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Lynton & Barnstaple OO9 Loco from Heljan

OO9 Lynton & Barnstaple




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#26 phil gollin

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 10:41

.

 

I will almost certainly buy one or two if they run properly.

 

I would suggest that with the 100th anniversary of WW1 coming up that models of the trench railways would be popular and of course the locos could have been traded on "post-war".

 

.



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#27 hayfield

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 11:59

Looking at this months Railway Modeller at a Dean Sidings review, they produce a 4mm scale Lyd which fots on to a Prairie N gauge chassis, seems to be a bit unlucky for them



#28 Southwold

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 12:10

Guys why say shame about any model, surely something is better than nothing? It was going to have to be a prototype that appealed beyond the traditional NG modeller to be viable as a first step. Look how long it took for industrials to become a subject of rtr OO models, apart from the J94 it's only been the last couple of years.

Look at the positive that this might lead one day to a quarry Hunslet or your own personal favourite. The main problem with NG is that the range of interest is much more diverse than SG modelling, if Peco hadn't done the wagons would we even see the 2-6-2 now?

Quite right...I'm also interested in model buses and for years the big boys said there wasn't a market for anything other than London buses which were often inaccurate, so we had to put up with white metal kits if we had the skill. Then along came EFE with a decent London RT and when that sold well they did some regional buses and coaches and now everyone is making them. It might take a few years but if there is a market for RTR 009, it will develop.


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#29 Ohmisterporter

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 12:34

Is it a coincidence that Peco announce r-t-r 009 rolling stock but no loco, soon after followed by this Heljan news? I wonder if they got their heads together before moving into 009. Some joined up thinking by manufacturers that are not direct rivals.


Edited by Ohmisterporter, 10 February 2013 - 12:37 .


#30 mjcampbell

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 14:45

No coincidence, PECO realised there was a chicken and egg situation, and RTR needs stock as well as a loco. They sell the track, so must have an idea of the market. PECO aren't in the market to make locos, but took the gamble on making stock then openly encouraged the main manufactures to go for the loco. I'm guessing PECO thought it was a safe bet, and I hope it is successful for both manufacturers.
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#31 PaulRhB

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 14:55

Is it a coincidence that Peco announce r-t-r 009 rolling stock but no loco, soon after followed by this Heljan news? I wonder if they got their heads together before moving into 009. Some joined up thinking by manufacturers that are not direct rivals.

No it's not Peco were actively talking to all the major manufacturers and strongly hinted at Warley that they had one seriously interested. Peco decided that producing the stock was they best way to encourage someone else to take the plunge by making a serious investment themselves.



#32 PLD

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 17:30

Shame about the prototype selection (personally the L&B is of little interest)

I have to agree on this, though maybe it's just personal taste.

So once again we have members decrying an inovative manufacturer taking a risk because it's not of interest to them. It seems a bit selfish to be saying it's not what I want so no-one else should be able to have it...

Actually we have two manufacturers working in tandem to deliver a substantial range of complementary stock putting a conplete 009 layout within the skills of a good many modellers who don't have the skill/confidence to attempt kit/scratch building and I think that should be applauded... OK it is one relatively obscure and short lived line in a remote corner of the country, but it is a starting point and better than a disperate mismatched selection for example a Ffestiniog Loco and Welshpool coaches...
 

Is it a coincidence that Peco announce r-t-r 009 rolling stock but no loco, soon after followed by this Heljan news? I wonder if they got their heads together before moving into 009. Some joined up thinking by manufacturers that are not direct rivals.

Reading beteen the lines of what was said by Peco reps, it was obvious they knew there was a matching loco in the pipeline, they just didn't give away who.


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#33 Kenton

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 20:27

So once again we have members decrying an inovative manufacturer taking a risk because it's not of interest to them. It seems a bit selfish to be saying it's not what I want so no-one else should be able to have it...

Actually not what was said.

Just stating (along with others) the opinion that the L&B is about the most uninteresting NG prototype there is along with the most difficult loco wheel formation to get running consistently through current NG track. I applaud them for bringing to OO9 the possibility of RTR but cannot get beyond the fact that it could have been done with a more popular, and useful, prototype. One that should have been easier to develop and have all of us buying it.

Of course there will be L&B lovers out there who will be cheering - especially if that loco runs really well. The rest of us will have to wait for the followup (whenever that comes along). Meanwhile we have to happily build from kits and struggle to find some chassis to match that wasn't taken from a RTR loco sold 2 or 3 decades ago.

#34 Allegheny1600

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 01:28

Just stating (along with others) the opinion that the L&B is about the most uninteresting NG prototype there is

Please!

Watch this and then tell me the same thing?

I personally feel that, along with the Leek & Manifold, this has to be one of the great scenic lines in the country - how can that be "uninteresting"?

Cheers,

John E.


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#35 PaulRhB

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 08:14

Actually not what was saidJust stating (along with others) the opinion that the L&B is about the most uninteresting NG prototype there is

 

 

In your opinion Kenton and totally ignoring the fact it is one of the most comprehensively recorded lines with numerous books that have sold well, not to mention the Accucraft 16mm range which continues to sell strongly after 5 years and the success of L&B world at Warley last year!


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#36 Edge

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 08:19

Now now now people, surely we should all just love all of god's little lines :D

 

I will be sorely tempted not to buy the entire range of locos, plus a couple more for repaints into freelance liveries :)

 

If there is one at Porthmadoc Harbour station in BR livery as 'Lyd' (yes, I know the cab is wrong, but there have been greater leaps of imagination e.g. Modelzones commission of that Heljan railbus) then I will certainly buy it. Come to think of it, even if its not in Porthmadoc Harbour, I'm likely to buy it. Maybe if Peco do the L&B coches in FR livery, a set could be arranged?

 

I'm also eager to see what else might be in the pipeline. I imagine it will be another well known design, maybe a Double Fairlie? Or an W&L Beyer?

 

All in all thoguh, Heljan are to be applauded for this. i'm ruddy useless at kit building, and I adore 009, so my efforts so far look as thought they have been made from plasticine. Happy that I can have a good loco now :)


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#37 Obi-Jiff Kenobi

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 09:53

I like the idea of RTR 009, as I will never have the time to build narrow gauge kits in addition to all my other modelling interests. Depending on price, I will be getting a loco or two.



#38 roundhouse

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 12:40

If the first one sells well then maybe Heljan will do the other cab variants LEW and LYD- if they don't then I will modify them myself as it shouldnt be too hard to do.  The Ffestiniog one is now in Southern livery but it did also look good in the BR black.

 

Would be nice if they can do one with sound or at least leave space for a Loksound Micro decoder and speaker (or maybe I am just pushing my luck)!!

 

Ian


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#39 mjcampbell

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 13:42

Just stating (along with others) the opinion that the L&B is about the most uninteresting NG prototype there is along with the most difficult loco wheel formation to get running consistently through current NG track. 

 

Perhaps not to your tastes but the L&B has an incredible amount of interest considering it closed in 1935, so much so that the line is being rebuilt (slowly), and a replica of one of these locos is in operation (very successfully). I suspect the M-W 2-6-2's are amongst the most modelled NG locos and with a wide appeal beyond current NG modellers.

 

What is difficult about a 2-6-2? In 009 more wheels for pick-up are a good thing, and if couplings can swing with the bogies it helps on curves. The 2-6-2 wheel arrangement was actually very common on NG, along with near variations like 0-6-2. 


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#40 Kenton

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 15:03

What is difficult about a 2-6-2?

In model form, which is what we are discussing, they derail. I accept the main cause of this is the lack of weight given to the uncoupled wheels. Something quite difficult to do in the smaller gauge and made even worse by the tight curves and crashing through RTR point frogs.

The dislike of the L&B is simply personal opinion, just like I hate Class 37s, and frankly will not change no matter what happens in attempts to reinstate the line, the number of books published on the subject, or anyone else's singing of its praises.

Although as I said I wish Heljan success with the model (and Peco with their wagons to match) I simply cannot get beyond the prototype being wrong and the loco a missed opportunity. Though accept the next one up might be more suited to my likes and an 0-6-0 more useful to many. It is only my opinion and obviously I do not expect others to subscribe to it, but equally so the opinion that it is the perfect solution to RTR OO9 along with the selected L&B is also just opinion. As said I will not be buying, though no doubt others will. The same sort of opinions could probably be said of any prototype in NG or SG. I'm not asking for support of my opinion just simply stating it.

#41 invercloy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 17:53

2-6-2s derail? Only if they're poorly designed or running track that's a tad on the lumpy side, I've never had issues with 2-6-2's. The new Peco points are much smoother and hardly cause stock to 'crash' through them, in fact I can propel (with a 4-4-0T) a rake of 10+ unweighted Parkside Dundas wagons with no issue.  The new track is a big improvement in terms of running, so much so that I've ripped up the only two 12" radius points I had and replaced them with the new ones.

 

Again, as it's your opinion I don't think you can say the prototype is 'wrong', but rather 'not what you would have chosen'.  


Edited by invercloy, 11 February 2013 - 17:54 .

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#42 Oldddudders

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 19:16

There are occasions when I just have to sit and scratch my head about some of the attitudes displayed by members of this forum - I cannot fathom their logic at all. How is it possible for someone who presumably - as indicated by their membership and regular postings here - likes trains, to actually say they "dislike" a particular prototype? Of course we all have preferences and favourites - but why would anyone "dislike" a steam railway that perished in 1935? By all means say you don't find diesels interesting, or you only like Pre-grouping steam on this or that line, but how can you "dislike" a trivial but scenic and characterful NG line that did no-one any harm?

 

All suggestions as to what I have failed to comprehend gratefully accepted.


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#43 edcayton

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 19:33


Just stating (along with others) the opinion that the L&B is about the most uninteresting NG prototype there is along with the most difficult loco wheel formation to get running consistently through current NG track. I applaud them for bringing to OO9 the possibility of RTR but cannot get beyond the fact that it could have been done with a more popular, and useful, prototype. One that should have been easier to develop and have all of us buying it.

 

 

I'm just interested to know what would have been a less uninteresting or a more popular and useful prototype in your opinion Kenton.

 

Ed



#44 298

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 20:53

I was going to say that soon L&B layouts will be the new GWR Branchline, until I remembered back to last year's Warley Show...


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#45 Kenton

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 20:57

A more useful prototype: that's an easy one a simple 0-6-0 - anyone one of many. The 0-6-0 chassis is reliable and covers many prototypes an (what if potential) not to mention the possibility of canabalisation for use in several kits. As for a prototype railway, it doesn't really matter when I "dislike" the choice of L&B. But any one of the existing NG railways (OK I know some folk are trying to bring the L&B back into existence - which may be a good reason for the next RTR loco) All these existing railways actually have a presence on which publicity and "train sets" could be focused. WHR, Festiniog, and others immediately spring to mind and several others. We could be really selfish and think that the manufacturers are thinking of the narrow minded modeller rather than the train set market.

BTW I love diesels - just not the over hyped Class 37 - these days I build more diesel than steam.

But are we not lucky to live in a world where we can all hold an opinion on something without being told that our opinion is wrong, worthless or rubbish simply because it does not please everyone. I just hope that Heljan and Peco have done their market research (no they obviously didn't ask me) because I believe RTR OO9 is a vital part of the jigsaw in keeping the hobby going bring OO9 to the mass market and majority model railway enthusiasts.

#46 flyingsignalman

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 21:48

Which 0-6-0 to use though?

I can only think of the W&LLR's The Earl and The Countess, The Snailbeach District Railway's Bagnall Dennis and the Harrogate Gas works Railway's Peckett loco now preserved on the Statfold Barn Railway.



#47 invercloy

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 22:02

There are many many more 0-6-0s, a generic 'catalogue' design would probably fit in more with what Kenton is thinking of, and to a degree he has a point in that its less line specific and therefore less limiting in terms of stock it will look 'right' with.

But conversely, and arguably more importantly, a catalogue design wont be as instantly recognisable as an L&B manning wardle, and wont have the added pull of the Peco stock perfectly matching it, or a prototype running at the Festiniog or L&B (soon hopefully!).

At the end of the day we're getting an RTR 009 loco, its just great that someone has finally taken the plunge.
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#48 PaulRhB

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 08:59

Generic doesn't bring in the collectors market which Heljan have pursued with the BR prototypes and I'd guess this model will fall in the same marketing bracket as far as Heljan are concerned. Appeal to NG modellers and those who collect something different. Generic locos are pretty well covered in 009 so going for something iconic makes far more sense and as Keith mentioned if they'd chosen one of the 060 prototypes they'd have been told it was an obscure prototype!

The quarry hunslets are iconic too but starting in a new scale with such a tiny prototype would have been a headache as there is literally little room for error and getting the weight for reliable running a challenge with Heljans main expertise being in plastic.

Heljan and Peco know that there are already L&B locos and stock on the kit market but chose this because, as in 16mm, they know there is a huge interest for the line that they can tap into. Lyd and the slow but well publicised restoration of the L&B itself no doubt help a lot. Look at the reviews and popularity of the expensive L&B drawn and described book to see that it has a dedicated band of interested modellers and enthusiasts who would happily buy a loco and train just for display.


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#49 Kenton

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 10:34

But conversely, and arguably more importantly, a catalogue design wont be as instantly recognisable as an L&B manning wardle, and wont have the added pull of the Peco stock perfectly matching it, or a prototype running at the Festiniog or L&B (soon hopefully!).

You may have seen I have exactly the same objections to Peco's offering the L&B stock. I would also argue just who is going to recognise anything that last run in the 1930's - only modellers already focused on the line, certainly not the trainset market. As I said I welcome RTR OO9, just think that this prototype is wrong. I guess time will tell how much of a success it turns out to be, and if the only buyers are those interested in boxes in a collection, aficionados of the L&B, and those so desperate to run OO9 that they'd buy anything even if they run it out of context.

#50 Obi-Jiff Kenobi

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 10:51

I guess time will tell how much of a success it turns out to be, and if the only buyers are those interested in boxes in a collection, aficionados of the L&B, and those so desperate to run OO9 that they'd buy anything even if they run it out of context.

I don't fit into any of those categories - I run everything I buy, I am aware of the L&B but not knowledgable about it, and I've only a very passing interest in narrow gauge, yet I am strangely excited by the prospect of RTR L&B. Perhaps I'm the exception that proveth the rule. As you say, time will tell.


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