Kernow Model Rail Centre - Bulleid Diesel

[GeoffBird]

These images of 10203 show a plate removed from below/in front of the “1” at the front end..

https://goo.gl/images/AWqfWn

Same for 10201

https://goo.gl/images/rLHLV7

Yes, but I suspect ´these were fitted after the locos were transferred to the LMR - they put shedplates on everything, even the ex_LNWR 7F's.  But I have not seen such a thing (nor the "5P" power classification) when they were running on BR(S).  I suspect that this may be becase they were never formally based at Nine Elms - all the refuelling and light servicing seems to have been done at Waterloo North sidings.  Just wondered if someone out there knew more than me. 

[tetsudofan]

My sound-fitted green 10203 with primrose roof (together with a sound-fitted black 10202 that I had paid for and forgotten about  ) arrived today courtesy of DPD a couple of minutes after returning from some retail therapy at The Hobby Shop in Faversham.

 

Having seen the image of this model on the KMRC website I was a bit put off by the brightly coloured primrose yellow roof and was contemplating contacting KMRC to ask them to change my order to a black version. KMRC didn't waste anytime in fitting the sound decoder and they got to me before I got to them!!

 

Finally plucked up the courage just now to look at the version received and very pleased to see that the primrose yellow on the actual model is much more toned-down than that indicated on the KMRC website. Hope to take a photo of the model tomorrow and see how it looks on here.

 

Keith

[tetsudofan]

Managed to take a couple of pictures as mentioned above. First pic the loco on its own:

 

 

Another picture taken on a part of the layout closer to the windows where the natural light affects the colour of the roof as perceived by the camera:

 

 

Keith

[Dunsignalling]

Brian Haresnape's British Rail Fleet Survey No.1 (Early prototype and pilot scheme diesel electrics) has a high level photo of 10203 in Tring Cutting. The loco has a clean roof showing the twin transverse exhaust cut outs as portrayed by the Kernow model. The preceding page has a photo of 10201 at Exeter Central, also with a clean roof and no indication of any kind of transverse exhaust cut outs - it's a lower angle shot, but it's clear that 10203 had a different arrangement.

 

David

There are also (at least) two relevant photographs of 10203, albeit taken from lower angles, in Southern Way Special No.1, 10201 - 10203 on the Southern (Noodle Books, 2007).

 

A b/w shot on page 73 and a double page colour spread on pages 100-101 both clearly show the exhaust slots on 10203 to be exactly as rendered on the model.

 

John

Edited July 28, 2018 by Dunsignalling

[JSpencer]

Finally collected my 10203 from the post yesterday. Runs well but not quite as good as 10201 (10201 is silent, 10203 sounds exactly like my Dapol 10001). I expect this will iron out after a running in period which 10201 has done already.

 

 

 

I originally order 10203 in green, but once I figured it never ran on SR metals in this colour, I changed it to black (this going back many years before the EPs appeared). I will add a Golden Arrow head board at some point and will think about the headcode settings for the other side.

 

[JSpencer]

The slight clicky noise did not go with running in, so off with the body, easy to do 4 screws. Traced the noise to a wire touching a shaft near a gear tower, moved that and the loco was silent like 10201. Ah bliss sat last....

 

While here, looked at sound conversion. Dead straight forwards, speaker is fitted, just plug in the chip.

 

I then tackled the head code discs. Some come off easily, some a little extra persuasion. Tried fitting the first, refused to go. I studied them and realised that the closed discs have 3 slightly different patterns, two have the plugs shaped for the middle, 2 shaped the left and 2 for the right. Some fell in easily, too easily that I added a little PVA to ensure they don,t pop out.

 

With both models, I see 10203 has 4 lamp irons each end while 10201 has just 2. The chassis on both are identical, so all detail differences are in the bodies. 1 lamp iron was loose in its hole, pressed against the face so I fixed that accordingly. They are tiny so be careful when changing head code discs. Some pics:

 

 

 

Edited August 1, 2018 by JSpencer

[adb968008]

10202 seems to be out of stock.

[Gibbo675]

This is probably a very stupid question, but what did they sound like?

 

I do ask it for a fairly good reason. I have a Silver Fox body, and having looked at my Bachmann Peaks as possible chassis donors have seen that that they are built like the proverbial brick out (sh*t) house, so sawing off 19mm from the chassis would be a monumental task, as Rembrow said.

 

I think his suggestion of the Hornby railroad Class 40 is a great idea, ad with the TTS sound versions not being that much more (I want to chip it anyway), is it worth using one with sound as a donor?

 

I do have a couple of Bachmann 40's, but one is a 21 pin, and the older other unchipped, old body style, so they may not be the best homes for a TTS sound chip and speaker.

 

So back to my original question, what did the Bullied diesels sound like, is anyone alive who could give an opinion, or could I just say 'Oh yes, they really did sound just like whistlers' and cross my fingers behind my back.

 

Jamie

Hi Jamie,

 

This video should answer your question,

 

 

Gibbo.

[SRman]

Hi Jamie,

 

This video should answer your question,

 

 

Gibbo.

 

An interesting film clip there. If those are original sounds, and not dubbed ones, then it vindicates my choice of class 40 engine sounds with SR whistles and compressor sounds, done by legomanbiffo at my request.

[JSpencer]

An interesting film clip there. If those are original sounds, and not dubbed ones, then it vindicates my choice of class 40 engine sounds with SR whistles and compressor sounds, done by legomanbiffo at my request.

 

Is that the same sounds Kernow installed?

[SRman]

Is that the same sounds Kernow installed?

No. I didn't like the Kernow sounds: they seemed to be the internal engine/generator sounds but with no external exhaust or turbo sounds (my opinion of what it sounded like). I know from a contemporary Queensland Railways English Electric class (1200 class from 1953) that the EE Co sounds at that time were still very similar to later locomotives, at least until the more efficient silencers were attached in much more modern installations (classes 56 and 58). I also thought that the class 40 turbo whistle would be a little different to those fitted to the Bulleid and, indeed, the Ivatt locomotives, but I was prepared to accept that compromise.

 

I was also prepared to compromise on the engine throttle behaviour; that is, the control system, as that could vary somewhat. Compare the engine wind-up and spool-down of a class 37 and a class 31, both of which have the same 12 cylinder EE Co engines, but different control systems. The class 31s exhibit much more even spooling up and down than the class 37s. QR's 1200 class seemed to have even more crude throttle controls than the 37s, with a distinct rush of revs, followed by a slight overspeed and reduction of power, followed by another rush, and so on. I had imagined (without proof) that maybe the Bulleids and Ivatts were like that, but the film above seems to indicate that the class 40 style of throttle spooling up and down is fairly close in behaviour.

Edited August 3, 2018 by SRman

[JSpencer]

No. I didn't like the Kernow sounds: they seemed to be the internal engine/generator sounds but with no external exhaust or turbo sounds (my opinion of what it sounded like). I know from a contemporary Queensland Railways English Electric class (1200 class from 1953) that the EE Co sounds at that time were still very similar to later locomotives, at least until the more efficient silencers were attached in much more modern installations (classes 56 and 58). I also thought that the class 40 turbo whistle would be a little different to those fitted to the Bulleid and, indeed, the Ivatt locomotives, but I was prepared to accept that compromise.

 

I was also prepared to compromise on the engine throttle behaviour; that is, the control system, as that could vary somewhat. Compare the engine wind-up and spool-down of a class 37 and a class 31, both of which have the same 12 cylinder EE Co engines, but different control systems. The class 31s exhibit much more even spooling up and down than the class 37s. QR's 1200 class seemed to have even more crude throttle controls than the 37s, with a distinct rush of revs, followed by a slight overspeed and reduction of power, followed by another rush, and so on. I had imagined (without proof) that maybe the Bulleids and Ivatts were like that, but the film above seems to indicate that the class 40 style of throttle spooling up and down is fairly close in behaviour.

 

Thanks, I personally see 10203 (the loco I wish to add sound to) as the prototype for class 40. So I will probably ask Legomanbiffo to do me the same. 

[charliepetty]

Thanks, I personally see 10203 (the loco I wish to add sound to) as the prototype for class 40. So I will probably ask Legomanbiffo to do me the same. 

Our Legomanbiffo test model has 3 sugarcube speakers inside the model, replacing the one that is in there now.    Charlie

[JSpencer]

I have spent a part of the evening comparing the sounds of that video with old class 40 videos. The sounds are indeed strikingly close.

Utterly beautiful music.

[Kaput]

Anyone had issues with 10203 stalling randomly? Worse on points but also happening on random corners. All other locos glide around the track with no issues (Tested on DC and DCC).

Also do the models of 10203 not have the little stay alive/capacitor factory fitted or is mine even more dodgy?

[RFS]

Anyone had issues with 10203 stalling randomly? Worse on points but also happening on random corners. All other locos glide around the track with no issues (Tested on DC and DCC).

Also do the models of 10203 not have the little stay alive/capacitor factory fitted or is mine even more dodgy?

 

Don't have the problem of 10203 stalling. But the model does have pickups on all 6 powered axles so I'm not sure what benefit you'll get from a stay-alive capacitor.  I would assume it's quite small and unlikely to have enough power to move such a heavy loco.  More likely it's just there to provide power to the decoder in the event of momentary breaks. 

 

I would suggest testing that the pickups are working correctly on all wheels.

[Kaput]

Don't imagine the stay alive would make much difference either, was just curious as every review and chassis picture shows a capacitor fitted from the factory albeit on the 10201 models and it seemed a little odd to include it on the first models but not the later ones.

 

 

Not sure how to actually test the pickups, visually they all seem to be contacting the wheels fine and on a rolling road there seems to be no stalls.

 

Have sent a message to Kernow via the website to see what they suggest - to be entirely honest I don't think my sanity can handle needing to tinker and tweak a £180 model to get it running well.

[royaloak]

10202 seems to be out of stock.

There was one available earlier, until I saw it.

 

The sound fitted ones (all of them) seem to be out of stock now.

[MikeParkin65]

An interesting film clip there. If those are original sounds, and not dubbed ones, then it vindicates my choice of class 40 engine sounds with SR whistles and compressor sounds, done by legomanbiffo at my request.

I think the sound may have been dubbed at least in part. The exhaust beat of the Patriot doesn't match with the visible exhaust from the chimney with and Brit wheels are rotating faster than the beats per revolutuon. Doesnt mean all of it is dubbed though.

[adb968008]

I think the sound may have been dubbed at least in part. The exhaust beat of the Patriot doesn't match with the visible exhaust from the chimney with and Brit wheels are rotating faster than the beats per revolutuon. Doesnt mean all of it is dubbed though.

I had that thought too, but the owner says it’s as recorded on the tape, reading the comments underneath.

The sound of the Super D certainly sounds convincing.

Edited August 7, 2018 by adb968008

[cctransuk]

 

 

Fresh from its final overhaul, 10203 displays twin horns in place of the whistles, additional cab roof ventilators, small yellow warning panels; grey roof, overhead live wire plaques and shedplates; (plus Peco / Hornby Dublo couplings).

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[Joseph_Pestell]

IMG_4770.JPG

 

IMG_4775.JPG

 

Fresh from its final overhaul, 10203 displays twin horns in place of the whistles, additional cab roof ventilators, small yellow warning panels; grey roof, overhead live wire plaques and shedplates; (plus Peco / Hornby Dublo couplings).

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Nice to see someone still using Simplex couplers. So much better than tension lock and so much simpler than recent efforts.

[Joseph_Pestell]

Hi Jamie,

 

This video should answer your question,

 

 

Gibbo.

 

Lovely bit of film.

 

Note an ex-LNER Gresley coach behind the pair. Where do we think the train was going? I thought Euston would be their usual destination but I don't recall seeing pics with ex-LNER stock on the WCML. Useful prototype for everything with someone having borrowed it as a strengthener?

 

PS: I agree with those who say the sound is virtually indistinguishable from a 40.

[Ian Hargrave]

Lovely bit of film.

 

Note an ex-LNER Gresley coach behind the pair. Where do we think the train was going? I thought Euston would be their usual destination but I don't recall seeing pics with ex-LNER stock on the WCML. Useful prototype for everything with someone having borrowed it as a strengthener?

 

PS: I agree with those who say the sound is virtually indistinguishable from a 40.

Both the twins and the three Bulleids had an out and home morning turn from Euston to Wolverhampton and return when allocated to Camden (1B). Gresley stock was frequently used on the LMR.

[Kaput]

Managed to do a spot of testing with the rolling road and it looks like on one bogie only one axle is reliably picking up power.

 

Giving Kernow a couple days to respond before having to try and find time to phone them during work but its looking like I got the Friday afternoon special

Edited August 7, 2018 by Kaput