Russell Saxton

I have seen at least two, one by Gavin Morrison of D25 and another on Flickr of a split box one either 25 or 26 but not IDed. I have these shots but can't post here. happy to send you scans though. Very, very rare to see one, I can swear to only two with the possibility of 100 which I am sure I saw myself but all the evidence says not. But I am sure I saw it.

D5026 was also BSYP. I have photo proof and it ran until 1970!

The class numbers came out in 1968 though and the TOPS numbers not till 1973.

Sorry, I meant to say class 12s. Tut tut, you don't seriously imagine i knew of only two blue class 11s...

Me and Muttlley have had hours of fun with this stuff. Hows about; At least 2 Class 20s with GFYE one end and GSYP the other (8005/70) Green Deltic with arrows (9010) Two blue class 11s Two 2 tone green 27s What we havenot so far unearthed is a good shot of a GFYE 45 (got loads of 44s and 46s)...or of 31294 green...

Has anyone got a shot of 24110 in green?

there were several of these, 6921/32/50 off the top of my head but a few others.

Rumour has it that D5068 had a reversed arrow on one cab door, photos anyone?

Got mine today. I shan't spoil the suspense too much for those who have yet to read it but it can do no harm to say this much. First of all it is NOT just a reissue of the old 1970 classic. I have both and can compare like for like and whilst it is broadly the same it is also very much a new book which won't hurt the value of the earlier pressing. The preface is completely new for a start. There are fewer shots, 228 versus around 280 in the 1970 edition, and maybe 20 or so are totally new, so perhaps 70 have gone, Odd thing is, you don't miss them which maybe says they shouldn't have been there. In fact the new edition seems to have MORE shots somehow, even though there are less. Some of the old shots have been resized, usually bigger but a few are smaller, mostly this works in both cases and the old shot of the WD on the Forth bridge in it's new size is simply brilliant, but I have to say a couple of my personal favourites have suffered. That's just a niggle though, almost always the results have been to dramatically improve. So is it better-can such a classic be improved upon? Got to say, yes, I think it can and it has been. The 1970 version is a masterpiece but the 2012 version is better, not radically different or anything but somehow just..better. if Colin Gifford's style is your thing, get this book straight away.

I am told mine has been sent and will arrive by wednesday.

I went to Colin Gifford's show in Stevenage in Jan 2009 and did not take my collection of his books because I thought it would be sad. But everyone else had. How I wish I'd taken mine now....

Back on Amazon with a release date of August.

I could, yes. But it was at £6 with about 2 days left. I paid £80 for my copy so I thought if i could get anopther for that little I'd be well advised to do so. The new edition is different to the old so whilst, yes, it will reduce the value, it won't be by all that much.

Hmmmm. Logged onto Amazon and my order has vanished. I've heard nothing.

I've had no email and I pre-ordered it. Odd. Colin is very much still alive and very much in possession of his collection and very keen to see it is not 'misused' after his death. As an aside, an original 1970 copy went for just £20 on ebay last week. I have it but planned to buy another and sell it on for a small mark up to pay towards my new book. Only Ebay didnt tell me the auction had nearly ended.....

Would of and and should of.

The Harwich-Manchester wasn't the same stock every day, I often recorded the stock as it passed me (well, tried, it was usually doing 75mph or more and the buffet changed most days-by this time about 1981 it had long been a mark one)

Apparently will be out in September or so. According to ian Krause, about 70 shots have been removed and 15 to 20 new ones put in and the quality of the scans is breathtaking.

Yes that's true. It was further north than Avenue.

As was said, I think it would be reasonable to assume you could see any March, Tinsley or even York or Immingham 31 in the west midlands. Coke did come (among other places) from Avenue at Hasland, Derbyshire which was just in the ER and i'd expect Tinsley to provide the power but it could have been Toton or even Westhouses, Barrow Hill or Shirebrook using outstabled locos. I lived in the late 60s/early 70s on the erewash valley line and we saw lots of 31s on coal, coke etc and they were more often than not from March.

As far as I know all blue locos excepting the early experiment D5578 had standard asymmetrical numbers. All locos repainted up to at least spring 1971 had cabside arrows and bodyside numbers Go here http://grahame910.fotopic.net/ And there are shots of many locos in blue, GFYE and GSYP. None of 5552 sadly but there is one of D5649 the first (by some margin) Rail Blue 31.

Hi Phil, got the PM. I dont know exactly what date you were planning to model but if we look at the 1968-72 period that should cover most bases. If I list the locos, allocation according to the 1969/70/1/2 locosheds and livery that should help. 1969 5520-9 March, 5535 WR, 5539 WR, 5543 Norwich, 5547 Finsbury park, 5551/2/5/6/9/62 Immingham, 1970 5528 had gone to Old oak, 5543 now Tinsley, 5547 now Immingham, rest as was. 1971 5551/2/5/6/9/62 all now Tinsley, rest as was 1972 5520-2 now Holbeck, 5525 Stratford, 5529 Gateshead, 5547 March, 5551/2/5/6 back to Immingham, 5559 Thornaby, 5562 Immingham Those dates are dec 68, nov 69, nov 70 and October 71 respectively. Liveries may prove to be more difficult to tie down exactly as Im still wading through piles of gen for 31s. Only one 31 made it to TOPS numbering in green and that was 5827 which became 31294. It was renumbered 16/2/74 and went into works on 6 April so ran for a just a few weeks in traffic. I have never seen a single photo of this loco and would dearly love to so if anyone has one...... the second to last was 5818 which was renumbered 31286 at its general overhaul in April 1974 but never ran in green as 31286. Photo in june 1974 modern railways. 31s wore a multitude of liveries. All received yellow panels on green and had D prefixed serif numbers. Rail blue started in autumn 1966 with D5649 and from early 1967 many green locos received FYE, many also had arrow symbols applied and the numbers were a mixture of serif and asymmetrical stles. D prefixes were dropped from sept 68 and all rail blue repaints after lacked them, many previous repaints lost them also. Up to 1971 blue locos had cabside arrows and bodyside numbers, thereafter they were given cabside numbers and a central bodyside arrow and all got this by 1975, a few running in TOPS in the old style. If we take jan 1 1970 as a reference point, at that time about half the class were blue and most (not all) green locos were GFYE, some with lions and some arrows. On 1/1/70 the skinheads 5521/8/35/39/47/52 were all Rail Blue in the old style with cabside arrows and bodyside numbers, the rest were GFYE with the possible exception of 5526 for which i have no clue! It was blue by 1971. All lost the D if they ever had it. 5551/62 had lion emblems, the former with asymmetrical numbers and mno d, the latter with d prefixed serif numbersthe others as far as I am aware had double arrows on green. dates to blue 5543 Some confusion-my records say still green 4/2/70 but also early blue with D-both cant be correct! I shall check further. 5552 Blue early on by July 1968 early style of course with a d which may have been dropped later. 5555 Blue early style without a d by summer 71, green beforehand 5556 late green survivor as late as July 1973, GFYE of course and latterly with asymmetrical no D numbers. I dont know when it got these. Hope this lot helps, happy to go into more deatil if you need it.

Done some inconclusive research. Assuming the date July 1971 to be correct, it isn't 4,5, 9 or 10 as the first two were blue and the latter two had different long grilles. That leaves 1,2,3,6,7 or 8. Its not 3 as that had a green roof and a stripe showing through the paint, besides, it was SYP until aug 72. I dont think its 2 or 8 as both were lined and I have no report to say either were ever GFYE which means nothing of course. 7 was SYP till 1972 so unless the date is wrong it isnt that. Which leaves 1 and 6. I strongly suspect its D6 as its easy to confuse 6 and 8 serif numbers from a distance. If it was D8 the last gen I have of it as green was RO June 71 and it was reported blue by them in September so july 71 seems unlikely. But-its possible..... My money is well and truly on it being D6 though.

Pretty sure it isnt D8. I shall research and report.

Sean is a great bloke and has sent me lots of accurate detailed gen.