Jump to content

Hippo

Model Rail / Heljan Class 11 0-6-0DE

Recommended Posts

11s seem a bit of a minefield with details,  the one on the north Norfolk has four marker lights which I suspect were fitted in preservation but I have seen pictures of them in service with four.

It also has wipers and these were fitted before it was on the railway so either BR or NCB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
1 hour ago, russ p said:

11s seem a bit of a minefield with details,  the one on the north Norfolk has four marker lights which I suspect were fitted in preservation but I have seen pictures of them in service with four.

It also has wipers and these were fitted before it was on the railway so either BR or NCB

Hi Russ

 

The LMR seemed to keep with just the two lights. Some ER locos had four lights fitted some time in the sixties. The rear conduit run was not the same as on a BR 350 on some locos, I think it was a Stratford own design.  12108 has the ER style and 12127 has BR style. The six (G)WR locos also received 4 lights same as an early class 08. The SR class 12s did get six lights fore and aft in two styles of conduit run .

 

Also note the ER based class 11, the (G)WR and the class 12 locomotives received windscreen wipers. The LMR locos seemed never to have had them fitted.

 

Here is number 15232 with the air brake pipes on the buffer beam as mentioned by Stu (Lapford)

  • Informative/Useful 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There will be a limit to the number of tooling variations we can accommodate to cover individual variations. (CJL)

  • Informative/Useful 1
  • Friendly/supportive 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, dibber25 said:

There will be a limit to the number of tooling variations we can accommodate to cover individual variations. (CJL)

 

How about including some additional marker lights on the detailing sprue, to enable purchasers to produce variants not available within the main releases.

 

Regards,

John isherwood.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, dibber25 said:

There will be a limit to the number of tooling variations we can accommodate to cover individual variations. (CJL)

Hi Chris

 

I can fully understand that, but as modellers we can use those toolings to customize our purchase(s) to the variation we want especially as they are minor variations.

  • Like 1
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

How about including some additional marker lights on the detailing sprue, to enable purchasers to produce variants not available within the main releases.

 

Regards,

John isherwood.

That sort of thing, we can probably do. The restrictions are in the main tooling, if lots of separate slides are needed in different places. I'll need to keep fairly quiet on this one, though, as it's a class of loco that I know nothing about. Must admit, I was never that much into diesel shunters - DMUs, hydraulics and steam were more my 'thing'. (CJL)

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The one on the north Norfolk was at Stratford I believe so lights and wipers were probably done there

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, dibber25 said:

That sort of thing, we can probably do. The restrictions are in the main tooling, if lots of separate slides are needed in different places. I'll need to keep fairly quiet on this one, though, as it's a class of loco that I know nothing about. Must admit, I was never that much into diesel shunters - DMUs, hydraulics and steam were more my 'thing'. (CJL)

 

Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than me can suggest what detailing items would be required to make the model as useful to modellers as is reasonably possible?

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than me can suggest what detailing items would be required to make the model as useful to modellers as is reasonably possible?

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

 

Believe me, where this particular class is concerned we have plenty of expertise, both on our staff and at Heljan - it's just not a loco that I know anything about, so I'm leaving it to those who do. (CJL) 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 13/07/2019 at 10:12, PenrithBeacon said:

I think that the lack of wheels in EM/P4 would knacker any conversion. This loco had 4"-0.5" wheels with the 'bevelled' rim. The 08 had 4'-6" also with the bevelled rim. I don't know how many spokes in either case. Wheels for the 08 are readily available, but there are, to the best of my knowledge, no wheels available that feature a 4'-0" o/d, bevelled rim and no crankpin. I suppose that those with a lathe could modify the RTR wheels, but for the rest of us this model is best passed by. A pity but there it is.

 

Regards

I don't think it matters whether the replacement wheels have crankpin bosses or not ....... 99.999999% of the population wouldn't  turn your model over to see whether they were hiding behind the frames !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Wickham Green said:

I don't think it matters whether the replacement wheels have crankpin bosses or not ....... 99.999999% of the population wouldn't  turn your model over to see whether they were hiding behind the frames !

With respect, it isn't possible to hide the rim! It will be possible to carve away the crankpin boss, even my limited skills will allow for that, but the bevelled rim is very distinctive and that is going to present issues for the finescale modeller. This model, as welcome as it is, will not work for the finescale modeller unless the wheels are available, and as both AGW and Ultrascale have clearly moved their attention away from wheels to developing other parts of their businesses, I really don't think that is going to happen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Wickham Green said:

I don't think it matters whether the replacement wheels have crankpin bosses or not ....... 99.999999% of the population wouldn't  turn your model over to see whether they were hiding behind the frames !

I wouldn't be so sure. I was exhibiting my layout at the Woking show  and this well dressed bloke reached over the barrier picked up a scratchbuilt loco. Looked underneath it and bumbled in a posh plumb in the mouth accent " It is not Hornby" and plonked down on the layout not even back on the tracks. And just walked off.

 

I have had someone reach over and pick up, yet another scratchbuilt loco, off the stock table. He then proceeded to have an argument with the trader next door to me as it didn't have a price tag on it and he wanted to know how much it was. He did not believe the trader or me that it wasn't for sale and it was mine.

 

As I am on about scratchbuilt locos, anyone want the parts to build two class 11 shunters, motors, gears, wheels, plastic card, fly cranks ? Or shall I keep them and still have a bash?

 

As for crank pin bosses, they are not noticeable on locos with outside frames.

007a.jpg.71ae2b29a9dc41e70be4fbfa64549cf7.jpg

Not the worlds best but all my own work.

 

Edited by Clive Mortimore
  • Like 4
  • Craftsmanship/clever 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Clive Mortimore said:

I was exhibiting my layout at the Woking show  and this well dressed bloke reached over the barrier picked up a scratchbuilt loco. Looked underneath it and bumbled in a posh plumb in the mouth accent " It is not Hornby" and plonked down on the layout not even back on the tracks. And just walked off.

 

I have had some reach over and pick up, yet another scratchbuilt loco, off the stock table. He then proceeded to have an argument with the trader next door to me as it didn't have a price tag on it and he wanted to know how much it was. He did not believe the trader or me that it wasn't for sale and it was mine.

 

Some people are just flat-out rude!

  • Agree 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

...I was exhibiting my layout at the Woking show  and this well dressed bloke reached over the barrier picked up a scratchbuilt loco. Looked underneath it and bumbled in a posh plum in the mouth accent " It is not Hornby" and plonked down on the layout not even back on the tracks. And just walked off...

Last reported sighting of Lord Faynesquale. You lucky man...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, PenrithBeacon said:

With respect, it isn't possible to hide the rim! It will be possible to carve away the crankpin boss, even my limited skills will allow for that, but the bevelled rim is very distinctive and that is going to present issues for the finescale modeller. This model, as welcome as it is, will not work for the finescale modeller unless the wheels are available, and as both AGW and Ultrascale have clearly moved their attention away from wheels to developing other parts of their businesses, I really don't think that is going to happen.

With all due respect - I don't think I said anything about rims !!?! ............................. have you investigated the possibility of using tender wheels ?

 

Incidentally, while on the subject of wheels, I'm a little concerned that I don't think I've seen any mention, on this thread,  of the fact that the ( BFB ) wheels under a 'Class 12' are bigger than those of its L.M.S. predecessor ... I hope Heljan are aware of this !!?!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Wickham Green said:

With all due respect - I don't think I said anything about rims !!?! ............................. have you investigated the possibility of using tender wheels ?

 

Incidentally, while on the subject of wheels, I'm a little concerned that I don't think I've seen any mention, on this thread,  of the fact that the ( BFB ) wheels under a 'Class 12' are bigger than those of its L.M.S. predecessor ... I hope Heljan are aware of this !!?!

A research package will be put together by Model Rail and supplied to Heljan's UK agent.  Whether it is possible to incorporate all the detail differences, only time will tell. (CJL)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Wickham Green said:

With all due respect - I don't think I said anything about rims !!?! ............................. have you investigated the possibility of using tender wheels ?

 

Incidentally, while on the subject of wheels, I'm a little concerned that I don't think I've seen any mention, on this thread,  of the fact that the ( BFB ) wheels under a 'Class 12' are bigger than those of its L.M.S. predecessor ... I hope Heljan are aware of this !!?!

Yes and AGW don't do a tender wheel of the appropriate size with a bevelled rim. Can you stop trolling now?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Excellent news, guess I can put the Lima and Bachmann bodies back in the stash

 

From the IRS handbook it looks like in addition to the NCB loco offered, the following locos mentioned on the initial list also ended up in Industrial service

 

C.11
 

12052 - NCBOE Widdington coal disposal point

12049 - Day and Sons (London)

 

C.12

15224 - Kent coalfields

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Would love to recreate the ones which languished at Stratford in the early 1970s, ending up in the storage lines withe the Baby Deltics.  They had a strange patina of oil, black paint and rust on them giving them an overall charcoal look. Can't even remember idenifying a totem on them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Down_Under said:

Excellent news, guess I can put the Lima and Bachmann bodies back in the stash

 

From the IRS handbook it looks like in addition to the NCB loco offered, the following locos mentioned on the initial list also ended up in Industrial service

 

C.11
 

12052 - NCBOE Widdington coal disposal point

12049 - Day and Sons (London)

 

C.12

15224 - Kent coalfields

12049 was then donated by Day and Sons to the Mid Hants Railway. Sadly it was destroyed by the fire at Ropley which also claimed an ex LSWR Dining coach. The full explanation is on the MHR website which I quote 

"The original 12049 was purchased by DAY Aggregates at Brentford, South West London, and used to shunt their internal sidings. Sadly 12049 was damaged beyond repair by a fire at Ropley in 2010, and has subsequently been replaced by sister 12082 from Barrow Hill and numbered as 12049.

Service History:

12082 was built at Derby Works in November 1950 and initially allocated to Carlisle Kingmoor shed (68A).  She moved around between Kingmoor, Carlisle Upperby, Speke Junction and Toton sheds before moving to Crewe Diesel Depot (5A) on 10/12/66.  Her final allocation for British Rail was to Llandudno Junction (6G) on 15/08/70, staying there until being withdrawn from service on 03/10/71.

From this point onwards 12082 worked in industrial service for the NCB and latterly the Harry Needle Railway Company, before moving to the Mid Hants Railway in 2010."

Edited by Chris116
Better and more accurate information

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Why are people getting agitated about the possibilities/ramifications of finescale conversions, the model is years away from production and we don't know what it will incorporate, it might even be an easy conversion so chill out.

 

Mike.

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good advice, I chilled as soon as I realised that the wheels aren't available and are unlikely to be, ever. I've got several 08s stashed away.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Dr Gerbil-Fritters said:

What are the differences between an 08 and an 11?  I can't see anything obvious... 

03

 

IGMC

  • Funny 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Dr Gerbil-Fritters said:

What are the differences between an 08 and an 11?  I can't see anything obvious... 

 

 

There are loads to be honest.  The 11 has smaller wheels a has a different shape cab . The front windows are a different shape.

  • Agree 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.