Mikemeg's Workbench - Building locos of the North Eastern & LNER

[mikemeg]

LONDON ROAD MODELS LNER G5

 

With a few more details added, yet another of those 'checking' photos.

 

Anything which is out of line, not straight or not perpendicular should shout back at me from the digital photograph - as that brake hangar bracket did on the last photo - especially when the photos are rendered and then cropped so that the image is larger than the size of the model.

 

I know I bang on about all of this checking, but it is an essential discipline for me, as it is far easier to correct errors at this stage, when not everything is fixed than when everything is fixed. The cab roof, bunker cage, braking components are still not yet fixed. This photo is specifically to check the cab door being parallel to the bunker side sheeting.

 

It is things like the safety valves, whistles, dome, chimney which I really do look at very critically to check for straightness and with these things then a larger image allows a much more critical assessment. It's also worth saying that the clearer the image then the more value the photo is in making these assessments. An out of focus, blurred image has the same usefulness as a chocolate teapot!  And with the digital camera, a photograph or a dozen or fifty of them, cost nothing!!

 

Anyway, we have arrived at this point three weeks after starting the model, so not far to go now. I should receive the wheels and crankpins in the next  day or two, so the next photo should look much more locolike.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 2, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J77 Fletcher Cab

 

Just before I primed this loco, earlier this week, I took this photo to illustrate the rain strip fitted to these locos which was quite distinctive.

 

Looking at prototype photos, the rainstrip appears to be composed of angle iron bent at each end. So to reproduce this feature I used 0.8 mm 'L' brass angle which was left over from the lattice signal building, Into the 'L' angle two 'V' shaped notches were filed 17 mm apart. The 'L' angle was then cut 2 mm beyond each of the notches with a piercing saw. The 2 mm piece, at each end, was then bent down and a touch of solder applied to the back flat of the 'L' angle just to seal the angle.

 

The strip was then superglued to the cab roof, just over the cabside window.

 

And that globe lubricator, which had gone out of kilter, was also restored to vertical!!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 2, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J77 Fletcher Cab

 

With the loco superstructure completed except for the 3-link couplings and the mechanicals all done, then just the brake linkage,some piping and the guard irons and the chassis will also be complete.

 

A bit of something on the front footstep, since removed!

 

This one will be 68402 of Hull Alexandra Dock shed.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 3, 2018 by mikemeg

[micklner]

Side of Dome looks a bit dodgy ?

[sp1]

Side of Dome looks a bit dodgy ?

Nah! It’s just been through a very narrow tunnel......

[mikemeg]

Side of Dome looks a bit dodgy ?

 

Mick,

 

Yes, you're not wrong. Side of dome needs some abrasive attention! Really shows up on the photo; another one up for the digital camera!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

[Daddyman]

It looks lovely, Mike! 

 

Just a couple of things if I may:

 

First, as well as the marks already mentioned, I think there's still a dab of solder on the end of the reach rod too. 

 

The ends of the valance should stand proud of the valance on these locos, but it looks a little bit too proud on yours. However, it may be too late to change that? 

 

My only gripe is the s.box door handle. Sorry, but it's awful! Can we all please scratchbuild our handles, chaps! The one below is .9 wire (EDIT: capillary tube) drilled to take 0.4 wire (the handles) with a 16BA washer as the centre: 

 

Edited February 5, 2018 by Daddyman

[mikemeg]

It looks lovely, Mike! 

 

Just a couple of things if I may:

 

First, as well as the marks already mentioned, I think there's still a dab of solder on the end of the reach rod too. 

 

The ends of the valance should stand proud of the valance on these locos, but it looks a little bit too proud on yours. However, it may be too late to change that? 

 

My only gripe is the s.box door handle. Sorry, but it's awful! Can we all please scratchbuild our handles, chaps! The one below is .9 wire drilled to take 0.4 wire (the handles) with a 16BA washer as the centre: 

 

20180204_175656.jpg

 

Dave,

 

I like the smokebox handles but you quote using .9 mm wire when the spindle looks to be tube?

 

Cheers

 

Mike

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J77 Fletcher Cab

 

Over the past months both MickLNER and Daddyman (I'll use their RMWeb usernames for convenience) have been very complimentary on the models but there has always been a reservation - the smokebox door handles. And I have to agree that some of them are not as good as I would like.

 

Now I've always been a believer that things can always be improved and one can always learn new techniques, even as a septagenarian, so it was out with the 0.9 mm and 0.4 mm wire and a 0.410 mm drill. Oh and a 14BA washer, mounted on a broach as a mandrill, and slightly turned down in diameter and not forgetting a magnifying glass on a stand and just a little patience!!!

 

So this photo is especially for Mick Bennett, who pointed out the 'dodgy dome' and the smokebox door handle and for Dave Addyman who finally persuaded me to have a go at scratch building the smokebox door handles - thanks Mick and Dave.

 

I'll leave it to you to decide whether this is an improvement - I know what I think because I am 'retro fitting' quite a few more!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 5, 2018 by mikemeg

[Daddyman]

Super! It looks very smart, Mike! 

 

You're right, I should have said 0.9mm tube. I nick the tube with a triangular mini file to make placing the 0.45 drill bit easier. I see you used a 16BA washer; maybe I did too - or maybe I change between 14BA and 16BA, depending on the railway company I'm modelling.  

 

Hopefully this will start a revolution and we'll see an end to oversize handles now! The only decent ones on the market that I know of are Dave Bradwell's, but they're part of a sprue of castings that costs £7 or so a go. 

[mikemeg]

Super! It looks very smart, Mike! 

 

You're right, I should have said 0.9mm tube. I nick the tube with a triangular mini file to make placing the 0.45 drill bit easier. I see you used a 16BA washer; maybe I did too - or maybe I change between 14BA and 16BA, depending on the railway company I'm modelling.  

 

Hopefully this will start a revolution and we'll see an end to oversize handles now! The only decent ones on the market that I know of are Dave Bradwell's, but they're part of a sprue of castings that costs £7 or so a go. 

 

Dave,

 

Many thanks and, I have to admit, they do look much more realistic.

 

I used a 14BA washer turned down very slightly using a broach as the mandrill to hold the washer . And I did use 0.9 wire but did nick it, as you do, with the triangular file to create a start for the drill. This takes a time but seems well worth it!!

 

So, perhaps only another seventeen or eighteen to make; I've made three in an hour and a half so it's not going to be quick but worth it, I think!! At least the G5's will have these on from the outset.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 5, 2018 by mikemeg

[Daddyman]

Dave,

 

Many thanks and, I have to admit, they do look much more realistic.

 

I used a 14BA washer turned down very slightly using a broach as the mandrill to hold the washer . And I did use 0.9 wire but did nick it, as you do, with the triangular file to create a start for the drill. This takes a time but seems well worth it!!

 

So, perhaps only another seventeen or eighteen to make; I've made three in an hour and a half so it's not going to be quick but worth it, I think!! At least the G5's will have these on from the outset.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Glad you like them, Mike! Keep up the good work! 

 

I'm not sure how much smaller a 16BA washer is than a 14, but that might obviate the need for turning down. Problem with 16BAs is that they come on a fret, so each one has four tabs to file off. I've also used plasticard tube in the past, cut roughly and then skimmed down in place on the door. 

[micklner]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J77 Fletcher Cab

 

Over the past months both MickLNER and Daddyman (I'll use their RMWeb usernames for convenience) have been very complimentary on the models but there has always been a reservation - the smokebox door handles. And I have to agree that some of them are not as good as I would like.

 

Now I've always been a believer that things can always be improved and one can always learn new techniques, even as a septagenarian, so it was out with the 0.9 mm and 0.4 mm wire and a 0.410 mm drill. Oh and a 14BA washer, mounted on a broach as a mandrill, and slightly turned down in diameter and not forgetting a magnifying glass on a stand and just a little patience!!!

 

So this photo is especially for Mick Bennett, who pointed out the 'dodgy dome' and the smokebox door handle and for Dave Addyman who finally persuaded me to have a go at scratch building the smokebox door handles - thanks Mick and Dave.

 

I'll leave it to you to decide whether this is an improvement - I know what I think because I am 'retro fitting' quite a few more!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

I was the dodgy Dome person only !!. New handle looks very nice as does the fettled Dome. I will admit , I get my turned brass ones via eBay for a good price. I am not a fan of lost wax or even worse white metal versions. Tiny detail ,but always very prominent in many photos.

[Compound2632]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J77 Fletcher Cab

 

Over the past months both MickLNER and Daddyman (I'll use their RMWeb usernames for convenience) have been very complimentary on the models but there has always been a reservation - the smokebox door handles. And I have to agree that some of them are not as good as I would like.

 

Now I've always been a believer that things can always be improved and one can always learn new techniques, even as a septagenarian, so it was out with the 0.9 mm and 0.4 mm wire and a 0.410 mm drill. Oh and a 14BA washer, mounted on a broach as a mandrill, and slightly turned down in diameter and not forgetting a magnifying glass on a stand and just a little patience!!!

 

So this photo is especially for Mick Bennett, who pointed out the 'dodgy dome' and the smokebox door handle and for Dave Addyman who finally persuaded me to have a go at scratch building the smokebox door handles - thanks Mick and Dave.

 

I'll leave it to you to decide whether this is an improvement - I know what I think because I am 'retro fitting' quite a few more!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

A North Eastern modeller's creative response to justified criticism. 

[Rob Pulham]

I have to agree Mike,  a great improvement.

[mikemeg]

A North Eastern modeller's creative response to justified criticism. 

 

Gratifying as it may be, and is, to watch the 'like' and 'craftmanship/clever' buttons tick up, it is the genuine and honest criticism which offers the greater value and which prompts the search for more improvement.

 

Just as these 'larger than life' photos allow me to be critical, they also allow others the same opportunity and it they spot something which I've missed then the photos have served their purpose.

 

Many thanks to all who take the time to offer their views - good or not so good; just please carry on doing it!

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 6, 2018 by mikemeg

[rowanj]

Gratifying as it may be, and is, to watch the 'like' and 'craftmanship/clever' buttons tick up, it is the genuine and honest criticism which offers the greater value and which prompts the search for more improvement.

 

Just as these 'larger than life' photos allow me to be critical, they also allow others the same opportunity and it they spot something which I've missed then the photos have served their purpose.

 

 

 

I couldn't agree more, Mike. I certainly don't approach your level of aptitude, and, I confess, your degree of patience in the search for perfection and maximum detail, Exposing my efforts has been enormously helpful, though frequently a cause for extreme hubris and embarrassment.   As long as criticism is constructive (which unfortunately it not always is), it really does help to correct errors, develop skills, and make the next model better.

 

I'm afraid I wont, however, be going down the hand-turned smokebox door handles route. Good luck to those who do. 

 

John

Edited February 6, 2018 by rowanj

[mikemeg]

LONDON ROAD MODELS LNER G5

 

The various 'add ons' to the chassis have been added on - guard irons, sandboxes, brake cylinder, etc. and the whole thing given a priming and then a coat of weathered black. Further weathering of the mainframes, wheels, etc. will be done once the chassis is wheeled.

 

The gearbox has been assembled - High Level Roadrunner Compact Plus (60 : 1 ratio) - and is now awaiting a Mashima 1420 motor, at which point the chassis can be wheeled.

 

This short delay provided an opportunity to make another eight smokebox door handles and retro fit some of the earlier models, so far without causing any damage to the various smokebox doors involved.

 

Now to complete the detailing of the loco body.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 9, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

I couldn't agree more, Mike. I certainly don't approach your level of aptitude, and, I confess, your degree of patience in the search for perfection and maximum detail, Exposing my efforts has been enormously helpful, though frequently a cause for extreme hubris and embarrassment.   As long as criticism is constructive (which unfortunately it not always is), it really does help to correct errors, develop skills, and make the next model better.

 

I'm afraid I wont, however, be going down the hand-turned smokebox door handles route. Good luck to those who do. 

 

John

 

John,

 

Thanks for the kind words, hopefully my comments have been helpful to you.

 

My own view on building these things is that one is never too old to learn - I'm now a septagenarian though, as yet, I don't know where Septageneria actually is - new approaches and new techniques.

 

One should always aim at the best as a target (in my case the great inspiration was the late Guy Williams) though you can learn from many folks.

 

One should never be completely satisfied and always seek to improve.

 

As to perfection, I know that I shall never achieve it, which paradoxically, is why I shall never stop trying to achieve it.

 

Incidentally, the thread has now passed the 50,000 views. Now I've done 48,000 of them, myself, so to those of you who have visited the thread the remaining 2,000 times - many thanks.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 11, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

NORTH EASTERN KITS LNER J77's

 

The trio of J77's is now approaching completion with the last two waiting for the final detailing and painting.

 

So this photo ilustrates three variations of these locos with the Worsdell cab version to the right and the two Fletcher cab versions; one with round windows, one with square windows.

 

Been quite a while in getting these done but is worth the wait!!

 

Should be said that the Worsdell cab version is one kit, the Fletcher cab version (both round or square windows) is a different kit.

 

The trio of G5's and the brace of J72's can then be finished.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 15, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

LONDON ROAD MODELS LNER G5

 

While waiting for the delivery of the Mashima 1420's then the opportunity was taken to begin the second of these G5's - 67256.

 

So the footplate and valances have been assembled, the beading has been fitted to the cab cut outs and the tank and cab/bunker sides and the bunker rear have been assembled. The bunker hopper has been removed from the bunker cage which has then been folded up and checked for fit, though not yet fixed. This cage will now be stored away until it is fixed, to prevent any damage to what is a very fragile assembly.

 

There are a number of 'tricks' or techniques, which I employ when doing these multiple concurrent builds, to try and ensure that all of the intended batch actually get built, though I won't bore anyone with the psychology of this, save to say that the third of these G5's - 67340 - will be started before either of the other two are completed.

 

I have drawn the tank extensions superimposed on a 7 mm drawing of the G5, supplied as part of the instructions in the kit, as a precursor to reducing that drawing to 4 mm from which to build this 'one off' prototype G5.

 

The two photos of 67340 are firstly taken at Hull Botanic Shed, around 1952, and secondly and in colour, at one of the Blyth sheds, where this loco finished its days.

 

I'm not sure that these extended tanks did anything for the aesthetics of this loco!! Also, notice how the footplate on this loco is discernably bowed in these photos, both of which are 1950's and, of course, are courtesy Mick Nicholson.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 15, 2018 by mikemeg

[MarkC]

The Aussies would describe 67340 as "a bit of a fugly", I think.

 

You're right, Mike, the extended tanks do nothing for the aesthetics...

[mikemeg]

LONDON ROAD MODELS LNER G5

 

I don't propose to describe the second of these G5 builds for fear of repetition; though there is, perhaps, one aspect of these builds which is worthy of repeating.

 

On every build or every kit, there are certain items which are crucial to getting the overall model right. On the G5's, it is probably the smokebox/front splasher configuration. If this is formed incorrectly and without the necessary degree of care then the model will never look correct.

 

So the splasher top should be formed slowly, very slowly, so that the curves exactly match the corresponding curves on the splasher upstand. After soldering the upstand to the splasher top, from the inside, then the thing should stand unaided if it is square.

 

All seems ok; now for the other side. This part, as with all of the etched brass parts, was polished on both sides with the glass fibre brush, prior to assembly.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 16, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

LONDON ROAD MODELS LNER G5

 

More progress on the second of the G5's with the boiler/smokebox being assembled. The cut out for the motor has to be marked and then sawn out from the brass tube supplied, which does mean that the remaining portion of the opened tube spreads slightly and needs to be carefully pinched back to its correct diameter - 18 mm.

 

The first of these G5 kits was a George Norton original and had a single piece of tube with the smokebox and boiler turned up in a lathe and the motor cut out already removed. The second kit is the current LRM version and differs in that a piece of tube is supplied for the boiler, necessitating the removal of the section to accommodate the motor as described above, and another piece of the same diameter tube is supplied from which to form the smokebox, by slitting it along its length and wrapping it over the front of the boiler.

 

Measuring this second piece of tube gave a depth of 12 mm (a scale 3' 0") when the smokebox depth on the G5 is given as 2' 6". So I sawed a piece off this tube, around 1.5 mm deep, using a piercing saw and then dressed the remaining piece back to around 10.25 mm depth which should correspond to the length of the top of the front sandbox. The brass ring between the boiler and the smokebox can then be fashioned out of 0.8 mm brass rod filed to a quarter round section and then rolled.

 

The final part of the smokebox assembly will be a wrapper exactly 10 mm deep and wrapped around the smokebox set back by around .010" from the rear edge of the smokebox and flush with the front, as was done on the first G5. This brings the diameter of the smokebox up to 20 mm which is only very slightly less than the scale 5' 0 1/2" of the prototype.

 

The fitting of the front cab spectacle plate allows the checking of the boiler levelling, which appears to be ok.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 19, 2018 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

LONDON ROAD MODELS LNER G5

 

With the simultaneous arrival of the motors, gearboxes and some of Arthur's white metal and brass castings into the post box, then the first chassis has been wheeled, the wheels quartered, and the motor and gearbox fitted and then the chassis tested for fit against the loco body. The motor and gearbox seem to fit inside the body, as they should, so all seems ok to proceed.

 

The ride height still needs some fine tuning as the rear of the loco is a little too high but this is simply a matter of adjusting the amount of packing of the body on the rear bogie. As this bogie is compensated, then there should be no need for any springing of the bogie pivot.

 

Several of the assemblies are not yet fixed - the cab roof, the bunker cage/hopper - and the coupling rods have still to be drilled out for the crankpin colletts. Still a lot of detailing to be done  - smokebox door (and handle!!), handrails, lamp irons, brake linkage, etc.

 

Then there is all of the push and pull paraphenalia around the buffer beams and the smokebox side to add, but now the first of these builds does begin to look like a G5 and they weren't bad looking locos! It never ceases to amaze how such a simple technology - using a coal fire to boil water to make steam - could produce such beautiful machines!!

 

For an etched kit, drawn and developed some thirty years ago, this holds up pretty well against the current ranges of kits, especially when 'updated' with some  of the castngs now available.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited February 21, 2018 by mikemeg