GordonC Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Was Manchester Mayfield station ever electrified? I know latterly it was used as a parcels terminal, but were the parcels trains to it always diesel hauled? I presume some of the parcels trains would have travelled along the WCML so were they still hauled by AC electrics and piloted in perhaps? I've had a look at the pictures on Flickr, but cant see any signs of masts, wires or insulators Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
caradoc Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 OS Nock's excellent book on the WCML electrification ('Britain's New Railway', Ian Allan 1966) has both diagrams and text (pages 54/55) showing that Mayfield was electrified, but of course photographic evidence would be good ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted July 29, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 29, 2015 My instinct is to say no it wasn't, in latter years at least. But these photos suggest it was at least in part wired. https://www.flickr.com/photos/37190-dalzell/12269834533/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/photograph_provider/4409092305/ 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennyboy Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 (edited) I don't think it was, as post electrification pictures show it without wires over the main part of the station. I think they simply electrified a short section where it branched off the main line as is usually done on electrified lines in case an electric train is sent down the wrong route. http://www.sutherland.davenportstation.org.uk/aaprint/man.html Edited July 29, 2015 by bennyboy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefreight Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 (edited) I thought I'd consult the mandatory working timetable for May 1976 which tells us that the following parcels services were booked to depart from Manchester Mayfield on a weekday. 4026 00.53 MX to Redhill Electric haulage 4F07 02.04 MX to Wavertree PCD DPU 3K22 04.00 MX to Crewe Electric haulage (this train originated at Manchester Piccadilly leaving at 03.50 and arriving Mayfield at 03.55 at attach) 4J08 04.25 MX to Bolton DPU 4H17 06.00 to Buxton DMU 4H02 09.23 to Buxton DMU 4K14 18.40 SO to Crewe Electric haulage 4010 20.26 SX to Bricklayers Arms Electric haulage 4K18 20.34 SX to Crewe Electric haulage 4E06 21.06 SX to Bradford Diesel haulage 3M12 21.24 SX to Nottingham Diesel haulage 4D08 21.11 SX to Chester DPU 4E02 23.08 SX to Doncaster Diesel haulage 4G02 21.49 SX to Curzon Street Electric haulage 3A66 22.47 SX to Euston Electric haulage 4M16 23.23 SX to Luton FSX/Cricklewood FO Arrivals followed a broadly similar pattern with a mix of electric and diesel haulage plus the occasional DPU, electric hauled parcels trains arriving at: 03.39 MX from Stafford 04.20 MX from Hayes 07.26 from Stoke-on-Trent 10.48 MX from Redhill 12.09 MX from Rugby 20.35 SO/22.04 SX from Crewe South Yard Back then it really was an electrified railway to the fullest extent possible. Hope this helps answer your query Gordon. Edited July 30, 2015 by davefreight Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted July 29, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 29, 2015 I still don't believe the station itself was wired, but it looks like the entrance/throat was. There is no evidence of wires, supports or hangers in the disused station, yet the portals outside the station remained after the wires had gone. The headroom also looks to have been pretty restricted. Mayfield Station. by Mick G, on Flickr 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted July 29, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 29, 2015 And then I find this... Manchester Mayfield Railway Station by True British Metal, on Flickr _DSC0182 by Kenny Goodwin, on Flickr So perhaps only the southern most platform was electrified, i.e. the one not under the overall roof, on left above. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Dava Posted July 30, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 30, 2015 I passed Mayfield often in the 70s when in use for parcels trains & recollect the catenary covered the station throat but not under the canopy. Maybe southern platform was electrified for arriving trains, what does WTT show? There was often an 08 shunting the GUV & BG vans Dava Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Just been looking at my two Manchester to Crewe EM Johnson books - amazingly neither mention or have any images of Mayfield in any form. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jamie92208 Posted July 30, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 30, 2015 I certainly remember seeing the portals at the station throat but don't know about the rest of the station. If it was a slow speed terminal platform they could have done it pretty simply with single wire tramway style overhead with minimal supports. Certainly in the post above with the breakdown crane there appears to be an anchor mast in the foreground with a run of wired disappearing towards the station interior. However it would be nice to know the facts. Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefreight Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Have updated the Working Timetable info with a list of the electric hauled arrivals at Mayfield. They were nicely spaced out consistent with having had just one track fully wired to handle inbound services. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted July 30, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 30, 2015 Anyone got a 1970s sectional appendix to see if there were any special working arrangements for Mayfield? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted July 30, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 30, 2015 Another photo of the derailed class 08 at Mayfield, but looking west. It's not very clear, but there doesn't appear to be much overhead equipment beyond the fourth portal. https://flic.kr/p/7F6DfJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 very timely pictures have gone up today on Facebook - show OHLE masts over the platform ends (de wired as it was closed) but no sign of anything under the canopies. There is a post by an ex shunter/driver on there so I have asked directly how the electric trains arrived, Hopefully we get an answer today. https://www.facebook.com/nick.melling.104/media_set?set=a.884311228283064.1073742285.100001125840218&type=3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 First answer back from an ex driver (diesel) - DPU and diesel hauled propelled into the station but electrics arrived into Manchester Piccadilly and were shunted back to Mayfield. That would make sense operationally, the bit we are missing is whether there were any wires to allow a direct departure from Mayfield. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jamie92208 Posted July 31, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2015 First answer back from an ex driver (diesel) - DPU and diesel hauled propelled into the station but electrics arrived into Manchester Piccadilly and were shunted back to Mayfield. That would make sense operationally, the bit we are missing is whether there were any wires to allow a direct departure from Mayfield. I've looked at the photo and enlarged it as much as I can. There appears to be a terminal mast just beyond the platform ends on the left hand road down the outside of the train shed. There doesn't appear to be anything similar that far along on the other side so perhaps departing trains were shunted into that side road then the electric loco was attached there. Hopefully we'll get a definitive answer in due course. Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 In the pictures by Nick Melling on Facebook, there are definitely the upright H section Girders over the platform ends. But as the pictures are post closure any wiring has been removed so it is difficult to tell whether or not they had ever had OHLE strung from them but why put in the posts and then not string them - this area dates from when wiring was full on and not the economic wiring of the ECML and later schemes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefreight Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 (edited) The WTT does not support the theory that electric hauled trains first arrived at Piccadilly and were then shunted back to Mayfield. What it clearly shows is that electric hauled services both arrived and departed directly from Mayfield. Given the lack of any evidence of wiring under the canopy the most sensible conclusion is that the southern most platform road, outside the canopy, was fully wired for arrivals while some, or all, of the other platform ends outside the train shed were also electrified. Edited July 31, 2015 by davefreight Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonC Posted July 31, 2015 Author Share Posted July 31, 2015 (edited) Wow!! Thats all fantastic information! Many thanks folks! In the initial days of electrification, going by what was done elsewhere, I'm not sure how much of that station canopy would have survived had all the platforms been electrified. They were quite brutal at times in cutting back canopies to increase clearances for the wires. But having a single electrified arrival platform was not a possibility I'd considered. I find the derelict Mayfield station just fascinating in how its just been completely abandoned in such a prime location and how little information there seems to be on it and its operation bearing in mind its practically across the road from Piccadilly. Edited July 31, 2015 by GordonC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwin_m Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 Presumably what is now the Mayfield Loop could have been used as a headshunt to allow stock to be transferred from an electric arrival platform to one of the other platforms by attaching a station pilot or even the departure loco to the rear. Then, as long as they didn't propel the whole of a short train right into the shed, an electric loco could be attached for the departure under the wires outside the shed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonC Posted July 31, 2015 Author Share Posted July 31, 2015 very timely pictures have gone up today on Facebook - show OHLE masts over the platform ends (de wired as it was closed) but no sign of anything under the canopies. There is a post by an ex shunter/driver on there so I have asked directly how the electric trains arrived, Hopefully we get an answer today. https://www.facebook.com/nick.melling.104/media_set?set=a.884311228283064.1073742285.100001125840218&type=3 On the second picture there - is that an 'electric trains stop' sign on the right hand side by the line down the outside of the station canopy? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 It certainly looks like there was some knitting but not any further than the canopy which would make arrivals difficult but fit in with the comment that electric services arrived into Piccadilly and were shunted back to Mayfield but would allow departures under the wires. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennyboy Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 Presumably what is now the Mayfield Loop could have been used as a headshunt to allow stock to be transferred from an electric arrival platform to one of the other platforms by attaching a station pilot or even the departure loco to the rear. Then, as long as they didn't propel the whole of a short train right into the shed, an electric loco could be attached for the departure under the wires outside the shed. The track layout does mean that electric trains could leave and depart from the Mayfield Loop so I suspect that they would arrive/depart there, but the parcel vans would actually be be shunted by diesels into Mayfield itself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Saunders Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 The track layout does mean that electric trains could leave and depart from the Mayfield Loop so I suspect that they would arrive/depart there, but the parcel vans would actually be be shunted by diesels into Mayfield itself. For departing trains could you place an Electric loco' on the stock for departure? Mark Saunders Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefreight Posted July 31, 2015 Share Posted July 31, 2015 (edited) It certainly looks like there was some knitting but not any further than the canopy which would make arrivals difficult but fit in with the comment that electric services arrived into Piccadilly and were shunted back to Mayfield but would allow departures under the wires. Sorry to labour the point but the Working Timetable shows no trains arriving at Piccadilly and then being shunted back to Mayfield. For instance in May 1976 4H12, the 01.25 Parcels from Stafford to Manchester Mayfield, called at Stockport from 02.50 to 03.40. While there it was overtaken by 4H05, the 02.34 Parcels from Crewe to Manchester Piccadilly which arrived at Piccadilly at 03.24 with 4H12 following it down the slow line arriving at Mayfield at 03.39. The WTT then shows the electric locomotive from 4H12 leaving Mayfield light engine at 04.05 for Longsight. Edited July 31, 2015 by davefreight Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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