Tallpaul69

I'm not suprised Mike! I realized the train would need a tank because of the reversal at Maidenhead. Knowing Slough had the occasional 56xx, and my having a couple of them, I thought to use one as a bit of variety! Much as I like the 61xx family, you can have too much of a good thing! Maybe I'll put the 56xx on the Morning Fish? Cheers Paul

Hi there, The aspect of the Joint line that I am interested in is the trains that ran from Aylesbury/Princes Risborough/High Wycombe to Maidenhead/Taplow/Slough and Paddington because I am modelling based on the Relief Lines and High Wycombe Branch junction at Maidenhead in 1960/2, which I am calling Lower Thames Junction. I have WTTs and Carriage Working Books that give me a lot of detail but I am missing key details on some of the trains, particularly the locos used. Three particular questions:- A key train is the 0540 Parcels from Reading via Maidenhead to Princes Risborough, whose loco returned around 0900 LE to Slough. I have the times and the formation, but what was the usual loco? As many of the Branch trains were hauled by 61xxs or Panniers, I plan to use a 56xx 0-6-2 for this train but is that right? There was a through evening Freight from Slough to the Birmingham area, but what hauled that? In one of the many books covering the Branch it is suggested that coal to the stations on the branch was dropped off by an evening train. Was this the train from Oxford to Slough or dropped at High Wycombe off a freight from Banbury and taken down the branch by the returning Taplow to High Wycombe freight? Any thoughts or facts would be welcome! Many thanks Paul

Ah, that'll teach me to dive into the middle of conversations! Unfortunately, everywhere seems to change over periods such as 15 years and usually not for the better . Hoe your move goes well. Cheers Paul

Hi Andy, Is that before or after the move to France? Cheers Paul

As we say to the grandchildren when they start scrapping:- Keith, John, play nicely!! Seriously:- While agreeing that John is correct in what he said re the colour, Keith has a point that often in a black and white photo the colour that appears grey would be light/mid grey rather than maroon! Thank god for colour photography, I say. At least with modern photos mostly, not always, we can only argue about the shade, not the base colour. The major exception I find is when the object is in deep shade and many colours then appear black or dark blue! Best regards Paul

Moving to France? That's taking disagreeing with the Brexit result a bit far isn't it?

Agreed Mike, I suspect, but don't know that section C might have covered "Wales" and section D "The Midlands , Birkenhead etc"? Thinking about it, my suggestion above for section D covers a wide area, but there only appears to be the four sections! It will take me a while to extract relevant details from the two documents I have and then relate it to my WTT, so I will hope that eventually I get hold of the remaining three sections! Cheers All, Paul

Hi Grahame If the layout is for your benefit and will not be exhibited, then the only person that needs to be happy with it is YOU!! I, for instance, am more concerned with being able to operate a reasonable representation of the trains that operated around Maidenhead in 1960/2 than I am with the scenic side being a slavish copy of the original. So in my layout "Lower Thames Yard", in a 12x8 room I only have room for the Relief Lines and High Wycombe branch- the Mains have gone! But I am more interested in the Goods, Parcels and local passenger trains than the expresses, so no problem for me. The buildings of the station are used as scenic divides and there are no visible platforms. Other buildings in the area a reduced in size, moved, or omitted. So the goods shed has moved from the yard to adjacent and in front of the Branch platform overall roof. But what is important for me is that it can still be operated in a similar manner to the original . Currently, for instance, I am trying to finalise the position of the signal box. This in reality moved in 1963 from the station end of the yard to between the branch platform and up relief platform lines. My problem is lack of space between the two lines so the signal box may have to stay where it was at the near end of the yard, despite my having bought forward the change from semaphores to colour lights, which was the reason for the box moving (and its design changing!) from 1963 to 1962. Only I will know about this, so I am not worrying about it. So really, I am saying, don't let your compromises spoil your enjoyment of the layout, provided it is built and operated in reasonable accordance with UK railway and building construction and operation norms. Good luck, Best regards Paul

Hi All, I thought that having educated (bored!) you on Parcels and Class 121 operations at Lower Thames Yard, it was the turn of something more exciting(!) So today is the turn of the Express Passenger trains. Now there are not too many of these because the model will be of the Relief Lines and Branch, but I need a few expresses to let me run those that I particularly like and also to provide some variety. So there will be four named expresses and four unnamed rakes, which is all I can accommodate. All the rakes will be of 5 coaches, mainly MK1s but with the occasional GWR built coach in the maroon rakes for variety. The named expresses will run from the lower fiddle yard via the scenic area to the main fiddle yard and return. The down run of one express will be timed to pass the up run of another in the scenic area. So the Down Cornish Riviera will start from the main fiddle yard and pass the Up Cathedrals Express in the scenic area. The Down Cornish Riviera ends up in the siding in the Lower fiddle yard that the Up Cathedrals Express vacated earlier, and the Up Cathedrals Express ends up in the siding that the Down Cornish Riviera vacated earlier. The unnamed rakes, one chocolate and cream and one maroon in each direction will circulate from the main fiddle yard via the scenic area back to the main fiddle yard. A refinement I will get to when I have more experience of running the layout will be that the up and down unnamed rakes will swap over to increase the variety, and may venture to the lower fiddle yard!. One of the tricky aspects is to compose the 5 coach unnamed rakes so that they are not too toy like, but typical of the line's expresses, whilst not peculiar to a particular train, as in 1960/2 there were still a lot of individuality to the rakes of each train. Any suggestions on this would be appreciated! Locos will be a mix of steam and Hydraulic Diesels, probably too many steamers for accuracy in the period, but again with skill at running the layout I will start to change locos on the unnamed rakes between their runs. The named rakes will always get a loco change at each end of their runs, but this will need care, as steamers reaching the buffers in the lower fiddle yard will need to be found a path between the other trains up and down the incline to get to and from the turntable which is beside one end of the main fiddle yard. In the early days of running the layout the unnamed rakes will get multiple runs round the layout one after the other , although unrealistic, to create windows for shunting and dealing with the branch trains! Hoe the above makes sense? Keep smiling Best regards Paul

Nick, What I have from Brian is "British Railways (Western Operating Area) Marshaling instructions for Principal Local Freight Trains -London District" for 1956. it is subtitled :- Formations of Feeding and certain connecting services to the inter district freight trains shewn in Marshalling Instructions Sections A,B,C, and D. So your 1951 item is another piece in the puzzle! I would appreciate a copy or if you have it electronically a file of it. So may I PM you, and we can sort out the mechanics of this? Many thanks Paul

Do pay attention and keep up! I advised I was aware of this resource in a post some 17 hours ago! Never mind, I know your intentions were good. Regards Paul

Now who is showing their age?? But don't give the BBC ideas, they are looking for ways to fill the void left by all sport being cancelled! Still we are probably safe as all the producers and decision makers will unfortunately be far too young to know what you are talking about, and will inflict on everyone more awful channel 3 rubbish and then use that as an excuse to bring back channel 3 and cancel channel 4!! Happy days? Paul

Thanks Mike, Yes I agree, I have managed to get a copy of one thanks to Brian Mc Dermott, which helps with some of the trains , but there is still more info to track down! Regards Paul

Not an Oxford Pilchard?

Many Thanks, I am aware of this resource, but unfortunately the detail I am looking for is not given in the WTTs What I really need is the Fright Train Marshalling Books. Cheers Paul

This Holly sounds a tough cookie if she can deck a Hall, never mind multiple Halls?!! Of course it could be that she was from the Wrenns, or Binns Road but then she would be decking Castles!! Just a thought. Cheers Paul

At least the branch wasn't blocked by a multi truck derailment!! Just be glad he shows some sensible interest, and seems to be able to turn the knobs in the right direction. Cheers Paul

You mean "Halls well that ends well"?- lets hope it does!

I knew there would be a "but" in it somewhere!!

Good idea Keith, the only trouble is a lot of the Newspapers were travelling in the opposite direction to the Fish! Mind you if the fish or the newspapers vans were on the back of a Passenger train which included a Restaurant car, and the two trains collided, then your wish would have come true!! Cheers Paul

Probably because several of the "Fish Trains" were actually "Fish and Parcels Trains" according to the WTTs!!

Good Afternoon All, Hope everybody is ready for the next 4 months-(ish) of staying at home? Little moving currently on the modelling front (I know, nothing new there!). No idea when the guys will be able to work on, baseboards, tracklaying and wiring which was planned to start c2nd April. But hopefully today sees the end of our (my) getting ready phase! This includes home food deliveries set up for the next two weeks, work that needs doing on the paths and fences outside organized (they will have to phone me if they hit a snag-I'm not going outside while they are here!), old conservatory furniture taken away by Charity and new furniture set out, and various internet orders, ordered. A bright ray is that, as much as we love the grandchildren, we have a good excuse not to turn out for grandparent duties, especially as my son is now working from home. So tomorrow I can do some planning of modelling tasks:- Not worried if run out of any parts glues etc. just follow my normal practice and put the offending item with its parts etc. in a clearly labelled box and move on to the next item in the "to do" pile! It may well be such items put aside will wait for a long time even by my standards to get moved on. Also, this week, next week sometime...………, might actually get to taking some pics and putting them up for you all to critique (laugh at!) Meanwhile , keep safe, keep smiling, keep modelling, and above all, don't let the B.....rs get you down!! Cheers Paul

So is Russell more reliable than Larkins? Who knows! Each to their own. If we are modelling late 50s/ very early 60s I think it reasonable to use mainly Late LNER and BR vans with one or two Bloaters particularly as the term is to be found in the Carriage Working Books for 1961! But this is just for variety, and to distinguish a fish van loading in Cornwall from one loading in Hull. Best regards Paul

Evening All, My basis for the comment was two pictures in David Larkin's "BR General Parcels Rolling Stock" published by Bradford Barton in 1978. The upper picture on page 16 show a short type GWR Fish van at Swindon in the early 60s after withdrawal. The caption talks about the fact that the GWR only had two types of Fish van designed in 1919 between Grouping and Nationalisation which replaced earlier wagons. The Lower picture on the same page shows a long type GWR Bloater . The picture is at Theale in 1969 when in Engineers service, but the caption states "The GWR fish traffic came from ports in West Wales and the West Country and both types of van were the mainstay of this traffic until the late 1960s , when they were replaced by the BR "insulfish" vans. Incidentally there is a picture on page 15 of the "INSIXFISH" van! Hope this helps? Cheers Paul

As a type 2 whose wife is a Type 1, I understand your and Peter's situations. My wife has had a Libre for six months now and just got CCG funding approval for another 18 months So on the Omnipod, who is funding that, the NHS or yourself? Peter's situation makes us remember that we really shouldn't moan about the restrictions to cope with Coronavirus. Better a restricted life than the alternative...… Cheers Paul (Tallpaul 69) Trying through "Lower Thames Yard" to achieve a long held ambition to play trains with the WR Main Line.