justin

Does anyone have the latest renumbering for this stock? I travelled in a set numbered 49116,48146,48147,48148 a few days ago but these aren't listed in the thread.

Are you sure about Port Talbot? The steelworks at Briton Ferry and Llanelli definitely received tenders from Woodhams but I have never heard of Port Talbot having any. There is information on these tenders at Briton Ferry and Llanelli in the Industrial Railway Record no 232 March 2018.

Thanks for everyone's input. It does seem to be a tricky one. I have recently joined the LNWR Society and have remembered they also have a forum for questions. At present I'm waiting for approval of my login to use the forum. If there is a definitive answer I'l pass it on. Otherwise I think contacting the Bahamas Society is a good idea. In the meantime if anyone else does have the answer feel free to contribute. Its amazing how once you start a model you realise there are all sorts areas where details are very unclear.

Can anyone tell me, or provide photos or drawings, of what happens to the coal rails fitted to the bunkers of various Webb 2-4-2 and 0-6-2T locos at the point where the bunker rises up at the back. Were they continuous across the inside of the back of the bunker or did they stop at the edge of the bunker as it increased in height at the back. Below is a photo of the preserved coal tank which hopefully demonstrates the area I'm interested in. The top rail on this loco does appear to stop rather than carry across. I really want to know about the arrangement on the 5'6" 2-4-2T locos but general information is welcome.

That looks pretty convincing. Did you have a drawing that confirmed the dimensions or was it a case of what looks right probably is right?

That’s interesting. The tender Terry Rippingale bought for 5967 was definitely in departmental use. Do you have any photos of it at Blaenavon. The only ones I can find on the internet show it without buffers at the front but these were taken afternoon 2000 so they could have been removed at some stage in preservation.

A couple of further points. The frames of tenders with 61001-37 had no rear guard irons and the coping plate at the top was fitted in such a way that there was a lip all along the outside of the tank side where it overlaid the lower part of the tank. Finally depending on what period you are modelling remember that the dividing plate between the back of the coal space and the water filler area increased in height and moved approximately 2 foot further forward in the 1950s. There are photos of the side of the tenders showing the lip in Yeadon’s Register volume 6.

Just had a look at RCTS Locomotives of the LNER Part 2B and choosing exactly the right tender seems a bit of a nightmare. 61000-11 had a riveted (flush riveted I think) rather than welded body, disc wheels and the tender tool boxes were placed low down near the foot boards. The were other small differences from other tenders as to where the fireman’s tools were stored.. These locos retained these tenders throughout their life. 61012-37 had similar tenders except the front plate was redesigned to take account of the higher floorboards of the B1 cab. The fireman’s tools went in a tunnel on the left hand side of the tender. They had a large and small toolbox in the position shown in the photo of the model and prototype in the earlier posts. Locos up to 61019 retained this type of tender throughout their working life.

The RCTS book on BR Standard Steam Locomotives Volume 1 lists 70004/5/27/41 as receiving plain green though it acknowledges that the list is probably incomplete, as confirmed by the photo of 70015 in Steamport’s link above. See also the photo below from Flickr of 70038 in July 1967 at York. The RCTS don’t list it as plain green, which is technically correct, but there is only lining on the cab. All the other lined areas, boiler, running plate and tender are plain green.

Another possibility, and it is only supposition, is that the outside of the bend is where bank erosion takes place and the river was very close to the railway embankment on the bend on the right, so it would remove the risk of undermining the embankment over time by realigining the river. The article linked below doesn't mention any specific work east of Bath as part of the post 1960 flood alleviation programme https://historyofbath.org/images/BathHistory/Vol%2007%20-%2009.Buchanan%20-%20The%20Floods%20of%20Bath.pdf

Just in case these are of interest before I throw them in the bin I have the following HD Insulating Tabs ( two envelopes, some in both envelopes) HD Switch Grouping Rods packaging (no contents) HD Transformer Fuse Packaging (contains one fuse though I'm unsure if it is HD related) HD Moulded Wheels box (contains a number of HD metal wheels) See photos All I would like is the cost of postage. Happy to split items. Justin

I read in the most recent Railway Herald that Pacers have been reintroduced in South Wales. Can anyone give any details of which units are in use and if they are on particular diagrams. Justin

I have seen a picture of one partly cut up at Woodhams of Barry and the ballast weight was concrete.

The tender that 4942 arrived at Didcot with was different from the tender it had when it arrived at Barry. The GWS bought another tender from Woodhams for 4942 and left her original tender at Barry when they took the loco in 1974.

In the 1960's several privately owned preserved locomotives were used on trains (mainly, but not exclusively, railtours) on the BR network. Does anyone know anything about the operating agreements and how it was organised? Where were the individual locos based in this period? Privately owned locomotives I have identified so far are. (I'm not including locos that were part of the National Collection at this time) GWR 4555 2-6-2T 6435 0-6-0PT 7029 Clun Castle 4-6-0 I think the link with the locos above was complete or partial ownership by Patrick Whitehouse 1420 0-4-2T 1466 0-4-2T Owned by the Great Western Society 4079 Pendennis Castle 6998 Burton Agnes Hall Owned by the Great Western Society SR 55 (Terrier 32655) 473 (E4 32473) 488 (Adams radial 30583) These three all ran on BR when based on the Bluebell Railway in 1963 LNER 1247 (GNR 0-6-0ST 68846) Owned by Captain Bill Smith 3442 (K4 61994) Owned by Viscount Garnock 4498 (A4 60007) Owned by Sir Nigel Gresley Society 60009 (A4) Owned by John Cameron 60019 (A4) Owned by Geoff Drury 4472 (A3 60103) Owned by Alan Pegler Attached are some photos of the locos in this period LNER A4 class 4-6-2 no. 4498 leaves Edinburgh Waverley on the At Work On The LNER railtour on 20.8.1967 Torpantau with 4555 and 3690 on the SLS Last Train to Brecon railtour on 2.5.1964 LNER A3 no. 4472 LNER A3 Flying Scotsman at Manchester Central 18.4.1964 60009 LNER A4 with the tender of Black 5 no. 44997 on left at Perth shed 25.3.1967

Thanks. It was the wood that confused me. I didn't consider wooden raves.

I'm not sure if you are referring to the 2-6-0s, 4-6-0's or possibly both. I doubt there is any definitive source for this information. I would suggest trawling sites like Rail Online or the RCTS photo archive to see what crests appear on locos. Time consuming but probably the best way to answer your question.

I'm not sure if my eyes are deceiving me but there appears to be an unusual wagon behind this Fowler tender at Barry in 1982. It has tall steel ends and what appears to be a long planked wooden body and appears to be an open wagon rather than a van> Any suggestions?

Attached is part of a scan of a recently acquired slide stamped April 1982. The Collett 4000 gallon tender is marked as sold with 5972 Olton Hall. What intrigues me is there are ordinary buffers at the footplate end of the tender. I have only seen this with tenders taken into departmental service. However apart from DS70183, the LBSC tender used as a water tank, I wasn't aware that Woodham's bought any tenders from BR other than those that came with locomotives. I did wonder if the new owner had done it to facilitate movement but it doesn't look like they have been newly added and it doesn't seem that likely anyway. The front of the tender is facing north and the only locos with 4000 gallon tenders that came into Woodhams facing that way were 4942, 5043, 6023 & 6024. The tender from 5043 was sold as a steel works ingot carrier while 6023 & 6024 left with the same tenders they arrived with. This leaves 4942 which did leave with another loco's tender but that doesn't explain the buffers on this tender. The only other information I have is from other photos I have seen that show that at one stage the number 2911 was painted just below the bottom edge of the tank of this tender. Can anyone say if this is a departmental tender or knows what happened to the tender that was with 4942?

I have now loaded the picture onto Flickr so, for completeness, here is the whole image.

Thanks to everyone for their input, and Blandford 1969 for the initial information. The chalked dates seen inside are presumably maintenance dates for the battery. The whole date is not legible but the last figures are 67 which would tie in with the loco's withdrawal date of 7th May 1967.

Can anyone tell me what was accessed through the door in the rear of the bunker on the BR Standard 4 tank locos? I have never noticed it until I scanned a negative recently. Crop of the image attached which shows 80151 at Barry.

I've spent a bit of time looking into these recently and have a few questions 1. What is the device bolted between the two axles closest to the plough for in the photos below. I think it might be to fit a scraper to remove snow and ice from the third rail but how was it fitted? 2. Has anyone got pictures of ADS70226 at the Great Central Railway? I am aware of several sightings on departmentals.com and ontrackplant.com but have never seen a picture. 3. Are there any original BR drawings of these vehicles in existence (as against modellers drawings)? 4. I think the plough was identical to that used with steam locomotives. Can anyone confirm this and tell me what type of plough it was?

The GWR engine record cards are at the National Archive at Kew. Definitely paper records with no electronic copy available yet. The GWR records are in number order. Record cards for many locomotives that made it into BR service are grouped into folders based on the year of withdrawal so it is helpful to know these dates before you go. https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/

Here is an example on Flickr of the BR1B tender with the divider in place on a Southern Region Std 4 2-6-0.