Building kits for Tyneside in the BR era. J24 and PDK D49/2

[mikemeg]

11 hours ago, Blandford1969 said:

I'd certainly happily just buy a set of etches if made available for the Q7. Maybe Arthurs daughter will read these comments and who knows .... it would be wonderful. 

 

I'll re-check but I'm pretty sure that the only remaining issue with the development of this kit was the representation of the motion work (crankshaft and Stephensons valve gears) on the driven axle. So with the provision of a diagram for the driven axle arrangement - allowing those who so wish to furnish some/all of this - then the kit would be saleable.

 

That said, a full set of instructions and some castings may also need to be completed.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

[Michael Edge]

Just making the etches (preferably with a drawing but not essential) available would be good enough - we do very well out of this sort of offering although we do supply detailed drawings with them.

[mikemeg]

The photo of the Q7, which I posted earlier, was actually taken four or five years ago. Further work was stopped awaiting the development of the representation of the 'mechanical assemblies' between the mainframes. Anyway, it has now been removed from the 'airtight tin' to, once more, see the light of day.

 

So, though by no means complete, here's a new photo of a model of the zenith of the development of the North Eastern Railway's 0-8-0 heavy freight locomotives.

 

Apologies to John for using his thread but the query was raised here; so best to answer it here.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

 

Edited February 22 by mikemeg

[mikemeg]

And just as a reminder of what these majestic machines actually looked like, a couple of photos of the real things, one taken during its service life and one when the locomotive had passed into preservation working a passenger train in September 1963.

 

Just look at the pristine external condition of both locos, though by the time of the second photo (September, 1963) 63460 had become a cherished 'national treasure'.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

 

Edited February 22 by mikemeg

[rowanj]

No need whatsoever to apologise, Mike, The more comments the merrier, I was actually on an SLS Special hauled by the Q7 in 1964, A3 Blink Bonny Newcastle-York, via the ECML. York -Whitby- Middlesbrough by a B1, then Middlesbrough-Newcastle by the Q7. I have a couple of photos, but on transparencies, so someday will sort them out.

Edited February 23 by rowanj

[mikemeg]

Thanks John.

 

I know my own thread has become somewhat 'eclectic', with all sorts of excursions and personal recollections and, like you, I feel it has benefitted from that.

 

Looking at the photos of these locos, I was reminded of an Easter Sunday 'bunk' around Tyne Dock shed in 1962. Eleven of the sixteen Q7's were on shed that day, along with the last three N10's, and lots of Q6's and 9F's. They were 'some great days', those bunks around the locomotive sheds; great cathedrals of places dedicated to the steam locomotive!

 

So, one more photo of  that 'national treasure' taken at Shildon and now resplendent in LNER livery.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

Edited February 22 by mikemeg

[rowanj]

I managed to get a half-hour running some trains so thought I may as well get the Alexander Q7 out. It actually ran a little "lumpily" so I'll give it some TLC, I tried to get a photo "in action" to show my attempt at filling the void between the frames. It wasn't easy, which, I suppose, shows that for "in service " purposes, strict accuracy is not essential, For personal satisfaction or fidelity to the prototype is, of course, another story.

[Blandford1969]

12 hours ago, mikemeg said:

 

I'll re-check but I'm pretty sure that the only remaining issue with the development of this kit was the representation of the motion work (crankshaft and Stephensons valve gears) on the driven axle. So with the provision of a diagram for the driven axle arrangement - allowing those who so wish to furnish some/all of this - then the kit would be saleable.

 

That said, a full set of instructions and some castings may also need to be completed.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

I'm sure a batch of them just as etches and just with a drawing would sell, most buying it would have probably purchase on of Arthurs before. 

[rowanj]

The D20 is progressing. While I'm waiting for the GW Models Mini Roller, I had a go at rolling the boiler, with my usual way of using fingers, marker pens of various diameters and a mouse mat,, It turned out well, using the smokebox etch to get the diameter right, I was a bit surprised that there was no butt joint at the boiler bottom, Checking constantly against the smokebox and cab front got me there without a mishap.

 All I have done is follow the instructions with the kit to get to this point, with the excepttion of the cab roof and interior, On the roof, I prefer to have them demountable, and on other of Arthurs kit, they are designed that way, In this case, the instructions indicate the roof should be soldered to the cab, but I just used a couple of crossbraces of 0,7 mm wire  to hold it in place by slidng it on.This also makes it easier to paint the cab, then slide in the detailed whitemetal backhead, The photo shows it needs a bit of fettling, but should be OK>

I found the cab interior, which is a fold up one-piece etch, was causing a short on the live wheel, so I cut the RH and LH splashers from the floor and soldered them in, making sure the RH live side cleared the live insulated wheel, I needed to file a fair bit off the fronts to get the backhead to pass through, and als nip the bottom  sides of the backhead itself, but I think it all works. I'll solder in a new floor from srap etch, them use a trick I think I got from Mikemeg to scribe a piece of paper to represent the planks, then harden it with thin PVA, No-one will ever see it, but it's a bit of fun, I'll take a photo later to show what I mean.

[rowanj]

Stupid question of the day. What dia, rod should I be using for the vacuum steam pipe along the boiler? I had a go with 1mm copper earth wire , but thinks it looks too bulky.

 

[jwealleans]

I generally use 0.9, but you have to go with what looks right.

[Daddyman]

Mine are all 1.0. If you think about it, the pipes are more likely to be 3" on the real thing than two-point-something inches. 

 

I think what spoils an ejector is clumsy bends - I nick the rod behind the "knee" with a triangular file. 

[rowanj]

Thanks to David and Jonathan (sorry, couldn't resist) for the posts. I think my copper wire may have been a bit larger than 1mm, but I certainly didnt like the "look", In the event, I couldnt find a source for 0.9mm rod, so will get some 1mm and see how it looks.

 

Re the build, although I take proving photos to check , as all I'm doing is follow the instructions, there is nothing to post about here. I have reached the detailing stage, so it looks like 62383 will pull a train before too long.

 

One thing I have been doing is practicing rolling boilers using the G W Watts roller. It does take a bit of practice, but I'm getting there. Building a J24 from scratchbuilt parts- chassis, boiler, footplate should be feasable, The J25 cab sides and front look usable, and boiler fittings are either already in the spares box or can be sourced, If the loco looks to be coming together OK, I'll get a tender kit from either ArthurK or LRM,  I 've never built a scratchbuild loco in brass, so this will be a great adventure.

[micklner]

Cambrain Models sell the 0.9mm wire plus 1.00mm. Good prices and service  at Cambrain ex Eileens stock.

 

https://www.cambrianmodelrail.co.uk/store/Brass-Wire-c148547257?offset=9

[Pebbles]

On 21/02/2024 at 07:07, mikemeg said:

Re Arthur's Q7 kit, I did do a test build of this using the early pre-production etches. The overall loco superstructure and the 4125 gallon tender etches were completed. What remained to be developed/finalised, as has been referenced here, was the profusion of 'mechanical assemblies' between the mainframes.

 

The Q7 was a three cylinder loco hence there was one set of driving motion and three sets of Stephensons valve gear sitting between the mainframes. Initially Arthur considered providing various etches for these assemblies but later decided on castings for this provision. The final developments of this kit were actually interrupted by Arthur's deciding to produce a kit for the F8 which, though intended as a relative 'quickie', took longer than expected to reach production.

 

Given the 'issues' with the 4125 gallon tender on the LRM B16 kit, I have just actually completed Arthur's kit for this 4125 gallon tender, including using the Bradwell castings and detailing the tender front.

 

I am now looking at what will be needed to complete the loco itself, perhaps as a small tribute to Arthur and his work. It has been my great pleasure to work for him and with him these past years and his contribution to our hobby has been enormous.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

 

 

Mike, as you have indicated, yours was a very much pre-production etch, and who knows where the master is.

There remained a significant number of issues to be resolved. The slide bars had been sorted, but quite apart from a representation of the internal valve gear, a master for the cast middle cylinder and various other masters had yet to be addressed. Arthur had evolved a fold up etch incorporating the valve cover together with the smokebox saddle, this had always been a problem.  Any production etch would have incorporated this together with alternative boilers.

Arthur also wanted to address the tender and changes to the etch were required, as well as various masters produced.  

Time had run out, and the F8 will most likely remain the last of the line. The Q7, as with the C6, will, again, most likely remain unfinished projects.  

We should be grateful for what Arthur has produced.

[micklner]

2 hours ago, Pebbles said:

Mike, as you have indicated, yours was a very much pre-production etch, and who knows where the master is.

There remained a significant number of issues to be resolved. The slide bars had been sorted, but quite apart from a representation of the internal valve gear, a master for the cast middle cylinder and various other masters had yet to be addressed. Arthur had evolved a fold up etch incorporating the valve cover together with the smokebox saddle, this had always been a problem.  Any production etch would have incorporated this together with alternative boilers.

Arthur also wanted to address the tender and changes to the etch were required, as well as various masters produced.  

Time had run out, and the F8 will most likely remain the last of the line. The Q7, as with the C6, will, again, most likely remain unfinished projects.  

We should be grateful for what Arthur has produced.

Has the J21 gone the same way please ?. Mike built, I believe built on his thread what is a complete version of the J21 . 

 

Agree re the grateful comment as well.

Edited March 2 by micklner

[Pebbles]

18 minutes ago, micklner said:

Has the J21 gone the same way please ?. Mike built, I believe built on his thread what is a complete version of the J21 . 

 

Agree re the grateful comment as well.

Not altogether sure about the J21, best to wait as Arthur's daughter has promised to publish a list. It must be appreciated that her time is limited, just hang in there!

[rowanj]

I seem to be getting there, The loco is just back from a layout test, and it is found to be capable of easily handling the 6-coach Alnwick service and, more importantly, going round bends, The rear of the boiler/firebox keft plenty room for a roll of lead, and I added a bit more to the underside of the cab roof and the ashpan. I actually had much less bother balancing this kit than the DJH one, There are a few places where I need to tidy up,- I see that splasher rim has become partly detached= but otherwise...

Paint the buffers and the splasher tops, glaze the windows and add numbers, then do some lightish weathering, and she is ready to go.

Edited March 5 by rowanj

[46256]

Nice model John

best wishes Brian 

[Blandford1969]

Looks really good. 

[rowanj]

Any suggestions for the colour of the loco splasher rims? Colour photos suggest they are almost white, but perhaps they should be steel? DJH seem to think brass or copper.

[micklner]

 Black in BR days? , Brass NER/LNER  .

[Daddyman]

Brass even in BR days I'd say - see Yeadon p.55 centre for a grubby loco yet still with brass visible. Did I read somewhere if workshops painted them black crews scraped the paint off to reveal the brass? 

 

Also, definitely brass not steel: 

[rowanj]

This, among others, is the photo which got me thinking about the splasher tops. I think they were, usually, unpainted in BR days, and the various B&W photos do show a much brighter colour, The ex-works photo of 62383 at Darlington at the link below is pretty convincing. highly polished brass, then?

62383 Darlington shed April 1955 - W.Worsdell Class D20 (NER Class R) 4-4-0 Locomotives - Railway-Photography (smugmug.com)

Edited March 5 by rowanj

[Daddyman]

39 minutes ago, rowanj said:

highly polished brass, then?

Yes!