Driving standards

[PhilJ W]

4 hours ago, peanuts said:

An interesting problem for someone. The house has been shored up but in doing so the van is trapped so how are you going to remove the van? My guess is that they will have to remove the van in pieces by cutting it up.

Edited June 29, 2022 by PhilJ W

[boxbrownie]

1 hour ago, PhilJ W said:

An interesting problem for someone. The house has been shored up but in doing so the van is trapped so how are you going to remove the van? My guess is that they will have to remove the van in pieces by cutting it up.

They could just use a bridged acrow method, luckily that was the front entrance so would have been stronger with a decent lintel/arch, had it gone through a side wall there could have been damage all the way to the roof.

[Enterprisingwestern]

2 hours ago, Titan said:

 

So now, in order to avoid offence, if we are to mention a perfectly possible and not unusual situation, that does not in any way exclude others - it explicitly says "may" - we have to explicitly mention all other possible sexual permutations and combinations of beauty in order to not offend someone?

 

2 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Whilst at the same time maintaining a sense of humour and the ridiculous!

 

What a world we're living in?

 

Mike.

[ejstubbs]

4 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

An interesting problem for someone. The house has been shored up but in doing so the van is trapped so how are you going to remove the van? My guess is that they will have to remove the van in pieces by cutting it up.

 

Reminds me a bit of this one not far from me a little over a year ago: 

 

 

although I believe they did manage to extract the car in more or less one piece.  There were certainly acrow props all over the place the next day when I passed it by.  Making good the property took a wee bit longer - IIRC the owners were only able to move back in at the start of this year, and the remedial work was finally completed almost exactly a year after the incident.

 

Ignore what that tweet says about the location, by the way - it was actually here.  The car was travelling SE along Oxgangs Road, which is uphill at that point, and had gone straight on, completely missing the gentle bend to the left that can be seen in that Google satellite image (where the road passes the pub) which took it on to the wrong side of the road, and it then continued on the same trajectory over the mini roundabout without stopping - fairly obviously so, since it then demolished a garden wall and ploughed on into the front hall of a house.  Note that I say "the car" in this case, rather than suggesting that the driver did anything that contributed to the crash, because it's pretty clear from the path the vehicle took and the force of the impact that the person behind the wheel was exerting next to no control whatsoever over its speed or direction.  (I believe it was reported at the time that said driver was being charged with dangerous driving but I've not seen anything since as to how that eventually panned out.)

Edited June 29, 2022 by ejstubbs

[Compound2632]

9 hours ago, peanuts said:

 

I'm going to try again, since folk struggled to identify the humour in my first attempt: 

 

Perhaps she's found herself a beautiful husband?

 

 

[boxbrownie]

56 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I'm going to try again, since folk struggled to identify the humour in my first attempt: 

 

Perhaps she's found herself a beautiful husband?

 

 

Are you now saying only women drive like that?

 

You just can’t win 🤣

[johnofwessex]

One point that I think cars crashing into houses highlights is that while you can lose your licence for criminally bad driving, the options for losing it if you are not found to be criminally bad ae very limited.

 

It seems to me that there is a strong case for having the 'car licennce' equivalent of a 'fit and proper' hearing that vocational licence holders can be called to.  Something along the lines of 'we cant prove that your driving was criminal but you drove into a house/tree/ditch/whatever which clearly should not have happened if you were driving properly so come up with a very good reason or we cancel our licence'

[jcredfer]

18 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I'm going to try again, since folk struggled to identify the humour in my first attempt: 

 

Perhaps she's found herself a beautiful husband?

 

 

 

Could be...  the driver clearly seems to 'fit in' well.   😉

 

Edited June 30, 2022 by jcredfer

[ejstubbs]

On 17/06/2022 at 20:25, boxbrownie said:

it is normally stated in the manuals about not using cruise control in wet or slippery (cold) conditions.

 

I read something along these lines somewhere a while back and, just to make sure I hadn't missed anything, I checked in the manual for my car (and yes, it does have cruise control!)  That confirmed my recollection that there is no mention of not using the CC in low-traction conditions.  However, I also know from experience that the CC will disengage itself if the car detects anything approaching a loss of grip - I suspect based on whether the electronic stability control system is about to intervene.  Even just driving over an usually bumpy bit of road can cause the CC to disengage.  So maybe they decided that the warning wasn't necessary.

[ejstubbs]

On 24/06/2022 at 12:59, Enterprisingwestern said:

Bear in mind also that slush boxes these days have variations built in, I have a sport option and manual selection by moving the stick to left.

 

Sounds similar to the auto box in my car, which is a DSG (in simple* terms: an automated, computer controlled manual gearbox & clutch) rather than a "slushmatic", so there's no torque converter involved.

 

* I'm aware that this is a bit of an over-simplification.  There's a more detailed explanation here for those that wish it..

[96701]

On 29/06/2022 at 05:53, peanuts said:

Some people seem to be incapable of letting the days go by.

[ejstubbs]

18 hours ago, 96701 said:

Some people seem to be incapable of letting the days go by.

 

My wife says I stopped making sense a long time ago.

[MarkC]

4 hours ago, ejstubbs said:

 

My wife says I stopped making sense a long time ago.

Join the club... 😜

[johnofwessex]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-shropshire-62011784

 

We would not tolerate repeated accidents in a workplace or on a railway so why do we do it on the road?

[Nick C]

10 hours ago, johnofwessex said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-shropshire-62011784

 

We would not tolerate repeated accidents in a workplace or on a railway so why do we do it on the road?

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.7559021,-2.5770194,3a,75y,254.9h,79.07t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sQ4zOLeFk4EKLmTEaNvLyuw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

 

You have to wonder how on earth the tractor managed that - the only thing I can think is that it was swerving to avoid something cutting the corner.

 

I also note that the chevron signs are damaged and half overgrown - a common problem, there's one near where my parents live where a crossroads becomes almost impossible to see in summer as the hedges get so overgrown that the signs vanish.

 

Otherwise, there's nothing inherently dangerous about the road in the above article, the camber looks good, it's got good sightlines, the road markings are all present and correct, the advanced warning signs are there - so the crashes are clearly the fault of the subject of this thread - driving standards... 

 

Maybe I'm biased, as I learnt to drive on similar roads, but I think a lot of the problem is down to people not being taught properly - I think most people learn to drive in towns and cities. and don't know how to deal with country lanes and the hazards they bring - unlit roads, mud, people in the road, etc - certainly driving around such lanes you often notice people unable to modulate their speed properly for the conditions - IMHO your speed on a road like that should be almost constantly changing, but many people seem to want to find one steady speed that suits the whole road - which doesn't exist - so they end up either going too slowly on the straighter bits, or too fast through the corners.

[johnofwessex]

17 minutes ago, Nick C said:

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.7559021,-2.5770194,3a,75y,254.9h,79.07t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sQ4zOLeFk4EKLmTEaNvLyuw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

 

You have to wonder how on earth the tractor managed that - the only thing I can think is that it was swerving to avoid something cutting the corner.

 

I also note that the chevron signs are damaged and half overgrown - a common problem, there's one near where my parents live where a crossroads becomes almost impossible to see in summer as the hedges get so overgrown that the signs vanish.

 

Otherwise, there's nothing inherently dangerous about the road in the above article, the camber looks good, it's got good sightlines, the road markings are all present and correct, the advanced warning signs are there - so the crashes are clearly the fault of the subject of this thread - driving standards... 

 

Maybe I'm biased, as I learnt to drive on similar roads, but I think a lot of the problem is down to people not being taught properly - I think most people learn to drive in towns and cities. and don't know how to deal with country lanes and the hazards they bring - unlit roads, mud, people in the road, etc - certainly driving around such lanes you often notice people unable to modulate their speed properly for the conditions - IMHO your speed on a road like that should be almost constantly changing, but many people seem to want to find one steady speed that suits the whole road - which doesn't exist - so they end up either going too slowly on the straighter bits, or too fast through the corners.

 

Its the sort of thing that 'hit a house, lose your licence' might help to sort out, plus of course lower speed limits and enforce them

[Nick C]

19 minutes ago, johnofwessex said:

plus of course lower speed limits

Why? As the homeowners say in the article, the existing limit is fine (when enforced), it's people's inability to know how and when to adjust their speed that's the problem. On a clear, dry day like today, 60 is perfectly safe on a road like that. If you're going to start reducing the limit for certain conditions, how far do you go? Max speed in a heavy snowstorm is probably well under 20, but a 20 limit everywhere would paralyse the country! As the highway code says, it's a limit, not a target...

[Reorte]

5 minutes ago, Nick C said:

Why? As the homeowners say in the article, the existing limit is fine (when enforced), it's people's inability to know how and when to adjust their speed that's the problem. On a clear, dry day like today, 60 is perfectly safe on a road like that. If you're going to start reducing the limit for certain conditions, how far do you go? Max speed in a heavy snowstorm is probably well under 20, but a 20 limit everywhere would paralyse the country! As the highway code says, it's a limit, not a target...

Quite. Speed limits shouldn't be used to micromanage driving, constantly changing as the road does. Being able to drive at a speed suitable for the road, which might well be a constantly changing speed, is a basic driving skill (one all too often lacking).

 

Unfortunately having to make decisions and being responsible for your own actions rather than being told what to do all the time isn't fashionable.

[Grovenor]

That tractor is clearly unlikely to be a townie unused to driving in the country! And if it was doing more than 60 there really is a problem. Complaints about tractors are usually the opposite of them speeding.

[Ian Smeeton]

The Kingfisher pub in Preston, Rutland was hit by a Jack-knifing tractor and corn trailer combination just over 20 years ago.

 

The T & T was travelling Northbound, allegedly braked to avoid something, and embedded itself in the North wall of the pub, pushing the pool table several feet towards the bar.

 

The pub was shored up, some plywood covered the hole in the wall and it reopened the following day with an A board outside stating:

 

Coaches Welcome

 

Tractors by Appointment.

 

Regards

 

Ian

 

 

[Titan]

2 hours ago, Nick C said:

Why? As the homeowners say in the article, the existing limit is fine (when enforced), it's people's inability to know how and when to adjust their speed that's the problem. On a clear, dry day like today, 60 is perfectly safe on a road like that. If you're going to start reducing the limit for certain conditions, how far do you go? Max speed in a heavy snowstorm is probably well under 20, but a 20 limit everywhere would paralyse the country! As the highway code says, it's a limit, not a target...

 

I can see why it is pointless changing the speed limit in this case.  the corner is sufficiently sharp that 20mph could be too fast to negotiate it without losing control, so reducing the limit from 60mph to 50 mph won't make a tremendous amount of difference. In fact a tractor would most likely lose control if it did not slow down enough, which is what I suspect happened here - they are not exactly known for their sports car handling!

[johnofwessex]

I suppose of course that the other thing would be proper crash investigation so if you are involved in an accident its properly looked into and if you have been a bit of an idiot then bye bye licence

[admiles]

4 hours ago, Nick C said:

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.7559021,-2.5770194,3a,75y,254.9h,79.07t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sQ4zOLeFk4EKLmTEaNvLyuw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

 

You have to wonder how on earth the tractor managed that - the only thing I can think is that it was swerving to avoid something cutting the corner.

 

 

I'd put a reasonable amount of money on the cause of that accident being the tractor bouncing out of control on the uneven road surface.  Tractors with large balloon tyres and limited (or zero) suspension can react quite violently to certain undulations in the road surface when traveling at speed (most big tractors top out at 50kph).  In effect they can pogo themselves off the road. Seen it a few times here in rural Suffolk.

[kevinlms]

4 hours ago, johnofwessex said:

 

Its the sort of thing that 'hit a house, lose your licence' might help to sort out, plus of course lower speed limits and enforce them

Article says that there have been 4 serious accidents since 2015. What was the situation pre-2015 and has anything happened to make the road different since then?

[PhilJ W]

5 hours ago, Nick C said:

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.7559021,-2.5770194,3a,75y,254.9h,79.07t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sQ4zOLeFk4EKLmTEaNvLyuw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

 

You have to wonder how on earth the tractor managed that - the only thing I can think is that it was swerving to avoid something cutting the corner.

 

I also note that the chevron signs are damaged and half overgrown - a common problem, there's one near where my parents live where a crossroads becomes almost impossible to see in summer as the hedges get so overgrown that the signs vanish.

 

Otherwise, there's nothing inherently dangerous about the road in the above article, the camber looks good, it's got good sightlines, the road markings are all present and correct, the advanced warning signs are there - so the crashes are clearly the fault of the subject of this thread - driving standards... 

 

Maybe I'm biased, as I learnt to drive on similar roads, but I think a lot of the problem is down to people not being taught properly - I think most people learn to drive in towns and cities. and don't know how to deal with country lanes and the hazards they bring - unlit roads, mud, people in the road, etc - certainly driving around such lanes you often notice people unable to modulate their speed properly for the conditions - IMHO your speed on a road like that should be almost constantly changing, but many people seem to want to find one steady speed that suits the whole road - which doesn't exist - so they end up either going too slowly on the straighter bits, or too fast through the corners.

 

1 hour ago, admiles said:

 

I'd put a reasonable amount of money on the cause of that accident being the tractor bouncing out of control on the uneven road surface.  Tractors with large balloon tyres and limited (or zero) suspension can react quite violently to certain undulations in the road surface when traveling at speed (most big tractors top out at 50kph).  In effect they can pogo themselves off the road. Seen it a few times here in rural Suffolk.

That was what I was thinking, the tractor rounded the bend and the driver couldn't straighten up. A similar occurrence happened near me about twenty years ago. A car came up the road on the right and took a right turn at the T junction. Instead of taking a ninety degree turn the driver took a hundred and eighty degree turn and piled into the front of the first house (with the silver car on the drive). There is no doubt about the cause, the woman driver was drunk.