Brass0four Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 (edited) It's a wonderful scheme, Sasquatch - jaw dropping! - but I do see Kal's point. My layout has a 1:144" rise and the same length descent. A pacific-hauled ten-coach train, entering the visual section at a scale 60+ mph, is reduced to a calculated 20mph by the time it reaches the apex of a 5' radii curve; part of this is due to carriage-wheel friction. This is with the controller set at the same setting, and I made it so purposely as it maintains a mechanically automatic performance, which - I'm please to say - works better than anticipated. (one of my very few successes!) The downside of any incline is that lightweight locos - the Hornby sound Black 5 is one of my worst, is greatly reduced in hauling power. Diesels are generally OK with most inclines; small steam locos much less so. On the drawing, the left hand-loop with its climb and decent on seems to indicate tightish curves. I used large radius set-track to test the whole idea and was badly put off by the result! Steam-hauled long passenger trains needed be doing something like 200+mph not to stall; A horrible sight with all the coach-ends sticking out at angles while the loco worked at Scalextric speeds! But again, as Kal says, you have the edge expertise-wise that puts me, at least, in the shade. You'll work it out I'm sure. Pity you couldn't view my video Sasquatch. ;-) Tony. Edited January 25, 2014 by Brass0four Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 (edited) You are both right of course! The plan is a sketch up so very misleading. That top loop will occupy 9'x5' and I'm not looking to run anything longer than 6 coaches as it's all secondary lines. Sasquatch is not a 12 coach kind of guy. (Although I also have A1s,2s,3s, and 4s!!) Long trains look silly on small layouts as there's always compression. All curves will have a cant this helps with such matters. All stock has metal wheels. Kit builds have pin point bearings. The gradients on Goathland are 1;50 there was a few problems with starting locos in the station, I resorted to banking with an old white metal J50 on a Triang chassis at one point which once perfected was quite effective and great fun. Now there's a thought, radio controlled banker!! Most trains will be short. Ivatt class 4 with 4 coaches. N1 with non corridor pair. J50 with 6 or 7 coal wagons. Crab with 10 vans. Longer trains will be hauled by 10 wheelers WD8f with hoppers 8F with bogie bolsters A2 with Halifax Pullman portion. Patriot on parcels B1 with express perishables Etc. etc. Edited January 25, 2014 by Sasquatch 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 That looks a cracking plan Shaun, I wanted a centre section in my new Den but I wont have the width to get either side of it. The gradient on a curve issue is something I'm looking at with my new plan so I will be interested to follow your success, or F , no no no no. just SUCCESS. And 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 (edited) I'm looking for 1 in 80! on 2'4½" radius. :laugh: Edited January 25, 2014 by Sasquatch Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 Not gonna happen, is it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brass0four Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 I'm looking for 1 in 80! I just edited mine, it should have been 1:144". Generally I agree with you about long trains on small layouts. Mine is only 12 X 14 but is designed as a "watch the trains go by" four track main-line and is very simple. Supposed to be south of Leeds with only a reasonable marshalling/goods yard on one side and a shed (based on Copley Hill) complex on the other. It's all on transition curves through grotty urban scenery/architecture and that's it. Changing locos on long trains is the main practice with the marshalling yard providing shunting fun as required. The track is mainly done and it works for me. The challenge is all that ruddy architecture: yards of terraces, factories, etc. I've just seen your last post. If anyone can do it you can. You could mock-up the loop with its over/underpass and try it. Shouldn't be too hard, then you'll know. The train lengths you are talking about will make it much more doable. Tony. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 I could flip the whole plan and run the incline behind Goathland giving 26' length, that's 1 in 104 on the straight! The curves need not be so tight and the passing loops need not be hidden and can be in the loop!! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 Like this 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brass0four Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Now that looks much better to me! Otherwise, do you see it as "the layout of a lifetime"? (not suggesting you'd not do anything else as a break/side-line) 'Cos doing it all to your high standards will take a while. Although I am the slowest modeller on the planet, whilst a rare few - like Jaz - are so scenically prolific that ones jaw is firmly wedded to ones chest. And you model first class structures very swiftly. But, as you've said elsewhere (L8r) there is the joy of a full life in your new wonderful environment. Enjoy smelling the cedars! Tony. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 (edited) Oh yes. This will be the last project. I'll need to get a job to finance it which will eat into modeling time. Need to keep the costs down with baulk cheap plywood, second hand rail, scratch built structures from dollar store foam board, scenic made from natural stuff, reclaimed telephone and Ethernet cables, Vietnamese embossed plastic card (it's half the price of that other well known brand we have over here) and sack the charwalla who just lazes about all day staring at the internet! Where is my third cuppa anyhow. Suppose I need to change into the sarong and do it myself!! Edited January 25, 2014 by Sasquatch 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 (edited) Hi I agree with Tony that I think the new plan is much more likely to give you sleepless nights. Funnily enough the incline hidden in the Goathland hillside is exactly what I have gone for. My gradient is so sedate new coaches will not run away down it when new from the box. I hate giving "advice" to people, as it sounds like I know better, when really it is just saying what I would aim at. Edited January 25, 2014 by Kal Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted January 25, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 Hi Shaun. Since you managed to wade your way through KL I thought it only right to pay you a visit. Glad I did, I'm enjoying it very much - and plenty of lively discussion too! I'd better start chucking a few "likes" your way!! Jeff 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 Advise is always welcome. I wanted Goathland viewing from both sides anyhow and the new plan allows for that too. So 23'x17' saving 20' of rail and 10sq' scenic section. I need not worry about the door position either!! All dive under but I may raise the mean height to 49 48". 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 (edited) Welcome Jeff. Lots of waffle here too mate! regards Shaun (Still wading) Edited January 25, 2014 by Sasquatch 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted January 25, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 Welcome Jeff. Lots of waffle here too mate! regards Shaun (Still wading) My kind of layout - lots of atmosphere and some lovely buildings. Love the abbey. I see what you mean about the cabinets. I'm a competent wood-chopper, but lack true finesse!! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted January 25, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 Advise is always welcome. I wanted Goathland viewing from both sides anyhow and the new plan allows for that too. So 23'x17' saving 20' of rail and 10sq' scenic section. I need not worry about the door position either!! All dive under but I may raise the mean height to 49 48". Interesting. I had the boards of KL at around 110cm (3'8"), but KL2 will be at 130cm (4'4") to allow more underboard clearance and easier access. It'll be ok for me underneath (I'm only 5'6") but I'll have to make myself a 12" wooden box to stand on for ease of access. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brass0four Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 . I hate giving "advice" to people, as it sounds like I know better, when really it is just saying what I would aim at. Me too! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 My kind of layout - lots of atmosphere and some lovely buildings. Love the abbey. I see what you mean about the cabinets. I'm a competent wood-chopper, but lack true finesse!! Jeff Have just finished full paneling in our living room it's all MDF and spackle. Some major structural repair work to the ceiling/rafters and rebuild of the wall around the window. Not to mention moving the doorways and sliding pocket doors. Want some pics? 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted January 25, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 Have just finished full paneling in our living room it's all MDF and spackle. Some major structural repair work to the ceiling/rafters and rebuild of the wall around the window. Not to mention moving the doorways and sliding pocket doors. Want some pics? GO ON!!!!! I can't resist the temptation..... Give us the full Oregon show.....!! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaz Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Like this more viaducts and canals etc...... sound like a GOOD plan..... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Come on Shaun, I have some doors to change soon. And Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 Here's the full horror story and the reason no modeling has got done. 70s Cabin feel 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sasquatch Posted January 25, 2014 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 25, 2014 Should be painting huh! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Well.... Whether you consider it modelling or not, that is a lovely job. Not so sure, about your pyjamas though! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 This is what I have to remove in our new place in a few weeks, luckily only one 16 ft wall of it BUT it will come in handy for lining out one side of the New Den. :locomotive: Do you want a Job? :no: Bodge 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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