andyman7

Which presumably makes it the Luddite solution to altering CV29 🙂

Completely agree re Electrostar - can you imagine the clamour for a 3 car set at, say, a £150 price point? The opportunity for the blue era stuff is actually one of the other stated target markets for Railroad - the enthusiast on a budget who wants the kind of models Accurascale, Bachmann, SLW etc are doing but can't afford them. A Hornby Railroad Plus TXS sound model comes in at less than half the price of the competition - that looks to me like a potential market segment.

I am quite tempted by one of these but still have my 1991 Bachmann 46045 which I'm quite attached to. If it had been a full retool I would have capitulated; should these end up being marked down at some point I may yet succumb

The 'weathering' on the Heljan ones was quite variable - some were better than others. It's been sold out for quite a long time now so there will be no direct clash with the new Bachmann model on the shop shelves.

I spotted 25 155 duplicating a Heljan number, actually slight relief in that it helps narrow down the 'must haves'. The 25057 weathered/non-weathered is interesting, I guess it's easier to split a batch down into options than to have a separate number - essentially all versions of 25057 start off the same, but some get the weathering, some get the decoder, some get the fan servo & tinted glazing etc. For the record, I have never purchased any version of Tamworth Castle in any of its celebrity liveries. It's filthy BR Banger Blue all the way for me 🙂

The price point is key but 50, 52 and 60 are all acceptable models in terms of basic dimensions and look; the 26/27/33 would benefit from flush glazing but again useful little models.

The Mk3/Mk4s are in many cases the ones left over with no suitable power cars or DVTs to accompany them. They would shift better if the missing bits were available I'm not so sure Hornby needed to go head to head with Accurascale/Cavalex/Bachmann/SLW, but as @woodenhead says Hornby have a fantastic tooling bank for BR Blue era models at around half the price point of the superdetail guys. I don't think this has been exploited nearly enough

I'll be in the queue for whichever comes first 🙂

The 25/0 needs to be derived from the related Class 24/1 tool set which they cosmetically resemble so I can understand the omission from the rest of the Class 25 family for now - hopefully it will come soon

The statements are indeed useful. What is more questionable is if they are presented from an angle of 'this is a terrible model because...' - that is a subjective opinion. Given that since the 60s models of diesel and electric locos have invariably carried headcode displays which are both fixed and likely as not to be wrong for the train the loco might be hauling, there is a precedent for the displayed lamps to be 'wrong'. And as for the fixed tender tail lamp, the D&E world has been happy to put up with red lights shining from the rear of locos hauling trains for nigh on 20 years - something that only the most recent models allow to be amended.

The front grab rail has more curvature on the 2nd batch of Heljan models for some reason

They are much better these days but early on, Bachmann were pretty hopeless at matching the tools they had to the examples they chose to number. We've conversed before about their almost total inability to pick the right locos for their Class 42 Warship tools. I'm invariably short of plated over boiler grilles and have plenty of unplated grilles I don't need!

Yes, but in a perfect retailer's world they would be steadily selling the stock and successfully restocking with new supplies. What instead happens is they have shelves of (say) 1st class or Brake end coaches they can't sell, but can't order any more of the 2nd class ones that are needed to shift the others as they sold out straight away.

Some really interesting analysis here, especially by @Gallows-Bait. I've always been wary of using personal preference as any kind of objective yardstick about what would sell but even a broad outlook at the general output across Hornby's brands suggests a mismatch between the market and their stock. On the railways side, blue period BR is a strong market now (it's where the BR era steam period was 20 years ago during the last 'golden period') yet as has been noted, there is a complete lack of coaches available even though Hornby have Mk1, Mk2 and Mk3 tooling. There is still a woeful inability to have all the components of a typical train on sale at the same time, and that is a big reason why dealers don't order - they're left with power cars but no coaches or brake ends but nothing else. Even the DRS Mk2s - initially released as two brake ends and single SO that sold out straight away; followed by 4 different SOs bit no Brake Ends as the remainder from the first batch had been flogged off at a discount, so that what should be a really good 'small train' opportunity becomes an ebay hunt at premium prices that accrue neither to dealers nor Hornby. This is the irony of the unsold stock is that there are a fair few items for which there is pent up demand, but no product with which to meet it. I think that the Railroad range can potentially be a real winner for them because they can use that distribution muscle, brand recognition and serve a market/price point that the competition is not placed to serve - but if you wanted to create a working setup it's really quite difficult to assemble something coherent from available stock. However the stock backlog is disposed of, Hornby really needs to overcome making so many mis-steps with regards to future production range and quantities.

Production for commercial gain is what the owners of trademarks are worried about. There's no automatic right for anyone to use trademarked material but if I paint Thomas in Virgin livery for my grandaughter for purely private use I am unlikely to be pursued as there is neither 'loss' to the trademark owner or material 'gain' for me or my family

There was a period from about 1978 to 1990 when the Roy Cross artwork wasn't used or was in some cases amended but Cross's artwork has featured on the classic kits now in original form for around 30 years (obviously there are many kits issued since which have never had a Cross painting to use). What was also happened in some cases was to overpaint the original artwork to reflect changes to the kit markings - this was quite usual with the airliners

The Driving Trailer does not use either X9636M or X9637M. Hornby have never retooled the trailer car bogie design.

The Airfix tools would have been machined for producing a hundred thousand or more models - standard production numbers then. For most of their life they will have been worked at a fraction of the capacity they were designed for. Modern tools are used across much smaller production runs.

In virtually every case it is certain liveries that don't sell out rather than the models as a whole. In the case of AC electrics, TOPS and later era models don't generally end up in the bargain bins, it's the late 60s and steam crossover variants that stick a bit. the CEPS/BEPS were stock disposals by Bachmann. In Hattons style TMC took them on at what was no doubt an advantageous price.

The silver is not meant to cover the whole frame. On the original there is a raised bead around the window; to the inside of this is a polished/bare metal frame in which the window sits. By any measure, at less than £20 each these coaches are a bargain

I've rather gone the other way, with a very strong bias to Bachmann in the past few years as they have covered a lot of D&E models in liveries I like (as opposed to kettles...). Even where they go head to head I like their offerings and their shade of BR Blue really works for me

I don't think that's necessarily true but the focus on the researched project inevitably moves forward in time. I (and a whole cohort of fellow enthusiasts) am fascinated by the 70s railway and spend a lot of time researching the locos and stock of this period. Hornby, though, caters quite significantly for 'trophy' models - A4s, Coronation, LMS Black 5 in blinged-up colours - these have a market that sits alongside the researched hobby. There will be a core in a generations time who look to model with accuracy but I suspect that what will be niche will be modelling the 50s and 60s

The Eastbourne Models and Collector's Centre applied very distinctive white labels to their stock, and these still turn up in seemingly enormous numbers - a lot of stuff must have gone through there! I did visit a couple of times in the 80s, an Aladdin's Cave indeed

They sold through the entire first batch and the second batch have now passed the period where discounting is limited so a few places have them at around 25% off - hardly a fire sale. Looks-wise the Heljan 25 is great - a convincing leap ahead of anything previous, and it made it to market years ahead of revised Bachmann and SLW. So as far as I can see it's been well worth doing, and at £150 it's going to remain a contender. I'm certainly planning to keep the Heljan ones alongside my awaited SLW and Bachmann purchases. As far as the original Bachmann version goes, I did obtain this 25/0 that had been made out of the first release Bachmann 24, and refinished it in BR Blue as one of the few to gain the livery whilst retaining full skirts and original exhaust - the beauty of this being that the skirt hides that hideous false underframe

I think 3D prints might be the way to go as there still seems to be a complete absence of a range of UK streetlamps, the Bachmann Scenecraft ones being the only ones I know of that look British rather than international. There were a number of distinctive designs, especially the CU or Stanton concrete posts which were everywhere at some time but have almost completely disappeared in the last 20 years.