Legend

Harburn Hobbies in Edinburgh seem to have a good line in specially commissioned wagons , so it is possible. Yes they are a bit more expensive but maybe only £2 or £3 more than the norm. I suppose a lot depends on whether you start with an already expensive Bachmann model or a cheaper Hornby/Dapol/Oxford model. It would be interesting to find out from Chris at what point he deemed the final price unacceptable.

Assumes there is a local modelshop. In Glasgow we really don't have one anymore. The excellent Pastimes is great for second hand , but I don't recall him being the first to receive new models from Hornby. Waddles models doesn't seem to have an account with Bachmann or Hornby. So I would be placing an order with Hattons, Hereford or maybe give C&M a try, but what's the difference compared to ordering from Hornby direct , which last time was very efficient? Playing a bit of devils advocate here, clearly you want to support model shops wherever you can, but just demonstrating a flaw in these possible new terms.

Isn't this why Oxford have announced initial Mk3s in these liveries......you don't need a DVT to run them . By combining with Mk1 parcels and restaurant cars you can have an effective train in blue grey and intercity. You do need an 86 or 87 to pull them though...............

But if there are no discounts on pre ordering, what's to stop you from ordering direct from Hornby? It's post free I think. That way you guarantee receiving a model . No incentive to ordering locally, which I thought the newly reformed marketing program was supposed to encourage

I kind of agree with RJS and Piranha. As prices go up, less people buy for sure. However I think you do have to look at the currency movements since Brexit vote. While they may (should) have had some currency hedged, there is no doubt that it will cost them more from their third party manufacturers to source models . I can't see any alternative for them but to raise prices. This is a real reason rather than some reasons Bachmann have magnified to justify 20% pa for the last three years. I do see Piranhas point re 142 . I don't know the price of this as it's never been a model I'm really interested in. Maybe instead of a block 15% increase then it would be better to target some models with higher increases and others with less. This does bring me to the restructuring of range that is required with trainset, railroad items (which probably should include 142) be priced lower and the more highly detailed enthusiast range perhaps priced up (but still with an eye to RJSs point if you price it too high folks just don't buy) . On a specific point I would bring back the Limby HST it is clear the main range model is better but is way too expensive for the general market. Especially with new liveries coming on line VTEC, GWR and forthcoming Scotrail, these could be good sellers .

I hope it can continue on as a blog, maybe with some form of contribution. I've always enjoyed it. I would reintroduce the 200 word limit though. People have to realise that you have to get point over quickly. I'd be surprised if people make it to the end of some of the very long posts, including one today!

This is beginning to make O interesting. I'm thinking Garden here

Assumes Mk3 still in their range

The times they are a changing. Bob Dylan Fools to the left of me Jokers to the right. Here I am, stuck in the middle with you. Stealers Wheel I think some sort of contraction inevitable , as the midwife said. I think semi volume production for trainset market, in so far as that still exists, with low cost( I mean to make) models . Clearly the prices need to be competitive in this market. I've said it before but a Railroad budget priced range of trains people actually see on the railway. HST, 66 and 156 , already in their range but marketed wrongly, I think is way to go. Then high spec enthusiast market , maybe with lower production runs than have hitherto been the case. I think there is a need still to be as competitive as possible, but clearly the enthusiast market is not as price sensitive as the train set one , and you can probably get away with a larger margin per unit. I think that's what Bachmann have been doing, but at the extreme end . Hornby look to be a bit more realistic. In either case the model here is sell less but at higher margin, hopefully as I said with realistic margin aspirations, or you'll just hack off the punters and make the market even smaller , as folk look to value for money and find they can easily get more enjoyment elsewhere Tricky times

Yep , even to me, one of the most vociferous against price increases, this is an acceptable reason. It's simples ! If you pay for goods and services in USD it now costs a lot more . If we are talking price increases around 15% Mark then I think Hornby are passing on a fair amount. I do contrast this with Bachmann whose 20% pa over the last three years based on supposed labour cost increases (it's true there are increases but not to account for 20% on final selling price)is just outrageous and has no such firm foundation

Thomas the Tank Engine , surely!

You've got to wonder who thought this would be a good idea? I thought I'd been magically transported to April 1st. It's up to them of course, but what a waste of resources. Never seen this mentioned in any poll. On the other hand a working turntable.......

And can we just point out Bachmanns price increases were pre Brexit in fact about 20% pa for three years. Awaiting next years announcements with interest. Also as Wicor says Hornby still in general below Bachmanns prices

I appreciate that crowd funding means you have the right to get a locomotive, but what happens beyond that really isn't of concern to you. As had been stated the contract you had has been fulfilled on delivery of your model. Actually to stop someone from making later releases (at a higher price , so therefore not at crowd founders advantageous terms) is more selfish as you are depriving other modellers of the model. Suppose you have no need for a 92 now , but in three years time you do.Have you got to wait for another crowd funding initiative? I look at crowd funding as simply being a way of funding new models, not restricting models to those who initially funded it.

Quite. If someone is showing plans at a show I think you can regard it as announced. Seems to contradict with the not announcing it until ready for market. Unless it's imminent, of course

Oh dear, what a shame. I do feel for both manufacturers who will have invested a lot of time in this bringing what they thought would be an unlikely to be duplicated model to market. But surely under crowd funding if sufficient numbers are reached then the model should go ahead . Presumably it's wise to build in a provision for people who may default after paying the initial deposit. It might be wise to increase that provision here. But if, taking this into account, sufficient numbers are reached then why would you not go ahead in either gauge. Something I find puzzling. If the alternate supplier has not announced his 92 in "n" or "OO" yet then how do people know to cancel their existing orders with DJM? I'm not sure why but if there's been an orchestrated effort to let some people know there is an alternative on the go , but not inform others then I find that a bit distasteful. Surely the other party should have made an announcement when Dave launched the crowd funding initiative. I appreciate they only want to announce when they've got something ready for market, but clearly there had been an important development here. If I read these threads correctly then DJM is the only one to have secured Caledonian Sleeper rights , so would that not make this the most popular model and therefore the one most likely to go ahead? I think Dave is right, however, once approached a we will do an "n" gauge one and you do an "OO" one would be construed as anti competitive carving up the market. Now standing back from this you might say this is only model railways and therefore not as important as something more mainstream,but it is the principle that counts and where does trivial end and important begin . Overall I do feel for both parties. I sense the frustration with Dave which maybe led to him unwisely revealing the other manufacturers plans, but then faced with cancelled orders I think I'd be quite annoyed too. Can I suggest to avoid this in the future, manufacturers look at producing something Scottish. There seems very little chance of any duplication there! I'll get my Caley 812 0-6-0 yet!

Where's that moggy when you need it! Agree exceptional value. Well done Oxford

Is this the actual price(I hope it is) or just Hattons estimate? Hattons have form on this. Is it confirmed elsewhere?

It's not a Pendolino. This issue is class 220/221/222 Voyagers and Meridians

Hoping for a Scotrail version in due course. Depends on price though, but Oxford have proven to be somewhat more realistic than others in price and margin expectations . High hopes

Not that simple though. My Gaugemaster units have inertia or simulated acceleration built in. So does this mean I can use coreless motors or not. What happens if I do ? Does the motor burn out or is it erratic running. I do think it's time someone gave definitive information . It does seem to be primarily DJM that's using these, although I note Bachmann have it in their latest Ivatt 2MT (but not V2?). Shouldn't they be obliged to give guidance other than the usual bland "not suitable for use........." I think Gaugemaster may also provide some guidance on this. After all it's in their interests to sell more controllers.

That's it official then , an H class. Good for Hornby , the announcement refers to the events of the last year which they say will defer the 2017 range into the second half of the year. Quite understandable. Happy for all those folks wanting an H and it's good to see Hornby coming back on line. Probably a good subject too with all the Southern modellers saying they want one. Just hope Hornby remember there are some of us North of the Thames and even some of us in the barren wastelands north of Hadrians Wall . They are promising future announcements........

Full speed inspiration sounds like one of these generic items that's neither something or nothing. Not so sure about BR liveries either. On the other hand quite fancy the HST Masterclass. I'll have a browse to see if worthwhile Why are they called "first reviews" of GNR 4-4-0 and sound 108. Are you going to review them again? They have already been reviewed in at least the Railway Modeller

Agree with yourself and Wombatofludham, a range of L&NWR items would be good. The only issues I see are they are mainly black (although an LMS Crimson Claughton would be lovely), not many of them made it to BR days. I don't necessarily agree , but most mainstream manufacturers believe this will restrict sales. Have a look at the latest Bachmann mag on why they don't make a Highland Railway Clan as an example of this . The main advantage of a Caley 812 is its colourful and there is a preserved example still existant. Coupled to them running well into late BR steam era then it seems to be a more attractive proposition to manufacturers . At least I hope so.

Caley 812 class 0-6-0 Loco. They could do it Caley Blue, LMS Black , early and late BR . There's a preserved one on Strathspeys line. It's a gorgeous colour scheme, something different . Could follow on from their Deans Goods. Failing that NBR J36. Could tie in with their NBR wagons But if they want to go big in model railways it has to be something more mainstream . In modern image that's Class 66, a sprinter dmu (156perhaps) and an HST power car to go with their mk3s On steam , well theres not a lot of low hanging fruit , so their going to have to go in and pick off old or un available models from the big 2 . 43xx and Manor are obvious choices. Bring it in at a good standard and lower price than Bachmann (shouldn't be hard) then they will be succesfull.