Imaginary Locomotives

[The Johnster]

2 hours ago, Traintresta said:

Yes they did, but the tidying up of the running boards hid the steam pipes quite well. I’m surprised some of the larger BR standards (such as the class 6, 7 and 8) didn’t get the V front cab like the A4, P2 and V2. 

They, and the Bulleid Pacifics, had a sort of 'semi V' cab in which the spectacle plates were angled.  I assume that the LNER V front was a cosmetic addition that did not impinge on the firebox space, but it certainly gave the locos a 'presence'.  I thought the BR standard cab was a quite good looking contrivance.

[Satan's Goldfish]

Quick unrelated question (but something imaginary I'm playing with in my head); I can remember reading somewhere on rmweb that HSTs could only go 125mph with a minimum of 5 intermediate coaches for brake force reasons. With the shortened 2+4 sets now being used in Scotland and the far west, what speed are they limited to? Ta

[Traintresta]

3 hours ago, The Johnster said:

They, and the Bulleid Pacifics, had a sort of 'semi V' cab in which the spectacle plates were angled.  I assume that the LNER V front was a cosmetic addition that did not impinge on the firebox space, but it certainly gave the locos a 'presence'.  I thought the BR standard cab was a quite good looking contrivance.

The LNER v front cab was a smoke clearing measure, apparently it was very effective at lifting smokemclear of the drivers view.

[rodent279]

6 hours ago, The Johnster said:

They, and the Bulleid Pacifics, had a sort of 'semi V' cab in which the spectacle plates were angled.  I assume that the LNER V front was a cosmetic addition that did not impinge on the firebox space, but it certainly gave the locos a 'presence'.  I thought the BR standard cab was a quite good looking contrivance.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Bulleid Pacific's have flat spectacle plates when first built? I think they were changed due to smoke clearance and to reduce internal reflections at night.

[Hroth]

13 hours ago, Flying Pig said:

 

I wonder whether Caprotti gear could be arranged for the divided drive of the Coronations? I've several times read claims that the valve events on these engines were not quite right, presumably due to reliance on rocker arms to drive the inside valves. Dream loco - Caprotti super-Coronation with GPCS and mechanical stoker, an LMR Red Devil.  Could have run right through to electrification on the WCML.

 

Meanwhile on the subject of 4-8-0s, here's one I did ages ago, probably on this thread:

 

 

Its a stretched streamlined B17!!!

 

[45125]

On 24/03/2019 at 17:30, Satan's Goldfish said:

Quick unrelated question (but something imaginary I'm playing with in my head); I can remember reading somewhere on rmweb that HSTs could only go 125mph with a minimum of 5 intermediate coaches for brake force reasons. With the shortened 2+4 sets now being used in Scotland and the far west, what speed are they limited to? Ta

It all depends on which technical documentation you  look at. Power cars back to back could at one time do 125, then some one panicked. XC used to run some 2+2s which at the time could run at 125, until Railtrack got their knickers in a twist, the documentation at the time didn't specify any speed restriction. Plus since then various changes to the brake pads has changed the braking characteristics for the better.

[melmerby]

How about a double ended Siemens Charger?

 

10' wide but plenty of space either side of the engine so that could be reduced to UK width

12' 6" high which is OK

About 120t on 4 wheel bogies so we could change those for 6 wheelers to meet UK max axle load.

4,400hp!

 

Any takers?

[Traintresta]

On 24/03/2019 at 13:49, melmerby said:

I thought the V front cab on the GWR King  "Plasticine" streamliner suited it.

None of the other protuberances did.

So it did. I always forget the GWR attempt at streamlining, for me it falls short of he mark but with a few tweaks could have been much better looking and still nothing like the typical British streamliner. 

 

I wonder if this cab had any aerodynamic effects in terms of smoke clearance. It has a nice rounded front to it rather than the sharp V that the LNER used. I’m some respects i prefer it.  

 

Perhaps we we should think of imaginary streamlined locomotives to see what alternatives we can come up with. 

Edited March 26, 2019 by Traintresta

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, Traintresta said:

So it did. I always forget the GWR attempt at streamlining, for me it falls short of he mark but with a few tweaks could have been much better looking and still nothing like the typical British streamliner. 

 

I wonder if this cab had any aerodynamic effects in terms of smoke clearance. It has a nice rounded front to it rather than the sharp V that the LNER used. I’m some respects i prefer it.  

 

Perhaps we we should think of imaginary streamlined locomotives to see what alternatives we can come up with. 

I wonder with the smaller smokebox diameter compared to a Coronation, whether a King's front might be along the same lines without the need to slope the smokebox top?

Certainly Stanier's effort modified the basic design as little as possible, making de-frocking a relatively easy process, unlike Gresley's where the A4 is more radically altered, compared to say, the A3.

Quite what a properly faired in copper capped chimney would look like is anyone's guess!

Edited March 26, 2019 by melmerby

[AlfaZagato]

I'd imagine a streamlined Castle or King might have a front akin to the AEC railcars.    The second design was done in-house if I remember correctly.    Admittedly, I think such things are hard to judge. 

[Coach bogie]

On 28/01/2019 at 00:49, Suzie said:

Might have happened if DC went all the way to Liverpool via CLC and somewhere a bit further East - might have needed a few more locos with 1500V DC...

 

..

The challenge was at London Road Manchester. The 1500 lines terminated from both Altrincham and from Sheffield and there was no way to connect. it stayed this way until all the lines became 25KV.

 

With all the loco changes at Godley, it needed the 1500 volt extending  from Godley junction through Stockport Tiviot Dale, Warrington to Liverpool. We could have had electric haul coal trains all the way to Fiddlers ferry.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[RLBH]

Came across the Ruhnian State Railways today - a creation of a German modeller and steam enthusiast.

 

http://www.kropplenburg.de/rsr/pages/rsrhome.html

 

There's a bit of context on the site, but the best developed feature is the locomotives page. All imaginary, and some of them really quite inventive. The story holds that the RSR has stuck with steam up to the present day, leading to barmy things like a 7-cylinder triple-expansion 2-12-4.

[Corbs]

I can't see a picture of an A2/2 without wanting to photoshop it. Really need to get on and finish mine, I think high running plate all the way to the front is the way to go.

 

 

Original:

https://www.p2steam.com/2014/05/19/no-2003/

 

Edited March 28, 2019 by Corbs
Reason for edit

[The Johnster]

2 hours ago, RLBH said:

Came across the Ruhnian State Railways today - a creation of a German modeller and steam enthusiast.

 

http://www.kropplenburg.de/rsr/pages/rsrhome.html

 

There's a bit of context on the site, but the best developed feature is the locomotives page. All imaginary, and some of them really quite inventive. The story holds that the RSR has stuck with steam up to the present day, leading to barmy things like a 7-cylinder triple-expansion 2-12-4.

I am familiar with the wonderful world of Ruhnian State Railways, and imagine it to be located somewhere around the Silesian region of southern Poland.  Clearly influenced by British practice up until WW2, both in loco and rolling stock design.  

[DCB]

On 24/03/2019 at 21:46, rodent279 said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Bulleid Pacific's have flat spectacle plates when first built? I think they were changed due to smoke clearance and to reduce internal reflections at night.

I thought it was the near impossibility of cleaning the front windows on the air smoothed locos which led to the windows being angled back.

[Steamport Southport]

20 minutes ago, DavidCBroad said:

I thought it was the near impossibility of cleaning the front windows on the air smoothed locos which led to the windows being angled back.

 

They had steam driven window washers.

 

Spent about half an hour playing about with the ones on City Of Wells. 

 

 

Jason

[Traintresta]

4 hours ago, Corbs said:

I can't see a picture of an A2/2 without wanting to photoshop it. Really need to get on and finish mine, I think high running plate all the way to the front is the way to go.

 

 

Original:

https://www.p2steam.com/2014/05/19/no-2003/

 

Funny how you’ve chosen to return it to a 2-8-2 arrangement!

[rodent279]

2 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

They had steam driven window washers.

 

Spent about half an hour playing about with the ones on City Of Wells. 

 

 

Jason

Really?!  It's not April 1st for a few days yet!

[Flying Pig]

6 hours ago, Corbs said:

I can't see a picture of an A2/2 without wanting to photoshop it. Really need to get on and finish mine, I think high running plate all the way to the front is the way to go.

 

 

Original:

https://www.p2steam.com/2014/05/19/no-2003/

 

 

Is that with original P2 wheels and cylinders?  It looks a lot better like that than the semi-streamlined locos actually built. 

[Gibbo675]

2 hours ago, rodent279 said:

Really?!  It's not April 1st for a few days yet!

Hi Rodent,

 

I made and fitted the ones on Tangemere, they only work when the feed is on.

 

Gibbo.

[Corbs]

29 minutes ago, Flying Pig said:

 

Is that with original P2 wheels and cylinders?  It looks a lot better like that than the semi-streamlined locos actually built. 

 

Yes I just altered the A2/2 image. As far as I know they re-used the cylinders, wheels and rods when they rebuilt them.

[rodent279]

1 hour ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Rodent,

 

I made and fitted the ones on Tangemere, they only work when the feed is on.

 

Gibbo.

I believe you! But I wouldn't know if you were kidding either!

Didn't they also have steam operated firehole doors?

I believe some cars had wipers operated off manifold vacuum. I'm told the wipers used to slow down on full throttle!

[Northmoor]

9 hours ago, RLBH said:

Came across the Ruhnian State Railways today - a creation of a German modeller and steam enthusiast.

 

http://www.kropplenburg.de/rsr/pages/rsrhome.html

 

This looks familiar for some reason:

http://www.kropplenburg.de/rsr/pages/ModernExp.html#455AB

 

[melmerby]

48 minutes ago, rodent279 said:

I believe some cars had wipers operated off manifold vacuum. I'm told the wipers used to slow down on full throttle!

They used to stop completely when labouring up a hill (usually when it was pouring with rain!)

[The Johnster]

My first ever car was a Ford Popular which had windscreen wipers of this sort; useless going uphill (well, you could say that about the whole car) and they used to have a sort of going downhill!

 

I was once guard on a fully fitted freight train between Gloucester and Cardiff hauled by a class 45, and sitting in front in the secondman's seat.  This would have been 1972 or maybe 3.  It was raining heavily and the air operated wipers were going flat out when the driver's side one decided to make a run for it, snapping at the base of the arm and spinning rather gracefully off into space just as we were crossing the Chepstow bridge.  I had to call the signals the rest of the way home, the driver was more or less blind.  He should probably have failed the loco.

 

Most 70s diesels had air operated wipers, the speed of which could be altered by a tap type valve