Where has everyone gone?

[Oldddudders]

I know some people regard RMweb as social media, although I am not among them. Within the broad kirk that is enthusiasm for railways full size and model, I am here far more to learn and enthuse than to glad-hand. I do have a Facebook page, but it sees me every couple of months or so, and seldom for very long. 

 

When Deb and i moved here in 2004 I took over a 17' x 20' barn, with very low ceiling, and within a couple of years had constructed a working walkaround US HO layout. I have lots and lots of locos and stock, having modelled US HO since the mid-80s. But then I became aware of the sea-change in quality of UK OO, and roughly one third of the layout is now based in Devon. I now have lots and lots of UK OO! Running sessions based upon a real WTT for Halwill Junction are quite rewarding. 

 

In one of the through roads of the US station a Rio Grande Athearn Challenger sits, on a dozen stock cars. Its sound system starts up every time I boot up the DCC. On the odd occasion I have a visitor, the Challenger does a lap and incurs oohs and ahs. One of these days I will tidy up the OO and have an HO operating session. Maybe.  

[F-UnitMad]

9 hours ago, pH said:

some US sellers won't post 'abroad' at all,

I've come across that problem on ebay. I even asked one "Lower 48 Only" Seller if they would consider shipping to the UK, it was an item I really, really wanted*.

They flatly refused. After the item sold, I sent a very polite message saying how it was a pity they refused to consider shipping to the UK, as I was prepared to bid rather a lot more than the item actually sold for. I never got a reply....

 

*It was such a 'must have' item that now, of course, I can't for the life of me remember what it was...

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

24 minutes ago, F-UnitMad said:

*It was such a 'must have' item that now, of course, I can't for the life of me remember what it was...

 

I bet it was a Soo line F unit 

 

[F-UnitMad]

1 hour ago, Dr Gerbil-Fritters said:

 

I bet it was a Soo line F unit 

 

It was most likely Soo Line, but not an engine.

[Ref44]

I'm in the process of dusting down my American O scale stock. A certain "Chicago Fork" introduced me to the scale back in 2011. Over the years Ebay has supplied around 50 freight cars plus too many locos. Not being so interested in more modern times, 40ft boxcars could be picked up cheaply. Even allowing for replacement wheels and couplers, they came out at less than the cost of a UK wagon kit. The first turnout for a new layout is under way using Right o Way bits plus Karlgarin rail. Age and a disabled wife means that the project must be simple, which the larger scale helps to enforce.

[Patrick SPF]

I am still actively modeling US in both N and HO, but a move north has had an effect on my modeling, along with the issue of finding transition era stock (does anyone do Accrurail in Europe?).
As well as moving and getting far too much garden to deal with I am also involved with the NMRA British Region....

[Northroader]

12 hours ago, Prof Klyzlr said:

Dear Northroader,

 

"Shortisation", I like that ;-) 

 

Happy Modelling, 

Aim to Improve, 

Prof Klyzlr 

 

Prof, if YOU say it’s OK.. Wahooo!!

 

[Allegheny1600]

Thanks for the replies, everyone.

It is good to know that the NA scene (I always include USA, Canada & Mexico in that term) is still alive even though it is definitely not as vibrant as it was back in the late eighties/early nineties when I first started crossing the Atlantic!

I note that "Model Railroader" appears not to be a patch on what it used to be as it's a LOT thinner for a start! The articles seem somehow less informative and the layout descriptions very formulaic as though the authors are told how and what to write.

Maybe it was because I was 'new' to that part of the hobby and eager to soak up everything in sight.

Anyway, a taster of what has sparked my interest;

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=687615

(c) Marty Bernard, rrpicture archives.

I find this to be the absolute "classic" Chicago image! There was a similar image in an article in "Rail Enthusiast" in, I think, the early 1980s that was probably the precursor of my NA interest.

Cheers,

John.

[Johann Marsbar]

Currently working on my New-England(ish) N layout which is theoretically mid 50's to late 60's with overhead electrification (PRR & NH), though I've got sufficient stock to run up to about 2000 with "modern" items as well. Also constructed a small portable layout for said "modern" items that has been to a couple of exhibitions locally (ie last years NGS Worldwide AGM).

 

Haven't bought much stock lately due to poor £:$ rates - last ones were from a visit to Kleins in Baltimore over 3 years ago, and you can't even do tyhat now as they have closed the "walk in" part of their business - plus I have exhausted the RTR items that fit either layout to be honest. May end up scratchbuilding some "odd" things like suburban EMU's etc, but have spent more time scratchbuilding structures than anything else over the past couple of years. You just can't get the sort of buildings I need in kit form, as I don't want an identikit DPM/Walthers townscape!!

Have posted items on the N Gauge Forum, but have never put anything about the layout(s) on here as yet.

Edited February 23, 2020 by Johann Marsbar

[warbonnetuk]

I think it might be a cyclical thing. Since I've built "Galatia" and "Hacienda Ave" my US modelling has taken a bit of a back seat to build my Swiss HOm layout but I'm still running a US Freemo meet, member of NMRA British Region and Chair + Exhibition Manager of Seaboard Southern (local NMRA group) and I've started dabbling on 0n30 California logging. My main problem (in HO) is finding some inspiration for a new compact layout that isnt just rehashing my previous layouts.

Edited February 23, 2020 by warbonnetuk

[298]

8 hours ago, Andy Reichert said:

 

Standard US layout compression and short trains are also covered by modelling various Interurban systems.  Adding the single overhead wire and trolley poles can be far simpler than modelling UK/European Catenary OHLE.

 

Usually there was short freight handlihg as well, And because  of the frequency, you can have almost constant movement when operating. And did I mention tight radii to make modelling in small spaces easy.

 

 A great read is. https://www.amazon.com/Traction-Guidebook-Model-Railroaders-Schafer/dp/0890245223

 

Andy

 

 

 

I've tried to promote the genre ( really I have), but would be the first to admit that trolley pole freight switching really isn't that relaxing or compliant with the hands-off operation that was always the selling point with US Kadee equipped stock. Pantographs are easier in this respect although the overhead catenary for them is more complex and requires finer tolerances like you say. A previous layout "Wiley City" sat at home as a pretty ornament and was rarely operated, whereas my switching inglenook "Blue Heron" is run much more frequently.

 

I would like to build another Yakima Valley layout (in HO or O) but have too many other project ideas on the go and no time to exhibit them unfortunately. 

Edited February 23, 2020 by 298

[Alcanman]

I noticed a downturn in postings, particularly those building small US layouts, a few years ago. I got a lot of inspiration from some of the small layout builders.

 

When I started posting back in 2011 (CSX Palmetto Spur) the response was great,  friendly and helpful. I subsequently built quite a few small US switching layouts but I seem to have run out of ideas. I'm stuck with a small space (9ft x 15ins) and I've simply have built enough inglenooks and timesavers.

 

The cost of Importing sound fitted locos from the US has become prohibitive so I won't be buying any more.

 

I've noticed a few people who used post on here are now using Facebook.

 

I may have to resort to a UK themed, small TMD layout for my next layout. Not very original! 

 

 

 

[Nova Scotian]

13 hours ago, pH said:

 

I'm lucky, living just 42km north of the border. I can get stuff posted to a 'parcel receiving' place in Blaine, Washington State at internal US postal rates. In fact (sorry!) some sellers will post free to 'lower 48' addresses. Also, some US sellers won't post 'abroad' at all, so it sometimes means I can bid on things I couldn't otherwise. Always declare things coming back, and I've not been asked for import charges. 

I did this more often when I was an hour from the border - although I can never quite get over calling it "Calis" when it's spelled Calais...

 

Even within Canada the postage is $17 on most items - I'm modelling on a budget (divorced, two kids, live in two provinces) so $10 for a coach is great, $27 not so.

 

Until recently the merest of lip service seems to have been given to Canadian modellers too - Lima were probably the worst offender of just throwing Via Rail (or other) liveries on their US products to satisfy Canadian buyers (even when those locomotives never made it up here!). Older Bachman here were awful quality, I wasn't expecting such weedy motors after my UK experience being so positive. With Rapido in particular the high-end is being well taken care of.

 

The second place I live has a club - they do an open day most weekends so people can watch their running sessions. I take my kids occasionally - https://www.facebook.com/sjsmrr/

[Prof Klyzlr]

Dear Alcan,

 

Quote

... I subsequently built quite a few small US switching layouts but I seem to have run out of ideas .... I've simply have built enough inglenooks and timesavers.

 

...

 

I may have to resort to a UK themed, small TMD layout for my next layout. Not very original! 

 

Soooo, If I read these two statements correctly, do I take it there's no real difference in "doing the same gag again" between:
- a re-re-rehashed "Inglenook"

VS
- a re-re-rehashed "TMD"

 

bar a change in terminology and geographic locale? ;-)

 

That's where I'd be prompted to respond:
"...never enough Proto-nooks,..." ;-)
(No, I did not mis-spell or have an Auto-correct hiccup... ;-) )

IE any "main + 2x spurs" array may well look like an "Inglenook",
and if car-spotted on the whims of a die or random-number-gen, could "play" like one,

but it's the specific prototype usage that takes this "simple common track-array" and spins it out into a head-warping range of visual, aural, and operational possibilities... and remember that what happens "on-stage on a 'Nook" is materially affected by what happens "off-stage",
whether in physical staging, or somewhere 100s of miles "beyond the modelled scene"...

 

HINT: What role does a Trackmobile, or a Shoving-Platform caboose have on a 'Nook?
HINT: which end of a 'Nook should the train arrive/depart from?

(to mention just 2)

 

I mean, look at "Sweetener Co" at Lodi on the CCT
(Railbox Boxcars, Covered Hoppers, and Syrup cars,
spotted between 2x car-spot-critical industries,
on what looks for all the world like a 'Nook...)

 

or the "FOGChart" for Clackamas, Ore,
("Holman Foods" car-spot  instructions on Freedman's FOGChart are Begging to be investigated,
and the Wymore warehouse and tank-farm spurs could make a car-spot 'Nook on steroids...)

 

or "the MJ Lead" on CSX in Michigan...

(2 spurs, in opposing directions, on a couple-mile-long branch,
handled by _one_ loco, in _one_ pass, with _no_ runaround,..
Centrebeam flats of lumber, and Covered Hoppers of plastic pellets IIRC...
...and could fit in HO on between 8 and 12' x 1', depending on whether you include the branch turnout off the subdivision main and the keynote "grade crossing" which forms the ceremonial "end of the branch" boundary...

...OK, it's not a 'Nook, but you know you're intrigued, YT has the reference footage... ;-)  ).

 

Happy Modelling,
Aiming to Improve,
Prof Klyzlr

PS I miss Shortliner Jack...
(Talk about "Inspiration cup runneth over"... ;-)  ).

 

Edited February 23, 2020 by Prof Klyzlr

[enginelane]

On 22/02/2020 at 11:25, Allegheny1600 said:

Hi All,

I know that I am somewhat guilty of abandoning North American outline railroading for the past few years so I'm not blaming anyone here but - where has everyone gone?

This section of the forum used to be quite lively with people introducing new projects, layouts, kit-bashes, detailing and so forth.

Not only that but there used to be so many US outline dealers here in the UK - almost all gone now.

OTOH, I can think of LSWR, Porter-Wynn, MG Sharp, The Signal Box as well as smaller part-time dealers like J. Sammans, J. Hey and others. Now I learn that Model Junction is closing down. Macs seems to have disappeared offline too.

By my reckoning that leaves Mech Models in BoT, RailsofS, Kittle Hobby(?), Contikits, Anoraks and the American Railroad Centre in Bodmin - is there anyone else who is fairly serious? I'm not counting shops that only stock a small line of secondhand items.

 

So - have most people simply changed focus or disappeared from this mortal coil? Quite a few of the people I used to know have done the latter, sadly and others have simply disappeared with no trace. Still others have gone 'British' or 'European' (I have been one of the latter!).

 

I've only noticed this as I've had a resurgence of interest in US outline as dealing with buffers is one of my greatest bugbears and I feel like going American again!

Cheers,

John.

Heart issues and poor weather reducing time that can be spent in the garage on the new layout. Agree that it is becoming more difficult to purchase items as outlets seem to be closing. For me Model Junction big loss. 

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

On ‎22‎/‎02‎/‎2020 at 11:25, Allegheny1600 said:

...Still others have gone 'British' or 'European' ...

To the extent that I 'never arrived'. There I was, arriving at a time of life when a little more space, time and money meant that I could resume the model railway interest properly, having largely laid it aside for career, mortgage, marriage (you know the rest). A combination of globally distributed family and much time travelling on business had me all set to go HO, and I had settled on North American, for the considerable benefits it offered over OO, for which the RTR support had always been little better than dismal.

 

And then in late 1999 Bachmann ambushed me with the WD 2-8-0, and BR's standard mineral wagons and mk1 coaches, all to a standard that had previously required a proficient kit builder to obtain! Suddenly modelling the mainline BR steam to diesel transition looked like it might be achievable from RTR; Hornby and Heljan joined in, and that was that. (I would have been very sceptical those 20 years ago, if someone had dared a prediction of the scale of coverage RTR OO now enjoys. I was still expecting to have to build an awful lot myself.)

Edited February 23, 2020 by 34theletterbetweenB&D
to insert a date

[D9020 Nimbus]

Model Railroader has shrunk a lot, and many of its one-time rivals have disappeared. I notice that it has a lot less advertising than once used to be the case—that may be one reason why. British magazines, by contrast, seem to have lost relatively less advertising, and there are still four major newsstand magazines—one more than in the hobby's supposed heyday and certainly more than in the US now, I think…

 

I have an interest in US N gauge, though I haven't built a layout as yet. One attraction is the Microtrains couplers. N Scale American Trains, at one time the 'N' side of Model Junction, are still around. US models—especially more modern ones—are significantly bigger than UK or European models; given the ever-decreasing size of houses, I wonder if this is a factor?

[F-UnitMad]

3 hours ago, Alcanman said:

I subsequently built quite a few small US switching layouts but I seem to have run out of ideas. I'm stuck with a small space (9ft x 15ins) and I've simply have built enough inglenooks and timesavers.

I can understand that sentiment. At one of the TVNAM shows, one of our more prolific layout builders (who has mostly migrated to Facebook I think) confided to me that, having built so many small 'switchers' himself, & operated other's similar layouts at shows, at the end of the day the actual operation was essentially the same regardless of layout setting, Railroad or Era:- pushing & pulling rolling stock in & out of spurs, & it could get rather 'stale'.

I think such a feeling might have spurred on the Freemo idea; yes there's the switching to do, but much else besides to retain interest, & it's the closest UK modellers are going to get to US Basement Empire-style operations.

I kept in mind these thoughts when I designed my own home layout. Several different operations are possible on it - switching spurs, interchanging stock between Class 1 & Short Line, & even a roundy-roundy for just watching trains highball - all to keep some variety & avoid 'sameness' in ops, or the layout becoming 'stale'. As it's very much a long-term project (it's taken over 5 years just to hand-spike all the track) I'm glad to say that despite it's simplicity as a track plan, it's been a very successful design in that regard.

 

But back to the original point, maybe the 'small US switching layout' has had it's day, for a while at least?

[mdvle]

4 hours ago, Allegheny1600 said:

I note that "Model Railroader" appears not to be a patch on what it used to be as it's a LOT thinner for a start! The articles seem somehow less informative and the layout descriptions very formulaic as though the authors are told how and what to write.

Maybe it was because I was 'new' to that part of the hobby and eager to soak up everything in sight.

 

There is certainly a "I have moved beyond Model Railroader" aspect, but there are also several other factors.

 

The US magazine business has been hurt badly by the Internet, with a lot of titles disappearing.

 

And, Kalmbach still seems to feel that this "Internet thing" is a fad and will go away and thus there is no reason for them to adapt to the times.

 

With that said, even the "free" Model Railroad Hobbyist" had to introduce a paid supplement because Google/Facebook/etc. are taking all the online advertising revenue and leaving little for the actual producers of content.

 

3 hours ago, Alcanman said:

I noticed a downturn in postings, particularly those building small US layouts, a few years ago. I got a lot of inspiration from some of the small layout builders.

 

Wonder if things like the Peckett and other small steam in OO drew some of the small layout people away?

 

3 hours ago, Alcanman said:

When I started posting back in 2011 (CSX Palmetto Spur) the response was great,  friendly and helpful. I subsequently built quite a few small US switching layouts but I seem to have run out of ideas. I'm stuck with a small space (9ft x 15ins) and I've simply have built enough inglenooks and timesavers.

 

Well, Tony Koesters Wingate layout is 16'x30" in O, so maybe an inspiration for something outside of a timesaver/inglenook.  There is a thread on here with some images, and perhaps someone could send you a copy of the track plan if it can't be found online - though really you could apply the same thing to any small town and the Library of Congress has lots of early 1900's insurance plans online.

 

Or these insurance plans from Calgary show some industrial sidings that may be different enough

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/47081-track-plans-for-north-american-layouts/&do=findComment&comment=3717129

 

 

[steve1]

I’m still exhibiting Duncan’s Mine 2 and a friend and I are in the planning stages of a bigger switching layout.

 

Bad new about Model Junction, they were always my first port of call for US stuff.

 

steve

[F-UnitMad]

29 minutes ago, mdvle said:

Wonder if things like the Peckett and other small steam in OO drew some of the small layout people away?

Quite possibly - and here in the UK I wouldn't underestimate the impact of the current boom in RTR O Scale, especially the smaller, more affordable locos, both steam & diesel. Using short locos & 4-wheel wagons, a small O scale UK shunting layout can be built in a similar space to that of a US HO switching layout. For anyone short of space & looking for something different to the usual OO 'mainstream', I suspect UK O is taking over from US/EU outlines.

[long island jack]

I'm still plodding away with my American HO, but both my exhibition layouts, 59th and Rust and End of the spur will be retired at the end of the year, (invites finally dried up),and a new small switching layout is underway.

 

 Don't get on here much, just call in now and then, had a spell on facebook, which is now going the same way, I like the freemo idea, but again don't get down to the Midland group much (450miles+ round trip),and always seems to clash with other things.

 

Buying American HO has also stopped(unless it's lovely Alco at the right price), i've more than enough, but have been tempted with some of the smaller UK engines for Brewery sidings and another small UK layout under construction.

[Philou]

I'm not into US based stuff at all - and I only stumbled into this thread as I was intrigued by the title - I do look at US diesel photos from time to time (street running I find intriguing) but I come away every time with a feeling of 'MEH'. I mean the locos all look the same and seemingly have so done for the last 30 or 40 years (in my view) and its only the colours that change - and a lot seem really pig-ugly too with little or no character (talk about putting lip-stick on a pig ). Is that a part of the problem? At least in the UK (and Europe) there are oodles of different locos and stock and far, far more variety in passenger carrying stock whereas it does seem to me on the US scene, it's endless miles of freight, freight and cubes. I cannot say that that would hold any real interest for me.

 

However, on the upside I do have a Rivarossi 'Challenger' bought in the late 1970s that is a very nice loco and despite not ever having run it in the 40-odd years that I have had it, it ran straight out of the box on the club's layout - made quite a few heads turn too.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

[F-UnitMad]

18 minutes ago, Philou said:

At least in the UK (and Europe) there are oodles of different locos and stock

You're kidding, right?? "Oodles of different locos" - on today's UK railways???  Anyway, the most numerous loco type on British tracks today came from North America!!

 

The US scene is very different to UK & EU; certainly far more freight focused than passenger, for historic reasons, & in the UK we have absolutely nothing like the equivalent of US Short Lines, more's the pity - maybe there'd be more freight moved by rail if there was.

US railroads were never built to be pretty. Let's call it "functional", & also rugged & no-nonsense when locos & stock might be required to travel a few thousand miles on just one trip, through some pretty remote & hostile terrain, too.

No one has to like or model US railroads, but don't just come flinging insults about them as if that's some kind of reason for a perceived decline in activity on this section of RMweb. 

Edited February 23, 2020 by F-UnitMad

[rodshaw]

US outline is alive and well for me, except that at the moment I'm modelling TT 1:120 scale. (See the link to Naples Street in my signature). My description of it on this forum is under the micro layouts section rather than American & Canadian.

As American TT isn't available from any supplier in the UK (and precious little from the US for that matter), the vast majority of what I buy is from Europe. And very nice it is too. I've taken the layout to various shows in the last couple of years with at least three more planned.

Before that I had an American HO layout, Yorkford, PA, and I've kept enough of my HO stock for another small layout if I decide to go back to it.