Cycle path etiquette - a question for cyclists.

[BoD]

Many cycle tracks/lanes are neither use nor ornament and I believe they can only have been created to allow the local authority to meet some sort of target. A good many of the simply annoy everyone.

[newbryford]

It really anouys me cyclist's on pavements.!

 

We could go on.

Joggers on the road in marked cycle lanes, when there's a perfectly good pavement.

[njee20]

Many cycle tracks/lanes are neither use nor ornament and I believe they can only have been created to allow the local authority to meet some sort of target. A good many of the simply annoy everyone.

That is a huge issue - cyclists won’t use them because theyre rubbish. Drivers are annoyed because cyclists don’t use the infrastructure. Everyone loses.

Edited August 23, 2018 by njee20

[Rivercider]

Part of the problem is that at times cyclists are more akin to motorised traffic (in terms of speed at least), at others more like pedestrians, and often somewhere in between. That wouldn't be a problem if everywhere didn't seem to be so busy.

I think that you have probably explained what prompted my original question.

I mostly go walking midweek, during the day, generally avoiding commute times, school holidays and bank holidays. When walking on my own I probably average 2.5 to 3 miles per hour, so not much slower than some cyclists, certainly not much slower than family groups with little ones learning to cycle. Walking on the left seems the sensible thing to do.

Occasionally on some cycle routes I walk speeds can be much higher, where a swift approach from behind can be unnerving, and I have thought about walking on the right to face approaching traffic. Here I have to say that in general where I have met cyclists who are obviously members of a cycling club and are going at speed, they almost always make themselves known, and single up, or slow down, as they pass.

I guess this is where common sense, and courtesy, by all path users is the only solution,

 

cheers

Edited August 23, 2018 by Rivercider

[Chris M]

Try cycling round a large French campsite. You have to work out whether the approaching cyclists are English or European in order to know which side to pass.

[eastglosmog]

Many cycle tracks/lanes are neither use nor ornament and I believe they can only have been created to allow the local authority to meet some sort of target. A good many of the simply annoy everyone.

Many years ago there was a complaint that the cycle lanes on the Oxford Bypass were seldom used, to which the reply was "who would want to cycle round Oxford?"

[mcowgill]

I'll admit to cycling on a pavement every day on my 12 mile commute home.   I approach our village along a truncated road which becomes a footpath/cycle-path at the end, it runs parallel to and above the slip roads and underbridge that form a junction with the A12.  Where the path emerges I want to turn right, followed by another right turn at the first turning 200 yards further along,  On my left is the slip road from the A12, curving sharply to the left and descending steeply with the view also obscured by bushes, I can't see the vehicles approaching from the left.  To the right the road continues to curve round at about Hornby 2nd radius, high bushes and fences mean I have no visibility of traffic from that direction.

 

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.0032945,1.0567737,3a,75y,4.16h,75.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sK4P9GuyxHtBs4yNGzeACBw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

 

What would you do?

 

I continue along the pavement, due to the shape of the road I can't see what's coming up behind me as I'd need the skills of a track sprinter, able to cycle in the perfect direction for a lap while looking backwards over the shoulder.  This seems preferable to playing russian roulette with cars I can't see only to turn right again in a few yards.  I carry slowly on along the pavement, turn right and drop back onto the now quiet road, keeping an eye out for pedestrians who aren't expecting me.   That's often the reason why people cycle on pavements, the alternatives are not safe.  The best solution to this problem would have been to continue the shared use path further along using some of the excessive road width for a wider pavement.

 

Martin

Edited August 23, 2018 by mcowgill

[Pacific231G]

Many years ago there was a complaint that the cycle lanes on the Oxford Bypass were seldom used, to which the reply was "who would want to cycle round Oxford?"

Yet the paved cycle path on the dual carriageway from the Wolvercote roundabout to Woodstock was there (and used by me) when most trains around Oxford were still hauled by Castles and Halls. 

What I don't like is the habit some French local authorities seem to have adopted of getting rid of preserved railways in order to use their trackbeds for Voies Vertes (for which I'm sure government funds are available to them probably with targets) Using an abandoned  trackbed as a cycle track is fine if it preserves the route especially if,(as in the case of part of the Thame branch) there's a mechansim to return it to railway use if, at some future date, that's needed, However, I know of at least two cases where the building of a Voie Verte has been at the expense of an extant railway. 

[eastglosmog]

Yet the paved cycle path on the dual carriageway from the Wolvercote roundabout to Woodstock was there (and used by me) when most trains around Oxford were still hauled by Castles and Halls. 

...............................

Er, don't want to be picky, but the Wolvercote - Woodstock road is not the Oxford Bypass!

[caradoc]

Many years ago there was a complaint that the cycle lanes on the Oxford Bypass were seldom used, to which the reply was "who would want to cycle round Oxford?"

 

Many (40 plus) years ago when cycling from Marston, Oxford I always used the cycle path alongside the Northern bypass; On the way home one evening a couple of guys were walking on the cycle path (on the fast downhill stretch) so I diverted onto the adjacent footpath, promptly went over a pothole and damaged my bike !

 

There are cycle paths along the Marston Road into Oxford, however these are interrupted by the many side roads so I rarely used them; Nowadays the side roads are marked to give way to the cycle path, but I would still be very wary of using them. Finally, there is a cycle path along the Marston Ferry Road, but for part of the way it is separated from the road by an earth bank and therefore invisible from the road, plus occasionally travellers have set up camp on the path !

[Chris M]

I'll admit to cycling on a pavement every day on my 12 mile commute home.   I approach our village along a truncated road which becomes a footpath/cycle-path at the end, it runs parallel to and above the slip roads and underbridge that form a junction with the A12.  Where the path emerges I want to turn right, followed by another right turn at the first turning 200 yards further along,  On my left is the slip road from the A12, curving sharply to the left and descending steeply with the view also obscured by bushes, I can't see the vehicles approaching from the left.  To the right the road continues to curve round at about Hornby 2nd radius, high bushes and fences mean I have no visibility of traffic from that direction.

 

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.0032945,1.0567737,3a,75y,4.16h,75.67t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sK4P9GuyxHtBs4yNGzeACBw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

 

What would you do?

 

I continue along the pavement, due to the shape of the road I can't see what's coming up behind me as I'd need the skills of a track sprinter, able to cycle in the perfect direction for a lap while looking backwards over the shoulder.  This seems preferable to playing russian roulette with cars I can't see only to turn right again in a few yards.  I carry slowly on along the pavement, turn right and drop back onto the now quiet road, keeping an eye out for pedestrians who aren't expecting me.   That's often the reason why people cycle on pavements, the alternatives are not safe.  The best solution to this problem would have been to continue the shared use path further along using some of the excessive road width for a wider pavement.

 

Martin

I don’t see anything wrong with cycling on the pavement. In the middle of a busy town where there are lots of shoppers clearly cycling is a definite no no and should not even be considered. Those that do deserve an on the spot fine. On the other hand where there is a very busy main road and a deserted pavement surely it makes sense for everyone to cycle along the pavement. I do this near where I live along a wide stretch of pavement which is almost entirely devoid of people on foot but I never exceed 10mph. I might see two people along the 1.5 mile stretch, sometimes not that many. This cannot be doing any harm. Pavements outisde of town centres are often almost deserted because hardly anyone walks anywhere these days. Maybe the law/rules should be revisited on this.

[Clive Mortimore]

We could go on.

Joggers on the road in marked cycle lanes, when there's a perfectly good pavement.

Hi Mick

 

As a professional dog walker I came to the conclusion that joggers when set free in a park were cyclist who had forgot to get their bikes out the shed. 

[Nearholmer]

It would be interesting to see some photos of you he various paths under discussion, because ‘shared use path’ covers a multitude of things.

 

Within five miles of where I live, we have all sorts, from an overgrown and barely used towpath, through a fairly muddy rural bridleway that is also part of a national cycle route, to a dead-straight converted railway, a good ten yards wide and surfaced like road, and oodles of variations in width, surface, alignment etc in between.

 

The point being each demands a different approach ....... the converted railway, for instance, can be taken at near-road speed, but not quite, in case of dogs or children appearing from the trees with zero warning.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

...What would you do?...

 What I did. After twenty five years of using a bike as my primary transport, I hung it on it's hooks on the wall, (now it only comes out for leisure use on off-road cycleways) and used an automobile. I wrote to the local authority responsible for highways to report that their policies and resulting road layouts had led to another cyclist deciding that the roads were now too hazardous for cycling during the busy periods of the day, so that was an extra motor vehicle on the road from now on.

 

Two friends with whom I discussed this frequently over the decade this significant  increase in hazard as I perceived it was developing, were staying on their bikes 'whatever'. When Jack was killed, my bike was hung up. Peter lasted another six years. I am still living. Make your own decision about the degree of hazard you are prpepared to tolerate.

[Rivercider]

It would be interesting to see some photos of you he various paths under discussion, because ‘shared use path’ covers a multitude of things.

 

Within five miles of where I live, we have all sorts, from an overgrown and barely used towpath, through a fairly muddy rural bridleway that is also part of a national cycle route, to a dead-straight converted railway, a good ten yards wide and surfaced like road, and oodles of variations in width, surface, alignment etc in between.

 

The point being each demands a different approach ....... the converted railway, for instance, can be taken at near-road speed, but not quite, in case of dogs or children appearing from the trees with zero warning.

Here are three cycle paths on former railway lines that I enjoy walking.

 

Here is the Strawberry Line that I was walking as I pondered the question.

Between Congresbury and Sandford, looking towards Sandford, the path is gravelled.

Strawberry Line Notice board.

 

The Granite Way is mostly tarmac and popular with cyclists.

Cycle club west of Meldon on the Granite Way.

 

The Tarka Trail is mostly tarmac, and can be very busy.

Near Bideford on the Tarka Trail.

 

cheers

Edited August 24, 2018 by Rivercider

[GeoffAlan]

I gave up on shared paths some years ago. Before that I met many helpful people who, like me, were careful and considerate, and sadly the few who were a total pain.

[Guest]

National Cycle Route 403 near Avebury. Just before it becomes unrideable

 

[Pacific231G]

Er, don't want to be picky, but the Wolvercote - Woodstock road is not the Oxford Bypass!

Of course it isn't. I was simply making the point that some of the cycle tracks round there have been useful for many years. I'm pretty sure the one alongside the Northern Bypass was equally venerable and that road used to be a three lane deathtrap.  For some journeys, from North Oxford to Marston, before the Martson Ferry Bridge when there wasn't a road bridge across the Cherwell  between the bypass and Magdalen Bridge, or Kidlington to Headington or Cowley for example, the Northern bypass cycle track would have been very useful and in those days cycling through the centre of Oxford - which I used to do regularly- was not a whole lot of fun. 

Edited August 25, 2018 by Pacific231G

[ejstubbs]

What would you do?

 

Dismount and wheel the bike along for the few yards that between the two safe sections of your route, perhaps?

 

I always think this is one of the huge advantages that one has on a bicycle compared to being in a car: you can convert yourself in to a pedestrian within seconds should the need arise.  For example: at a dangerous pinch point on the carriageway, or if you find yourself facing a huge detour because the direct route is one way against you for a short distance.

 

I don’t see anything wrong with cycling on the pavement.

 

Apart from the fact that it is illegal?  (Guidance from various Home Secretaries notwithstanding: that asks police to exercise discretion when dealing with an offence, it doesn't mean that an offence isn't committed.)

 

Given that cycling on the footway* is (unless it's a designated shared use path) illegal, pedestrians are absolutely entitled to use them in the expectation that they won't have to take the possibility of the presence of wheeled vehicles in to account as they do so.  SO it's not surprising that some of them get irate when that expectation is confounded (in much the same way that one would be entitled to be cross about having to avoid pedestrians or cyclist when driving on a motorway - they're simply not meant to be there).  If the decision was made to make cycling on the footway legitimate in certain circumstances, steps would need to be taken to re-educate the population as a whole about how safely to proceed along the footway on foot.

 

where there is a very busy main road and a deserted pavement surely it makes sense for everyone to cycle along the pavement. I do this near where I live along a wide stretch of pavement which is almost entirely devoid of people on foot but I never exceed 10mph. I might see two people along the 1.5 mile stretch, sometimes not that many. This cannot be doing any harm. Pavements outisde of town centres are often almost deserted because hardly anyone walks anywhere these days. Maybe the law/rules should be revisited on this.

 

I'd suggest that in the kind of case that you cite, rather than people simply taking the law into their own hands, it would make sense to lobby the local authority to make the footway shared use.  As mentioned elsewhere on this thread, much so-called "cycling infrastructure" gives the strong impression of having been installed in order to meet targets rather than to actually provide something of use to the populace.  On the face of it, it would seem that a shared use pavement alongside a busy rural road which is likely to create minimal conflict between pedestrians and cyclists should be an easy way for a LA to up its cycling infrastructure totals while actually delivering something of genuine value.  And it can all be achieved within the existing regulatory framework, no new laws required.  There are organisations (eg Sustrans) whose sole raison d'etre is to help make things like this happen, and who are happy to hear and discuss constructive ideas for useful and effective cycling infrastructure.

 

* "Footway" is the term used in the relevant laws for what is commonly referred to as the "pavement".  As the name suggests, it's the part of the highway which is specifically reserved for the use of people travelling on foot (or using a wheelchair or compliant mobility scooter).  That's in contrast to the "carriageway", which is the part of the highway "carriages" ie wheeled vehicles including bicycles, are allowed to use.

[Pacific231G]

I don’t see anything wrong with cycling on the pavement. In the middle of a busy town where there are lots of shoppers clearly cycling is a definite no no and should not even be considered. Those that do deserve an on the spot fine. On the other hand where there is a very busy main road and a deserted pavement surely it makes sense for everyone to cycle along the pavement. I do this near where I live along a wide stretch of pavement which is almost entirely devoid of people on foot but I never exceed 10mph. I might see two people along the 1.5 mile stretch, sometimes not that many. This cannot be doing any harm. Pavements outisde of town centres are often almost deserted because hardly anyone walks anywhere these days. Maybe the law/rules should be revisited on this.

If all cyclists rode considerately and responsibly it might make sense but we don't. Making the pavements free for cyclists to use would include the not small enough minority who would certainly behave as if they were in a road race, regard the pavement as belonging to them and expect any pedestrians to jump out of their way. I encounter enough of these on the pavements round here that are shared use, one of them about forty minutes ago.  

 

When I was cycling most days to school s a teenager in the 1960s the police would certainly stop you for cycling on the footway, without lights at night, or just generally like an idiot and  that was in Oxford where cyclists were everywhere. I suspect that nowadays  I could do all my cycling on the footway and never be stopped (but I don't)

Edited August 24, 2018 by Pacific231G

[Happy Hippo]

 Make your own decision about the degree of hazard you are prepared to tolerate.

I think that could be reckoned to a lot of things, but especially riding on two wheels. My decision not to return to a donor cycle were the deaths of a number of friends who were motorcyclists.

 

As a  pedal cyclist I now only cycle for recreational purposes ie keeping fit, so the ridiculously routed cycle paths around where I live are used in preference to the roads.

 

Having cycled in Belgium and the The Netherlands I find that UK road planners have absolutely no idea about how to put in sensible cycle routes, and it ought to be a prerequisite before authorising the route to actually cycle it and see where the problems are going to occur.  Simple things like co locating a traffic light pole and a road sign upright to create a pinch point on a bend springs to mind.  That it is at a section of the pavement where the cycle route and the pedestrian route combine just shows the mentality of these so called professional planners

 

Putting a cycle path on an uphill stretch of road with priority to emerging traffic from side roads shows a complete lack of common sense.  Each one of those roads ought to end with a STOP sign not a Give Way, to ensure traffic stops short of the cycle route.

 

When the guy that designed this route passes on, I hope his punishment down below will be to perpetually cycle this route in the rain and at rush hour!

[Butler Henderson]

For some of the more crazy cycle paths etc look at "facility of the month" pages at http://www.warringtoncyclecampaign.co.uk/

 

A relatively good shared pavement / cycle track near me got new signposts a couple of years back - most direct cyclists along the adjacent road than the cycletrack

Edited August 24, 2018 by Butler Henderson

[Nearholmer]

Mention of Sustrans ........ do talk to them, they do listen and help where they can, and their Chief Exec is a really good chap, both a keen cyclist and a bit of a railway enthusiast on the side; I used to work with him.

 

Kevin

Edited August 24, 2018 by Nearholmer

[Dunsignalling]

It's always useful to have a bell or similar on a bike to warn others of your approach - especially peds from behind.

 

But - how many cyclists do you know that have a bell or similar audible warning on their bike?

 

I don't know of any - including myself in that as well...………

 

(My mate goes "ding-ding" in a loud voice)

I heard a bicycle bell being sounded a few weeks ago - rare enough for me to remember it.

 

It started me checking the station bike rack when passing, out of idle curiosity and to kill time until my train arrives - I've not found one yet.

 

Is it no longer a requirement for one to be fitted in order for ones velocipede to be "street legal"?

 

As for cyclists using pavements; maybe, but only if subject to the same 4mph speed restriction that applies to mobility scooters.

 

John

Edited August 24, 2018 by Dunsignalling

[Ozexpatriate]

Is it no longer a requirement for one to be fitted in order for ones velocipede to be "street legal"?

Knock knock.

 

Isabelle.

 

Isabelle a requirement for one's velocipede to be "street legal"?