buffalo

Yes, I'm fairly sure it's a Duke. The first two digits on the bufferbeam are almost certainly '32' but I'm not certain about the other two. The presence of these numbers makes the photo later than about 1905. Nick

Jason's comment was a bit misleading. Perhaps he meant that Templot doesn't do all the work for you. It is quite possible to make any type of slip with the current Templot. Essentially, you create a diamond crossing and add switches and the linking slip rails, though you have to do quite a bit of work to achieve this. First time can be something of a nightmare, but after you've done it once it's fairly straightforward. Video of creating a single slip here with Templot2 and an old page about doing it with earlier versions here. There's also plenty of discussion on the Templot Club pages. Nick

Very sorry to hear of your decision, Julia. I don't comment on many of your entries here but I can safely say that I've enjoyed them all and been inspired by many of them. I'm sure you have good reasons but at least RMweb provides a single place to find much interesting material. I've bookmarked your external blog but I'm afraid that, whether through idleness or forgetfulness on my part, I rarely get around to looking at many of the excellent individual blogs that are out there. Nick

Sorry to hear about your misfortunes, Dave. I'm only too well aware of the effects of lack of movement in the arms on modelling progress. Nevertheless, you've done a fine job with those figures. Get well soon, Nick

The wagons may belong to a lime works but that doesn't necessarily mean they were used to transport lime. They are more likely to be used for incoming coal supplies for the lime kilns or, in this case, outgoing limestone from the associated quarries. Another possibility is 'agricultural lime' used to improve acidic soils. This was usually crushed limestone rather than real lime and so might be transported in open wagons. A fine pale creamy ballast would do for this, but don't fill the wagons as, like other stone, it would be more dense than coal. Real lime, quicklime and hydrated lime, produced in lime kilns are rather unpleasant substances that might be produced in various sizes from a fine powder up to large lumps but it needs to be kept dry, especially quicklime. If transported in opens it would need to sheeted and is more likely to bagged and transported in vans. Nick

One point for identifying the rail in the photos, Ray, but none for the rest Modern flat bottomed rail in the UK is normally clipped to baseplates. Spikes were widely used in the USA, but are not a common feature of British standard gauge lines. As to Rocket on chaired rails, you must be thinking of a replica, not the original. I believe the L&M originally had wrought iron fish-belly rails on stone pads, though wooden sleepers were used over Chat Moss. Both flat bottom rails, known as Vignoles rail, and Bullhead were used from the late 1830s though bullhead became more popular once wrought iron could be replaced by steel made by the Bessemer process in the 1870s. All generalisation, of course, because the history of 19th century rail profiles is rather complex Nick

You'll find a bit more on types of rail in the Maggs book. On p155 it mentions 90lb/yd rail being laid from 1934, flat bottom at Newton Meadows in 1959 and welded rail on the up line at Kelston in 1963. Nick

It looks like the Ultrascale wheels may still be available. Nick

Yes, it's from Col. Yolland's report delivered on 2/8/1869. I don't know the details of Midland rail at this time, but 20' lengths of 80lb rail sounds right, the GWR were using lengths of this weight and up to 32' at this time. Their 44'6" panels were not introduced until 1898. A photo of Bitton station c1910 on p49 in the Maggs' book that Andy received a few days ago shows a track panel with 11 or 12 sleepers, so probably in the 30-36' range. On the ballast, I agree with Brian that a carboniferous limestone was most likely, at least in the 20th century, but other materials including some Pennant could have been used in the early days. Given that the cuttings to the north of Bitton station were through Pennant layers, there would have been small rubble as well as building stone available from here. That said, I don't recall seeing Pennant crushed to a suitable size for ballast and I suspect from memory of how it splits it would be a little too angular in shape. Nick. edit to correct a date....

Ah, the wonders of GWR class naming. There is really no such thing as a 41XX or 51XX class. All those you list at Barry were members of the 5101 class (5101-10, 5150-99 and 4100-79), not to be confused with the 5100 (originally 3100) class (5100 and 5111-49). Do tell us how you identify the different steel used in the boiler plates of the 6100s from a photo Nick

No, the type of oil lamp top you have there is a permanently fixed cover and ventilator. The actual lamp and hole in the roof is inside this cover and is reached through a hinged lid. See, for example, here. Some railways apparently did have a form of oil lighting where the whole thing was removed, but the lamp covers did not look like that. I can't find an example right now, but here is a GNSR model example. Your flatter example in the drawing looks more like an gas lamp top, though those used on the Cambrian look to me to have had a somewhat taller central part. The give away, of course, is that such coaches will have gas tanks underneath and piping to each lamp along the roof. Nick

Hi Jonathan, I'm fairly certain about the pennant, but the quoins, etc. are more of a guess based on local knowledge. They could perhaps be sandstone, but they are of a very pale creamy colour. There are limestones in the area that are only suitable for rubble walling, but remember that Bitton is only a few miles from Bath and the Cotswold scarp where there are plentiful supplies of oolitic limestones which are eminently suitable, and widely used, for such puposes. Queen Square station, later Green Park, at the end of the line is like most of the City of Bath built entirely of the stuff. Nick

I thought I'd seen a post suggesating tht the local stone is a red sandstone, but it seems to have disappeared. Whilst there are red sandstones to be found in the Bristol area, most of the buildings in Bitton are either limestone or pennant sandstone. IIRC, and it is a long time since I was there, the station buildings are pennant which is a grey/blue/green colour, with pale limestone quoins and windows. Nick

Axles? The wheels are on stub axles that fit into a plastic muff that includes the gear. I assume you mean the muff has split? Nick

Funny, I'd always called that the expansion link. I thought the crank in question was the eccentric crank which is attached to the crankpin of the driven axle. So named because it provides the same motion as the alternative eccentrics used with some early forms of outside Walschaert's and the eccentrics on the driven axle used with inside Walschaert's and several other types of inside gear. The issue was, I thought, which way these lean relative to the wheel centre. Nick

In that it has three compartments and four wheels, I suppose you might argue a resemblance to the first class No 1 but, frankly, that's as far as it goes. A photo of this coach appears in several books, e.g. Robin Atthill's The Somerset and Dorset Railway, Colin Maggs' Highbridge in its Heyday. Like the preserved four compartment No 4, it had wider double panels between compartments and wider panels between windows and ends. From this, I suspect the 'model' is somewhat too short. Obviously, we have different views of what 'resemblance' means, Neil. Nick

Yes, Jon, you made the right choice. Who cares about those folk who proudly tell us they don't read blogs. It's their loss. Nick

Yes, a very neat conversion. One point, though, you do not need to create a new blow each time you post. Your 3F, coaches and this are all in separate blogs and will be a devil for for folk to track down. Just create a new entry in a single blog each time you post. Nick

I don't think so, it was the norm on tenders built before about 1888/9 which have coal rails curved down to meet the top of the flare well behind the 'cutout'. All of these had simple vertical handrails at the front of the side sheed. The types where the coal rail is continued forward and bent down to form the vertical handrail, whether inline or outrigger, are mostly the later types without the cutout, though there are a few examples, e.g. the tender behind No 9 Victoria as I mentioned earlier. On the other hand, it does appear from some photos that the cutout may provide more clearance around the handbrake and scoop handles. Nick

Haven't we discussed this before, maybe in the Bachmann 7F topic or elsewhere? IIRC, the conclusion was that they could be made to fit, perhaps as Mike describes, but the only photos show 7Fs not quite fully on the turntable. Elsewhere there a photos and accounts of 7Fs on Bath-Templecombe runs turning at Evercreech and proceeding tender first to Templecombe. Maybe it was possible but, at least some of the time, it was avoided. Nick

It's been discussed a few times before as a quick search would show. The short answer is it bears no resemblance to anything. For the longer answer, see here and here. Nick

No, boilers and tanks on these were interchangeable. The GWR produced new boilers for some of the 1392s in 1895 and the new boilers built for the 1361s in 1910 were of the same external dimensions, though had internal differences. The latter type was subsequently also fitted to 1392s. The saddle tanks fitted to 1392s in 1883 were said to have a capacity of 840 gallons, though by the time the 1361s were produced, both were listed as 800 gallons. 1392 was withdrawn at the end of 1906 so, perhaps, there was a spare tank available when the 1361s were built? Nick

He did, but his caption is misleading. He shows a drawing of 850 class No 1925 with "G W R" on the tanks and says that it was "...applied only for the making of a film in 1947...", and that there is "...no record of any other of these saddle tanks carrying the Company's letters or initials." The word "these" suggests he was talking only about 850s. However, photos in GWRJ 25 show 1925 at Didcot in 1938 and 1939 with GREAT WESTERN and 2007 similarly lettered at Didcot and on the Lambourn branch in 1936 and 1938, but not lettered when in the works in 1931. Both probably come into the category of shed pets, and it is interesting to note the use of the lettering in the shirtbutton era. Of course, none of this helps with the 1361s, other than perhaps to illustrate that shed pets might be decorated in strange ways. Nick

Hi Duncan, Yes, indeed. Looking back at what I wrote, I realise I said something quite different from what I meant. When I said the flare and step cutouts "lasted until", I should have said something like "were original build features until". As you say, they lasted very much longer than that. The information with Martin Finney's 2500 kit suggests that lot A38 of 1899-1900 was the first with straight flares, steps and widening at the front, though I don't have the equivalent information for the 3000 to hand. I'm not aware of any specific evidence of these changes during rebuilds and I very much doubt whether the flairs were ever altered except perhaps in the most extensive rebuilds. Most of the widened versions seem to have been built in that form. I have noticed a few examples of the early types with flair and step cutouts where the coal rails are extended forward to form "outrigger" handrails as on the widened types. Here the plate appears to have only been extended at the very front where it meets the handrail. One example is behind 2-2-2 No 9, Victoria, in 1904 (photo in Roger Carpenter's An Edwardian Album of GW Passenger Classes, an excellent source for views of tenders, at least the front parts). Nick

I'm inclined to agree with Mike that the tender behind 2322 is a 2500 gallon type simply by comparing wheel diameter with wheelbase. That would certainly be quite normal for a Dean Goods, though many carried older Armstrong tenders for many years. Some 3000 gallon tenders were used, but were less common. The issue of 'rivet lines' is interesting. What we are seeing is the effect of a pattern created during cleaning. Perhaps the cleaners could see the rivets, but we can't as Dean era tenders were normally flush rivetted, in contrast with Earlier Armstrong and later Churchward types. The cutout at the front of the tender flare and the curved cutout in the front steps are both early features which lasted until the end of the 1890s. Thereafter the straight flare and and straight steps appear, but not always together. At about the same time, or soon after, many new builds incorporate a widening of the running plate at the front and the handrails are curved outwards. This was to match the wider cabs that were beginning to appear on the new 4-4-0s, Krugers, Aberdares, etc. Some had raised footplates to match the higher footplates of the 4-4-0s. Dean tenders all had narrower bodies than the later Churchward types. Later, some engines were provided with flared cab side sheets to match narrower cabs with wider tenders. The last of the Dean type tenders built 1902-3 show many minor transitional features. For example the sandboxes were re-positioned away from the footplate into the entrance to the coal space and a fire iron tray appears along the left hand side. These also had the round dome and separate filler cap unlike earlier ones with the all-in-one D shaped cover, or just a round filler cap on those without scoops. Before I forget, one other feature that moves around. There is a good side view of 2811 in the RCTS part 9 to match your first photo. It shows the Dean tender with a transverse vacuum tank immediately behind the front wheels. A similar type is shown in figure 195 of Russell vol 2, behind No 40. Nick