RMweb Premium Reorte Posted September 17, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 17, 2015 If I was a First shareholder, a financial lender to the company or a senior executive, I would be very "bothered" if they weren't "bothering" about their costs. From a railway perspective, it is neither crazy or not crazy to move these locos by road, rather than rail. It's down to the commercial judgement and priorities of the companies concerned how they wish to carry out this task. Any negative impact on the highways, its users and any affected local communities, would be another matter. I think that the issue isn't so much that they've chosen the most practical / cost effective means but that road is the most practical / cost effective means. On the other hand road vehicles have been moved by rail at times so arguably there's no reason that's fine but the other way round looks daft. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith George Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 It would appear to me to be a statement that road transport is cheaper, more convenient and more sensible than to consign cargo by railway. Just about advertising for the competition in transport. Keith. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ron Ron Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 (edited) It would appear to me to be a statement that road transport is cheaper, more convenient and more sensible than to consign cargo by railway.... In this case, unless there are other factors at play, FGW clearly think it is. There's nothing wrong in that. In most cases road transport is "cheaper, more convenient and more sensible". Just about advertising for the competition in transport. Well it's not FGW's competition. They're not a freight hauler. . Edited September 17, 2015 by Ron Ron Ron 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith George Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 In this case, unless there are other factors at play, FGW clearly think it is. There's nothing wrong in that. In most cases road transport is "cheaper, more convenient and more sensible". Well it's not FGW's competition. They're not a freight hauler. . So the way forward is Road transport, not Railways Glad really because Road transport kept me in full employment all my working life. Keith. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Reorte Posted September 17, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 17, 2015 (edited) So the way forward is Road transport, not Railways Glad really because Road transport kept me in full employment all my working life. It looks like it is when it comes to moving some bits of railway equipment. I doubt a lorry load of signals or bits for electrification would raise the same eyebrows but is that any different? Sometimes it's the other way around, how much roadstone gets moved out of quarries by railways? It doesn't feel right though but FGW can't be blamed if they've worked out that's the easiest way of moving things they need moving. So in summary - move road things by rail and rail things by road! Edited September 17, 2015 by Reorte Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted September 17, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 17, 2015 (edited) is there a 57 in the new green livery yet? edit: just found the answer to my own question, 57605 is green Edited September 17, 2015 by big jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 (edited) how much does it cost to be transported? Probably a tidy sum! I expect for this move it was probably not much more than the cost of a path - bearing in mind that the only available path may have been utterly inflexible for the expected release time of the vehicle, and/ or compromised by engineering works overnight somewhere en route. Also FGW will have a negotiated rate for multiple trips with the haulier. And what message does that send to every road user who sees one in transit? "Oh look - another broken down train" I acknowledge the realities of the railway in 2015 but with a whole fleet to re-livery surely it's not beyond the realm of possibility to work them in pairs by rail??? And the costs should be factored into the equation before a rebranding exercise even gets off the drawing board. My bullets mate, indulge me! Not FGW's problem in isolation, really - although they (and RVEL) could use the move as a marketing opportunity - 'another smart refurbished locomotive for First Great Western...' Working in pairs assumes that two can be released simultaneously a) for repaint and b ) from repaint The costs are, down to the last egg-cup of fuel Agree Abello are moving their reliveried stock by rail with just a loco on front so it can be done. Because Abellio has found this method to be the most effective for its operation, in this specific instance. Also I can understand a private owner of say one loco using a lorry if cheaper but to FGW a company with income into the £m's each day are they that bothered about 'saving'??? a few quid on diesel when they must spend literally £'000's fuelling up their HST fleet every day. It's about far more than a few quid on diesel, although if they have to refuel power cars in Derby it will cost them far more per litre than in Plymouth. In this case at least, 43188 and then 43187 followed each other within about 24 hours. Running back-to-back together in this case would surely have made more sense. Not if FGW has negotiated a deal for a total number of moves. Edited September 17, 2015 by 'CHARD Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith George Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 I suppose the bottom line is that road transport can operate fully without any railway involvement. Railway cannot operate without the help of road transport. Keith. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Banger Blue Posted September 17, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 17, 2015 At Paddington on Monday 21st (from about 06:30ish) will be: Platform 1: gWr liveried HST Power Car + rake of gWr mk3 (refurbed external & internal) Platform 2: Rake of refurbed Sleeper coaches Platform 3: 166205 (gWr refurb internal & external) 166204 will be around somewhere, it's the backup for 166205 but is gWr only externally. Don't know how long they'll be around for as I can't see them wanting at least three platforms tied up for the morning Peak. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 Will the Cl.158s on the Cardiff - Portsmouth route eventually get the same treatment? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chy Mengrowyn Paul Posted September 17, 2015 Share Posted September 17, 2015 Yes although route is destined for turbos. When a loco is released from repaint, it needs an exam before use. Our coaches need a week's worth of work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rail Picture Library Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 I know the green HST works to Worcester during Monday, but does anyone know the full day's diagram for the HST and Turbo and if they will remain on the same diagrams for the rest of the week? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted September 18, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 18, 2015 (edited) Had to drop a van off in derby earier and as i walked back to the station this was coming off rvel i assume heading for london as it went off towards leicester Edited September 18, 2015 by big jim 14 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steadfast Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 Yeah should be going back to Old Oak as 0Z57. Just missing the gold band and we could have fag packet all over again. Ahhhhh yeah! It looks a little odd with the number plate fitted so high up though. They always used to be in line with the name plate jo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted September 18, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 18, 2015 (edited) Does it work? All the way from Cornwall to Paddington and back????? Edited September 18, 2015 by Gwiwer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Banger Blue Posted September 18, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 18, 2015 (edited) (trying to insert pic but Flikr on iPad is f'ing around!) https://flic.kr/p/yMQTbB 166205 back at Reading TCD, the first Turbo to receive the gWr branding and internal refit (no pics of inside unfortunately. Edited September 18, 2015 by Banger Blue 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCML100 Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 Intersting pics of the turbo fully kitted out with the branding. Unusually saw a hst rake in paddington yesterday (still in fgw livery) but 3 coaches within the rake were completely unbranded. Just plain blue with pink doors. It looked rather nice on the mk3 coach. Shame this layout with the fgw was never applied properly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfsup Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 Intersting pics of the turbo fully kitted out with the branding. Unusually saw a hst rake in paddington yesterday (still in fgw livery) but 3 coaches within the rake were completely unbranded. Just plain blue with pink doors. It looked rather nice on the mk3 coach. Shame this layout with the fgw was never applied properly. I'm not sure what is going on with those, they really do look odd especially when formed into a rake with the smarter and complete Dynamic Lines livery. (trying to insert pic but Flikr on iPad is f'ing around!) https://flic.kr/p/yMQTbB 166205 back at Reading TCD, the first Turbo to receive the gWr branding and internal refit (no pics of inside unfortunately. The more I see it with the branding, the less I like it I'm afraid. Was rather wondering if the Turbo could make the livery look somewhat better, but with that 'sketchy' silver line running along the bodyside turning to green over the doors, the GWR logo exaggerating how dull that Matt band is, and the oddly placed numbers on the front I think it looks worse than the Mk3s. Why couldn't the number have been placed in the black plastic area underneath the windscreen and the GWR logo placed central? Yeah should be going back to Old Oak as 0Z57. Just missing the gold band and we could have fag packet all over again. Ahhhhh yeah! It looks a little odd with the number plate fitted so high up though. They always used to be in line with the name plate jo Exactly what I thought first time around when 605 came out of the works. Now a smart gold band instead of the silvery effect one they're going for...There's an idea! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted September 18, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 18, 2015 Saw a power car on the back of a lorry yesterday, in overcast conditions. My word it looks dull! Surprised they are releasing them from the works without the vinals as they really do look drab in anything but perfect light. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 Yeah should be going back to Old Oak as 0Z57. Just missing the gold band and we could have fag packet all over again. Ahhhhh yeah! It looks a little odd with the number plate fitted so high up though. They always used to be in line with the name plate jo Name and number in line? Not always Jo........... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianusa Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 Like the repaint of Tintagel (heard it once pronounced on the BBC yet, as Tint a gel!) .Agree with comments about the number plate being up so high and where is the gWr to let everyone know whose railway it is. Brian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chy Mengrowyn Paul Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 Loco branding on its way.... high number plate reason.... you'll see ! Big question is will 604 be repainted in GWR or gWr.....? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Phil Mc Posted September 18, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 18, 2015 Leave 604 alone, it looks fantastic as it is !!!!!!!!! Cheers, Phil. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfsup Posted September 19, 2015 Share Posted September 19, 2015 (edited) Well done to the PR team, who seem to be very keen to tell me about the rebranding with 2 emails and a letter. Unfortunately i'm still not that convinced! The journey begins The first train in our new colours will roll up to the platform on Monday morning, signalling the dawn of a new era for British railways. Resplendent in green, it will have the letters GWR down the side. Your 'Great Western Railway'. Our ambition? To rediscover the pioneering spirit that drove Isambard Kingdom Brunel when he built what was then, without question, the world's greatest railway. To dream of something better, and bring prosperity to our region. To make people fall in love with rail travel again. We've made a short film to tell the story of the Great Western Railway. Take a look and see for yourself how we intend to realise our ambitious plans for a renaissance of rail. ( ) This is much more than a rebadging exercise. It's a statement and a mission. We have a far-reaching plan for the greatest transformation in the railway in decades – including the largest fleet overhaul since the days of steam and heralding a new age of faster electric trains, equipped with the foremost technology and passenger comforts. So as you begin to notice the new ticket offices, uniforms and trains in the months ahead, please remember that Great Western Railway is more than just a name. It's a promise, and one we mean to keep. Kind regards, Mark Hopwood Managing Director, GWR There is also a lot of 'We're doing this' and We're investing here and here' with the line together with Network Rail - Are you really putting in all this money First Group? I'll finish with a line 'borrowed' from Rail Technology Magazine "RTM previously reported on the brand evolution in May as part of a conversation with Patrick Hallgate, managing director of the Great Western Route Modernisation for Network Rail. He had referenced FGW’s direct award and evolving brand towards GWR, but said it will be important to “earn” the word ‘Great’. " Edited September 19, 2015 by surfsup Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted September 19, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 19, 2015 I've had that not only by email but also via Farcebook. As with many such things it's what isn't said that is telling, and what is said is carefully scripted. Basically it's a rebranding exercise and nothing more. It's already come in for some harsh criticism with respect to the chosen livery and the style of its application. Questions have been raised over the accuracy of the "Cornish" language applied to the sleeping car sets. I don't doubt they will try to forget failings of the past but until they can source additional rolling stock (some of which is tied into the national cascade arising from the new TSGN franchise, Crossrail and the GW electrification projects) and timetable enough trains to cope with the burgeoning traffic then "earning" the Great will ring hollow for many people. They're suffering from motive power issues on the sleepers again as well which doesn't do their credibility much good. Rebranding costs fancy money. I'm sure it's all been accounted for somewhere. I question whether it was really necessary at this point in time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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