Has UK dairy farming become a lot more intensive?

[Metr0Land]

As you know, us modellers tend to look at all kinds of detail including eg how many horses/sheep/cows would look realistic in a field.

 

For the last 2-3 years it seems to me that the number of Friesian cows per field has gone up dramatically.   It seems to me that there's at least double the number of cows per acre than there was even 5 years ago. 

 

Am I alone in thinking this?

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

Tell the Daily Mail. Immigrant EU cows piling in to take honest British cow's jobs

[chris p bacon]

When looking at the purchase of some land a couple of years ago, Dairy farming was being slowly taken over by the Danish.

[LBRJ]

The answer like with  so many things, is "It depends".

 

Going by some very rough rules of thumb a productive dairy cow needs approx. 1 acre per year of grazing.

Other younger cattle can be grazed at about 2 to 3 per acre.

You also need similar areas of land for growing winter feed for the beasts.

 

In modern dairy farming the vows are not fed on grass all day every day, though they very often are let out to pasture immediately post-milking

Morning and afternoon appearances in the field by the cows would suggest that this is what is happening. 

Spot grazing like this can obviously support a far higher herd than the other way, but I don't know any solid numbers for it.

[The Stationmaster]

All the dairy farms round here have long been turned over to 100% arable for economic reasons.  So it might not be so surprising that those which are still in the milk business have gone in for larger herds as a way of trying to remain profitable.

[Sir TophamHatt]

Interestingly there was an interview on BBC Radio Leicester a while back about cows milking themselves.

A cerain sound was played to "call" the cows in, but the machines fix and milk the cow all by itself.

[Oldddudders]

Interestingly there was an interview on BBC Radio Leicester a while back about cows milking themselves.

A cerain sound was played to "call" the cows in, but the machines fix and milk the cow all by itself.

 

Yes, an acquaintance here has a robot milker. Cost a fortune. Disastrous reliability in poor weather or cold. But provides oodles of data about yield per cow etc. And avoids his lazy wife having to get involved outdoors.

 

I think supermarkets in some countries have been squeezing prices on milk so dairy is increasingly unfashionable. A fat lot of good when you're up to your ears in debt on machinery and facilities to provide the stuff. Suicide rates among French farmers are tragic right now.

[skipepsi]

Depending on who you believe in Britain the prices have been between 5p and 3p less than the cost of production per litre I have no idea how much milk the high producers give now but even if you only suggest 30 litres £1.50 per cow per day quickly mounts up.  There have been planning applications put in for 4,000 cow units basically battery cows, none have passed as yet but I think it is only a matter of time.  French farmers have less land so smaller herds and higher overheads.

[rab]

Interestingly there was an interview on BBC Radio Leicester a while back about cows milking themselves.A cerain sound was played to "call" the cows in, but the machines fix and milk the cow all by itself.

Anyway cows will soon be redundant.

Overheard a snippet on the radio recently

about a technology which produces milk without cows.

[bbishop]

Not in Ambridge.

 

Bill

[Andy Hayter]

Depending on who you believe in Britain the prices have been between 5p and 3p less than the cost of production per litre I have no idea how much milk the high producers give now but even if you only suggest 30 litres £1.50 per cow per day quickly mounts up.  There have been planning applications put in for 4,000 cow units basically battery cows, none have passed as yet but I think it is only a matter of time.  French farmers have less land so smaller herds and higher overheads.

 

The same happened in Germany some 8 years ago where farmers went on Milchstrijk - Milk Strike - and refused to continue to supply until prices went up a few cents.

 

I am less sure about your comments about France.  In principle there is 3 times as much land to cover a similar population compared with the UK.  Small farms/ small herds probably results more from Napoleonic succession laws.  Essentially all children inherit land/property equally.  This leads either to joint ownership, or land being split into smaller and smaller parcels.

[South Central]

We have cattle at home and graze them on what's known as a paddock system - a technique brought over from New Zealand. The field is divided up into paddocks which provide just enough grass for the number of animals for a day or two, after which the cows are moved into the next paddock and the first one left to recover. It encourages far more efficient use of the grass by the cattle and improves grass yields overall no end. Thus reducing the reliance on supplementary feeds (largely based on soya from South America planted on former rainforest) and offering the consumer a far more sustainable source of milk and meat

[Phil Bullock]

Unfortunately significant pollution issues are arising - both single point and diffuse

 

http://westwalesriverstrust.org/welsh-government-reported-to-european-commission-over-agricultural-pollution-in-rivers/

 

Phil

[spikey]

We have cattle at home and graze them on what's known as a paddock system - a technique brought over from New Zealand. The field is divided up into paddocks which provide just enough grass for the number of animals for a day or two, after which the cows are moved into the next paddock and the first one left to recover. It encourages far more efficient use of the grass by the cattle and improves grass yields overall no end. Thus reducing the reliance on supplementary feeds (largely based on soya from South America planted on former rainforest) and offering the consumer a far more sustainable source of milk and meat

This is new to me and sounds a really good idea, so I have to ask - are the paddocks permanent, just electric fenced?

[Oldddudders]

We have cattle at home and graze them on what's known as a paddock system - a technique brought over from New Zealand. The field is divided up into paddocks which provide just enough grass for the number of animals for a day or two, after which the cows are moved into the next paddock and the first one left to recover. It encourages far more efficient use of the grass by the cattle and improves grass yields overall no end. Thus reducing the reliance on supplementary feeds (largely based on soya from South America planted on former rainforest) and offering the consumer a far more sustainable source of milk and meat

Is this called Strip Grazing? We used our meagre pasture that way for the horses. And in the days when the grass was a bit rich, it avoided laminitis.

[burgundy]

Anyway cows will soon be redundant.

Overheard a snippet on the radio recently

about a technology which produces milk without cows.

 

I can remember that suggestion from my youth. 

 

My aunty had a metal cow,

she milked it with a spanner.

The milk came out in shilling tins

or small ones for a tanner.

 

...which gives some indication of just how long ago that was. 

Best wishes 

Eric 

[laurenceb]

This is new to me and sounds a really good idea, so I have to ask - are the paddocks permanent, just electric fenced?

The paddocks are semi-permanent, just taken out when the field gets ploughed

 

Is this called Strip Grazing? We used our meagre pasture that way for the horses. And in the days when the grass was a bit rich, it avoided laminitis.

Strip grazing is where the electric fence is moved a few yards twice a day

[Oldddudders]

Strip grazing is where the electric fence is moved a few yards twice a day

 

Our fence was moved about once a week to give them a bit more grazing. 

[jonny777]

The same happened in Germany some 8 years ago where farmers went on Milchstrijk - Milk Strike - and refused to continue to supply until prices went up a few cents.

 

I am less sure about your comments about France.  In principle there is 3 times as much land to cover a similar population compared with the UK.  Small farms/ small herds probably results more from Napoleonic succession laws.  Essentially all children inherit land/property equally.  This leads either to joint ownership, or land being split into smaller and smaller parcels.

 

 

I read that most cheap supermarket milk is imported from Eastern Europe, especially Poland; but they don't particularly want you to know that. The factory farming methods out there do not conform to any standards and cows never go outdoors. 

 

I think a lot of UK production goes to more high margin products such as cheese and yoghurt. 

 

If the average British consumer could see the conditions animals were kept in, in order to provide the public with cheap supermarket or take-away food, there would be a dramatic increase in the number of vegetarians.

[melmerby]

I read that most cheap supermarket milk is imported from Eastern Europe, especially Poland; but they don't particularly want you to know that. The factory farming methods out there do not conform to any standards and cows never go outdoors. 

 

If you call Asda cheap then that's not correct

The milk comes from British farms and is marked so, as is that in the others I have looked at

Even their UHT milk in cardboard cartons is British.

 

Keith

Edited May 6, 2018 by melmerby

[jjb1970]

Agriculture is one of the main sources of marine pollution, fertiliser run off leads to eutrophication and can result in the seabed or river bed basically ending up dead. The reason the Baltic is such an ecological mess is eutrophication.

[rab]

If you call Asda cheap then that's not correct

The milk comes from British farms and is marked so, as is that in the others I have looked at

Even their UHT milk in cardboard cartons is British.

 

Keith

Ditto Tesco

[Fat Controller]

Ditto Tesco

Also Sainsbury's and Waitrose. The area where you have to watch out, if you're concerned about avoiding produce from animals raised to lower welfare standards than the UK, is the area of processed pork products, such as gammon and bacon. Labels will often say 'Produced in the UK' in larger script, then 'using Dutch/ Danish meat' less obviously.

[jonny777]

If you call Asda cheap then that's not correct

The milk comes from British farms and is marked so, as is that in the others I have looked at

Even their UHT milk in cardboard cartons is British.

 

Keith

 

 

 

Well, I should have added that the chap who told me about Polish milk was one of those people who seem to be an authority on everything - so if he was making it up in order to sound clever I wouldn't be too surprised. 

[F-UnitMad]

If British dairy farmers weren't supplying our supermarkets, then I wouldn't have been caught up when they blockaded an Asda RDC Warehouse one night a few years ago, in protest at the rates Asda was paying them for milk.

Funny thing was, the farmers had to lift the blockade at 4am to go & start the milking...