Formula 1, 2020

[Sidecar Racer]

Which confirms GR's comments on a re-active car like the Williams and a

pro-active car that is the Merc .

[SR71]

10 hours ago, Joseph_Pestell said:

 

To many in the industry, the manufacturers' championship is more important than the drivers' championship.

 

You can't win the manufacturers' championship without a good second driver. 

 

I would agree with this but the pedant in me made me go look it up. I can't get the maths to work based on the drivers standings (I think the fastest lap points or something may be skewing it?) but has Hamilton really scored enough constructors points this year for Mercedes to have convincingly won the title entering just the one car?!

[Jol Wilkinson]

8 minutes ago, SR71 said:

 

I would agree with this but the pedant in me made me go look it up. I can't get the maths to work based on the drivers standings (I think the fastest lap points or something may be skewing it?) but has Hamilton really scored enough constructors points this year for Mercedes to have convincingly won the title entering just the one car?!

Hamilton 332 points

 

Red Bull 282 (MV 189, AA 93)

 

So LH alone has beaten Red Bull this year, but would you bet on that normally? I don't think any team would take that risk at the beginning of the season.

[LNERandBR]

And Perez has outscored Stroll.

 

Really does not make any sense them getting rid of Perez.

[kipford]

Quote

Really does not make any sense them getting rid of Perez.

I think it does because no way was Daddy Stroll going to fire his son, he would have ended up in the divorce courts. I bet Perez did the Mexican equivalent of up yours to himself afterwards, I know I would.

[RJS1977]

50 minutes ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

Hamilton 332 points

 

Red Bull 282 (MV 189, AA 93)

 

So LH alone has beaten Red Bull this year, but would you bet on that normally? I don't think any team would take that risk at the beginning of the season.

 

Though don't forget that had Bottas not been driving for Merc, Max may well have picked up a number of extra second places, so more points.

 

(I have now done the maths - no Bottas would have meant 17 extra points for Max - and an extra 15 for Alex - nowhere near enough to overhaul Lewis. However Max has had five retirements, and Alex one, to Lewis's one DNS - so too risky for Mercedes to go a whole season with only Lewis).

 

And of course, Merc's problem at the moment isn't one of not having enough drivers - quite the opposite!

[298]

6 hours ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

Hamilton 332 points

 

Red Bull 282 (MV 189, AA 93)

 

So LH alone has beaten Red Bull this year, but would you bet on that normally? I don't think any team would take that risk at the beginning of the season.

 

But that is virtually an impossible situation, as both Red Bull cars would have scored more points by finishing in higher positions. I suppose the only way it can happen is if a driver gets all of their results disqualified and their points taken away.

 

Something apparent from the race show was the pit wall telling George Russel to curb his emotions, something Verstappen hasn't quite mastered yet...

Edited December 9, 2020 by 298

[newbryford]

1 minute ago, 298 said:

 

 

 

Something apparent from the race show was the put wall telling George Russel to curb his emotions, something Verstappen hasn't quite mastered yet...

 

Or Toto.......

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.a-star-is-born-says-wolff-as-he-reveals-cause-of-colossal-up-that-robbed.3zeIiwySgy3Ch46QS1A14Q.html

[Joseph_Pestell]

9 hours ago, SR71 said:

 

I would agree with this but the pedant in me made me go look it up. I can't get the maths to work based on the drivers standings (I think the fastest lap points or something may be skewing it?) but has Hamilton really scored enough constructors points this year for Mercedes to have convincingly won the title entering just the one car?!

If Mercedes had just one car, other drivers would have scored more points. Bottas has provided a cushion.

[LNERandBR]

In the WRC teams run 3 cars but only 2 of those score Constructors points. Having 3 means that if one DNF's the other two can still pick up the points for the team.

 

So, Mercedes would be silly to run one car. Running two provides that same buffer so that if one DNF's the other is there to collect the points.

[Andrew P]

With so mush young talent out there, (Take Jake Aitken as one  example) I still don't understand Renault wanting Alfonso, he is old, and disrupt able to a Team.

And don't get me Started on Daddy Stoll and his decision making. 

[PaulRhB]

The decisions don’t seem logical to us but the teams run on money and influence and we don’t get to see all those factors. Lewis is fighting hard for equality but we’ve just seen Haas dump both drivers for those with more money. Perez got RP out of a hole with his backing and now gets dumped despite showing he’s not just the pay for place driver everyone thought he was alongside Ocon. To be honest you’d think Williams would love to take Perez for his money . . . where would that leave George as Latifi is said to bring in €30m

Edited December 9, 2020 by PaulRhB

[Hobby]

9 hours ago, 298 said:

Something apparent from the race show was the pit wall telling George Russel to curb his emotions, something Verstappen hasn't quite mastered yet...

 

That was one of the things that impressed me about George, he seems well in control of his emotions, certainly more so than some of the others of his age. I wonder if trying to get the most out of the Williams has helped him to be patient and take what he can carefully...

[woodenhead]

10 hours ago, 298 said:

Something apparent from the race show was the pit wall telling George Russel to curb his emotions, something Verstappen hasn't quite mastered yet...

To be fair to Verstappen, if you spent your whole time being told you were the new Messiah and the replacement as multiple world champion when Lewis retires then you're probably going to handle it strangely.

[Zomboid]

1 hour ago, Andrew P said:

With so mush young talent out there, (Take Jake Aitken as one  example) I still don't understand Renault wanting Alfonso, he is old, and disrupt able to a Team.

And don't get me Started on Daddy Stoll and his decision making. 

They've got one relatively young gun in Ocon (he's been around a bit, but they obviously see potential), and in Alonso there's a proven quantity.

 

They want to be pushing for podiums and wins, so having a driver of Alonso's proven quality to go along with someone they see as potential long term option is a sensible choice.

 

As far Daddy Stroll, he owns the team. His investment kept it in business when Force India collapsed. It's his right as team owner to give his son a drive. He might not be the best on the grid, but he's also clearly capable of driving an F1 car. There would be a load of people from the Silverstone area potentially out of work if he wasn't paying the bills.

[Andrew P]

Haas has a problem or so it might seem.

https://www.gpfans.com/en/articles/60218/haas-condemns-mazepin-behaviour-in-social-media-video/?fbclid=IwAR3ZGZZhTpSrsS8XRKvZsTG2reC6S7bQBTr5yGyvel3v-l-W8JqzOdcIj34

[didcot]

I believe Mazepin has a bit of a reputation as a bad boy. 

[Pete the Elaner]

3 place grid penalty for Leclerc for causing the 1st lap incident between himself, Perez & Verstappen:

https://www.gpfans.com/en/articles/60115/leclerc-handed-three-place-grid-drop-for-abu-dhabi-for-causing-lap-one-collision/?Bibblio=True

 

It seems the the stewards actually did investigate this after the race instead of just forgetting about it.

I still think they should have been able to sort this during the race to prevent Perez taking the podium celebrations while under investigation.

 

I am also impressed with the way Leclerc reviews incidents.

He seems to accept that as a racing driver, you need to take half-opportunities but they don't always work out. On another day, he could have made that pass & gone clear. I do not have a problem with this.

[LNERandBR]

They probably looked at it to decide if an investigation was needed and at that point decided that more blame was likely on Leclerc's side then Perez's. The fact Leclerc ended up retiring due to the incident meant that any in race penalties weren't possible. 

 

 

[PaulRhB]

2 hours ago, woodenhead said:

To be fair to Verstappen, if you spent your whole time being told you were the new Messiah and the replacement as multiple world champion when Lewis retires then you're probably going to handle it strangely.

And the characters of the past like James Hunt were similar  

Lewis gets vilified for a simple moan and Max’s are shrugged off because of his character  life just ain’t fair

 

I’m glad we’ve got varied personalities with passion and I enjoy Max being a bit ranty as it’s comes across as just frustration and he seems a nice enough guy when he calms down again. 

[Oldddudders]

58 minutes ago, LNERandBR said:

They probably looked at it to decide if an investigation was needed and at that point decided that more blame was likely on Leclerc's side then Perez's. The fact Leclerc ended up retiring due to the incident meant that any in race penalties weren't possible. 

That makes sense, but as said above, both Perez and we punters were wondering if a penalty was going to spoil the top-step party. 

[Oldddudders]

1 hour ago, Andrew P said:

Haas has a problem or so it might seem.

https://www.gpfans.com/en/articles/60218/haas-condemns-mazepin-behaviour-in-social-media-video/?fbclid=IwAR3ZGZZhTpSrsS8XRKvZsTG2reC6S7bQBTr5yGyvel3v-l-W8JqzOdcIj34

Elsewhere it has been construed that the groping hand is Mazepin's. I have no idea of the moral outlook in the former Communist Bloc, nor of it these days, but suspect an outgoing president in another continent would think it was all fair game. 

[woodenhead]

8 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

And the characters of the past like James Hunt were similar  

Lewis gets vilified for a simple moan and Max’s are shrugged off because of his character  life just ain’t fair

 

I’m glad we’ve got varied personalities with passion and I enjoy Max being a bit ranty as it’s comes across as just frustration and he seems a nice enough guy when he calms down again. 

I do like him too, he's  character and whilst he gets angry I don't think he is foolish or dangerous.  He was a bit of a loose cannon in the beginning, but he was learning how to drive F1 and being extremely fast meant he was always at risk of going beyond his abilities (in fact they all still are).  But in the past two seasons he has settled into a class driver and I look forward to him, Hamilton, LeClerc and Russell battling it out in 2022 where I feel the field will be much closer

[PaulRhB]

4 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

Elsewhere it has been construed that the groping hand is Mazepin's. I have no idea of the moral outlook in the former Communist Bloc, nor of it these days, but suspect an outgoing president in another continent would think it was all fair game. 

He seems to have admitted it in his statement and apologised. He should have realised by now that even though it may be ‘ignored at home’ he’s in an international spotlight and has to play by those rules or the team will lose sponsors, oh and hopefully actually disapprove of it! 

[Pete the Elaner]

12 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

That makes sense, but as said above, both Perez and we punters were wondering if a penalty was going to spoil the top-step party. 

 

That was my point entirely.

It would be a really bitter feeling to go through the interviews & podium procedure after having won the race then be told later "I hope you enjoyed all that but sorry, we've taken the result away"

& also to Ocon:

"We've decided that after a penalty, you are the winner. Sorry we couldn't decide in time to let you enjoy the win properly".

 

I'm really glad the penalty didn't change the result, but it has done in the past. Wasn't Sainz's first podium awarded after the podium procedure itself?