well filled baps The Sheep Chronicles : These are the adventures of a Sheep, the Works Forecat and Naughty George,

[Tortuga]

45 minutes ago, JustinDean said:

Liking this photo a lot Rob!

Is this a Bachmann 08?
There was an 08 trialed on the C&HPR for one day in the 60’s - that’s a good enough excuse for me to buy one right?

 

Jay

A 350hp diesel shunted was trialled on the Friden Trip Working in April 1959. I believe the loco was on loan from Toton depot. A photo can be found on page 67 of Scenes from the Past 32 Railways of the High Peak Buxton to Ashbourne by J M Bentley and G K Fox.

 

From the photo it looks very similar to a class 08 to my untrained eye, but so do the class 3/6, the class 3/7, the class 09, the class 10, the class 11 and the class 12 shunters, especially, and I want to make this ABSOLUTELY CLEAR, when seen from dead front on.

 

So going off photo and caption evidence alone, I’d say you've got an excuse to buy at least 7 locos there!

Edited October 15, 2021 by Tortuga
Missed the reason for posting!

[NHY 581]

Morning all, 

 

A slightly different view to the earlier post. 

 

A mistier feel to this one. 

 

 

 

 

Rob. 

 

 

 

[JustinDean]

8 hours ago, Tortuga said:

A 350hp diesel shunted was trialled on the Friden Trip Working in April 1959. I believe the loco was on loan from Toton depot. A photo can be found on page 67 of Scenes from the Past 32 Railways of the High Peak Buxton to Ashbourne by J M Bentley and G K Fox.

 

From the photo it looks very similar to a class 08 to my untrained eye, but so do the class 3/6, the class 3/7, the class 09, the class 10, the class 11 and the class 12 shunters, especially, and I want to make this ABSOLUTELY CLEAR, when seen from dead front on.

 

So going off photo and caption evidence alone, I’d say you've got an excuse to buy at least 7 locos there!

Here’s the earlier trialed diseasal:

12006 in 1959 at Parsley Hay. 
There’s going to be a Heljan/Model Rail version of this next year apparently. 

Second photo shows the same loco grinding to a halt on Gotham curve, ending the trial. 
 

Edited October 16, 2021 by JustinDean

[Liam]

2 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

Morning all, 

 

A slightly different view to the earlier post. 

 

A mistier feel to this one. 

 

 

 

 

Rob. 

 

 

 

Wonderful photo Rob. Very atmospheric and for me it perfectly resembles the essence of Mountain Ash.

[Dunsignalling]

49 minutes ago, JustinDean said:

Here’s the earlier trialed diseasal:

12006 in 1959 at Parsley Hay. 
There’s going to be a Heljan/Model Rail version of this next year apparently. 

Second photo shows the same loco grinding to a halt on Gotham curve, ending the trial. 
 

That isn't a Class 12, though the number makes for easy confusion. 

 

It's one of the ex-LMS 350s, built during WW2 on a rather longer wheelbase than either an 08 or a 12, with drive from a jackshaft between the centre and rear wheelsets. Unfortunately, we shall still be awaiting the announcement of a RTR model....

 

They never received D-prefixed numbers and all had been withdrawn before the TOPS numbering system was implemented. EDIT: the final withdrawal took place in 1967, but BR only actually applied TOPS numbers to shunters they expected to keep, i.e. up to class 09.

 

Had they trialled what would later be designated as a Class 08 or 12, they wouldn't have had any trouble on that curve.

 

John

Edited October 16, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[JustinDean]

2 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

That isn't a Class 12, though the number makes for easy confusion. 

 

It's one of the ex-LMS 350s on a rather longer wheelbase than either an 08 or a 12, with drive from a jackshaft between the centre and rear wheelsets.

 

They never received D-prefixed numbers and all had been withdrawn before the TOPS numbering system was implemented.

 

Had they trialled what would later be designated as a Class 08 or 12, they wouldn't have had any trouble on that curve.

 

John

Interesting! I’d assumed this was a Class 11. 
 

Jay

[Dunsignalling]

2 minutes ago, JustinDean said:

Interesting! I’d assumed this was a Class 11. 
 

Jay

The cab extension is the giveaway. Unfortunately, the gentleman standing trackside is obscuring our view of the jackshaft, but the connecting rod  (not fitted to later swb 350s) is just visible to his right.

 

John

[Tortuga]

According to Wikipedia (so make of this what you will) the LMS jack shaft drive 350hp shunters were classified as Class 3/7 by BR.

 

If the combination of long wheelbase and Gotham Curve were responsible for ending the trial, why were none of the shorter wheelbase shunters trialled? The Class 3/6, class 08 and class 11 certainly existed at this time.

Edited October 16, 2021 by Tortuga
Pondering

[Tortuga]

…and sadly Jay has just whittled down his excuse for running 7 different types of 350hp diesels to just one.

[Dunsignalling]

1 minute ago, Tortuga said:

…and sadly Jay has just whittled down his excuse for running 7 different types of 350hp diesels to just one.

Actually, none, if it didn't make it to the end of the line.....

 

John

[JustinDean]

6 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

Actually, none, if it didn't make it to the end of the line.....

 

John

They did also trial an 08 in the 60’s which made it round the curve…but struggled with Hopton Incline.

 

[Tortuga]

1 hour ago, JustinDean said:

They did also trial an 08 in the 60’s which made it round the curve…but struggled with Hopton Incline.

 

Well there you go. You can have an 08 after all, but only if your layout is based on a location between Buxton and Hopton incline! Or you could go for the  Class 3/7, but not if your layout is based beyond Gotham Curve! 

 

On a more serious note, I thought the Friden Trip Working from Buxton terminated at Friden? Wasn’t it usually handled by a Midland 3F then later by an Ivatt 2MT neither of which, being tender engines, were officially allowed beyond Friden?

Edited October 16, 2021 by Tortuga
2MT instead of 2F and Friden instead of Newhaven Crossing.

[Dunsignalling]

20 minutes ago, Tortuga said:

Well there you go. You can have an 08 after all, but only if your layout is based on a location between Buxton and Hopton incline! Or you could go for the  Class 3/7, but not if your layout is based beyond Gotham Curve! 

 

On a more serious note, I thought the Friden Trip Working from Buxton terminated at Friden? Wasn’t it usually handled by a Midland 3F then later by an Ivatt 2F, neither of which were allowed beyond Newhaven Crossing?

Perhaps counterintuitively, that could explain the choice of the LWB shunter for the trial. If there was a presumption that SWB types would be OK, testing the "most extreme case" would be more informative.

 

The MPD providing the locos would have had both types, and if the LMS loco had successfully negotiated the tight curve, it might have been possible to send "any" 350 rather than having to find a short one.

 

John

 

 

[JustinDean]

38 minutes ago, Tortuga said:

 

On a more serious note, I thought the Friden Trip Working from Buxton terminated at Friden? Wasn’t it usually handled by a Midland 3F then later by an Ivatt 2F, neither of which were allowed beyond Newhaven Crossing?

Yep that’s correct and although the LMS 350hp loco was trialled on that particular working the intention was to replace the NLR tanks working the line. As many know J94’s were drafted in as replacement. 

[JustinDean]

Apologies for the the drift on topic @NHY 581!

[NHY 581]

11 hours ago, JustinDean said:

Liking this photo a lot Rob!

Is this a Bachmann 08?
There was an 08 trialed on the C&HPR for one day in the 60’s - that’s a good enough excuse for me to buy one right?

 

Jay

 

10 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

 

 

Hi Jay, 

 

Yep it is a Bachmann 08. 

 

Acquired from a certain auction site. Bit miffed as what was described as mint and hardly run was neither with a botched repair to the front step and wheels and pick ups testament to a lot more running that had been described. 

 

That said, an evening spent cleaning and adjusting has transformed it. The botched repair was tidyed up and hey presto! 

 

Not too bad at all.  

 

 A spot of running in should be of benefit. 

 

So all good. 

 

However, I would like to find a Hornby example at some point as I think they have the edge over the Bachmann example......,....

 

 

Rob. 

 

 

1 minute ago, JustinDean said:

Apologies for the the drift on topic @NHY 581!

 

 

Please don't ! 

 

All that's going to happen is I'll end up building my take on a slice of the C&HP..........

 

 

Regarding the Bachmann 08, further to my last, I have had a little pre-breakfast running and shunting session with the little chap and it went okay. I think it could be better mind you. 

 

The motor in them is huge, as is the flywheel. The pick ups rest on top of the wheeltreads which is probably not the best as they gather all the rubbish. Easy to dismantle and clean but really? 

 

There is some fore and aft  movement in the motor shaft, about 0.5-1.0mm at certain speeds and I'm not sure it helps but it's pretty good now. A lot better than when I got it that's for sure. 

 

I shall keep an eye out for a Hornby example as I do think they are a bit more polished but there's no rush. 

 

In other news, there may be some progress later on with Project X but a few domestic errands to attend to first off..............one of which may or may not take me dangerously close to the train shop......

 

Rob. 

[Ramblin Rich]

9 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

 

Please don't ! 

 

All that's going to happen is I'll end up building my take on a slice of the C&HP....

Rob. 

It's got to happen at some stage, hasn't it? It has an actual Sheep name location!

Edited October 16, 2021 by Ramblin Rich

[JustinDean]

9 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

 

 

 

 

 

All that's going to happen is I'll end up building my take on a slice of the C&HP..........

 

 

Rob. 

I would love to see that!

 

Jay

[Tortuga]

23 minutes ago, JustinDean said:

I would love to see that!

 

Jay

Seconded!

I also apologise for my part in the thread drift Rob. I probably should have complimented the photos of the 08 before diving into a discussion on the use of 350hp shunters on the C&HP.

 

Incidentally, I’m surprised you haven’t modelled a take on the C&HP. With its mix of different locos and little changing regards the infrastructure over its existence, it’s always struck me as a prototype where you could legitimately model several different decades merely by changing the rolling stock.

[Tortuga]

By the way, you already have at least two locos that are suitable for a C&HP layout, admittedly both are diesels but still…

[bgman]

3 hours ago, JustinDean said:

Here’s the earlier trialed diseasal:

12006 in 1959 at Parsley Hay. 
There’s going to be a Heljan/Model Rail version of this next year apparently. 

Second photo shows the same loco grinding to a halt on Gotham curve, ending the trial. 
 

 

Oh ! A Gronk with a Conk ! Never seen the like 

[mullie]

59 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

 

 

 

 

 

Please don't ! 

 

All that's going to happen is I'll end up building my take on a slice of the C&HP..........

 

 

Regarding the Bachmann 08, further to my last, I have had a little pre-breakfast running and shunting session with the little chap and it went okay. I think it could be better mind you. 

 

The motor in them is huge, as is the flywheel. The pick ups rest on top of the wheeltreads which is probably not the best as they gather all the rubbish. Easy to dismantle and clean but really? 

 

There is some fore and aft  movement in the motor shaft, about 0.5-1.0mm at certain speeds and I'm not sure it helps but it's pretty good now. A lot better than when I got it that's for sure. 

 

I shall keep an eye out for a Hornby example as I do think they are a bit more polished but there's no rush. 

 

In other news, there may be some progress later on with Project X but a few domestic errands to attend to first off..............one of which may or may not take me dangerously close to the train shop......

 

Rob. 

Bachmann 08s of a certain age benefit from new pick ups, I know mine did. I now have the parts to convert it to EM so will probably redo the  pickups again. 

 

Martyn 

[NHY 581]

5 hours ago, Tortuga said:

Seconded!

I also apologise for my part in the thread drift Rob. I probably should have complimented the photos of the 08 before diving into a discussion on the use of 350hp shunters on the C&HP.

 

Incidentally, I’m surprised you haven’t modelled a take on the C&HP. With its mix of different locos and little changing regards the infrastructure over its existence, it’s always struck me as a prototype where you could legitimately model several different decades merely by changing the rolling stock.

 

 

No, it's fine, Torters. 

 

I have long had a bit of a soft spot for the Cromford and High Peak.  

 

I've held off doing anything along those lines (!) As I've wanted to concentrate on other stuff.

 

However, never say never. 

 

It could happen but to be fair, the standard has been set by Al and Jay, not to mention Middlepeak all of whom exert their influence. 

 

And I quite like J94s.............there, I've said it.............

 

 

Rob. 

Edited October 16, 2021 by NHY 581
Called Jay aka justin, julian. Too much famous 5

[JustinDean]

20 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

 

It could happen but to be fair, the standard has been set by Al and Julian, not to mention Middlepeak all of whom exert their influence. 

Rob. 

Who’s Julian?

[Oldddudders]

25 minutes ago, JustinDean said:

Who’s Julian?

Calendar.