West Highland Line V4, a 1980's West Highland Line layout

[young37215]

22 hours ago, 37Oban said:

Hi,

 

prior to my previous post re: the ferry van, I think would be added to a normal freight service on an "as required" basis.  At the time Oban received a regular freight service, mainly fuel oil for the ferries and fishing fleet and central heating oil, with other wagons added as needed.

 

Roja

 

Thanks Roja, I agree that the daily Glasgow to Oban freight would have been the likely means of movement if a ferry van cargo was in transit which is borne out by the few pictures that exist. My point was that I don't think that many ferry van trips were made judging by the limited number seen in pictures. Your idea that it is whisky the ferry van was required for is very plausible although it would be nice to get a definitive answer as to what it carried and where it went/came from.

 

37017 makes use of its vacum brakes when collecting a rake of Dogfish from Crianlarich in preparation for ballasting on the viaduct. A tamper awaits to follow on behind to make good the ballast drops and track alignment. This will be a day or two more in the waiting because I am off to London for a day out today. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 7, 2022 by young37215

[Legend]

Forgive me for stating the obvious , but could the Ferryvan or PMV not just be getting used as the block wagon for oil trains . I'm not sure it would be getting used for whisky , there would be a lot of security implications around that , especially when passing through Glasgow !

[37Oban]

Hi,

 

as far as I'm aware, the oil tanks, being air braked, didn't need block, or barrier, wagons.  At least, all the times I saw them there I never saw any other wagons in their consists.  However, if needed, any other air-braked vans etc could be added to this service.

 

Security for the Ferryvan would not be a problem.  If it was used for whisky, once loaded it would be examined, then sealed by a customs official using official seals on the door locks.  Apart from signal checks, and one, maybe two stops, to allow passing trains on the the line between Crianlariach and Craigendoran, the train would be routed directly to, I would assume,  Mossend yard prior to transit to the south coast and Europe.

 

This is all conjecture, I have no actual knowledge that this is, in fact, what actually happened, but it seems quite plausible.  Maybe someone more knowledgeable on the movement of whisky from the various distilleries to Europe via rail could put me right.

 

Roja

[03060]

12 hours ago, Legend said:

Forgive me for stating the obvious , but could the Ferryvan or PMV not just be getting used as the block wagon for oil trains . I'm not sure it would be getting used for whisky , there would be a lot of security implications around that , especially when passing through Glasgow !

 

Yes, possibly and I have to say that I hadn't thought of that but the Don Gatehouse photo has one at the head of an empty timber train heading towards Oban from where I would expect all returning fuel tanks to be empty.

 

These particular Belgian made Ferryvan(s) that are always in the few photos that I've seen have a central door with outside strengthening bars as a design feature unlike other types of Ferryvan .... but I don't know if that's relevant to increased security or not .... and probably still not strong enough to withstand opening by a 'Glasgi nightlatch key' ! LoL.

 

At the end of the day, from a modelling point of view we don't really need to know what's inside the van, it could be anything from boxes of detergent to bespoke Italian furniture, alas we may never know, but they do make an interesting addition to the trains and scenes being modelled.

 

Apologies to Rob for me distracting attention away from his current WHL v.4 scenic development which sounds like it is heading towards a satisfactory conclusion after a bit of redesign headscratching on his part. Looking forward to seeing this feature in the morning photos to cheer me up after another long night shift.

 

Kind regards,

Ian.

Edited December 7, 2022 by 03060
More waffle added.

[young37215]

19 hours ago, 37Oban said:

as far as I'm aware, the oil tanks, being air braked, didn't need block, or barrier, wagons.  At least, all the times I saw them there I never saw any other wagons in their consists.  However, if needed, any other air-braked vans etc could be added to this service.

 

Some interesting points although I am not certain that all oil tanks were TTA's (air braked) and not TTV's (vacum braked) in the early 80's. For sure the oil tanks seen on the Mallaig extension were TTV's so that they could work with the vacum braked coaching stock. Whether this impacted the need for a barrier wagon I don't know but I largely discounted it because I have seen plenty of pictures with oil tanks next to the loco. Would there be a different requirement for a vacum braked train as against an air braked one? 

 

A good day out yesterday, fortunately I managed to miss the chaos at Euston and other than a 30 minute delay by GWR on the train home, everything ran to time. A quick peak at the viaduct and it appeared that all plaster cloth and Sculptamold was dry so I painted it.  Work is incomplete around the base of the pillars and the edges of where the rail enters the viaduct at each end. I intend fixing the structure in place using decorators cauk around the bases before completing the ends; even without this and the application of any scenic matter the viaduct is beginning to have the feel that I am looking for.

 

 

 

 

 

[young37215]

Although nothing visual to show, I made progress with the viaduct yesterday adding small detailing and filling in gaps in the scenic base. I need to cast more rock to finish the landscape before adding scenic material but with luck I may get there today. 

 

As ever I was easily distracted by the thought of some running and spent most of my modelling time operating. I find it challenging to think about moving the less glamorous rolling stock around probably because movements are not hard wired into the timetable and have to make a conscious effort to run engineering trains. 20085 did get an outing yesterday and is seen reversing an engineers train into the siding at Garelochead.

 

 

 

 

[young37215]

Further progress on the viaduct with the wing walls added, some rocks planted and more gaps filled and painted. It is a slow process becuase Sculptamold is slow to dry when applied, plaster cloth on the other hand is usually workable and paintable within minutes. The upside is plenty of time to run trains in between activities. 

 

 37011 had charge of 8D10 seen arriving at Crianlarich.

 

 

 

 

 

[young37215]

Ever onwards with the viaduct, I should be dreaming about viaducts given the time that I have spent on it but the finish looks in sight now. At the northern end the line off of the viaduct enters a rocky cutting formed of various Woodland Scenics molds joined together by infilling gaps with additional plaster. At the southern end of the viaduct the line winds its way through the typical WHL landscape of embankments and mountainside. Todays focus is ballasting, completing the northern end and starting to add scenic materials to the floor of the ravine.

 

37011 approaches the viaduct with 8D19. The track should be glued down today and possibly ballasted which will improve its appearance no end.

 

 

Viaduct wing walls can be seen, a little more infill and tidying up is required before dressing the area with scenic materials

 

 

On the other side I need to add a further piece of rock to hide the baseboard and support

 

 

Onto the viaduct where the ravine landscape is now complete

 

 

The southern end of the viaduct and area leading away remains work in progess

 

 

The floor of the ravine is complete, just a little more touching up of paint before dressing

 

 

 

[young37215]

Further progress with the viaduct track ballasted and most of the ravine dressed with Woodland Scenics coarse turf. Once everything has dried I'll make a start on the trees and bushes next, a lot are required! Tempting as it is to carry on straight away, such is the gradient of the embankment in the ravine it is a struggle to get the scenic material to stay in place and I do not want to disturb what has been laid until the glue holding it in place has dried thoroughly. I am not short of other tasks, in particular the rocks in the cutting area are still incomplete.

 

This is what I am attempting to create the feel of, 37014 heading north coming off of the Craigenarden viaduct in 1985. 

 

 

Seen from the A82 at the foot of the viaduct

 

 

WHL4, the current lack of trees and bushes is very evident. There is a backscene piece of polystyrene missing from these pictures which will hide most of the wires.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[young37215]

In addition to adding more coarse turf, tree and bush planting began yesterday. It was a fiddly process with access to the area behind the viaduct challenging combined with the ongoing need to minimise the disturbance to the coarse turf. By the end of the day it was beginning to take shape and I was able to enjoy a little running time as a reward for the work. In addition to more planting there is still plenty of detailing work outstanding, in particular the viaduct wing walls need tidying up and I have not got around to sorting the additional rock required in the cutting yet.

 

The first picture shows the view looking south from the viaduct where there is another 2 metres of scenery required to reach the outskirts of Arrochar which I am intending to complete in the coming weeks before pausing for breath.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[6990WitherslackHall]

That looks amazing. 

[young37215]

1 hour ago, 6990WitherslackHall said:

That looks amazing. 

 

Thank you, I am pleased with progress so far and am working on how best to video the section. I fancy that a class 37 growling its way up the incline towards Ardlui could make good viewing. A break from scenic work meant that I could play trains for a day although I am still obsessing with the viaduct. 37085 with 1T32, the 1226 Oban to Glasgow heads south and crosses the Craigenarden viaduct.

 

 

 

 

 

[young37215]

There is more going on than just viaducts at present, yesterday the bodyshell of 37104 in railfreight grey arrived from Bachmann Spares. My intention is to respray this in BR blue and renumber it as 37111 in the condition it ran during 1982 and 1983. This was post its brief appearance in psuedo large logo where it appears that the extended yellow ends were simply painted over back into corporate BR blue. My conclusion reflects the fact that the loco retained the bodyside mounted  numbers with pictures showing no signs of an overall repaint. 111 was still in largely as built condition during this period with nose end valances still intact (the headcode panels were plated in 1981) until it was sent to Crewe for overhaul in the summer of 1983. 

 

The loco nose ends need swapping, I have several candidates available and the railfreight paint will be stripped back to the plastic although I am not sure how best to achieve this as yet. The roof boiler port needs drilling out as 111's boiler remained operational until the mid 80's. Prior to repainting I hope to remove the glazing and nose ends to make the respray as simple as possible; again this is new territory and depends on how easy it is to remove the Bachmann fitted glue. 

 

All in all the research has been an interesting exercise and has highlighted the variety of liveries 37111 went through during the first half of the 1980's. Hopefully the outcome of the repraying will be just as enjoyable...

 

 

Researching from Flickr provides plenty of pictures to use as a template, this Eastfield 1982 shot will be mine

 

 

I was tempted by the psuedo large logo as worn in 1981 but having done 37112 in this livery, I decided that all over corporate blue was more appropriate

 

 

 

 

Edited December 15, 2022 by young37215

[03060]

2 hours ago, young37215 said:

There is more going on than just viaducts at present, yesterday the bodyshell of 37104 in railfreight grey arrived from Bachmann Spares. My intention is to respray this in BR blue and renumber it as 37111 in the condition it ran during 1982 and 1983. This was post its brief appearance in psuedo large logo where it appears that the extended yellow ends were simply painted over back into corporate BR blue. My conclusion reflects the fact that the loco retained the bodyside mounted  numbers with pictures showing no signs of an overall repaint. 111 was still in largely as built condition during this period with nose end valances still intact (the headcode panels were plated in 1981) until it was sent to Crewe for overhaul in the summer of 1983. 

 

The loco nose ends need swapping, I have several candidates available and the railfreight paint will be stripped back to the plastic although I am not sure how best to achieve this as yet. The roof boiler port needs drilling out as 111's boiler remained operational until the mid 80's. Prior to repainting I hope to remove the glazing and nose ends to make the respray as simple as possible; again this is new territory and depends on how easy it is to remove the Bachmann fitted glue. 

 

All in all the research has been an interesting exercise and has highlighted the variety of liveries 37111 went through during the first half of the 1980's. Hopefully the outcoe of the repraying will be just as enjoyable...

 

 

Researching from Flickr provides plenty of pictures to use as a template, this Eastfield 1982 shot will be mine

 

 

I was tempted by the psuedo large logo as worn in 1981 but having done 37112 in this livery, I decided that all over corporate blue was more appropriate

 

 

 

 

 

I'll be watching this one with interest Rob as this is the sort of WHL 'conversion' work that many of my Farish 37s will have to begin to undertake from next year onwards and 37111 is a prime example of the difficulty in modelling WHL locos to cover a reasonable period.

 

Similarly to you my research shows that between 1981 and 1985  this particular loco carried at least 7 different combinations of either body and or livery variations .... so you just have to pick your favourite and go with it .... not so much of a problem if you are modelling the WHL on a particular Weds ... in the middle of June ... in 1982 ... in the rain !! LoL.

 

Regards,

Ian.

Edited December 15, 2022 by 03060
Correction.

[young37215]

The video below shows the recent developments of the scenic area to the south of Ardlui. 

 

 

[mallaig1983]

A very nice scene you’ve created there Rob and the viaduct looks nice and dramatic. A very nice little video that bringing it all to life.

Wonderful stuff.

[thegreenhowards]

I love the video Rob. One vid is worth a lot of still pictures and when you add sound on top it’s even better.

 

One small AFI if I may. A tail lamp on the Alcan hoppers would improve it.

 

Andy

[young37215]

6 hours ago, thegreenhowards said:

One small AFI if I may. A tail lamp on the Alcan hoppers would improve it.

 

Agreed, adding tail lamps to freight wagons is on the 'to do' list. It is an easy task to glue the lamps in place, the reason for me being slow to add the lamps is I have not decided how I will shunt/assemble trains. Essentially I am committing a wagon to be a tail end one if it gets a lamp and I will have to physically lift and turn each lamp fitted wagon each time it reaches its destination to ensure the lamp is in the right direction for the return trip. Probably not a big deal but I don't have clarity in my mind as yet.

 

On the subject of freight trains, 37051 is seen with the daily Oban to Mossend which is booked to uplift wagons at intermediate stations if required. On this occassion 37051 picks up 2 loaded OTA's at Ardlui. The shunting manourve is a simple one but it adds a little break from the usual routine.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[BoD]

Morning Rob.  
 

It is good to see your regular postings again  after the ‘summer recess’. The viaduct is looking particularly effective.   It always amazes me that once you have decided to do something you progress it so quickly.

 

Are those the Hornby OTAs?  How well do yours run?  I find the design of the axle housing so bad that they aren’t free running at all and it doesn’t take many of them to create so much drag that some locos struggle with them.  I’ve tried cycle grease and graphite powder but nothing seems to ease them.

[37Oban]

Hi,

 

regarding the problem of the taillamps, perhaps it would be worth experimenting with small neodymium magnets and steel pins.  A bit of experimentation would be needed to see which variation would work best, such as whether the magnet would be powerful enough to be hidden within the body of the wagon whilst still holding the lamp, with a piece of steel pin inserted, in position.  Lamps could be removed/attached with a pair of plastic tweezers or similar.

 

Got myself thinking about this for my St Mungos' layout!

 

Roja

[young37215]

On 17/12/2022 at 08:59, BoD said:

Morning Rob.  
 

It is good to see your regular postings again  after the ‘summer recess’. The viaduct is looking particularly effective.   It always amazes me that once you have decided to do something you progress it so quickly.

 

Are those the Hornby OTAs?  How well do yours run?  I find the design of the axle housing so bad that they aren’t free running at all and it doesn’t take many of them to create so much drag that some locos struggle with them.  I’ve tried cycle grease and graphite powder but nothing seems to ease them.

 

Thanks Warren, the daily posts are very much my diary of WHL4's evolution where I find it theraputic to record the frustrations and challenges along the way. So far it has been nearly 6 years in the making so I am not sure that I can be accused of being quick! In an effort to maintain focus and motivation I try to undertake what I call bite sized projects which should only take a few weeks to complete. I find the successful completion of a project creates the momentum to move on to the next one. The freezing weather also helps, I don't have much interest in playing sport through the winter months. 

 

I have 4 Hornby OTA's which I tend to run in pairs so that they can be dropped off and collected from the intermediate stations along the line. The OTA's only arrived towards the end of my time window and the wagon liveries are of those carried after 1985. I would like to backdate the wagons to OTA-A as explained by James Makin on pages 44-46 of Keys excellent Modelling British Railways Wagonload Formations.  I have not noticed any running issues, they appear to function similarly to everything else on the layout. I do use a reamer to keep the axle boxes free running as I seem to get a number of wagons that squeak and squeel which is very effective. A reamer also clears away any misplaced paint following weathering. Have you tried one?, they get my recommendation.

 

Following the collection of the loaded OTA's, 37051 gets away from Ardlui.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 19, 2022 by young37215

[young37215]

On 17/12/2022 at 10:02, 37Oban said:

Hi,

 

regarding the problem of the taillamps, perhaps it would be worth experimenting with small neodymium magnets and steel pins.  A bit of experimentation would be needed to see which variation would work best, such as whether the magnet would be powerful enough to be hidden within the body of the wagon whilst still holding the lamp, with a piece of steel pin inserted, in position.  Lamps could be removed/attached with a pair of plastic tweezers or similar.

 

Got myself thinking about this for my St Mungos' layout!

 

Roja

 

A nice idea but not really practical with 100+ wagons to potentially fit out. Even if it was a viable approach it would still involve a lot of fiddly manual intervention with swapping lamps around when a train reaches its destination which I want to avoid as far as possible. I am committed to adding tail lamps to wagons, most likely in the same way as with the carriage fleet by the use of superglue and forsee around dozen so fitted. I am resigned to the reality that wagons fitted with tail lamps will have to be lifted by the hand of god and swapped to the rear of a train on arrival at their destination. It is not ideal but I cannot see an alternative. 

 

37012 returns the empty Alcan hoppers southwards on the approach to Crianlarich

 

 

 

 

 

[03060]

49 minutes ago, young37215 said:

 I am resigned to the reality that wagons fitted with tail lamps will have to be lifted by the hand of god and swapped to the rear of a train on arrival at their destination. It is not ideal but I cannot see an alternative. 

 

How noticeable would it be to have a lamp on either end of a 'fixed' rake such as the Alcan hoppers, Rob ? Just a thought, particularly when viewing from the above angle.

 

Seasons greetings to all,

Ian.

Edited December 19, 2022 by 03060

[franciswilliamwebb]

1 hour ago, young37215 said:

It is not ideal but I cannot see an alternative. 

 

But perhaps an ideal interim solution nonetheless.  If an alternative does present itself it should be easy enough to change later on👍

[LNERGE]

I have resorted to a fixed tail light at each end of my rake of MGR hoppers. Similarly the hand of god appears and rotates a brakevan now n then. Whats wrong with the odd intermediate tail lamp anyway?..