Early Risers.

[PhilJ W]

Goodnight all.

[J. S. Bach]

1 hour ago, PhilJ W said:

The mind boggles

https://www.northnorfolknews.co.uk/news/could-cromer-and-sheringham-crab-lobster-festival-go-vegan-1-6652724?fbclid=IwAR0aSXxfkvK4piGZ7x9arWKdwEqN8pv_ApjN2yBtw4HpjjOpCb8Qm4HMsE8

Well it is Norfolk.

PETA = People Eating Tasty Animals.

[J. S. Bach]

Good night owl from the Piedmont.

[BR60103]

Polly:

Have you run into The Bird Fancyer's Delight?  Tunes to be taught to your pet bird. Work well on most whistles. A friend had it on LP a (half a century?) ago but I only have the music.

 

[AndyID]

It was distinctly like Arrochar here this morning. The weather radar didn't show any perticipation preciscipation rain but we still got wet when Shona took us for our constitutional. "Cobblers" I here you say - well yes. The Cobbler (aka Ben Arfur {although what exactly Arfur was doing in Arrochar is something of a mystery}) is adjacent to Arrochar. I've been to the top a couple of times but I chickened-out when it came to threading the needle.

 

 

[iL Dottore]

7 hours ago, Gwiwer said:

...Today's addition to the 10 albums is Billie Holiday's "Lady Sings The Blues".  I could listen to this for many more hours than it plays for.  I reckon you can taste the smoke and atmosphere of a late-night club through the music....

Very nice, although the age of the recording does impact on its “listenability”, though some may argue that’s part of the appeal and charm.

 

For me, one of the best interpretations of some of the music of this era is in Linda Ronstadt’s ‘Round Midnight: a Box set of the three albums she recorded with the Nelson Riddle Orchestra (band leader and arranger who worked with, amongst others, Frank Sinatra, Ella Fitzgerald, Nat King Cole). The title track being particularly atmospheric, evoking - for me - a sense of a cold, wet, Autumn evening in Chicago, viewed from within a warm bar, with a glass of bourbon in hand... Heartily recommended.

7 hours ago, polybear said:

..My money's on this; however I do find that listening to it when driving is a very bad move, as I do notice my speed can unexplicably increase somewhat whenever it comes on the radio....

Very energetic, but for music for fast driving, I don’t think anything can beat Burning Bar from Tangerine Dream’s soundtrack for the James Caan film Thief It’s a piece based around a pulsating sequencer Riff. 

7 hours ago, brianusa said:

Bacon sarnies are sandwiches.  When I lived in the UK which was ages ago now, I had never heard the term 'sarnie'.  I learnt what it was on a on a BBC comedy show much later over here

     Brian.

There is a lot of British slang, used by people of a certain age (I.e. grew up in the 50s/60s) that came from the military, as their fathers, uncles, older brothers had done National Service. Linguistically, this melting pot led to regional, class based and purely military slang gaining a wide distribution. Apart from “sarnie”, there is “Shufti”,  “Butcher’s”, “khazi”, “nobbled”, “chai” (or “char”), “skoff” and so on. One can derive great amusement from our our colonial cousins, by using such slang with them, as you are speaking English to them and they can barely understand what you are saying!!! (an amusing divertissement that works best with Americans and Canadians, less so with Ozzies and Kiwis).

6 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

The mind boggles

https://www.northnorfolknews.co.uk/news/could-cromer-and-sheringham-crab-lobster-festival-go-vegan-1-6652724?fbclid=IwAR0aSXxfkvK4piGZ7x9arWKdwEqN8pv_ApjN2yBtw4HpjjOpCb8Qm4HMsE8

Well it is Norfolk.

Another bit of lunacy from the über-zealots! Unfortunately, this sort of publicity stunt (can it really be in earnest?) backfires. Stunts like these dilute or obscure the important message that we have a duty of care to the animals over whom we have the power of life or death. Ethically, I would argue that we have a duty to all animals we husband (including food animals) to keep them as healthy and happy as possible (and in the case of food animals, healthy and happy animals are tasty animals!). I am very much a meat eater (almost, but not quite, an obbligate carnivore) and I am very much aware that this means food animals must die. Therefore, I firmly believe that we must eat or use every part of the animal and that animal carcasses should be displayed in every butcher’s and over every supermarket meat counter so that people are continuously reminded of what meat eating actually means (I firmly believe that we have done ourselves NO favours by disassociating the food we eat from where it comes from - animal or vegetable).

 

Vegetarianism has a long, storied and distinguished history and connects man with land; Veganism, on the other hand, is an artificial construct only made possible by modern technology. Furthermore (and here I am being serious), veganism is NOT environmentally friendly: the various food substitutes (such as almond or soy milk) require very large quantities of both energy and water to produce (I read that 100 litres of water are required to make 1 litre of soy milk), the huge amounts of palm oil needed for vegan products has led to tropical deforestation with the resulting palm oil tree plantations shrinking even further the Orang Utang (and other animal) Habitats, replacing leather with plastic is not exactly carbon-neutral, and so on.

 

So, if I may be very contentious here, I would like to offer the opinion that vegans are the Jihadi wing of the non-meat eater’s movement: extreme, intolerant, preachy and in pursuit of an unrealistic goal...  

 

Finally, a philosophical question (and a serious one), if you decide not to eat meat as part of your personal philosophy and world view, why eat “meat substitutes”? Surely the philosophically consistent approach would be to eschew meat substitutes? If your philosophy rejects eating bacon, isn’t eating a bacon substitute just about the same thing? After all, decaf coffee is still coffee, even if it is as synthetic as all get out.

 

Anyway, enjoy your carnivorous or herbivorous breakfast of choice.

 

Enjoy Sunday

 

iD

Edited May 16, 2020 by iL Dottore

[pH]

4 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

So, if I may be very contentious here, I would like to offer the opinion that vegans are the Jihadi wing of the non-meat eater’s movement: extreme, intolerant, preachy and in pursuit of an unrealistic goal... 

Finally, a philosophical question (and a serious one), if you decide not to eat meat as part of your personal philosophy and world view, why eat “meat substitutes”? Surely the philosophically consistent approach would be to eschew meat substitutes? If your philosophy rejects eating bacon, isn’t eating a bacon substitute just about the same thing? 

With regard to your first paragraph , I should put you in touch with my eldest son, and would watch the interaction with interest!

 

Second para - he is absolutely consistent in not eating anything pretending to be meat, and has been for years.

[AndyID]

36 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

After all, decaf coffee is still coffee, even if it is as synthetic as all get out.

 

 

I don't care for decaffeinated coffee (what's the point? - oops, there we go again) but while the processes currently used to remove the caffeine are a bit complicated they are not all that different from many processes we might use in our kitchens (admittedly supercritical carbon dioxide isn't something you'll find in a lot of kitchens).

 

"Synthetic" connotes something artificially synthesized from various compounds/molecules but that's hardly the case with decaff coffee. It's just coffee that's been processed to remove most of the caffeine.

[leopardml2341]

1 hour ago, iL Dottore said:

Enjoy Sunday

 

iD

But it's Saturday.......

[leopardml2341]

And talking of which, what will it bring for us all?

 

For me, it will be more work in the garden, including more 'bone throwing' no doubt. A visit to the Blue coloured DIY emporium, to collect the goods that Screwfix could then apparently couldn't supply, is on the list as well as Doggo food shop - the purveyor of Doggo's preferred brand has its premises opposite.

 

Tea in hand, Doggo by my side the world is good.

 

Best wishes, stay safe and keep well, 'see you later'......

Edited May 16, 2020 by leopardml2341

[Ozexpatriate]

1 hour ago, iL Dottore said:

... the various food substitutes (such as almond or soy milk) require very large quantities of both energy and water to produce (I read that 100 litres of water are required to make 1 litre of soy milk),

Almonds (and other nuts) require enormous amounts of water. Almond growing is an ecological disaster. Parts of the San Joaquin valley (where almonds are grown in California) have subsided by 30' (10m) due to draining of the aquifer, which is not refilled by rainfall. That aquifer exists because at one point the entire central valley of California was an inland sea.

 

This chart shows the relative amount of water required for different foods. Olive oil is almost as bad.

 

1 hour ago, iL Dottore said:

.... the huge amounts of palm oil needed for vegan products has led to tropical deforestation with the resulting palm oil tree plantations shrinking even further the Orang Utang (and other animal) Habitats, replacing leather with plastic is not exactly carbon-neutral, and so on.

Palm oil is not necessarily a "vegan" thing. Deforestation for palm oil plantations (particularly in Borneo) is devastating. Palm oil is in many "processed items" including soaps, detergents, chocolate, margarine, cosmetics and processed foods (including those with meats). 

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by Ozexpatriate

[chrisf]

18 hours ago, roundhouse said:

I know how you feel Chris as we are normally away somewhere at weekends and Bank Holidays so despite having plenty to do at home with a good shed and garden that many don't have, its still hard to just stay in let alone with no pubs to go to of an evening. I just hope it is safe for places to reopen in July and that we can go somewhere this summer that's worth going to as I am sure many others would also wish to do.

 

Greetings one and all

 

Well said, Roundhouse.  My diary emptied within hours of the start of the lockdown.  All the concerts, holidays, meetings, model railway shows, festivals and the other stuff I do had been cancelled or postponed, leaving supermarkets as the only places to go.  It is so easy to forget when in despair and frustration, at whatever depth, that others are in the same boat.  Unlike work, leisure activities tend not to expand to fill the time available and there is something about not having enough to do which removes the imperative to do what there is.  This is very similar, I think, to what Flavio describes as “ICBA”.  I doubt that any of this is good for mental health and I would not be surprised to learn that the proportion of the population with mental health issues is well above the 1 in 4 commonly estimated.  As next week is Mental Health Awareness Week we may find out.

 

I’m convinced that we are now running on infinite improbability drive.  Until this week who would have expected a Secretary of State for Transport to advise against the use of public transport?  Further evidence is that I did some gardening yesterday.  Until my right knee protested I wielded the digging fork to great effect and removed but a small proportion of the available nettles to the quarantine that is my garden waste bin.  Once I had stopped doing this a delightful half-hour or so was spent on the phone with 88C putting the world to rights while my digi box was busy recording “Brief Encounter” from BBC2.  Oh yes, and I did some laundry yesterday, giving rise to the inexpressible joy that is a pile of ironing.  Were it not for that ruddy virus I would have fancied breakfast out today but there are neither pubs nor supermarket cafes to satisfy that whim and I must make do with a bowl of porridge instead.

 

Best wishes to all and, if possible, keep bu99ering on

 

Chris

[Ozexpatriate]

39 minutes ago, AndyID said:

I don't care for decaffeinated coffee

I am happy to consume decaffeinated coffee in the evening. I often enjoy coffee after a meal but depending on the meal, the full strength will keep me awake way longer than I prefer. In that case decaff is a nice option.

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by Ozexpatriate

[TheQ]

Mooring awl,  Inner Temple Hare, 

6.5 hours solid sleep,  plus I hope for some more shortly. 

 

Ben the alarm clock Collie was on time this morning,  he took me for a shufi out on the bondhu , he yomped at full bore around the place while I bimbled along behind.

 

I'm now having some scran,  prior to digging the dhobi out of the machine. 

 

Ben has been up to see the long haired general,  but has now returned to his pit. 

 

Time to,  show a leg.. 

 

Oh some of us can't take caffeine because it send the heart rate through the roof,  I find it noticeable when I eat out and they don't have decaf.  So I have a real coffee and within minutes my heart is pounding.. 

 

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by TheQ

[jamie92208]

Good moaning to all and of course sundry, wherever he, she orbit is.  I's sunny and a bit warmer than yesterday.  This morning I will venture to The Danglies (St Jean D'Angely to newcomers) to orde building materials. Our builder is coming as soon as the materials arrive, to re roof the lower part of the house and paint the exterior.  This afternoon I may attempt to rake the mower apart to find out why it is so hard to start. The main suspect is the blade clutch.  I may even get chance to do some more scanning. 

 

Musings on the new normal.  Wearing a mask to go to the dentist... and being told to put on a mask before going into a bank.

 

Regards to all.

 

Jamie

[BoD]

2 hours ago, iL Dottore said:

 

 

Finally, a philosophical question (and a serious one), if you decide not to eat meat as part of your personal philosophy and world view, why eat “meat substitutes”? Surely the philosophically consistent approach would be to eschew meat substitutes? If your philosophy rejects eating bacon, isn’t eating a bacon substitute just about the same thing? 

 

One explanation I was given was the person still liked the texture and taste of meat and enjoyed eating the substitutes - but still didn’t eat meat for personal ethical/philosophical reasons.

[grandadbob]

Good morning all,

A greyish start to the day here but both forecasts I've looked at suggest it will stay dry and there may even be sunny spells.

An email arrived earlier from Sainsbury's telling us we'll get most of our order today.  Annoyingly they're out of eggs again but we've still got a couple left.  My decoders have still not arrived so Royal Mail 24 is now 72 and counting.  Never mind, these things are trivial and not exactly important compared to other things at the moment.

Not sure if we're walking today yet but I will hopefully get into The Shed after yesterday's failure. 

Tonight it's family Zooming and I believe we're having a quiz.

Sounds like The Boss is on the rampage way down so I better prepare for inspection see if she needs my assistance with anything before breakfast.  

Have a good one,

Bob.

 

[Barry O]

Ey up!

Slept in!!

 

I drink decaff coffee too..told to by my GP. I love full wack coffee...especially Italian Espresso...

 

Her indoors found a company in the UK who have a replacement drive belt for the scarifier. 2 for £8 free postage (a tad cheaper than the German unit (£19 plus £16 postage) that order will be sorted this morning.

 

I like your explanation BoD, two people I know don't eat meat (because they were told it is bad for you) but happily eat vegan burgers. In New Zealand the big think was a new vegan burger which taste and looks like meat..could they try making it to look more healthy? Mind you the Chip buttie had just been invented by the same company.

 

Talking of butties and sarnies an alternative is "banjo". Nowt like an egg banjo prepared on a  primus stove on the back of a Chieftain Armoured Recovery and Repair vehicle by the Staff Sergeant. At 4am on a cold morning  in the Hohne gunnery ranges..absolutely delicious! (The added engine oil on the sliced white bread wherein the egg had been deposited added flavour!)  Along with REME Coffee (mug of half coffee half Baileys) it set me up for a day of sorting out REME problems.. like "why is this turret moving on its own Mr Design Authority?"  Happy days!!

Now for Saturday! Time to smash it into submission! With no cricket to umpire this is freeing up time to get lots of other things done.

Chrisf..try setting targets for jobs to be done...seems to be working for me and her indoors.

 

Time to..cook a bacon banjo, brew some coffee and set to work! To rights.

 

Have a safe and steady day!

Positive thoughts to all.

 

Baz

[Happy Hippo]

10 minutes ago, Barry O said:

Talking of butties and sarnies an alternative is "banjo". Nowt like an egg banjo prepared on a  primus stove on the back of a Chieftain Armoured Recovery and Repair vehicle by the Staff Sergeant. At 4am on a cold morning  in the Hohne gunnery ranges..absolutely delicious! (The added engine oil on the sliced white bread wherein the egg had been deposited added flavour!)  Along with REME Coffee (mug of half coffee half Baileys) it set me up for a day of sorting out REME problems.. like "why is this turret moving on its own Mr Design Authority?"  Happy days!!

Now for Saturday! Time to smash it into submission! With no cricket to umpire this is freeing up time to get lots of other things done.

Chrisf..try setting targets for jobs to be done...seems to be working for me and her indoors.

 

Time to..cook a bacon banjo, brew some coffee and set to work! To rights.

Banjoes are specifically fried egg sarnies/butties, so called because of the similarity in looks to the main body of a banjo and a frying egg.

 

Never eat Shreddies

[Dave Hunt]

Military slang entering the common usage is something that I have noticed frequently during my time but there is much more of it that is still foreign to most non-military folk. That is particularly true of some of the more specialist terms, acronyms etc. used by, for example, submariners, armoured troops or, as I well know, aviators. Without really being aware of it, when I am talking with ex-RAF colleagues I quickly lapse into the lingo and Jill has often commented that, "When you're talking to your RAF mates I sometimes don't understand what you are all on about." I imagine that the same thing can be said of other specialist communities such as the police, healthcare etc. and it would be interesting if others have any relevant views.

 

Later this morning the Midland Railway Society committee members are going to try out a Skype get-together as a dry run for a potential committee meeting next week. We do indeed live in interesting times.

 

Have a good Saturday people.

 

Dave

[Joseph_Pestell]

56 minutes ago, BoD said:

One explanation I was given was the person still liked the texture and taste of meat and enjoyed eating the substitutes - but still didn’t eat meat for personal ethical/philosophical reasons.

I don't see any ethical problem here. But I really don't understand anyone eating vegan bacon rashers: texture, flavour and colour all atrocious.

 

Vegan mince (Quorn) is perfectly acceptable and I am OK with the "chicken chunks" although nearly ex-SWMBO (the vegetarian) would not do them.

[Shedman5]

46 minutes ago, grandadbob said:

Good morning all,

A greyish start to the day here but both forecasts I've looked at suggest it will stay dry and there may even be sunny spells.

 

 

 

Morning re the above its the same here!

Thus gardening jobs will be taking place later on today than planned. As I need to go for petrol for the lawnmower I will at the same time fill my car up, 99.9p a litre hmm hope it stays at that price for a while.

 

Otherwise all quiet, time to have a look at the paper with a nice bacon and egg sandwich x2 lots of energy needed for todays tasks!

 

Enjoy your day and be safe

 

 

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by Shedman5

[Joseph_Pestell]

2 hours ago, Ozexpatriate said:

Almonds (and other nuts) require enormous amounts of water. Almond growing is an ecological disaster. Parts of the San Joaquin valley (where almonds are grown in California) have subsided by 30' (10m) due to draining of the aquifer, which is not refilled by rainfall. That aquifer exists because at one point the entire central valley of California was an inland sea.

 

This chart shows the relative amount of water required for different foods. Olive oil is almost as bad.

 

Palm oil is not necessarily a "vegan" thing. Deforestation for palm oil plantations (particularly in Borneo) is devastating. Palm oil is in many "processed items" including soaps, detergents, chocolate, margarine, cosmetics and processed foods (including those with meats). 

 

 

I think that this graph may lead to misleading conclusions.

 

Where is that water going? Not into the almond. Most of it must be evaporating into the atmosphere where it will regenerate as rainfall.

 

But, of course, that rainfall will be elsewhere so I accept the idea that one should not intensively plant almonds in some places where it could affect aquifers. Where I lived in Southern France, almond trees grow very readily (lovely blossom in February) but they are mostly wild rather than cultivated.

[grandadbob]

Oh happy day!  I mentioned the talk of bacon sandwiches on here to The Boss and within minutes I had been presented with one.  She is obviously in a good mood.  Now thinking of what to mention next!   Something unmentionable perhaps? 

!

[bbishop]

3 hours ago, iL Dottore said:

 

Finally, a philosophical question (and a serious one), if you decide not to eat meat as part of your personal philosophy and world view, why eat “meat substitutes”? Surely the philosophically consistent approach would be to eschew meat substitutes? If your philosophy rejects eating bacon, isn’t eating a bacon substitute just about the same thing? After all, decaf coffee is still coffee, even if it is as synthetic as all get out.

 

Anyway, enjoy your carnivorous or herbivorous breakfast of choice.

 

Enjoy Sunday

 

iD

 

Taking a big risk here Flavio, the ER rozzer may arrest you for spouting philosophy!  To start with coffee!  I have plugged myself into my blood pressure monitor whist drinking a mug of strong black coffee: quite a diastolic spike.  Then my tablets kick in and it returns to c.130. 

 

I'm a non meat, minimal lactose eater on health grounds.  We insert enough chemicals into the poor beastie before and after death - the final straw being trump's chlorinated chicken.  (Incidentally now to be allowed after the lock down Parliament passed the Agriculture Bill).   And bacon, enough chemicals to make it a cancer risk.  So obviously I have no objections to meat substitutes.  Veggie wurst?  Very nice but a tad expensive.  Veggie bacon?  Consistency and taste of shoe leather!  My meals for today? Breakfast - cheese on crispbread; lunch - avocado and tuna sandwich; supper - braised cabbage and onion with a fried egg.