Wearing face masks or coverings on public transport to be mandatory from June 15th

[andania 213]

51 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

You won’t feel daft wearing a proper mask though, and you’ll look like a caring and responsible person along with it 

 

Like the caring and responsible eejit wearing a mask in our local supermarket yesterday that obviously though his mask allowed him to totally ignore social distancing, picking up only what you're going to buy and the one way system 

 

I fear that too many folk will, like that prat, think that wearing one is ALL that

they need to do now,  ( ISTR, the jury is still very undecided on their true effectiveness of them.)

 

19 minutes ago, Fat Controller said:

My French colleagues find it quite normal to put one on to go out to have a ciggy; when you ask them, they say they wouldn't want to pick up anything from 'un courant d'air' (draught or breeze). You wouldn't know that Louis Pasteur was French......

 

Errm, so, with a masks on for protection, what do they do with the ciggy ??  !!

 

K

[Gwiwer]

The jury is definitely out on the advantages (if any) of facial coverings. 
 

Browsing around the webs this morning it appears that compliance is patchy and at around 50%. It’s only the first morning so that figure might improve. 
 

There have been complaints that bus drivers are not preventing non-wearers from boarding which is precisely what is expected of them; they can remind but neither challenge nor refuse.  There are some random police patrols who at this stage are reminding people rather than issuing infringements. And there are a few legitimate exemptees worried that they have no proof and that they will be refused travel and / or discriminated against in some way. Which includes fellow passengers “reminding”, staring or talking about them. 
 

There is no requirement to prove an exemption. We are being trusted on this. I suspect the Government modelling is based upon a compliance rate well below 100%. With lockdown I saw an early report that their modelling was based on 60% compliance but 98% was achieved. Same, probably, with facial coverings. If 60% wear them, around 20% may be exempt allowing for children, asthmatics and all other exemptions, leaving 20% to be “reminded” and encouraged to comply. 
 

There will be a public confidence element to this as well. We know masks are only of limited use, if any, in protection but if they give more people more confidence that they can travel, shop, interact and help to restart the economy then the government and business leaders will probably be happy. 

[MR Chuffer]

There are face mask exemption cards available on my local bus company's (and others) website to download and print - self-certification?

 

Crazy really, this has been really well thought out - not...!

[MR Chuffer]

1 hour ago, Metr0Land said:

 

I don't know about physical shops but I've had a couple from different sellers on Amazon - arrived in about a week, and you should be able to see at a glance if they're in stock.

My local Aldi has them stacked by the checkout and, as ever, at a reasonable price for those that want/need

them...

[Butler Henderson]

With most if not all buses these days being fitted with CCTV theres always the possibility that if mask wearing passengers complain (after all they are at risk of catching it while doing their upmost not to pass it on if they unknowingly have it) those CCTV recordings will go to the police.

[MR Chuffer]

10 minutes ago, Butler Henderson said:

those CCTV recordings will go to the police.

And your point being? They have far bigger fish to fry, we tried to report a group of travellers way beyond a family group transgressing social distancing in their camp early in the lockdown cycle, their response? So what..

 

Just print yourself a self certifying card, you'll be ok.

[andania 213]

Frankly, rather than try and force people to wear face masks, a bit of good old fashioned, basic hygiene rule enforcement, ( though lord knows how you'd achieve it), could probably achieve more in actuality.

 

To whit, In the 2 months running up to lockdown, twice a week I was travelling from Humberside to North Yorks by train, mostly changing at Leeds. always 2 separate trains each way, often 3.

 

On every carriage I travelled on, most of the clienetele was what we'd class as 'movers and shakers',( except on the 144 on the Selby-York, everyone was a mover & shaker on that !!)  and on every carriage I noted the following.

One of them would be picking his nose, and not using a hanky ( YUK!! ) then tapping away on his phone, the table, Ipad, whatever.

Then there was the carriage cougher : loud, frequent and as you'd guess, never covering their mouth. Finally, there was of course, Sneezy ( often 2 of them, sadly) . Hankies?, tissues?, anything at all?, nah, just over anything in front of them.

Every damned day I noticed this, the best of it was,  I wasn't deliberately trying to see this kind of thing, it was just all there in front of me, and mercifully at a reasonable distance.

 

Ok, I can see how if that lot had to wear masks, it would probably have some beneficial effect, but I do think that a bit of good old common sense hygiene could be better, and not just with the present nasty; what was that famous rhyme from Hancock's Half hour, something about coughs and sneezes? !!

 

K  

Edited June 15, 2020 by andania 213
missing word!!

[Fat Controller]

'Coughs and sneezes spread diseases'

[andania 213]

21 minutes ago, Fat Controller said:

'Coughs and sneezes spread diseases'

 

 Oh I do know it!,  Whole verse recited in various T.H. comic tones, as well as 'drinkapintamilkaday' !!

 

K

[Mark Saunders]

The filthy British public !

 

We all know what to do but don’t !

[John M Upton]

What annoys me is that we are seeing newly introduced extensive cleaning, hygiene and hand washing, all things that should have been a matter of course in the first place irrespective of any virus!

[HonestTom]

Full compliance on the Tube this morning, although passenger numbers didn't seem to have been affected by the reopening of shops yet. Then at work (NHS), we were all issued with surgical grade ones because they're the only ones they trust, so I guess I could have saved the money I spent on my masks.

 

As someone who wears glasses and is currently in dire need of a haircut, I'm finding it uncomfortably hot with a mask as well. That being said, I am enjoying annoying my colleagues with Darth Vader impressions.

[boxbrownie]

5 hours ago, Andy Kirkham said:

Are any shops selling reusable masks?

 

Boots say they are going to, but haven't got them in stock yet.

Amazon.....or oddly one of the online/counter electrical components stores, I keep getting emails from RS Comps, Farnell, Rapid etc telling me they have all sorts of masks in stock.

[Steamport Southport]

Dying to get your trainers....

 

 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-53044826

 

Relevant as most of these imbecilles will also be traveling on public transport.

 

 

Jason

[Reorte]

But most of them have masks on!

 

As someone very much for physical shops over ordering everything online I suppose I should be encouraged by that picture, but I'm not. I can't think of anything I'm that desperate to get that I'll be in a queue at the first opportunity. Not even when the pubs reopen.

 

Maybe the barbers, if I looked in a mirror more often

Edited June 15, 2020 by Reorte

[PaulRhB]

7 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

Well at least the trains are wearing masks even if the staff don’t feel the need to......

It’s not so much not feeling the need to as they do cause communication problems especially around diesel trains or with a bus or taxi outside near gatelines.
We had conflicting instructions about wearing them on the platform too so we asked for a combined statement. (During the shift I may have to give instructions from the door or on the platform and they need to be clear). 
BTP said staff do not have to but should try to when in close contact and it doesn’t interfere with the job. That was quickly clarified this morning by the boss and a sensible compromise that leaves us to make a decision without having to worry about who’s going to make a fuss about it. 

I had a graphic demonstration as I left today where one of our gate line staff and a passenger were struggling to hear each other in a noisy entrance hall as a 166 was idling on the platform because they both had soft voices and were wearing masks. They resorted to hand signals!

I wore a mask as I left in case the booking hall was busy and work has made plenty available so I feel a good compromise has been reached relying on common sense. 

[PaulRhB]

Duplicate

Edited June 15, 2020 by PaulRhB

[spikey]

5 hours ago, andania 213 said:

Errm, so, with a masks on for protection, what do they do with the ciggy ??  !!

 

[Gwiwer]

3 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

It’s not so much not feeling the need to as they do cause communication problems especially around diesel trains or with a bus or taxi outside near gatelines.
We had conflicting instructions about wearing them on the platform too so we asked for a combined statement. (During the shift I may have to give instructions from the door or on the platform and they need to be clear). 
BTP said staff do not have to but should try to when in close contact and it doesn’t interfere with the job. That was quickly clarified this morning by the boss and a sensible compromise that leaves us to make a decision without having to worry about who’s going to make a fuss about it. 

I had a graphic demonstration as I left today where one of our gate line staff and a passenger were struggling to hear each other in a noisy entrance hall as a 166 was idling on the platform because they both had soft voices and were wearing masks. They resorted to hand signals!

I wore a mask as I left in case the booking hall was busy and work has made plenty available so I feel a good compromise has been reached relying on common sense. 

 

We too have had employer's instructions which differ to the law and have caused confusion and some misunderstanding.  A further email late today hasn't entirely clarified matters but does now state that platform colleagues "are exempt from the law they are expected to wear face coverings in public-facing situations where social distancing isn't possible".  

 

As I am on leave I have not been able to confirm how that has been implemented.  

 

It remains my understanding that face coverings are not required (but may be advisable) unless actually travelling on a means of public transport.  This excludes taxis, private hire and Uber vehicles where masks are advised - although Uber has made them mandatory for anyone in their vehicles.  

 

Face coverings has always been a safety-critical issue.  There is a risk to be balanced here.  Use of whistles was banned early in the emergency in case saliva blown through them transmitted the infection.  The only means of warning anyone of a potentially dangerous situation (such as doors closing, train departing or a fast train running through) is vocally.  An instruction requires us to make more use of vocal warnings.  Without exception those staff who have chosen to wear face coverings have found it much harder to communicate clearly whether by means of a loud warning or softly-spoken one-to-one response to an enquiry.  

 

Hand signals has a potential to confuse.  What if a member of train crew misinterpreted a gesture as a signal to start or stop?  It happens.  It happens under normal circumstances.  We are human and we are by nature social beings who will often wave to each other in greeting.  I use an open hand at waist-height for that since it is very unlikely to be misinterpreted.  But I see arms raised above heads almost every day waving greetings to station colleagues and drivers.  That can - and has been - misinterpreted as an emergency stop signal.  

 

There is a need to suppress the virus.  But there is also a need to maintain railway safety.  In order to do that I support station staff being left to choose for themselves whether or not they cover up.  There are few situations - even at the busiest stations - where a member of station staff is unavoidably less than 2 metres from another person for any appreciable length of time.  The risk of transmission outdoors among a transient number of passengers is probably extremely small.  

[Steamport Southport]

37 minutes ago, Reorte said:

But most of them have masks on!

 

As someone very much for physical shops over ordering everything online I suppose I should be encouraged by that picture, but I'm not. I can't think of anything I'm that desperate to get that I'll be in a queue at the first opportunity. Not even when the pubs reopen.

 

Maybe the barbers, if I looked in a mirror more often

 

But we are still under the 2 metre rule even with a mask on.

 

 

 

Jason

[Reorte]

6 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

But we are still under the 2 metre rule even with a mask on.

 

That was my point, I was being sarcastic about them.

[RJS1977]

4 hours ago, Fat Controller said:

'Coughs and sneezes spread diseases'

 

https://youtu.be/-qmBivUlPXE?t=584

[tractionman]

7 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

You won’t feel daft wearing a proper mask though, and you’ll look like a caring and responsible person along with it 

 

these might appeal to those of our fraternity:

 

 https://pixelshack.co.uk/products/locomotive-facemasks-several-designs?variant=32402110251092

 

I have ordered two.

 

What I do find a bit perplexing is people driving cars--**on their own**--wearing face masks?  

 

cheers,

 

Keith

 

 

 

 

[PaulRhB]

29 minutes ago, Gwiwer said:

 

Hand signals has a potential to confuse.  What if a member of train crew misinterpreted a gesture as a signal to start or stop?  

That’s why the paddle is used surely? 

 

29 minutes ago, Gwiwer said:

 

  But I see arms raised above heads almost every day waving greetings to station colleagues and drivers.  That can - and has been - misinterpreted as an emergency stop signal.  

It shouldn’t be unless someone doesn’t know their rules as it’s quite clear it’s both hands raised above the head because waving one arm is so common on a station. One arm raised above the head is the standard acknowledgment of I've seen you or heard your horn to a driver if you’re on track too. 

Similarly it’s always been understood Signallers who may be in view of trains should avoid bright red or green clothing, such as football shirts, especially as a red shown at a Signalbox window or door may confuse while it’s not uncommon for passengers on a platform. 
 

If you are well aware of the official railway hand signals it’s easy to avoid them and save confusion, fingers held up to confirm numbers are the common ones, two fists punched together to say join up along with pointing east or west to signify change ends for a shunt. It works very well in context  

[Metr0Land]

16 minutes ago, tractionman said:

 

these might appeal to those of our fraternity:

 

 https://pixelshack.co.uk/products/locomotive-facemasks-several-designs?variant=32402110251092

 

 

 

Someone with a sense of humour, I love the 1C19 headcode