to Reading, Newbury, Didcot, Swindon, and Oxford trains that I suppose now we might term "Outer Suburban". They were in the main corridor sets whose engines were Halls, with the occasional 61xx. I have to decide whether to portray these by up and down round and round trains, main fiddle yard to lower fiddle yard and return trains, or a mixture of the two! I intend to use my Collett and Hawksworth coaches so the trains will be mainly maroon with the odd Mk1s in blood and custard or chocolate and cream to give a bit of livery variety. I have to also decide whether to include the one or two trains that started from Westbury and Frome but didn't always work directly back to those points. Parcels trains are another area to work up, there being local Paddington to Reading/Didcot/Oxford runs and longer distance ones. I need to remember that there was an evening parcels from Shrewsbury to Paddington that picked up vans from Maidenhead so is worth including. The main problem with all these types of train is fiddle yard capacity, not availability of locos and stock. There will be more on these topics later, but a parting question:- The morning Reading to Slough fish, as the fish vans were passenger rated stock rather than goods rated, would it have had a passenger brake van or a toad? Keep smiling, Only another x weeks (where x varies from 12 to 26 depending on who you listen to!), to go!! Cheers Paul

Thanks Phil! Apologies all, I can't claim corona bottle never mind coranovirus (thank god!). Should've searched for reference before putting fingers to keyboard! Cheers Paul

Just make sure you don't want o take the Dapol signals out to do other work where they might be in the way. Robin or Kevin (sorry Guys, can't remember which of you had the problem!), will tell you they don't like being removed and put back.! Cheers Keep safe Paul