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Hornby Princess Coronation Class (Duchess)

Dick Turpin

By Dick Turpin
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Paul_sterling

Paul_sterling

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Non gloss? Wasn't the Locomotion one the same Crimson Lake as 46256? The very same colour most people are raving about?

 

more a semi gloss, but yes. and I personally am quite impressed by it, subtle enough to carry off a museum finish or preservation finish, but not so OTT that it looks like a toy, as my Heljan Western Enterprise did.

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brushman47544

brushman47544

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The original release sold so well that it seems the demand is still there, so it would be silly not to make the most of it.

 

Indeed, as long as they don't over produce and then end up selling them off cheap. It would also suggest that Hornby has no immediate plans for a standard production run of a variant such as with the yellow cab stripe.

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MikeParkin65

MikeParkin65

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The original release sold so well that it seems the demand is still there, so it would be silly not to make the most of it.

A logic they don't seem to have applied to Pecketts! But then I should imagine the profit margin is greater with the 46256 and its a money in the bank quick win for Hornby. 

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adb968008

adb968008

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Wow, and just yesterday someone paid £369 for this one...

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hornby-R3555-BR-Princess-Coronation-Sir-William-A-Stanier-FRS-Brand-New/122949859586?epid=12008042464&hash=item1ca061f902:g:2nIAAOSwSutaCHNV

 

In a few months he might be able to get two for the same price.

In 6 months it might be even less, so far as I know each time the “2nd bite at the identical cherry stunt” has been tried it’s crashed the market. Maybe Hornby might shift them all to shops by limiting the run, the shops will end up carrying them.

As only 33 have been sold on ebay above £200.. it’s not a mass.. the last auctioned one at £330 was actually only a fight between 4 people .. as 4 have been sold since Feb 3rd.. it could be that demand is nearly met.

 

By example Peckett prices have completely crashed...at one point 3x RRP, the last one that sold on ebay ..today.. sold for £104..pretty much RRP.

 

If the re-run is 100, they could probably clear it.. 500.. i’m not so convinced... it’s not as if you can convert or renumber it to anything else.. 46257 is an inevitability at some point from Hornby.

Edited by adb968008
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Black 5 Bear

Black 5 Bear

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Wasn't this precisely what Hornby did with the airsmooth W/C Exeter, which Sanda-Kan massively under-produced some years back???

Or in the case of SWS, is it because of QC issues???

I had three in total from three different outlets,maybe I was just unlucky but they all went back for various defects, which couldn't be readily rectified.

I'm biding my time before I purchase to see if Hornby have got it right with this model.

Edited by Black 5 Bear
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MikeParkin65

MikeParkin65

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I suppose another possibility is that there is a batch of Ivatts being produced as a limited edition for someone and they have tagged another run of maroon 46256's on to the end of it? There is precedent in the apparently short runs of Class 31 being produced for Kernow. They certainly seem to be pitching the Duchess at the premium rather than the mass market.

 

And to think you can buy a King for as little as £69.50 at the moment!

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robmcg

robmcg

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I don't what the fuss is about, you can buy one new from a retailer in NZ

 

https://www.hobbycity.nz/collections/locomotives/products/br-coronation-cl-sir-william

 

about £185, plus delivery   but that price is quite normal local retail for we antipodeans,  who have the advantage of VAT off for web purchases from UK retailer (not Ebay)

 

the above may even qualify for NZ goods and services tax off for export,  12.5% off   but I don't know Hobby City's system... only that they are good retailers here. (no connection)

 

FWIW I bought two SWS models from UK sellers, one was faulty , front locating lug broken, valve gear badly made/bent, , paint, mostly fixable but refunded in full after return to Rails, the other was fine.

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ScRSG

ScRSG

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In 6 months it might be even less, so far as I know each time the “2nd bite at the identical cherry stunt” has been tried it’s crashed the market.

Crashed what market? The Ebay one ....oh, dear, how sad! The new run won't saturate the market to such an extent that there will be hundreds left at Hornby or even their retailers, they are only likely to make a few hundred at most.

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Black 5 Bear

Black 5 Bear

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Does anyone know how many were in the original batch?[/

 

When I originally sent my first loco back for replacement, the lady in Hornby customer services stated about a 1000 units.

I'm aware from speaking to other dealers that there were a fair few returns for various QC issues, so who knows and maybe that's why they've done a second run.

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JSpencer

JSpencer

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Does anyone know how many were in the original batch?

 

We don't know how many models Hornby sets for a production these days. But we do know that the initial lot sold out on pre-orders (we passed a period whereby it was no longer possible to pre-order the model) causing Hornby to increase the size of the initial batch (which meant a few months later, the model was again re-opened to pre-orders).

 

So let's assume it was 500 then they added another 500, it could be a 1000.

Or maybe the first run was initially set at 1000, then 500 added.

 

So, I'd say somewhere between 1000 and 2000 models.

With Exeter, they probably knee jerked too many out in the second run. I guess this SWS extra batch will be conservative and takes into account the year on year price increase (Exeter did not).

You probably only need a few hundred more to settle market demand. Too many, and models will sit on shelves.

 

=========

Side tracking slightly, the issue of all wheels not touching the rails (the famous sheet of paper slides underneath test), I found some older Sanda Kan models have the same issue - maybe this was not noticeable when people paid less than a £100 for these but probably we are becoming more nit picking as we steam towards £200 (and beyond). I also found some Bachmann have also the same issue which suggests fettling of diecast chassis parts is to a broad tolerance (I'm sure the axle holes are machined out, if the tool doing that is square end, we end up with square axle boxes on the chassis part for that production instead of curved).

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Paul_sterling

Paul_sterling

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Does anyone know how many were in the original batch?[/

 

When I originally sent my first loco back for replacement, the lady in Hornby customer services stated about a 1000 units.

I'm aware from speaking to other dealers that there were a fair few returns for various QC issues, so who knows and maybe that's why they've done a second run.

 

That does add some insight to my earlier post about the changing volumes for manufacturers like Hornby. and to think that the two tender Flying Scotsman sets were limited to an exclusive 5000 units........

 

Paul. 

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G-BOAF

G-BOAF

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=========

Side tracking slightly, the issue of all wheels not touching the rails (the famous sheet of paper slides underneath test), I found some older Sanda Kan models have the same issue - maybe this was not noticeable when people paid less than a £100 for these but probably we are becoming more nit picking as we steam towards £200 (and beyond). I also found some Bachmann have also the same issue which suggests fettling of diecast chassis parts is to a broad tolerance (I'm sure the axle holes are machined out, if the tool doing that is square end, we end up with square axle boxes on the chassis part for that production instead of curved).

 

that would certainly explain why numerous Hornby locos have floating middle driving wheels. I have just packed a Royal 70000 Britannia by 0.6mm to get the drivers true. And have to do the same to the K1, as well as pack to top edges to get the body straight. If the axle/bearing recesses are machined, this would explain different heights and leaning bodies. HOWEVER, I would assume that they are machined using some sort of shaped tool. How then does one end up with 'flat' edges which are often the cause of 'rocking' on a centre axle? This would suggest tool damage to the recesses. It might help if Hornby give us insight into their production processes (that is if they can't ensure all their chassis sit true). I certainly won't be accepting hovering axles on my Duchess... (well I might pack a centre axle, but not a leading or trailing axle)

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MikeParkin65

MikeParkin65

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Does anyone know how many were in the original batch?[/

 

When I originally sent my first loco back for replacement, the lady in Hornby customer services stated about a 1000 units.

I'm aware from speaking to other dealers that there were a fair few returns for various QC issues, so who knows and maybe that's why they've done a second run.

 Is it possible this new 'small batch' is in fact Hornby constructing  new 'good' models out of a larger than usual number of returns? Problems seem to have been broken body lugs (fixable), mangled valve gear (fixable) and marked or damaged bodies (less fixable - these are proper 'seconds'). For the price this model is going for I would think it would be worth Hornby's while employing whatever service desk capacity they have to create saleable 46256's from the parts bin. 

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G-BOAF

G-BOAF

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 Is it possible this new 'small batch' is in fact Hornby constructing  new 'good' models out of a larger than usual number of returns? Problems seem to have been broken body lugs (fixable), mangled valve gear (fixable) and marked or damaged bodies (less fixable - these are proper 'seconds'). For the price this model is going for I would think it would be worth Hornby's while employing whatever service desk capacity they have to create saleable 46256's from the parts bin. 

I don't quite see how they can fix the body lug, which from descriptions on here is moulded as part of the main body shell element, and sell the model as 'new' rather than 'refurbished' (no Class 50 jokes please).

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G-BOAF

G-BOAF

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Yes I was a bit surprised to see that. Clearly old stock that someone somewhere has found, and decided to offload in Liverpool! I do wonder how many orders they will get from people thinking it is the new model (and not looking at the picture or R number!).

Looking at the old model, the biggest things that really stick out to me are the cab front windows, bogie/body gap and the general character/detail of the chassis. And then the tender chassi shelf! So basically the model forward of the cab and above the running plate is really quite good even by 2018 standards!

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