TPE new trains

[TomScrut]

28 minutes ago, newbryford said:

 

Although IIRC that would cause some platform/train length issues. Albeit "fixable" with selective door opening. 

 

Definitely at Seamer. I aren't sure they can handle 6 car 185s in entirety. The couldn't when they first started at least.

[Mallard60022]

Wasn't the original idea  that the 68 was an interim Loco when Electrification of the Trans Pennine route was envisaged and would be replaced by a Driving (Electric) Unit at the now Loco End?

Seem to remember reading that some time back when the Trains were pre production?

Could have dreamed that of course!

P

[jamie92208]

1 hour ago, Mallard60022 said:

Wasn't the original idea  that the 68 was an interim Loco when Electrification of the Trans Pennine route was envisaged and would be replaced by a Driving (Electric) Unit at the now Loco End?

Seem to remember reading that some time back when the Trains were pre production?

Could have dreamed that of course!

P

As I mentioned above the 88's were the intended replacement  power.

 

Jamie

[jjb1970]

It pains me that we are still talking about old technologies like diesel and electric traction. 

 

I advocate an alternative type of heat engine which uses water as the working fluid and which exploits the energy transfer potential of water when changing phase to provide useful work. Such an engine is a viable technological solution which would free us from reliance on diesel and electric power. As an interim step it would actually be possible to develop a hybrid electric - water engine, leveraging advantages of each while we transition to the future.

[jamie92208]

40 minutes ago, jjb1970 said:

It pains me that we are still talking about old technologies like diesel and electric traction. 

 

I advocate an alternative type of heat engine which uses water as the working fluid and which exploits the energy transfer potential of water when changing phase to provide useful work. Such an engine is a viable technological solution which would free us from reliance on diesel and electric power. As an interim step it would actually be possible to develop a hybrid electric - water engine, leveraging advantages of each while we transition to the future.

I suppose such machines could even run on locally produced fuel.

 

Jamie

[jjb1970]

Just now, jamie92208 said:

I suppose such machines could even run on locally produced fuel.

 

Jamie

 

I have even seen research to suggest that they could run on biogenetic fuel, we could thus develop motive power certified for use by vegans, the possibilities of this new technology are limitless!

[APOLLO]

2 hours ago, jjb1970 said:

It pains me that we are still talking about old technologies like diesel and electric traction. 

 

I advocate an alternative type of heat engine which uses water as the working fluid and which exploits the energy transfer potential of water when changing phase to provide useful work. Such an engine is a viable technological solution which would free us from reliance on diesel and electric power. As an interim step it would actually be possible to develop a hybrid electric - water engine, leveraging advantages of each while we transition to the future.

 

One too many "Singapore Slings" ? -- !!!!!!!!!!

 

Brit15

[jjb1970]

39 minutes ago, APOLLO said:

 

One too many "Singapore Slings" ? -- !!!!!!!!!!

 

Brit15

 

I have my best ideas when I am tired and emotional.

[Phil Mc]

On 27/01/2023 at 19:09, newbryford said:

 

Although IIRC that would cause some platform/train length issues. Albeit "fixable" with selective door opening. 

Meadowhall is one.

Can only handle 4 coaches of a Mk5 set in the platform. (Not that I've actually managed to see one in service there, only staff training turns.....☹️

Pairs of 185's can only operate doors on 4 coaches there too.

 

Cheers,

Phil.

Edited January 30, 2023 by Phil Mc

[GWRPhil]

On 08/04/2022 at 13:19, 4630 said:

Difficult to see these as 'new trains' anymore, but as the class 68s and Mark 5s have never fully entered service with TPE, I guess it's probably still a relevant description!

 

 

They are newer than older trains. Maybe “TPE trains moving forward in the North”

 

(sounds like an advertising slogan)

[birdseyecircus]

It's being reported on a number of sites/ forums that TPE are to withdraw the class 68s & mk5 stock from the December time table.

 

Paul

[GordonC]

11 minutes ago, birdseyecircus said:

It's being reported on a number of sites/ forums that TPE are to withdraw the class 68s & mk5 stock from the December time table.

 

Paul

 

permanently withdraw? would they not have a leasing contract on them so unless they could find another use then they'd be stuck with them?

[Gilbert]

From the TPE 68 FB group

 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/413897616021577

 

"Today, TransPennine Express have announced the withdrawal of Class 68 & Mk5A operation from their timetable from December going forward. The decision, we are told, was not one that has been taken lightly - however it is necessary to ensure a stabilisation in the timetable.

As it stands, Sunday 10th December will be the last time a Class 68 will haul Mk5A Coaches in passenger service for TransPennine Express."

 

[hexagon789]

25 minutes ago, GordonC said:

 

permanently withdraw? would they not have a leasing contract on them so unless they could find another use then they'd be stuck with them?

Warm store until Spring 2024 when the current TPE lease on them runs out.

 

Then - who knows...?

[nightstar.train]

22 minutes ago, hexagon789 said:

Then - who knows...?

 

It's tough as it's a small fleet, just 13 sets. Allowing for maintenance etc then they can only realistically cover 11 diagrams. or maybe even just 10. There's been talk of Scotrail replacing the HSTs as the unions are threatening to black them. But Scotrail have 26 HST sets so would need a follow on order from CAF or a split fleet, neither of which feel likely. A more likely candidate for that would probably be the Midland Mainline class 222s (27 sets) when they are displaced by the class 810s. Maybe an open access operator would want them? They are rated for 125mph so can happily fit in on either the ECML or WCML (with a different loco). I hope they do find a new operator, and Accurascale make a new run of them in the new livery. 

[TomScrut]

1 hour ago, hexagon789 said:

Warm store until Spring 2024 when the current TPE lease on them runs out.

 

Then - who knows...?

 

Wow, didn't think anyone would fund the lease of new stock for only 5 years. Unless TPE have been paying a LOT for them. That said, I know very little about rail leasing.

[woodenhead]

Might 5 years have been the end of the TOC’s TPE contract as was?

[Ben86]

2 hours ago, Gilbert said:

From the TPE 68 FB group

 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/413897616021577

 

"Today, TransPennine Express have announced the withdrawal of Class 68 & Mk5A operation from their timetable from December going forward. The decision, we are told, was not one that has been taken lightly - however it is necessary to ensure a stabilisation in the timetable.

As it stands, Sunday 10th December will be the last time a Class 68 will haul Mk5A Coaches in passenger service for TransPennine Express."

 

Sad news, but hardly surprising with the lack of use of the fleet, on the day the news broke, class 68022 Resolution awaits to depart leeds station whilst working 1U47 1135 Manchester Piccadilly to Scarborough. 25/08/23

 

 

[Watto1990]

Anyone made a start on forming the Nova 3 Presentation Society yet? 😂 

[phil-b259]

1 hour ago, TomScrut said:

 

Wow, didn't think anyone would fund the lease of new stock for only 5 years. Unless TPE have been paying a LOT for them. That said, I know very little about rail leasing.

 

They didn't!  - please remember the TPE fleet was ordered BEFORE a certain Pandemic wrecked the railways fiances and made all previous assumptions about passenger numbers (which lest we forget had seen around 30 years of steady increases and no signs of collapsing) had to be junked. 

 

Since then we have had the DfT turning all franchises into management contracts and decreeing that 'As very few people are using the trains these days the railways are awash with empty trains running at too frequent intervals and its necessary to cull them so as to repay 'hard working tax payers' for all the money they 'pumped into the railways during the Pandemic

 

Had the Pandemic and HMGs subsequent actions been foreseen at the time then the contract for the Mk5s would never have been let in the first place!

 

You should also not that XC are about to withdraw their HST fleet and the remaining GWR HST fleet has been halved (with 'robust' discussions necessary by Mark Hopwood / GWR to keep any of them!

 

As such its highly likely the TPE Mk5s will be exported or scrapped rather than re-used in the UK - remember the DfT are firmly in cuts mode*

 

 

* Though Roger Fords most recent blog suggests that HM Treasury might have finally conceded that they cannot 'cut their way to profitability' and that'growing the market is the only way to recovery - though preferably without any extra phyiscal assets of course!

Edited August 25, 2023 by phil-b259

[Gilbert]

36 minutes ago, Watto1990 said:

Anyone made a start on forming the Nova 3 Presentation Society yet? 😂 

Preservation?

 

[phil-b259]

4 minutes ago, Gilbert said:

Preservation?

 

 

Yup.

 

Given the lunatics (the DfT / HM Treasuary) which are running the system these days and an obsession with cuts, cuts and yet more cuts to try and 'balance the books' you don't seriously think they have a future in the UK do you?

[Gilbert]

15 minutes ago, phil-b259 said:

 

Yup.

 

Given the lunatics (the DfT / HM Treasuary) which are running the system these days and an obsession with cuts, cuts and yet more cuts to try and 'balance the books' you don't seriously think they have a future in the UK do you?

On the dockside at Hull on the way to a second life no doubt...

[rodent279]

Another round of short-sighted decision making which we will come to regret in future years. Once they're gone, they're gone, and just like closed railway lines, they will be a load harder and more expensive to replace.

[APOLLO]

31 minutes ago, phil-b259 said:

 

Yup.

 

Given the lunatics (the DfT / HM Treasuary) which are running the system these days and an obsession with cuts, cuts and yet more cuts to try and 'balance the books' you don't seriously think they have a future in the UK do you?

 

 

Felix on the ELR  July 2022 (ELR diesel gala day).

 

My first and probably last run behind one - what a breathtaking acceleration up to 25mph !!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Our railways are being "managed" into oblivion. So very, very, sad.

 

No cars soon (except Mega expensive EV's), Less trains, strikes, HS2 from nowhere to nowhere, most rail projects in trouble financially, buses a joke & unreliable, no gas boilers soon, interest rates / energy / food / housing  through the roof, rampant inflation, strikes no end in sight.

 

What a crock of Poo !!!

 

Brit15