daltonparva Posted April 15, 2017 Share Posted April 15, 2017 Does anyone have a fixed(ish) price yet? Many websites are saying TBA still.... . Hattons ad in Modeller says "pre-order for £111 (estimated). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold NHY 581 Posted April 15, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 15, 2017 Sounds about right really, albeit subject to change. Regardless of that, really looking forward to these arriving. I can wait........ Rob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWR8700 Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 (edited) I don't know if anyone noticed but in the catalogue they listed some of this model's features like firebox flicker, the return of sprung buffers (Yes!) and a pre fitted speaker. So maybe they are all sound versions, not too sure. Sounds promising! Edited January 24, 2018 by GWR8700 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 I don't know if anyone noticed but in the catalogue they listed some of this model's features like firebox flicker, the return of sprung buffers (Yes!) and a pre fitted speaker. So maybe they are all sound versions, not too sure. Sounds promising!Or not. As a DC railway modeller I don't want that sort of stuff, all it does is increase the price. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Decorum Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 Or not. As a DC railway modeller I don't want that sort of stuff, all it does is increase the price. It’s an awkward one. I welcome it. No soldering, no messing with wires. Just plug in a sound decoder. On the other hand, as you say, it adds to the cost for features you don’t want. If the manufacturers do two versions, each becomes a little more expensive. I don’t think that I would like to be a manufacturer, trying to work out what the market wants. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Downer Posted January 24, 2018 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 24, 2018 (edited) Simple really - they’re running out of subjects that will sell in large quantities, so the accent has to be on selling, and charging for, increased quality. Hence the crane, this super-duper 1P, all the bells and whistles on the forthcoming Mark2F coaches. Edited January 24, 2018 by Downer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold NHY 581 Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2018 Simple really - they’re running out of subjects that will sell in large quantities, so the accent has to be on selling, and charging for, increased quality. Hence the crane, this super-duper 1P, all the bells and whistles on the forthcoming Mark2F coaches. I have to say, I think this will sell in large quantaties. Rob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
daltonparva Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 (edited) I don't think "firebox flicker" necessarily means DCC fitted. Their diesel locos have lights which work on DC, and become switchable with a DCC chip.. I presume one light in a firebox will do the same. Edited January 24, 2018 by daltonparva Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2018 Or not. As a DC railway modeller I don't want that sort of stuff, all it does is increase the price. And reduce the space available for adhesive weight, a vital issue on a small loco. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2018 (edited) I am sure one model has opening smokebox door along with opening firebox door with fire flicker which is just overkill and just adding cost for very little use under normal running. Hopefully it's just a one off and not a sign of the norm to come Edited January 24, 2018 by farren Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWR8700 Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 I don't think "firebox flicker" necessarily means DCC fitted. Their diesel locos have lights which work on DC, and become switchable with a DCC chip.. I presume one light in a firebox will do the same. True, but it also says pre-fitted sound speaker which would imply dcc onboard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2018 I read it as meaning just the speaker on board and no chip. Obviously it would be DCC ready. But I don't like the idea that everyone has to pay the extra money for something many won't want or use. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWR8700 Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 (edited) I know this is stated as the 1532 class but isn't the BR version a member of the later 2228 class? I'm just going off Wikipedia so it's probably not particularly accurate Edited January 24, 2018 by GWR8700 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
daltonparva Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 I read it as meaning just the speaker on board and no chip. Obviously it would be DCC ready. But I don't like the idea that everyone has to pay the extra money for something many won't want or use. Adding a speaker at point of manufacture probably only adds pennies to the cost. The Webb tank had wiring and provision for only one type/size of speaker, so it's logical to go one step further at small cost and add the correct speaker, thereby eliminating possible problems caused by aftermarket fitting attempts. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 I tend to agree with daltonparva here. Getting the speaker into a loco, even 7mm models, can be fraught. So, yes, doing this at the factory only adds pennies but save the modeller grief if he/she wants to add sound. Hopefully it will be wired to the board making sound plug and play. In another thread by Little Loco Company, that manufacturer has said exactly the same thing about their upcoming model. It will be wired for sound AND smoke. There one or twoo 4mm models years ago that had smokebox glow (Hornby tender drive 8F as I recall) but it never seemed to catch on. Now, with sound, the glow can be synched with "fireman shovelling" because the door is only open then. John 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free At Last Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 Quotedoing this at the factory only adds pennies Was it Graham Hubbard who said adding sprung buffers at the factory ends up costing £15 extra on the retail price by the time everyone along the chain adds their margin. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Flying Pig Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 24, 2018 This argument cropped up on the Farish 40 thread as these models are also fitted with speakers as standard. However, only one model actually has DCC onboard (with sound) and it is clearly advertised as such and sold at a commensurately higher price. The other 40s are £5-10 pounds more expensive than comparable models such as recent 37s and 55s on the retail sites I've looked at, though it isn't possible to say how much of this is due to the speaker. In the 2018 Farish announcements, Bachmann advise that they are updating the chassis of a number of recent models to also have speakers as standard, so it looks like company policy in N gauge at least. It makes sense from their point of view to rationalise the range. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Wellyboots Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2018 I know this is stated as the 1532 class but isn't the BR version a member of the later 2228 class? I'm just going off Wikipedia so it's probably not particularly accurate According to Midland Engines No.1 58072 was originally MR 2226 which was a Class 1833 engine, the first of the Class 2228 in BR service was 58073 which was originally MR 2229. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 24, 2018 (edited) I know this is stated as the 1532 class but isn't the BR version a member of the later 2228 class? I'm just going off Wikipedia so it's probably not particularly accurate 31-740 No. 1273 (post-1907 number, originally No. 1539) was a member of the 1532 class, one of the first twenty built at Derby to O/N 289 in 1881/2. Not built as a condensing engine. Not to be confused with pre-1907 No. 1273, a member of the 1252 class of 1875/6, which had 3" larger diameter driving wheels. Bachmann's photo shows the engine in a transitional condition as running about 1909 (according to Summerson), with a flat Deeley smokebox door but still the original Johnson smokebox and chimney. Is this the condition Bachmann's model will represent? 31-741 No. 1303 (pre-1907 No. 1649) was likewise a member of the 1532 class, one of the batch of twenty built at Derby to O/N 460 in 1883/4, and also not built as a condensing engine. 31-742 No. 58072 (Pre-1907 No. 2226; post-1907 and LMS No. 1379) was indeed a member of the 1823 class, one of ten condensing engines built by Neilsons in 1893. The 1823 and 1833 classes were externally identical to the 1532 class, the difference being larger cylinders and higher boiler pressure. The 2228 class (1907 and LMS Nos. 1381 upwards, BR survivors 58073 upwards) had longer bunkers and deeper tanks. Refs. R.J. Essery & D. Jenkinson, An Illustrated Review of Midland Locomotives, Vol. 3 (Wild Swan Publications, 1988). F. James, D. Hunt & R. Essery, Midland Engines No. 1: '1833'and '2228' Class Bogie Passenger Tanks (Wild Swan Publications, 1999). S. Summerson, Midland Railway Locomotives, Vol. 3 (Irwell Press, 2002). EDIT: The numbering details in the Wikipedia entries for the Johnson 0-4-4T classes appear to be correct. Edited January 24, 2018 by Compound2632 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold NHY 581 Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2018 I will certainly have a home for more than one of these. They are essential for a Midland based layout, or as in my case, a Somerset and Dorset based layout. In addition the providing of pre grouping liveries is very appealing. I really do think that Bachmann are onto a winner and the 1P fills a gap in the stable of Midland locomotives already offered by them. Rob 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWR8700 Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 (edited) 31-740 No. 1273 (post-1907 number, originally No. 1539) was a member of the 1532 class, one of the first twenty built at Derby to O/N 289 in 1881/2. Not built as a condensing engine. Not to be confused with pre-1907 No. 1273, a member of the 1252 class of 1875/6, which had 3" larger diameter driving wheels. Bachmann's photo shows the engine in a transitional condition as running about 1909 (according to Summerson), with a flat Deeley smokebox door but still the original Johnson smokebox and chimney. Is this the condition Bachmann's model will represent? 31-741 No. 1303 (pre-1907 No. 1649) was likewise a member of the 1532 class, one of the batch of twenty built at Derby to O/N 460 in 1883/4, and also not built as a condensing engine. 31-742 No. 58072 (Pre-1907 No. 2226; post-1907 and LMS No. 1379) was indeed a member of the 1823 class, one of ten condensing engines built by Neilsons in 1893. The 1823 and 1833 classes were externally identical to the 1532 class, the difference being larger cylinders and higher boiler pressure. The 2228 class (1907 and LMS Nos. 1381 upwards, BR survivors 58073 upwards) had longer bunkers and deeper tanks. Refs. R.J. Essery & D. Jenkinson, An Illustrated Review of Midland Locomotives, Vol. 3 (Wild Swan Publications, 1988). F. James, D. Hunt & R. Essery, Midland Engines No. 1: '1833'and '2228' Class Bogie Passenger Tanks (Wild Swan Publications, 1999). S. Summerson, Midland Railway Locomotives, Vol. 3 (Irwell Press, 2002). EDIT: The numbering details in the Wikipedia entries for the Johnson 0-4-4T classes appear to be correct. Thanks for that, I must have just been confused with the numbers. Probably the model I am most excited for at the moment! Edited January 24, 2018 by GWR8700 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 24, 2018 Apropos of the S&DJR, apart from the single 1532 class 0-4-4T transferred to the joint line in the twenties and subsequently re-assimilated into the class, resuming its old number (and of which Bachmann are aware), the other blue 0-4-4Ts - the nine built by Avonside in 1877 and the four by the Vulcan Foundry in 1883 - are bit of a mystery to me. I don't have much on them but I gather they differed from the contemporary Midland engines quite significantly, even possibly having shorter coupled wheelbase than 8'0". Is this so? Johnson's 4-4-0s for the S&DJR are also charmingly petite and unlike any of his Midland engines and I'm starting to suspect that even the Neilson and Vulcan Foundry "Scottie" 0-6-0s were smaller than standard, though not the later Derby-built and Neilson "Bulldogs". This is in contrast to the engines he supplied for the M&GN which were identical to contemporary Midland classes. Curious. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold NHY 581 Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2018 Bachmann offering is only good for the example transferred in the twenties to replace a life expired example. No good for the orginal S&D example for a number of reasons. It appeared in Midland Red livery but lettered/numbered as S&DJR No 54.....Either way, if Bachmann produce one in Prussian blue I for one will have one....or two.... Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkC Posted January 24, 2018 Share Posted January 24, 2018 Quite a number were fitted for Pull Push I think. No one does any Pl Ph LMS coaches (why oh why? ) but the new Hornby PIII Non Corridors can be converted. The old Airfix/Dapol coaches wouldn't be correct for this. John 51L/Wizard did/do? D-502 and D-526 coach kits, complete with push-pull ends Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted January 24, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 24, 2018 The Ratio Midland suburbans are also good candidates for the later period, with a number being converted in the early 1930s and surviving until the very early 50s, or mid 50s if you're not too particular about using 8'0" wide vehicles with 10' wheelbase bogies to represent 8'6" wide ones with 8' bogies. Coachman has at one time or another posted photos of examples of such conversions he's built. The Wizard kits mentioned are for earlier 43' and 45' arc-roofed carriages converted in 1907, so contemporary with Bachmann's model of No. 1273. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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