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Heljan announce Class 45 in OO


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1 minute ago, stovepipe said:

Yes that is right, part of the Brush refurbishment programme scope, from about 1965. The first examples turned out in GSYP and later in BFYE.

 

I recognise that this is slightly off-topic, but wasn't the fleet modification work contracted to Brush because they were effectively disqualified for a follow-on order of 47s, that was instead negotiated with English Electric unilaterally by the BRB to become Class 50.  Thus the Peaks were put through Loughborough to keep the workshop occupied.

 

Sorry; back on topic again.

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2 hours ago, stovepipe said:

Yes that is right, part of the Brush refurbishment programme scope, from about 1965. The first examples turned out in GSYP and later in BFYE.

That's interesting, I have noticed that the 45s which received the trapezoid grille also had their headcode boxes modified to single piece, suggesting that Brush were most likely responsible for those as well. That explains a great deal.

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7 hours ago, apollo 079 said:

The following is a summary of class 45/46s which for one reason or another did not have the standard sealed beam fronts at withdrawal:-

 

45025/7/47/53/61 retained outside split headcode boxes to withdrawal

45032/5/6 retained twin centre headcode boxes to withdrawal

45008/18/24/67 and 46005/12/20/4/37/41 retained single centre headcode boxes to withdrawal

45043 and 46016/47 has sealed beam lights but retained handrails and both WR and LMR headboard brackets to withdrawal

45143 had sealed beam lights but retained the WR and LMR headboard brackets to withdrawal

45147 has sealed beam lights but retailed the LMR headboard brackets to withdrawal.

All class 45/1s except 45147 carried the central headlight before withdrawal, though 45109 was not in this condition very long before it became the second eth peak to be withdrawn.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Kevin

 

 

Not sure about 46047, but 46049 missing from this list and that definitely did retain the handrails / brackets etc. 

 

Also worth noting is 45071, which in addition to retaining the handrails / brackets, was given smaller non-standard marker lights (more like those seen on disc fitted class 20's).

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57 minutes ago, Mophead45143 said:

 

Not sure about 46047, but 46049 missing from this list and that definitely did retain the handrails / brackets etc. 

 

Also worth noting is 45071, which in addition to retaining the handrails / brackets, was given smaller non-standard marker lights (more like those seen on disc fitted class 20's).

Sorry, typo, should be 46049, not 46047. Will correct. Also will add 45071 to the list. I was confused by a photo which was stated as 45071 but can't be because it has a trapezoid grille.

 

Kevin

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32 minutes ago, apollo 079 said:

That's interesting, I have noticed that the 45s which received the trapezoid grille also had their headcode boxes modified to single piece, suggesting that Brush were most likely responsible for those as well. That explains a great deal.

 

Not in all cases, for instance the 45's which were retro-fitted from split headcodes with doors to single piece headcodes did not receive the trapezoid grille.

 

45015 was one of them (I can mention that loco here right? It's not Preserved Diesels)

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3 minutes ago, Mophead45143 said:

 

Not in all cases, for instance the 45's which were retro-fitted from split headcodes with doors to single piece headcodes did not receive the trapezoid grille.

 

45015 was one of them (I can mention that loco here right? It's not Preserved Diesels)

Yes, I think a few were done at Derby so they didn't receive grilles. Some mods at one end would be crash repairs, like no1 end of 44009. This seems to have been a whole new cab since it had shorter handrails at that end. But I digress.

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Back at the main PC now, D154 was the first refurbished 46 at Brush in September 1965, the class were completed by May 1968.

 

Some of the class 45s were also refurbished beginning in 1967, but I think only up to about 20 were completed before it was shelved, probably because the dual-braking programme took over from 1969. I think all of these early refurbs had the trapezoidal grille and single centre headcodes. Some had plated over boiler grilles and some didn't, not sure why.

 

With the exception of D11, the split/door locos weren't dealt with until 1969, being dual-braked at Derby, with trapezoidal grilles plated over at the same time. D12-17 were treated in this period. I think D11 was one of the early refurbs, but a 1968 photo would confirm it...

 

 

 

Edited by stovepipe
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15 minutes ago, stovepipe said:

Back at the main PC now, D154 was the first refurbished 46 at Brush in September 1965, the class were completed by May 1968.

 

Some of the class 45s were also refurbished at Brush, beginning in 1967, but I think only up to about 20 were completed before it was shelved, probably because the dual-braking programme started in 1969. I think all of these Brush refurbs had the trapezoidal grille and single centre headcodes. Some had plated over boiler grilles and some didn't, not sure why.

 

With the exception of D11, the split/door locos weren't dealt with until 1969, being dual-braked at Derby, with trapezoidal grilles plated over at the same time. D12-17 were treated in this period. I think D11 was one of the Brush refurbs, but a 1968 photo would confirm it...

 

 

 

That makes sense as only 20 class 45s received trapezoid grilles. Derby obviously decided the mod was not required so left the rest of the 45s as they were built. Quite a few 45s received single piece centre headcode boxes at Derby, including 45001/11/5/6/8/24/6, all early split box built machines.

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22 minutes ago, stovepipe said:

I've edited my post as it appears it wasn't Brush who did the early class 45 refurbs, but Derby Works, however the work scope changed in 1969 after about 20 locos.

Ok, edited my response to suit. My guess is the additional ventilation proved to be of  little or no benefit, so they cancelled the mod, which was what I suspected. Reminds me of the headcode box mods on a few late English 24s. Also done by Derby at around the same time...

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I think the idea initially was to iron out the wiring, train heating and ventilation niggles and standardise the fleet, but progressively the scope was cut back to save money, no doubt informed by how the first locos were getting on. So first ventilation was deleted, then standardised headcode displays, then it was into dual braking, ETH conversion, nose corrosion removal, and then finally headlights.  BR invested in the class pretty heavily over the years. Here's a pic of D11 in 1970 - looks like an eary Derby refurb with the trapezoidal grille.

 

p622183811-5.jpg

 

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22 minutes ago, stovepipe said:

I think the idea initially was to iron out the wiring, train heating and ventilation niggles and standardise the fleet, but progressively the scope was cut back to save money, no doubt informed by how the first locos were getting on. So first ventilation was deleted, then standardised headcode displays, then it was into dual braking, ETH conversion, nose corrosion removal, and then finally headlights.  BR invested in the class pretty heavily over the years. Here's a pic of D11 in 1970 - looks like an eary Derby refurb with the trapezoidal grille.

 

p622183811-5.jpg

 

That's right, the later 45122 of course.

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10 hours ago, Ian J. said:

OK, now a little fly in the oinkment - 45 119 had sealed beam lights and no HI light in 1985, but also had a plated-over trapezoid grill judging by pictures I can see online (https://hiveminer.com/Tags/45119%2Cpeak). So, is Heljan doing their 454xx series with a trapezoid grill or plated over?

Of the 45s so far announced by Heljan in the standard range, only 45106 had the trapezoid grilles fitted.

 

Locos with the grilles were (original numbers):-

D11/8/21/33/43/51/3/9/60/1/82/5/6/90/1/4/106/16/20/6

TOPS numbers:-

45008/19/22/6/41/56/102-9/12/4/21/2/34/41.

As far as is known, no other 45s ever carried trapezoid grilles. This was a modification (see above) which was made to all 56 class 46s and just the above 20 class 45s.

 

45119 is not in the above list, so the model should be a standard one with the original trapezoid access panel.

 

Kevin

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Hi Can anyone confirm the suggestion made earlier that there were two different sizes of one piece centre? I had noticed that the one piece looks deeper than the equivalent split centre type - but might be an illusion as the split type edges were painted yellow whereas the centre type edges were black (actually the rubber surround - see later reply).

Edited by Hal Nail
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The one piece glass is deeper , due to the centre split panels having an aluminium frame in which the glass sat, the single piece glass was retained by a rubber strip straight in to the nose end.

 

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8 hours ago, apollo 079 said:

Of the 45s so far announced by Heljan in the standard range, only 45106 had the trapezoid grilles fitted.

 

Locos with the grilles were (original numbers):-

D11/8/21/33/43/51/3/9/60/1/82/5/6/90/1/4/106/16/20/6

TOPS numbers:-

45008/19/22/6/41/56/102-9/12/4/21/2/34/41.

As far as is known, no other 45s ever carried trapezoid grilles. This was a modification (see above) which was made to all 56 class 46s and just the above 20 class 45s.

 

45119 is not in the above list, so the model should be a standard one with the original trapezoid access panel.

 

Kevin

 

Thanks. So it will be a case of hoping Hattons unnumbered version will have the right panel (which it probably will), or if not, then renumbering a model of 45 133. Either way it looks like I should be OK.

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On 05/06/2019 at 09:26, 25901 said:

 

46035 as preserved, is that with the same style body as 45015 lol

Must not take the bait...

must not take the bait...

must not take the bait...

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  • 2 weeks later...

This is the best model news for a long time, I loved the peaks and although the Bachmann model is still a good model it should be possible for Heljan to move things on significantly. I'll be in for at least a couple of these, hopefully the wait won't be too long!

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 03/06/2019 at 11:41, 61661 said:

Good Morning All,

Thanks for the overwhelmingly positive reaction to this announcement. As you might have guessed, we've been working on this for some time and if the first batch sells well there will be more to cover other livery/detail variations that haven't made it into the initial production run (hence the gaps in item numbers). We were also keen to ensure that retailers and modellers were not overwhelmed with a large number of short-run locos in one hit, possibly causing confusion and upset if people can't afford/obtain all they want and end up missing out. 

For the sake of clarity, the item numbers have been chosen to identify different sub-types, rather than allocated randomly. They are as follows: 
#451XX = steam heat, vac or dual brake 45/0 with glazed split-centre headcode panels

#453XX = steam heat, dual brake 45/0 with sealed beam nose ends

#454XX = Electric heat, dual brake 45/1 with sealed beam nose ends

#455XX = as above but with square HI headlight added

The eagle-eyed among you will notice that there's a gap for #452XX. This was intended to be early ETH-fitted 45/1s with glazed split-centre headcode panels but due to the limited lifespan and lack of variety in liveries for this variant we held it over to reduce complication in the initial batch. It might appear later if there is sufficient demand. Other variants may also appear in due course if the model is a success. We would be interested to find out what your priorities are from the following options: 

- Class 46 - both original and sealed beam ends

- Split headcode Class 45 without centre doors

- As above but with centre doors 

- Single centre headcode Class 45 

 

Droopy couplings: We have specifically asked for all future OO locos to have the shorter variant of our tension lock coupling as developed for the O2 'Tango' but not used since for some reason. I've had a bee in my bonnet about this problem on Heljan locos for a long time, so it will not get approved unless the couplings are right. The same applies to headcode typefaces, which is something we've been particular attention to recently. 

 

Chassis: An image of the chassis and drive mechanism was issued with the press release and can be viewed on our Facebook page. It's a central motor with two flywheels and, as far as I am aware (will check the models when EP samples arrive) pick ups on all except the pony wheels. Apart from the Class 47 faulty metal issue from many years ago, we are not aware of any problems with Heljan loco chassis, including the Class 23.

 

Hope this helps to provide a little more insight into what we're doing and how we are doing it. 

 

Kindest Regards

 

Ben

 

 

 

Count me on for two with central doors and split boxes as per D11 to D15

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