Class 205 in Conjunction with Kernow Model Shop

[Ian Hargrave]

Do remember that these 205 are not the only items to have been discounted by Bachmann in the last week. I have got various 205 over the years all at different price both Bachmann & DC kits, yes I would like 3 car unit. I would like to thank Kernow for build a ready to run model.

 This strictly speaking is not a Bachmann model. Although manufactured by Kader via Bachmann,it is a Kernow product....for which they exclusively claim ownership

[adb968008]

I have a 2h already and am chewing over buying a 2nd, but did they ever run as a pair ? (Eg as a 4 car), in Green ?

 

I can only find 3H running as 6 coaches, or 3H or 2H as solos.

[SRman]

I can't say I have seen any pictures of pairs of 2H units but there is no reason why they could not have run together in the early days before augmentation to 3H. In their last years it certainly happened - there were four, five or six car formations depending on what was available (some, at least were also hybrid units formed from two or more surviving vehicles from different sets, or even from different classes such as class 205 centre coaches in class 207 units).

[Gwiwer]

Pairs of units were uncommon until they took over the Oxted line services where peak-hour trains were formed of six and occasionally nine cars.  In that case the 205s were often worked in multiple with 207s.  The early 2-car units in Hampshire did have what were largely stock positioning / balancing moves with two 2-car units paired but they were few.  Just as six-car trains were few once the trailers were included but one or two existed again for stock movements rather than due to customer demand.

 

I know of one occasion when a pair of 2H units worked the Alton - Southampton service upon which they normally worked singly until its closure.  The reason was that one of the three sets required for the service was declared a partial failure at Alton and considered unable to run "over the Alps" alone.  The next arrival was coupled to it and, having cancelled one trip the next was four cars with the failure removed at Eastleigh for attention.  That service alone remained the preserve of the two-car units due to the gradients which meant three-car units were under-powered and lost time.  Absence of passengers also meant two cars were enough.  100% availability was required, three sets from three allocated, which ironically meant a three-car was more often than not used on one diagram when the 2H sets were under maintenance. 

 

As mentioned before the Kernow MRC blue 2H unit is one of the four which never had a centre car in that livery and is thus correct rather than missing anything.

[SRman]

Further to my last posting, and after a little digging in Southern Region DEMUs (Kevin Robertson and Hugh Abbinnett, 2012, Ian Allan Publishing Ltd.), I have found a few photos of early green 2-car units running in multiple as four cars in total.

Page 26 has 1103 plus another 2-car unit on crew training or test at Fullerton Junction in Summer 1957.

 

Page 30 shows the same unit and another unidentified 2H at Fratton on a Salisbury - Portsmouth service in September 1957.

 

Page 33 has a photo of the same unit once again, with an unidentified 2H on an Andover to Southampton service via Romsey and Redbridge in January 1959.

That should be sufficient for modellers to realistically run two green Kernow models together if they want to.

[papagolfjuliet]

How come Hatton's are selling Kernow 205s?

[40F]

How come Hatton's are selling Kernow 205s?

 

 

Because they are no longer exclusive to Kernow

[BR(S)]

How come Hatton's are selling Kernow 205s?

The well-known model shops often sell each other's ltd ed models, presumably once the original seller feels sales have slowed down or they just want to reach a wider audience.

[SRman]

How come Hatton's are selling Kernow 205s?

 

Rails of Sheffield are too, and a bit cheaper. I got tempted and bought the NSE liveried one. It can run on its own, or with the Connex version I bought from Kernow when they first came out.

 

[40F]

The well-known model shops often sell each other's ltd ed models, presumably once the original seller feels sales have slowed down or they just want to reach a wider audience.

 

 

This was done by Bachmann and Kernow and has nothing to do with shops "swapping" stock

[sc2016]

It would be nice if Kernow Model Rail Centre could sell them for the same price as the others as it was there model in the beginning.

[Butler Henderson]

Kernow are more a model shop than a box shifter - they obviously want to sell stuff but not at the same minimal margins; this means they often have stocks sold out elsewhere, for example FGW TGSs which are going for over £40 on ebay on the basis that they are sold out at Hattons etc are readily available from Kernow for £28.49.

[PenrithBeacon]

Is it possible to do a cut&shut to produce a centre car?

 

Regards

[SRman]

The problem with a cut-and-shut using, say, a 2 EPB DTS, is that you lose the through connections for the lighting. I'm in the process of using a Replica Railways non-gangwayed coach body and seating unit on a Bachmann 4 CEP TS chassis: the through lighting works using this method (I tried it with the CEP coach before dismantling it for the conversion). Once i have finished it and it works, I'll post how I did it and some photos in my workbench blog.

[Gwiwer]

For those of us who don't need through-wired power are there still any significant issues?  I'm thinking underframe detail and the power jumpers between the cars.  Plus the rubbing plates above the couplers.

[SRman]

The rubbing plates are not too difficult to make, or failing that, are available in plastic from Replica Railways, or white metal from the MJT range.

[knitpick]

The problem with a cut-and-shut using, say, a 2 EPB DTS, is that you lose the through connections for the lighting. I'm in the process of using a Replica Railways non-gangwayed coach body and seating unit on a Bachmann 4 CEP TS chassis: the through lighting works using this method (I tried it with the CEP coach before dismantling it for the conversion). Once i have finished it and it works, I'll post how I did it and some photos in my workbench blog.

 

Why cut-and-shut a 2EPB DTS?  Just repaint it to match and put in the middle of the 2H.  It's then a 3T.  The 3Ts were formed when (most of) the 3Rs (class 206) were disbanded.  So Blue/Grey period onwards. The main issues are the heights of the NEM boxes in that the intermediate ones on Bachmann produced 2EPB and 2H are low whereas the outer ones are the correct height, plus no connectivity for lighting.

 

Just trying to save you some work.

[Gwiwer]

Because the 14xx 3T units were short-ish lived reformations and I suspect a goodly number of us wish to represent the 3H units as they originally were.  Thoughts re saving work appreciated however

[RFS]

The problem with a cut-and-shut using, say, a 2 EPB DTS, is that you lose the through connections for the lighting. I'm in the process of using a Replica Railways non-gangwayed coach body and seating unit on a Bachmann 4 CEP TS chassis: the through lighting works using this method (I tried it with the CEP coach before dismantling it for the conversion). Once i have finished it and it works, I'll post how I did it and some photos in my workbench blog.

 

I found that when trying a 4CEP TS as the centre coach of a 2H that the interior lights in the TS only worked in one direction.

 

BR also did the same thing, albeit with a class 207 and a refurbished TS trailer - http://www.semgonline.com/gallery/class207_2.html

[knitpick]

What I should also have said is try DC Kits for the 3H Centre car.  According to the web site, DC Kits still do the 2H and 3H kits (as well as a 3T kit) - so presumably the 3H centre car can be produced as required.  Charlie at DC Kits is normally quite helpful in supplying extras - but you might have to wait a short while for the relevant bits to be collated together as it wouldn't be an "off the shelf item".

 

Again should be easier than a cut and shut operation.

[SRman]

I found that when trying a 4CEP TS as the centre coach of a 2H that the interior lights in the TS only worked in one direction.

 

BR also did the same thing, albeit with a class 207 and a refurbished TS trailer - http://www.semgonline.com/gallery/class207_2.html

 

Are you using DC or DCC? I am on DCC and didn't note any problem with the lights directionally.

[RFS]

Are you using DC or DCC? I am on DCC and didn't note any problem with the lights directionally.

 

I use DCC.  I thought it was because with the 4CEP the two connections are head code and interior lights, but with the Thumper they're forward and reverse (ie white lights or red lights).

[SRman]

If that's the case, it is easy enough to rewire the interior lights to work directly off the track (which means they'll be permanently on). I had to reverse just such a wiring mod when I bought this particular CEP unit that I am using for the centre coach.

[47606odin]

Is it possible to do a cut&shut to produce a centre car?

 

Regards

 

i am cuttting and shutting a 2EPB DT (underframe fitting of electric couplings from a CEP) to make a 3T

[47606odin]

this is how far i have got. I have plugged the 3 coaches together and confirmed i have lighting in the demu DT and by crossing the wires on the coupler have the lights working in the right direction. the EPB coach was wired in the opposite direction for the route indicator and this had transferred through to the DT as reverse. i have to check the coach lighting feeds next, as i have to hard wire them in due to the fact the circuit board in the floor has to be cut to accommodate the electrical coupler.

 

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