Locos seen on the Somerset and Dorset mid 50s

[dube]

 

 

Having planned a layout between Birmingham and Derby mid 50s to run around my double garage, I was thinking about representing a section of the S&D on 1 wall as it will be all scenic and as I already have a lot of suitable Ex LMS and BR locos, would be a good excuse to run some foreign types, southern Pacific’s, Maunsell coaches ?

 

Already got

 

2P

3F

4F

Jinty

Black 5

Ivatt 2-6-2

BR Class 5

BR Class 4 2-6-0

BR Class 4 4-6-0

 

Need

 

7F

?

?

 

And I can still run some of the trains from my 1956 train formations;

 

534

NEWCASTLE-BOURNEMOUTH

GWR stock

*BTK-TK-TK-CK-CK-TK-TK-BCK

 

347

NEWCASTLE-BOURNEMOUTH

ER MK1

 

*BSK-FK-RU(LNER)-SO-SO-SO-SO-SK-BSK

Edited November 14, 2018 by dube

[bike2steam]

Apart from the Midland 0-4-4T's ( which Bachmann will be supplying - one day?), you've got it covered, and of course you'll need 'Spam-cans'. Black-5's were rare, but not unknown, the occasional visitor ( more often than not, a Saltley allocated example) would be 'borrowed' if BGP was short of a loco. Look forward to seeing pics of the layout.   Oh and if you're stretching to 1958, then exGW came on the scene because of the boundary change with Collet goods and panniers.   

[JZ]

 ( more often than not, a Saltley allocated example) would be 'borrowed' if BGP 

Though Ivo Peters managed to get a picture of a Carlisle loco, complete with snowplough leaving Devonshire tunnel. Green park were adept at 'borrowing' loco's.

 

Just to add. If the next batch of 'Clans' had been built, a couple were rumoured to be going to BGP.

 

And a Schools ran over the S&D on a railtour.

Edited November 14, 2018 by JZ

[bike2steam]

Just to add. If the next batch of 'Clans' had been built, a couple were rumoured to be going to BGP.

 

 

 

 Mmm, interesting, seeing as the class received a reputation at Polmadie of being 'gutless', it would've been nice to see how they'd perform.

[dube]

I’ve gone through a few books, one says BR 3MT 2-6-2, Ivatt 4MT and 8Fs although I think they replaced the 7Fs later, also I have a OO works Johnson 2F but not sure if it’s the correct type or how long they lasted

Edited November 14, 2018 by dube

[bike2steam]

I’ve gone through a few books, one says BR 3MT 2-6-2, Ivatt 4MT and 8Fs although I think they replaced the 7Fs later, also I have a OO works Johnson 2F but not sure if it’s the correct type or how long they lasted

 

The 3MT's didn't turn up until after the boundary changes in 1958 supplied by the WR, 8F's not until after 1960. By the 50's the 2F's were based mainly in the Midlands, the 3 'Flying Pigs' (Ivatt 4's) 43012/3/7 were unpopular and gone by 1953. 

[devonseasider]

I know the 3MT tanks worked into BGP - seen various photos & references to that - but did they actually work services over the S&D?

I've always thought they were just on the Bristol trains.

[pH]

Yes, they worked over the S&D. In September 1965, I travelled down 'the branch' to Highbridge and back behind two different engines. There were also several of them on Templecombe shed.

[DCB]

The S&D locos are very well documented. Ivo Peters books of photos and Peter Smith's books Mendips Engineman and Footplate over the Mendips

give useful info.

The S&D cam alive for passenger trains on a few Summer Saturdays and was otherwise primarily a coal hauler.

S&D locos were primarily provided by Bath MPD, Bournemouth had crews but no locos allocated and used Bath locos for S&D work and Bournemouth Central

for shunting and to cover failures, typically Std 4s though at least one T9 deputised.

The Std 5s largely replaced the Black 5s with the appearance of 73050/1/2 and the coming of the 4MT 4-6-0s hastened the demise of the 2Ps on piloting

duties.

I believe the 9Fs came in 1960 with 92001/2/6 freshly fitted with double chimneys and one other 32? They could not handle the "Pines" single handed

so the Pines usually remained a 5MT turn with a pilot over the Mendips. 4MT 2-6-4s came late in the day and a large number of 2251s worked out their

mileage before withpassdrawal on the S&D replacing Midland 3Fs. The 7Fs were the best heavy freight locos as they had Ferodo brake blocks instead of the

usual cast iron and as a result had brakes which actually worked. Spam Cans didn't, neither did a GW 56XX tested over the hills and a WD 2-8-0 which

had a fitted head added to its test train "Just in case" and could not stop at Evercreech new without them.

A SR U and U1 were tested as Black 5 replacements but were not up to the job.

Weekday S&D turns featured passenger trains one direction and goods the other, even the Down Pines loco returned with a goods "The Up Mail"

[Phil Bullock]

Have you got both tank and tender version of 3f? Both are warranted!

 

Cheers

 

Phil

[Phil Bullock]

Ah...sorry... See you did say jinty! In mitigation it is the middle if the night, sleepless in Manchester!

 

Phil

[JZ]

Pretty sure that the Ivatt 4MT's were all fitted with their original double chimney. Their performance was transformed when they were retro-fitted with a single one. Shame they never came back to the S&D like it.

 

Std 4MT tanks also appeared in the last few months.

[PaulG]

In addition to the WC would any other former SR locos have worked overall the S&D?

[neilkirby]

Ah...sorry... See you did say jinty! In mitigation it is the middle if the night, sleepless in Manchester!

 

Phil

Hi,

 

Jinty!? What's a Jinty? If we are on the S&D they look like 'Bagnalls' to me

 

Neil

[neilkirby]

More seriously, If you want to have all three varieties of 7F running, which were the original  1914 built version, the 1925 built large boiler and 1925 converted to small boiler (as per the Bachmann model)

they are not that big a job

 

See here for the 1914 type:

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/108502-converting-Bachmann-7f-to-1914-build/

 

And her for the large boiler type:

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/117896-converting-a-Bachmann-7f-to-the-large-boilered-variety-now-with-various-other-sd-bits/&do=findComment&comment=2700892

 

Regards,

 

Neil

Edited November 16, 2018 by neilkirby

[Dunsignalling]

Yes, they worked over the S&D. In September 1965, I travelled down 'the branch' to Highbridge and back behind two different engines. There were also several of them on Templecombe shed.

But the OP's enquiry related to the mid-1950s. According to my 1955/6  IA Locoshed Book (reprint), even Bristol Bath Road hadn't received a 3MT allocation by then.

 

First ones with an S&D connection appear in the 1959 edition, with 82041 at 82F (Bath Green Park) and 82039 at 82G (Templecombe), so not mid-1950s and, as pointed out by others, not until after the WR takeover.

 

John  

Edited November 15, 2018 by Dunsignalling

[dube]

Thanks for the replies, I’m sticking with 1956 as all my coaches are crimson cream, noticed Hornby are bringing out a S & D 3 coach set 399 in BR green, could I get away with running these in 1956 ?

Got

2P

3F

4F

Jinty

Black 5

Ivatt 2-6-2

BR Class 5

BR Class 4 2-6-0

BR Class 4 4-6-0

 

Need

7F

West Country

R3016 BR Class 4

1P

[PenrithBeacon]

Pretty sure that the Ivatt 4MT's were all fitted with their original double chimney. Their performance was transformed when they were retro-fitted with a single one. Shame they never came back to the S&D like it.

 

...

You could argue that they did but in the form of the BR4 Mogul. The two were essentially the same.

 

When the SR took over the supply of rolling stock in the early 1950s from LMR the Ivatts were withdrawn from the S&DJR and the BR4 variant was supplied from SR stocks

Edited November 15, 2018 by PenrithBeacon

[pH]

But the OP's enquiry related to the mid-1950s. According to my 1955/6  IA Locoshed Book (reprint), even Bristol Bath Road hadn't received a 3MT allocation by then.

 

First ones with an S&D connection appear in the 1959 edition, with 82041 at 82F (Bath Green Park) and 82039 at 82G (Templecombe), so not mid-1950s and, as pointed out by others, not until after the WR takeover.

 

John

 

Apologies - I was thinking about the Ivatt 2-6-2Ts with that answer. I had forgotten they were only Class 2. Ignore what I wrote.

[Mallard60022]

The S&D locos are very well documented. Ivo Peters books of photos and Peter Smith's books Mendips Engineman and Footplate over the Mendips

give useful info.

The S&D cam alive for passenger trains on a few Summer Saturdays and was otherwise primarily a coal hauler.

S&D locos were primarily provided by Bath MPD, Bournemouth had crews but no locos allocated and used Bath locos for S&D work and Bournemouth Central

for shunting and to cover failures, typically Std 4s though at least one T9 deputised.

The Std 5s largely replaced the Black 5s with the appearance of 73050/1/2 and the coming of the 4MT 4-6-0s hastened the demise of the 2Ps on piloting

duties.

I believe the 9Fs came in 1960 with 92001/2/6 freshly fitted with double chimneys and one other 32? They could not handle the "Pines" single handed

so the Pines usually remained a 5MT turn with a pilot over the Mendips. 4MT 2-6-4s came late in the day and a large number of 2251s worked out their

mileage before withpassdrawal on the S&D replacing Midland 3Fs. The 7Fs were the best heavy freight locos as they had Ferodo brake blocks instead of the

usual cast iron and as a result had brakes which actually worked. Spam Cans didn't, neither did a GW 56XX tested over the hills and a WD 2-8-0 which

had a fitted head added to its test train "Just in case" and could not stop at Evercreech new without them.

A SR U and U1 were tested as Black 5 replacements but were not up to the job.

Weekday S&D turns featured passenger trains one direction and goods the other, even the Down Pines loco returned with a goods "The Up Mail"

 

I can not agree more about getting a look at as many IP (and those two PS books) as possible and just go for what you actually see in those. There will be other S & D books of course but maybe not from the mid 50s when it wasn't really so 'recognised' but was far busier with coal traffic in parts. Every so often you will stumble on the 'oddity' and that can be great fun.

Phil

Edited November 15, 2018 by Mallard60022

[johnofwessex]

Crabs were not unknown I believe

[Co-tr-Paul]

And dare I say GWR Collett 0-6-0s on the Highbridge branch.

[JohnR]

Have to echo what others have said. Get a copy of Ivo Peters books. There are two volumes covering the S&D specifically in the 50s. Not only did Ivo manage to capture the  essence of the line's day-to-day activity, he was also able to bag those rarities and special trips. The captions are packed with detailed information.

 

Not got my copies to hand, so cant check, but I seem to recall a week when Bournemouth shed rostered a T9 for an evening trip up to BGP? Might fall into your timeframe, or it might be a bit later. 

[Mallard60022]

And dare I say GWR Collett 0-6-0s on the Highbridge branch.

See the lovely film about that with John B. A really rather sad tale but very atmospheric as are all of his works.

[bike2steam]

The original question was about locos on the S&DJR in the mid 50's, if you stretch that then certainly you can add a few more like the little used Stanier class 3 2-6-2T's along with Collet Goods, and pannier tanks.